Skill Inheritance Discussion.

[MrSmokestack]

7 minutes ago, Raven said:

I'd possibly go with Blarblade, since I also usually run Eirika in my team anyway. Any idea if its power would increase with the Swift Sparrow Atk/Spd+4 buffs?

I'm fairly certain it does not, but I would get confirmation from elsewhere.

[LuxSpes]

6 minutes ago, Raven said:

I'd possibly go with Blarblade, since I also usually run Eirika in my team anyway. Any idea if its power would increase with the Swift Sparrow Atk/Spd+4 buffs?

The blade tomes don't consider in-battle bonuses like those from blows and spur/goad/ward. You'll hit for 4 more damage with Swift Sparrow, but you won't get 8 more bonus damage on Blarblade.

[Raven]

1 minute ago, LuxSpes said:

The blade tomes don't consider in-battle bonuses like those from blows and spur/goad/ward. You'll hit for 4 more damage with Swift Sparrow, but you won't get 8 more bonus damage on Blarblade.

That makes sense. I was pretty sure this was the case, just needed someone who knew for sure to confirm it.

From what I'm able to scrape together with what I currently own in duplicates, I'm considering this setup for her: Blarblade, Ardent Sacrifice (to help hit the Desperation 2 50% threshold easier), Moonbow, Swift Sparrow 2, Desperation 2 (but I'll take Odin's R Tomebreaker 3 anyway), and Hone Atk 2.

[LuxSpes]

Just now, Raven said:

That makes sense. I was pretty sure this was the case, just needed someone who knew for sure to confirm it.

From what I'm able to scrape together with what I currently own in duplicates, I'm considering this setup for her: Blarblade, Ardent Sacrifice (to help hit the Desperation 2 50% threshold easier), Moonbow, Swift Sparrow 2, Desperation 2 (but I'll take Odin's R Tomebreaker 3 anyway), and Hone Atk 2.

Are you sacrificing 2 Odin on her? Because if you're only planning to sacrifice one, you won't be able to pass R Tomebreaker 3 if you're already passing Blarblade, Moonbow and New Moon

[Raven]

4 minutes ago, LuxSpes said:

Are you sacrificing 2 Odin on her? Because if you're only planning to sacrifice one, you won't be able to pass R Tomebreaker 3 if you're already passing Blarblade, Moonbow and New Moon

Yes, first I'll sacrifice one of my 3* Odins, then sacrifice the 4* to obtain Moonbow and the rest of RT3.

[Okigen]

So I thought Xander was a the hottest guy in Fates until I see the carrot.

Ah that carrot... Oh that carrot. Xander, are you confiming what we have always suspected? xD

Anyway, given spring is coming I think the combo of 3 moves + carrot + fury could do wonders for my squishy team without sacrificing BST. However, he's not going to kill anyone with that atk... Any suggestion?

Edited March 31, 2017 by OKigen

[Shiro]

Has anyone tried or know if a raven tome plus triangle adept could work on srping camilla? like does it nulifiy any damage? and if so how much and why. I just dont want to spent 750 sp on a weapon that might not work. and if it does work i think overall it would be more effective than iotes sheild as it only nullifies the damage whereas raven and tri can potentially deal more damage to both blue units and colorless. Testing this on my sanaki would has a similar skillset she is able to one shot archers and also tank them even though she has little defense.

[Ice Dragon]

3 minutes ago, Shiro said:

Has anyone tried or know if a raven tome plus triangle adept could work on srping camilla? like does it nulifiy any damage? and if so how much and why. I just dont want to spent 750 sp on a weapon that might not work. and if it does work i think overall it would be more effective than iotes sheild as it only nullifies the damage whereas raven and tri can potentially deal more damage to both blue units and colorless. Testing this on my sanaki would has a similar skillset she is able to one shot archers and also tank them even though she has little defense.

Weapon triangle advantage with Triangle Adept when your opponent has an effective weapon is a total -10% to the opponent's Atk (1.5 x 0.6 = 0.9), which is more effective than Iote's Shield (+0% to the opponent's Atk). Same deal as Nowi or Corrin against Falchions.

[Shiro]

Just now, Ice Dragon said:

Weapon triangle advantage with Triangle Adept when your opponent has an effective weapon is a total -10% to the opponent's Atk (1.5 x 0.6 = 0.9), which is more effective than Iote's Shield (+0% to the opponent's Atk). Same deal as Nowi or Corrin against Falchions.

So would you use triangle adept raven tome green tome breaker moonbow and goad fliers on sring camilla??

[Ice Dragon]

8 minutes ago, Shiro said:

So would you use triangle adept raven tome green tome breaker moonbow and goad fliers on sring camilla??

If you are using a Raven tome, Triangle Adept is the way to go if you don't have someone else to take care of bows. I don't have much of an opinion on the other skills.

[Shiro]

2 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

If you are using a Raven tome, Triangle Adept is the way to go if you don't have someone else to take care of bows. I don't have much of an opinion on the other skills.

So I already have sanaki as my anti bow user I just dont want to simply opt to iotes sheild on camilla as triangle adept means i can potentially one shot blues. or would fury work on camilla and if so what should her other skills be? also her weapon synergizes with fury meaning she only loses 2 hp if she has fury 3.

[BANRYU]

So IMO Raven Adept is very good for Bunny Camilla as she has the defenses to take bows esp through TA3, but yeah if you already have Sanaki doing that then there might not be much point. I would rather have Camilla doing that then Sanaki personally but if you keep Camilla out of the way of bows then you can do whatever. 

[Shiro]

7 minutes ago, BANRYU said:

So IMO Raven Adept is very good for Bunny Camilla as she has the defenses to take bows esp through TA3, but yeah if you already have Sanaki doing that then there might not be much point. I would rather have Camilla doing that then Sanaki personally but if you keep Camilla out of the way of bows then you can do whatever. 

so how would fury work on her? with her weapon healing 4/6 damage taken? she only takes 2 damage if she attacks. SO what other skills would synergize with a 2 damage fury? desperation wouldnt work since it would take a bit to get under 75%.

[BANRYU]

11 minutes ago, Shiro said:

so how would fury work on her? with her weapon healing 4/6 damage taken? she only takes 2 damage if she attacks. SO what other skills would synergize with a 2 damage fury? desperation wouldnt work since it would take a bit to get under 75%.

https://rocketmo.github.io/feh-damage-calc/ Do some testing, find out yaself. 

But uh, Desperation is better on fast, fragile units IMO, and IIRC this Camilla actually has some decent physical bulk so IDK man might be a bit of a waste. Fury should be fine I guess. 

Edited March 31, 2017 by BANRYU

[Raven]

2 hours ago, BANRYU said:

So IMO Raven Adept is very good for Bunny Camilla as she has the defenses to take bows esp through TA3, but yeah if you already have Sanaki doing that then there might not be much point. I would rather have Camilla doing that then Sanaki personally but if you keep Camilla out of the way of bows then you can do whatever. 

Sadly I don't have any units with Triangle Adept, let alone any duplicates with the skill.

[BANRYU]

1 hour ago, Raven said:

Sadly I don't have any units with Triangle Adept, let alone any duplicates with the skill.

Oh haha sorry I wasn't strictly speaking to you, I was saying 'raven adept' as shorthand for the color-raven tomes + triangle adept. 

[!Skydiver]

@Shiro
Well, desperation only changes the order of the attacks: Instead of  You > Opponent > You, It turns to be You > You > Opponent, so, if you can't double the enemy desperation does nothing and, with base 25 speed I don't think Spring Camilla will be doubling anything, honestly. That said, triangle adept 3 is a solid choice for the A slot. Neutral attack Camilla is able to 1 shot neutral Linde, Azura, and Robin!M, but if they are +RES either an Attack buff or +ATK boon will be needed.
She can do decent damage to greens but isn't able to ORKO any of them due to low speed, and the same applies to any other blue
If you're not too fond of triangle adept, with death blow 3 the same happens: neutral attack Camilla will 1HKO neutral RES Azura, Linde and M!Robin on player phase and will need an Attack Buff or +ATK boon to Take down the +RES variants, but now she can do decent damage to reds(17 damage on +RES Fury 3 Lucina) and is doubled to death by neutral Linde in enemy phase. 
Also, the only way you will be OHKOing neutral Nowi is with Triangle Adept 3, +ATK boon AND +4 Attack buff(or RES debuff). If Nowi is +SPD she can double and do 2x8 dmg, in case Nowi is +RES she survives with 3 hp ( even with all those buffs).
Also, neutral Julia takes 16 dmg from Death Blow 3 Neutral Attack Camilla on the player phase and does a whopping 30 dmg in return, so you really don't want to fight her.
+RES Nino can be 1RKOed with Death Blow and G tome breaker when neutral Camilla initiates, if neutral RES Nino, you only need G tomebreaker.
I think she's only useful to counter blues on player phase and then help to do damage on melee units always maintaining a safe position. Avoid high RES mages and archers is a wise choice most of the time, so Seal skills or Poison Strike might be very useful for the team front liners, as she will always stay behind.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

On 3/30/2017 at 4:04 PM, XeKr said:

Linde is a bit less dominant now since she’s not functionally 3 Spd above everyone else’s Spd tier. 36 base is still really fast, ofc, but more people have Spd boosters now. Nino who had a focus is similar but makes better use of buffs, Green seems more meta nowadays, and she even beats most Reds anyways. And doesn’t necessarily require 20k feathers for her tome. Linde is still fine with Aura (I still use it), but Blarblade+ is pretty much just better for her role.

I think Fury 3 is the best skill because the Def/Res might actually let her take some hits, and it gives +3 Att and also helps activate Desperation. Fury 2 also works, but you lose 1 Spd compared to her natural Spd+3 (which I use). Life and Death or one of the player phase Blows are definitely strong, as befits a glass cannon. Sometimes she does want to take a hit, trading with other Linde, destroying Robin(M) and red mages, avoiding certain physical ohkos, etc.

Desperation is ideal since you blow through Ryoma/Takumi/Kagero/Lightning Breath Dragons/etc and do a lot more to Hector and such to finish them off. 

Fortify Res is good for the buff. Hone Atk/Spd might be ultimately better for the team but are low priority for SP imo. The Res lets units tank Julia/Nino/Reinhardt/etc better, which is sometimes necessary to bait them in.

-Atk is fine with buff support, though Moonbow or Iceberg will help. The latter is especially useful for some ohkos and hitting greens harder.

I think the best assist for mages is Draw Back, but Ardent Sacrifice can activate Desperation and Reposition and the other mobility ones are still good. 

 

Nino was definitely a consideration for my team, as well, but I didn't get a chance to pull her banner and the one I got in my current batch was a 3* -Atk. No way I'm investing 22k feathers into that.

I do have an Odin and Blarblade was a consideration, but it just starts out too far behind Aura to be worth it. As with Nino, Blarblade+ is too expensive to be throwing at a -Atk Linde. Maybe a +Atk, but eh.

Anyway, thanks for your help! Taking your advice into account, I stuck with Aura and Ardent Sacrifice (might replace it later once I have spare SP), added Iceberg, then Fury 2 (gonna need to pull for HInatas to bump that to 3 ASAP, though), Desperation 3 and Fortify Res 3 (currently at 2, currently working up to 3).

I've only done the matches to claim the quest rewards, but so far she's been doing pretty well. Murders stuff so hard where M!Robin would have been in that awkward position of not doubling and needing to stall or get Drawn Back. Missing out on a few benchmarks that Fury 3 would have made, though, so there's that. If Sharena or Marth aren't busy, they can easily help her make those benchmarks, but that does mean needing to commit someone else to helping her out. On the other hand, Fury 2 gives her enough bulk versus Life and Death that she doesn't really need to fear trading with anyone other than Blue Tomebreakers (typically, anyway; I fought a M!Robin who had it and she could trade him no problem because his Atk is so low) and Brave Bows.

[BestFriendJ0]

How does a gwendy with quick riposte and bonfire sound? she already has a killer lance so -1 to proc, so counter would start at 2, taking an attack would send it to one, first counter attack would ready it, second one activates and she has a very nice defense. 

Or might there be a better unit for this sort of combination?

EDIT: Thanks for link!

Edited April 1, 2017 by BestFriendJ0
not wanting to repost

[MaskedAmpharos]

5 minutes ago, BestFriendJ0 said:

How does a gwendy with quick riposte and bonfire sound? she already has a killer lance so -1 to proc, so counter would start at 2, taking an attack would send it to one, first counter attack would ready it, second one activates and she has a very nice defense. 

Or might there be a better unit for this sort of combination?

I think that sounds pretty great. Quick Riposte and Bonfire are two of the best skills for Gwendy to have imo

@Ice Dragon Wrote up a pretty detailed analysis earlier this week

 

[LordFrigid]

Looking for 2nd opinions on Chrom (Spring Exalt) skills. I actually have no idea of what kind of team I'd stick him on, but it wouldn't be focused on him or anything, I'd just break it out for fun, every now and again. He's either +Atk/-Res or +Spd/-HP...I haven't decided yet. Still looking over the matchups.

A Passive: Debating on Fury vs Triangle Adept. Fury burn is 2/3 mitigated by the Carrot Axe being cool 'n stuff, but since Axes are basically stuck to playing "hunt the blue unit(s)" in the current meta, Triangle Adept might be the better option? It helps him more against the blue+magical variety of enemies, anyway. Also open to other suggestions.

B Passive: A bit stuck on this one. I'm considering warp skills (get to the blues faster), Drag Back (get out after dropping a blue), maybe Lancebreaker (it'd just be 2 because I am not 5*-ing an Arthur just to sacrifice him)? His Def is pretty high, so I might even look into Brash Assault, depending on what the Lance/Axe matchups look like...he's pretty quick already though.

C Passive: tbh I rarely know what to do with C slots =P . Probably some flavor of Hone or Fortify to help out the team when there aren't any blues around to fight. That or a Threaten, I'm thinking.

Assist: Shove is probably fine. If I had to change it, I'd probably use Reposition. I'm liking what I'm seeing out of it from other units I've stuck it on.

Special: Bonfire or Draconic Aura. Last I looked they have similar damage output, so it'd basically be whichever I have a sacrificial unit for.

[eclipse]

1 hour ago, LordFrigid said:

Looking for 2nd opinions on Chrom (Spring Exalt) skills. I actually have no idea of what kind of team I'd stick him on, but it wouldn't be focused on him or anything, I'd just break it out for fun, every now and again. He's either +Atk/-Res or +Spd/-HP...I haven't decided yet. Still looking over the matchups.

A Passive: Debating on Fury vs Triangle Adept. Fury burn is 2/3 mitigated by the Carrot Axe being cool 'n stuff, but since Axes are basically stuck to playing "hunt the blue unit(s)" in the current meta, Triangle Adept might be the better option? It helps him more against the blue+magical variety of enemies, anyway. Also open to other suggestions.

B Passive: A bit stuck on this one. I'm considering warp skills (get to the blues faster), Drag Back (get out after dropping a blue), maybe Lancebreaker (it'd just be 2 because I am not 5*-ing an Arthur just to sacrifice him)? His Def is pretty high, so I might even look into Brash Assault, depending on what the Lance/Axe matchups look like...he's pretty quick already though.

C Passive: tbh I rarely know what to do with C slots =P . Probably some flavor of Hone or Fortify to help out the team when there aren't any blues around to fight. That or a Threaten, I'm thinking.

Assist: Shove is probably fine. If I had to change it, I'd probably use Reposition. I'm liking what I'm seeing out of it from other units I've stuck it on.

Special: Bonfire or Draconic Aura. Last I looked they have similar damage output, so it'd basically be whichever I have a sacrificial unit for.

. . .and looking at Chrom's bases, I am slightly in love with him.

A passive: I think some math would help, since he's not insta-dead if he runs into a sword without Triangle Adept, and it looks like he'll do some damage to them.  Unless he really struggles to kill Robin without TA, I think Fury would be the better option.

B passive: +Spd can pull off Desperation, especially with Fury (he'll always shank himself down into that range).  +Atk would probably like something else (Escape Route/Vantage comes to mind).

C passive: Yeah, team buff, whichever one you need.

Special: Dragonic Aura will do more damage, especially on +Atk with Fury.

[LordFrigid]

7 hours ago, eclipse said:

. . .and looking at Chrom's bases, I am slightly in love with him.

A passive: I think some math would help, since he's not insta-dead if he runs into a sword without Triangle Adept, and it looks like he'll do some damage to them.  Unless he really struggles to kill Robin without TA, I think Fury would be the better option.

B passive: +Spd can pull off Desperation, especially with Fury (he'll always shank himself down into that range).  +Atk would probably like something else (Escape Route/Vantage comes to mind).

C passive: Yeah, team buff, whichever one you need.

Special: Dragonic Aura will do more damage, especially on +Atk with Fury.

Yeah, it's a pretty nice stat line. It fits him better than his sword incarnation, imo. Also, turns out I mixed up the banes on the Chroms...it's actually +Atk/-HP or +Spd/-Res. Still pretty benign though.

Looking at the breakdowns now...he'd 2HKO every M!Robin, and +Spd Fury would let him double variants without +Spd/[base speed boosting skill]. Also ran the matchup on Triangle Adept M!Robin since it's not uncommon for him to be running it himself...+Spd/Fury one-shots him lol. Seems solid, I'll just have to be extra careful about where I put him if blue magicals are around.

On the Red matchups...from what I've just checked now, he needs +Spd/Fury to take a round with +Spd/Fury variants of the more common ones. He deals ~12 or ~15 damage to the neutral Def/Fury sword lords, depending on his boon. I think I'll end up going with +Spd. I like his +Spd/Fury matchups against +Spd/Fury Blues better, and giving enemies +Def/Fury instead doesn't really change anything so significant that I'd want to run +Atk instead.

I'll give Desperation a shot, see what my buff-fodder looks like, and Draconic deals the same amount of damage as Bonfire with the +Spd version, but if I gave him a buff, it'd probably be an Atk one...I'll see if I have any spare Draconic Auras lying around. Thanks for the help!

Edited April 1, 2017 by LordFrigid

[BANRYU]

Hey folks what do y'all think of the combo of Brash Assault + Defiant Def/Res for very slow, tanky units? combined with like Sol (if the unit hits hard enough) or Bonfire/Iceberg (if they don't lol). 

EDIT: Specifically, I'm considering a build like this for Oboro... Quick Riposte is always a decent option ofc, but I have several Bartres and would like to try some testing with Brash Assault to determine its viability. Defiant Def/Atk + Brash Assault + Bonfire would be the build. But curious as to how it might fare on anyone, really. 

 

Also I made the decision to put Pivot + Fortify Def 2 (4* Cherche) and Fury 2 + Fortify Cav (4* Jagen) on my Atk+/HP- Abel and I was kinda impressed with myself for being able to fill out everything on him 'cept a proc so neatly until I realized that Fury is counterintuitive to Swordbreaker lmao. Whoops. Maybe I shoulda just done all of the Fortify Cav stuff from Jagen instead....? (FortDef2 IS more useful than Res, but...) 

Ehh maybe Pivot will be passable on him... can cross trees this way at least.

 

Edited April 1, 2017 by BANRYU

[eclipse]

20 minutes ago, BANRYU said:

Hey folks what do y'all think of the combo of Brash Assault + Defiant Def/Res for very slow, tanky units? combined with like Sol (if the unit hits hard enough) or Bonfire/Iceberg (if they don't lol).

That's when I pick on their non-Defiant stat and go nuts.  Sophia might be able to pull this off with Defiant Res, though.