Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[GuardianSing]

1 hour ago, Acacia Sgt said:

To be fair, that's kinda the fault of the original story itself. Original Aladdin took place in China. A very Arabized China (which admittedly did had some Arab presence back then, thanks to merchants in port cities and by what is now Western China), but China nonetheless.

Still, not quite the excuse for the made up hodgepodge that is Agrabah.

1 hour ago, Αυτοκράτορας των Γαρίδων said:

fyi, Badlah is arabic for suit. Your typical, normal boring ass suit.

For dancing i think it's called  Badleht El-Ra'as (Dancing suit)? Not sure.

In Egyptian Arabic it's attributed more to dancers.

1 hour ago, Αυτοκράτορας των Γαρίδων said:

Correction: There's usually a hired dancer/group wearing such clothes. Guests and invited people do dance and party, but with normal/casual/formal clothes (depending on party)

Ultimately that's more of an addon than a correction as it does depend on the event taking place.

55 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Is the badlah a specific article of clothing or are the outfits somewhat broad in scope?

Ehh, somewhere in between. Traditionally speaking it's nothing more than a bra, bottoms, and dress, but everybody has their own idea on the specifics.

56 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Would these loose enough pants be less of a concern going through a thicket or bushes than more traditional badlah? That's probably the one context I could think of at the minute that makes sense and even then it's not much better if at all.

With that I would have to know the material of the pants itself, but generally it would fair well in a situation like so in that context it makes more sense.

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

Looking at the heroes art, it's definitely more like a bindi.

Then again I don't think I've come across associating belly dancing with India from my limited exposure, so *shrug for me personally. Now belly dancing getting associated with certain behaviours, that I've seen.

I definitely don't blame FE for making these mistakes, it's mostly for fun, but it is worth looking into design choices and what may have sparked them.

[Saint Rubenio]

4 hours ago, Punished Dayni said:

She wasn't ready to climb down it even on the lower branch, but she wasn't a baby kitten so chances are she just hasn't much experience with trees.

She ran off afterwards and I didn't see her later.

Oh dear. I hope she's okay.

4 hours ago, Punished Dayni said:

His dad?

Yes, I do wonder about that...

4 hours ago, Punished Dayni said:

You made a Leygance in SS?

It's undone, no worries.

4 hours ago, ping said:

Now do Henning and Gel

No please.

3 hours ago, Edelguardiansing said:

One of my least favorite tropes in media is the "older brother keeping the younger sister from any romantic interests" and even when the genders have swapped it still feels equally as creepy.

Haha, yes, aren't romantic tropes great? I like the one that isn't creepy or potentially harmful. You know, that one.

3 hours ago, Edelguardiansing said:

Well that's certainly more thought put into it than the devs ever did

Hah!

...Uh, hah I guess?

3 hours ago, Edelguardiansing said:

It's a shame to see how anime, and extension Fire Emblem, sort of forgets black and brown people...exist? There's an unfortunate cultural context of living in a much less diverse country with roots of racism that paint this idea of darker skin being attributed to troublesome or delinquent behavior (Which is a prejudice still alive to this day) and how that can seep into the minds of writers and artists. It creates odd moments like this Fire Emblem where they create a place that is so obviously meant to be a specific place with a specific people that wear specific clothing but end up still being white as milk.

Yes, people forget Japan still has a serious problem with xenophobia to this day.

1 hour ago, Edelguardiansing said:

Alright you assholes, I didn't want to do this until way later but you forced my anthropologist hand.

This just in: Oddly aggressive Quetzal hurts my feelings and then drops an essay.

1 hour ago, Edelguardiansing said:

Tethys is a belly dancer with loose inspirations from the Arab world. She is from the fictional desert country of Jehanna, a place with pyramids, oasis' and many sandstone buildings.

The country from this information was likely based off of Egypt.

Belly dancing is an ancient tradition from the middle east dating back to the early Ottoman Empire. The Greeks referred to it as "The dance of the quivering thighs", however belly dancing as we know it today (And the one that is most present in Fire Emblem) originated in Egypt from the mid to late 19th century, and features the iconic dress shown here.

The dance is called Raas Baladi in Egyptian Arabic which translates to folk dance.

This costume is called a Badlah, and is worn by lots of women and men in Egypt for dances, weddings, parties and other such events. The custom typically keeps to a simple combination of a long wavy dress (one that often leaves room for the legs) and a bra and headband. Just like Fire Emblem, the long piece of cloth held at each ends by the hands is common as well though not standard.

The pantaloons or "Harem pants" Tethys is wearing is not common in Egypt as they are often ditched in favor of flowing dresses that move with the music. While you could that "Oh, she's on the battlefield so she needed more movement options" it doesn't quite land as the Badlah isn't nearly as restrictive as your typical western dress.

Unless of course Tethys was making sure her bottoms weren't visible, which if you've watched many belly dances you'll know isn't really a main concern of the dancer.

Pantaloons exist in belly dancing mostly outside of Egypt though even then aren't nearly as common as regular dresses.

And yeah, as someone who's participated in a bit of belly dancing, dresses are way more fun to work with.

Any other elements of her dress are also elements of the Badlah, such as the rings and guard around her lower arms, the small vail on her head and the sandals she wears with the wraps.

Two things I wanted to touch on though, first her hair. 

Tethys hair is braided to the back in a long whip like style which takes from Germanic and Celtic style braids, so there is one major culture discrepancy.

However, our team just came from the mountains between Carcino and Jehanna, which are home to vaguely Germanic people. With these two people living so close together there's bound to be some cultural exchange.

So bish bash bosh, it makes sense

That was a stretch, I know.

The second thing however can't be excused, and it's the little crystal on her forehead.

Belly dancing has found a place all over the world, in Brazil, Turkey and India and each have brought upon their own take on the Raas Baladi. This comes with it the unfortunate side effect of certain countries associating one thing with another, and in comes the classic mistake of merging Arabic and Indian culture as if it's the same thing, and it's my only real complaint of Tethys' design aside from her skin color.

And last but not least, the music that plays when she dances.

 

There we go, this is a taste of an entire forum thread I may make sometime in the future.

Well, that was super interesting. If I get this right, basically she's... decent enough? A bit of a hodgepodge in places, but decent for a game that forgets people living in places with high exposure to sunlight probably won't be looking like they live in caves.

Also, I should remove the forehead dot in my hack. Got it.

Incidentally, I love how your sig is now Basedter.

1 hour ago, Edelguardiansing said:

Also sorry for calling all of you assholes in the beginning, I love you all *Smooch*

Aww, it's okay. I forgive you.

[Codename Shrimp]

14 minutes ago, Edelguardiansing said:

In Egyptian Arabic it's attributed more to dancers.

Nope, it's not.

Badlah in Egypt is usually used for "normal" Suits.

Nobody there would think of dancing suits when saying Badlah, except when talking in the context of dancers/belly dancing....Which, tbf, you've been doing.

Egyptian Arabic does have it's differences from standard Arabic in major ways, but this ain't one of em.

Edited September 17, 2022 by Αυτοκράτορας των Γαρίδων

[Acacia Sgt]

(Elguardiansing, don't open the spoiler, just in case)

Just saying, but I'd like to point out that...

Spoiler

Chapter 17 takes place in Jehanna... yet it's not desert.

Why couldn't Tethys be from this part of Jehanna?

 

[Saint Rubenio]

3 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

(Elguardiansing, don't open the spoiler, just in case)

Just saying, but I'd like to point out that...

  Hide contents

Chapter 17 takes place in Jehanna... yet it's not desert.

Why couldn't Tethys be from this part of Jehanna?

 

 

Spoiler

TIL that's Jehanna. I had always assumed it to be border Rausten territory.

[Acacia Sgt]

Just now, Saint Rubenio said:

 

  Hide contents

TIL that's Jehanna. I had always assumed it to be border Rausten territory.

Spoiler

Notice the part of the coastline that is a curve going northeast?

Chapter 17 takes place in the 21 Dot. Notice how it's more or less aligned with the top of the arc?

So yes, the Narube River is in Jehanna. It's not entirely desert.

Further more. Notice Jehanna Hall itself? Location number 19?

The Hall is not that far from the desert edge, which means all that portion between the lake and the Grado border is also not desert.

Also notice the villages aren't that far into the desert itself. One is by the edge, and the destroyed one is only a little into the desert itself.

As it stands, not that many people live in the desert itself. Perhaps those at Jehanna Hall and maybe some villages, but not the entire country.

 

[Dayni]

27 minutes ago, Edelguardiansing said:

With that I would have to know the material of the pants itself, but generally it would fair well in a situation like so in that context it makes more sense.

I would also bring up that she does travel a fair bit as part of Gerik's mercenaries and it doesn't seem like they travel with much on them from what we can see.

12 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Oh dear. I hope she's okay.

Wasn't collared so likely stray, no idea if it was chipped though I doubt that if it was a stray, pretty lean too so it's not likely it's got an easy source of food from an owner. It was in a village in fairness.

I'd wonder how it'd do by the time winter comes, it's not like it's that young a cat so it could manage but there's still possible concern about it and scavenging options could be harder by then. That or any hypothetical owner is super cavalier and not exactly feeding it much.

1 minute ago, Acacia Sgt said:

(Elguardiansing, don't open the spoiler, just in case)

Just saying, but I'd like to point out that...

  Reveal hidden contents

Chapter 17 takes place in Jehanna... yet it's not desert.

Why couldn't Tethys be from this part of Jehanna?

Spoiler

Well it's not made apparent which part of Jehanna she was from (as it's very much not something the game focuses on), for all we know she could have been from the area around Chapter 13E as well, I swear that's also Jehanna.

1 minute ago, Saint Rubenio said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

TIL that's Jehanna. I had always assumed it to be border Rausten territory.

Spoiler

Looking at the chapter text at the start of 17 it does sound like it's more Rausten than Jehanna but Acaica has raised that point too. Hamill Canyon from 13E is suggested as being part of Jehanna in it's opening text as well, I'll show you a pic of it too:

[Saint Rubenio]

1 minute ago, Acacia Sgt said:

  Hide contents

Notice the part of the coastline that is a curve going northeast?

Chapter 17 takes place in the 21 Dot. Notice how it's more or less aligned with the top of the arc?

So yes, the Narube River is in Jehanna. It's not entirely desert.

Further more. Notice Jehanna Hall itself? Location number 19?

The Hall is not that far from the desert edge, which means all that portion between the lake and the Grado border is also not desert.

Also notice the villages aren't that far into the desert itself. One is by the edge, and the destroyed one is only a little into the desert itself.

As it stands, not that many people live in the desert itself. Perhaps those at Jehanna Hall and maybe some villages, but not the entire country.

 

 

Spoiler

Yeah, you make some fair points. Still, I think I like the variety. And I don't want all the trouble I went to to make palettes go to waste

 

1 minute ago, Punished Dayni said:

Wasn't collared so likely stray, no idea if it was chipped though I doubt that if it was a stray, pretty lean too so it's not likely it's got an easy source of food from an owner. It was in a village in fairness.

I'd wonder how it'd do by the time winter comes, it's not like it's that young a cat so it could manage but there's still possible concern about it and scavenging options could be harder by then. That or any hypothetical owner is super cavalier and not exactly feeding it much.

I see... Hopefully she'll be all right.

[Acacia Sgt]

It's a shame the intro world map and the actual game world map are on different scales, still...

(Warning: Further geography and spoilers stuff.)

Spoiler

 

Quote

  Hide contents

Looking at the chapter text at the start of 17 it does sound like it's more Rausten than Jehanna but Acaica has raised that point too. Hamill Canyon from 13E is suggested as being part of Jehanna in it's opening text as well, I'll show you a pic of it too:

On the world map, the Hamill Canyon dot is indeed in Jehannan territory. In fact, looking at Rausten's territory, the canyon is right at an intersection point between Carcino, Jehanna, and Rausten. Makes sense since the Rausten troops spawn in the northeast corner, if I recall correctly. They likely came from a pass or route between Darkling Woods and the mountains that make the actual border between Jehanna and Rausten.

So yes @Saint Rubenio, the border is north of Narube. The Gorgon Egg chapter takes place in the border region. Or rather, in the Rausten portion of the mountains.

 

Edited September 17, 2022 by Acacia Sgt

[Saint Rubenio]

4 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

It's a shame the intro world map and the actual game world map are on different scales, still...

(Warning: Further geography and spoilers stuff.)

  Hide contents

 

On the world map, the Hamill Canyon dot is indeed in Jehannan territory. In fact, looking at Rausten's territory, the canyon is right at an intersection point between Carcino, Jehanna, and Rausten. Makes sense since the Rausten troops spawn in the northeast corner, if I recall correctly. They likely came from a pass or route between Darkling Woods and the mountains that make the actual border between Jehanna and Rausten.

So yes @Saint Rubenio, the border is north of Narube. The Gorgon Egg chapter takes place in the border region. Or rather, in the Rausten portion of the mountains.

 

 

Spoiler

I do love the attention to detail in having the Rausten troops pop up from the correct angle. That's not something I had expected.

 

[Acacia Sgt]

It's all interesting, really.

Spoiler

Due to how dangerous the Neleras Peak path is, and the Hamill Canyon connection being remote, it wouldn't be surprising that Rausten mainly contacts the other countries by sea. We know Eirika's original plan was to take a ship to Rausten at Carcino to the Melkaen Coast. As such, Rausten ships go west across the northern coast to Carcino and Frelia, and south across the eastern coast to Jehanna and Grado.

As such, it's not surprising Carcino is where it is. As the mid-point between Rausten and Frelia, merchants saw it a good point to be intermediaries of Frelian-Rausten trade, thus allowing the merchant republic to flourish.

 

[GuardianSing]

 

49 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Well, that was super interesting. If I get this right, basically she's... decent enough? A bit of a hodgepodge in places, but decent for a game that forgets people living in places with high exposure to sunlight probably won't be looking like they live in caves.

That's the general conclusion, yes.

51 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Incidentally, I love how your sig is now Basedter.

Basedter all the way.

49 minutes ago, Αυτοκράτορας των Γαρίδων said:

Nope, it's not.

Badlah in Egypt is usually used for "normal" Suits.

Nobody there would think of dancing suits when saying Badlah, except when talking in the context of dancers/belly dancing....Which, tbf, you've been doing.

Egyptian Arabic does have it's differences from standard Arabic in major ways, but this ain't one of em.

Then...what people have I been talking to?

I must've misinterpreted it when it came.

 

[Armagon]

5 hours ago, Edelguardiansing said:

t's a shame to see how anime, and extension Fire Emblem, sort of forgets black and brown people...exist? There's an unfortunate cultural context of living in a much less diverse country with roots of racism that paint this idea of darker skin being attributed to troublesome or delinquent behavior (Which is a prejudice still alive to this day) and how that can seep into the minds of writers and artists.

Now i don't know everything and tbf, Japan does have a problem with xenophobia but while it's true black people are rarely seen in anime (games), i can't think of any instance where black/brown = delinquent. In Fire Emblem, you got Basilio and Flavia, they're pretty badass. Petra's great. Nailah's hot fantastic.

Gravity Rush's protagonist is brown (although tbf, Kat is modeled more after gyaru). Xenoblade 3 has two brown leads+two major brown characters+a brown side character who's amazing.

In anime examples, i've got less to think of if only because i haven't watched anime in a long-ass time. But Stardust Crusaders has Avdol.

Like maybe i just saw the right stuff but i any brown/black people i've seen in anime usually aren't bad guys. And if they are, it's not because they're black.

3 hours ago, Sooks said:

At least she has long hair now.

Which makes her better.

[Acacia Sgt]

Yo, how can you forget our homeboy Gazzak.

Edited September 17, 2022 by Acacia Sgt

[Acacia Sgt]

Inb4 piracy also has you working under the blazing sun all day unless you get a job below deck.

[Dayni]

SS having actual logic for the formation of it's smaller nations? Nice.

2 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Inb4 piracy also has you working under the blazing sun all day unless you get a job below deck.

pirates working in stormy weather all the time.

[GuardianSing]

...Wait a second

Uhuh...

I see...

I take everything back about Tethys, this game's pure bullshit.

Unbased

Oh hey we get to fight an incel this chapter.

Ah...how classic. A moment comes when I pick and choose so frequently that in a rush to heal Eirika, I accidently heal Lute instead.

But surely this little mistake wont be detrimental to the Princess, will it?

Oh...

31 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Now i don't know everything and tbf, Japan does have a problem with xenophobia but while it's true black people are rarely seen in anime (games), i can't think of any instance where black/brown = delinquent. In Fire Emblem, you got Basilio and Flavia, they're pretty badass. Petra's great. Nailah's hot fantastic.

Gravity Rush's protagonist is brown (although tbf, Kat is modeled more after gyaru). Xenoblade 3 has two brown leads+two major brown characters+a brown side character who's amazing.

In anime examples, i've got less to think of if only because i haven't watched anime in a long-ass time. But Stardust Crusaders has Avdol.

Like maybe i just saw the right stuff but i any brown/black people i've seen in anime usually aren't bad guys. And if they are, it's not because they're black.

Which makes her better.

Personally I can't name anything as what I'm drawing from is mostly clips and images I've seen.

I know Nagatoro is a show with a tanned character reinforcing that stereotype, but other than that I'm not great with names.

 

[Acacia Sgt]

To be fair, FE's shtick is that the bandits are Hispanic.

Which means Ortega of Yggdra Union would totally not be out of place in Fire Emblem.

[Acacia Sgt]

3 minutes ago, Edelguardiansing said:

...Wait a second

Uhuh...

I see...

I take everything back about Tethys, this game's pure bullshit.

Ziggurats:

[Dayni]

Just now, Edelguardiansing said:

Oh hey we get to fight an incel this chapter.

I see you understand Carlyle.

1 minute ago, Edelguardiansing said:

...Wait a second

Uhuh...

I see...

Playing Devil's Advocate, while I see what you're getting at stepped pyramids existed outside of Mesoamerica, including some of the older Egyptian ones and temples of Mesopotamia (Acacia give the name).

As for castles/forts, it's not the first time the inner layer is raised compared to lower layers and this could be a layered castle that has higher walls and the interior levels are raised too, but I'm admittedly trying to think of real examples at the minute and don't have one to mind.

[Acacia Sgt]

Indeed. Step-sided pyramids were how the first pyramids were made. Egypt eventually switched to smooth-sided, although...

Took a while to get it perfect.

[GuardianSing]

4 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Ziggurats:

1 minute ago, Punished Dayni said:

Playing Devil's Advocate, while I see what you're getting at stepped pyramids existed outside of Mesoamerica, including some of the older Egyptian ones and temples of Mesopotamia (Acacia give the name).

As for castles/forts, it's not the first time the inner layer is raised compared to lower layers and this could be a layered castle that has higher walls and the interior levels are raised too, but I'm admittedly trying to think of real examples at the minute and don't have one to mind.

The idea of a ziggurat came to mind as well but I don't know.

Does this

Really look like this

More than it looks like this?

 

[Acacia Sgt]

Totally unrelated but, random fact:

My first FE editing anything was making a palette swap of Carlyle, all the way back in 2009.

[Acacia Sgt]

Just now, Edelguardiansing said:

The idea of a ziggurat came to mind as well but I don't know.

Does this

Really look like this

More than it looks like this?

 

Ultimately, step-sided pyramids are not unique to any one place or follow a standard design, just that they're step-sided. The sprite isn't really that detailed to begin with. Can always be its own design.

[GuardianSing]

14 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Ultimately, step-sided pyramids are not unique to any one place or follow a standard design, just that they're step-sided. The sprite isn't really that detailed to begin with. Can always be its own design.

Listen if you want to argue semantics all day lets just say the pyramid looks like Angor Wat and leave it at that.

But in all seriousness, you're right as there are many different step-sided pyramids across the world with no one structure looking the same, but if we were to place bets on what the artist in particular was thinking about when designing that pyramid, I'd place mine on Chichen Itza in the Yucatán state of Mexico.

Edited September 18, 2022 by Edelguardiansing