Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[Codename Shrimp]

wait, Scarlett, i have something for you

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

This... From what Shrimpers says, no permadeath might have lead to this game being too easy

I wouldn't say it being the main reason - the punishment for losing a squad on the map can be quite harsh - Valor is quite valuable, and you only have max 10 deployment slots.

I think the bigger problems are how mobility is balanced and how cheap some skills are.

For mobility:

Armors - 50 (lol)

Infantry - 100

Fliers - 150

Cavs - 300

Which make cavs just dominate, as putting them as leader will make your squad have a mobility of 200+, since Mobility is heavily geared towards the leader.

That said, Infantry leaders still have their uses since they can use assist attacks (Imagine Fates Dual attacks with Range - that also burns RNG rolls) and hide in Terrain without getting slowed to hell and back - Really helpful on maps with lotsa siege stuff and watchtowers, since hidden units can't be targeted with long range attacks and assists (except for Catapult, since it's area based and not unit target - but then you play the Berwick game of spot the enemy before they spot you) - while fliers are sitting ducks since they can't hide.

Infantry also have the most Stamina, and Cavs getting fatigued faster does balance them a bit - but not enough for that huge mobility advantage. Other classes need a big MoV buff (instead of nerfing cavs, as that will slow the game down i imagine - although maybe a small Cav nerf would help).

Like, i think

Armors - 100

Infantry - 170

Fliers - 200

Cavs - 280

Would've worked better.

As for skills...

Wild Rush (Cav skill), Dragon Dive (Wyvern skill) and maybe Haste (Griffon skill) are too valuable for their cost

Wild Rush and Dragon Dive cost 3 Valor each, and just allows you too go zooming and deal big damage. Haste increases a unit mobility for 30 secons...might be too cheap for 1 Valor, but eh, it helps infantry, and also fliers through mountains since mountains slow fliers down, so dunno about that.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

ystems like generic units and highly homogenous characters are better suited for a permadeath system where you can lose them at any turn.

The cast isn't that homogenous honestly, and alot of units have unique classes - and even similar classes have different niches and uses. Reclassing is also very expensive (30k gold).

Generics do break the balance tho - hence why i only am using the first one i got from a quest.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

The way you talked I thought everyone was following this thing for the incest.

eh

The story has alot more going to it than incest....

And is it really incest when there's the reincarnation loophole 😛 

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

...personally, I hope he kills one of them off before the end. Then when you post about it here I can laugh about it.

If one dies the other will 100% follow - and it's one of my expected endings honestly.

Edited March 12 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Lightcosmo]

23 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Generics do break the balance tho - hence why i only am using the first one i got from a quest.

The game needs self-crippling right from the get-go! Lol

[Codename Shrimp]

36 minutes ago, Lightcosmo said:

The game needs self-crippling right from the get-go! Lol

Eh

They do cost honors, which you need to do anything in the game - Promotion, deployment expansions, etc.

The problem i see is that classes limited by story/cast become readily available.

For example, the story gives you 1 Wyvern..

With Generics you can have more, with honors being your only limit and you not having any real effort in getting them.

You can also choose their growths

Edited March 12 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Lightcosmo]

13 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Eh

They do cost honors, which you need to do anything in the game - Promotion, deployment expansions, etc.

The problem i see is that classes limited by story/cast become readily available.

For example, the story gives you 1 Wyvern..

With Generics you can have more, with honors bring your only limit and you not to having any real effort in getting them.

You can also choose their growths

So... Is it yes or is it no? Xd

[Saint Rubenio]

39 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Which make cavs just dominate, as putting them as leader will make your squad have a mobility of 200+, since Mobility is heavily geared towards the leader.

This was the impression I got from watching someone play it for a bit a few days ago (and also what they said textually). I don't know if it changes later on but it seemed very slightly less Horse Emblem than FE4 (still extremely Horse Emblem).

40 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

The cast isn't that homogenous honestly, and alot of units have unique classes - and even similar classes have different niches and uses. Reclassing is also very expensive (30k gold).

Generics do break the balance tho - hence why i only am using the first one i got from a quest.

Oh, the way Armagon talked about the designs and stuff, I had thought classes would be a similar deal. My bad there.

41 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

eh

The story has alot more going to it than incest....

Does it have traitors?

41 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

And is it really incest when there's the reincarnation loophole 😛 

The story doesn't exist in a vacuum, it was written by someone with an intention in mind. The intention, clearly, being thinly-veiled incest.

So, yes. Someone put these two in jail. Prison arc.

42 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

If one dies the other will 100% follow - and it's one of my expected endings honestly.

Good. Death is good.

10 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Eh

They do cost honors, which you need to do anything in the game - Promotion, deployment expansions, etc.

The problem i see is that classes limited by story/cast become readily available.

For example, the story gives you 1 Wyvern..

With Generics you can have more, with honors bring your only limit and you not to having any real effort in getting them.

You can also choose their growths

Honestly, the more I see of this game, the less I understand the addition of generics. I know I'm the haha generics guy, but UO seems like a game that was neither designed around nor needed playable generics. Especially with the lack of permadeath, there seems to be absolutely no reason for generics to be there, they just make balancing more difficult. Just make it like Triangle Strategy, every character is different and you need to decide who's best suited for each situation.

[Codename Shrimp]

3 minutes ago, Lightcosmo said:

So... Is it yes or is it no? Xd

Yesn't

XD

5 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I had thought classes would be a similar deal. My bad there

All good

Honestly i love what did they did with the classes - so cool.

7 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Honestly, the more I see of this game, the less I understand the addition of generics. I know I'm the haha generics guy, but UO seems like a game that was neither designed around nor needed playable generics. Especially with the lack of permadeath, there seems to be absolutely no reason for generics to be there, they just make balancing more difficult

+1

If i have to guess, it's for the customization crowd

And well, perma death mode does exist - unlocked after you beat the game

[Lightcosmo]

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Yesn't

XD

That is so unsatisfying. Xd

[Saint Rubenio]

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

All good

Honestly i love what did they did with the classes - so cool.

I haven't delved too deep into it, but I'm loving the hammer folks, like I said before. Just a giant slab of stone on a stick. Fantastic.

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

+1

If i have to guess, it's for the customization crowd

One of the most common... complaints? No, not really - whines about Triangle Strategy was "WAAH WHY NO CUSTOMIZATION, FF TACTICS HAD CUSTOMIZATION", completely ignoring the fact that Triangle Strategy is a different game that is not designed around such a thing. So I suppose I cannot blame them for covering their bases to avoid that issues. But it just seems like they didn't think generics through all that much.

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

And well, perma death mode does exist - unlocked after you beat the game

Yes, but that's exactly it - it's an unlockable challenge mode. You don't add mechanics for the benefit of the unlockable challenge mode, you make sure the unlockable challenge mode is beatable with the base mechanics of the game. Otherwise you just muddy the balance of the entire thing, like generics seem to do here.

[Codename Shrimp]

11 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

but I'm loving the hammer folks, like I said before. Just a giant slab of stone on a stick. Fantastic.

They pew pew pew armors, as you might expect - and they have one of the best attack stats in the game.

The first one you get is a drunk beardy as well

Since you brought em up, i can talk about class differences in similar classes, using them as an example

Along Hammer dudes, for footie Axes early on you have fighters and giant muscle heads.

Hammer dudes crack armor and disable guard

Fighters have parting blow - extra attack at the end of battle

Muscle heads have AoE but low accuracy.

And that just the tip, as they keep differentiating further as they lvlup and promote

11 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

One of the most common... complaints? No, not really - whines about Triangle Strategy was "WAAH WHY NO CUSTOMIZATION, FF TACTICS HAD CUSTOMIZATION", completely ignoring the fact that Triangle Strategy is a different game that is not designed around such a thing. So I suppose I cannot blame them for covering their bases to avoid that issues. But it just seems like they didn't think generics through all that much.

One other reason i could also think of is that generics are a way to fill your roster if you decide to go Excelblem Marth

Edited March 12 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Saint Rubenio]

Just now, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

They pew pew pew armors, as you might expect - and they have one of the best attack stats in the game.

The first one you get is a drunk beardy as well

Since you brought em up, i can talk about class differences in similar classes, using them as an example

Along Hammer dudes, for footie Axes early on you have fighters and giant muscle heads.

Hammer dudes crack armor and disable guard

Fighters have parting blow - extra attack at the end of battle

Muscle heads have AoE but low accuracy.

And that just the tip, as they keep differentiating further as they lvlup and promote

Fucking fantastic.

I also know that there's this crossbow girl, uh whatsherface, I know she had the best female design I saw from this game. Anyway, I was told by the person I was watching that she promotes to get a greatshield, which is how crossbowmen were used in real life. We thought that was a nice touch.

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

One other reason i could also think is that generics are a way to fill your roster if you decide to go Excelblem Marth

But, again, there's no permadeath normally. In this case I feel they should've done like DSFE. Have generics appear if you're really low on normal characters in permadeath mode, to give the player some leeway. Otherwise, just use the real characters. And, of course, in this way, no generics in the main campaign, which seems like it'd be a good thing. The thing you said about the one wyvern reminded me of Berwick, and how much of a disaster it'd been if the game had let you have more wyverns than Larentia.

[Codename Shrimp]

14 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

also know that there's this crossbow girl, uh whatsherface, I know she had the best female design I saw from this game. Anyway, I was told by the person I was watching that she promotes to get a greatshield, which is how crossbowmen were used in real life. We thought that was a nice touch.

Yh Shieldshooters. High Atk and def, ultility/poison shenanigans, but slow

Archers have higher accuracy, skills that ignore evasion and can multitarget

Elven Archers get to use Magic in their attacks, lower enemy avo and cure ally debuffs.

14 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

But, again, there's no permadeath normally.

That is true, but you can fuck up recruitments and/or recruitment chains

For example, in Drakenhold there's an enemy you can recruit by having a healer that starts as a green unit talk to him

Thing is - both have no squads, and thus can easily die - and they are both parts of different recruitment chains to recruit later characters.

That said, i do agree with your sentiment yh.

14 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

The thing you said about the one wyvern reminded me of Berwick, and how much of a disaster it'd been if the game had let you have more wyverns than Larentia

Yuuuup - exactly.

Honestly, my feelings towards this game are developing to be quite similar to Berwick, ie. "Great, unique and fun, but please have a sequel to iron out some stuff here and there"

From what i read tho, VW doesn't do sequels, so probably will meet the same fate as Berwick 2.

Edited March 12 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Saint Rubenio]

2 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

That is true, but you can fuck up recruitments and/or recruitment chains

For example, in Drakenhold there's an enemy you can recruit by having a healer that starts as a green unit talk to him

Thing is - both have no squads, and thus can easily die - and they are both parts of different recruitment chains to recruit later characters.

That said, i do agree with your sentiment yh.

Well, then just have the DSFE generics in the main campaign as well. Have them be an emergency resort, not something you just break the game with.

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Yuuuup - exactly.

Honestly, my feelings towards this game are developing to be quite similar to Berwick, ie. "Great, unique and fun, but please have a sequel to iron out some stuff here and there"

From what i read tho, VW doesn't do sequels, so probably will meet the same fate as Berwick 2.

That's rather high praise, considering I like Berwick even more than you do. At 60 bucks though... Concerns have more weight when the investment is that high. I know there's a long demo, but you didn't perceive any of these complaints in the demo, and experiences like CrossCode and Octopath Traveler 2 have made me a bit wary of trusting my impressions of demos too much lol

I'll likely wait and see if this one goes on sale.

[Codename Shrimp]

30 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

At 60 bucks though...

*whispers*

I got it for 40

 

Tbh, i think your biggest problems with the game would be

a) down time

b) liberation quests

 

[Lightcosmo]

I love this about their site for Trails:

This is one of Van's crafts they give you info about, what they don't tell you about it is that it also has an effect that acts like provoke, forcing enemies to target him I want to say, it's set at 90%? Of the time. Big misleading right there.

[Armagon]

3 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

o punish you for losing units. Triangle strategy has no permadeath (and it REALLY wouldn't work there, every unit is so specialized) but units die if a stiff breeze blows over them so the challenge is in deploying the right tools and using them correctly to beat back the storm before it overwhelms your entire team.

This... From what Shrimpers says, no permadeath might have lead to this game being too easy. Systems like generic units and highly homogenous characters are better suited for a permadeath system where you can lose them at any turn. Without it, it's a bit of an excess of units without a real reason to use most of them. Just speculating here, though, of course.

Well the difference between Triangle Strategy and Unicorn Overlord is that in the latter, you have to commit to a round of combat when two units meet. If the forecast says you lose, you lose. With TS, you don't have to commit so you can send in someone else.

2 hours ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Which make cavs just dominate

Kid named Griffin Rider.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Especially with the lack of permadeath, there seems to be absolutely no reason for generics to be there, they just make balancing more difficult

It's there to help you fill out squads if you need to. If you only stick to recruitables, you'll end up with a squad of two people for the time being.

59 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

From what i read tho, VW doesn't do sequels, so probably will meet the same fate as Berwick 2.

At most, it'll get the Rebirth/Leifthrasir treatment. But Unicorn Overlord took 10 years to make, I think this is it.

[Codename Shrimp]

9 minutes ago, Armagon said:

's there to help you fill out squads if you need to. If you only stick to recruitables, you'll end up with a squad of two people for the time being

I had that only happen once so far

10 minutes ago, Armagon said:

But Unicorn Overlord took 10 years to make, I think this is it.

F

[Armagon]

All that just to release Persona 3 Reloaded Pink in 2026.

10 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

F

Even if they revisit the genre, I don't think it'll necessarily be a spiritual sequel either, going by the differences between Muramasa, Odin Sphere and Dragon's Crown as an example.

[Codename Shrimp]

15 minutes ago, Armagon said:

All that just to release Persona 3 Reloaded Pink in 2026.

An 18 yo game for 135 bucks

Amazing

16 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Even if they revisit the genre, I don't think it'll necessarily be a spiritual sequel either, going by the differences between Muramasa, Odin Sphere and Dragon's Crown as an example.

And GrimGrimoire, Aegis Rim and now UO

[Acacia Sgt]

8 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

An 18 yo game for 135 bucks

Amazing

Be thankful the price conversion is not adjusted for inflation. If it was 135 USD back then, then it'd be a little over 200 today.

Edited March 12 by Acacia Sgt

[Sidereal Wraith]

13 hours ago, Armagon said:

Oshi no Ko not beating the incest allegations.

13 hours ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

❤️

It doesn't need to, AquRuby is the way - and the only way the story works.

 

[Sidereal Wraith]

6 hours ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

The story has alot more going to it than incest....

And is it really incest when there's the reincarnation loophole 😛 

 

A dramatization of Wraith’s reaction when hearing more details about UO’s plot:

 

[Acacia Sgt]

Okay, gonna visit the East/North Sewers first.

[Acacia Sgt]

> Edel Guarders

Now why does that sound familiar, I wonder...

[Armagon]

Yeah i think UO's Rapports where the fix i was looking for with regards to FE Supports.

12 hours ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

An 18 yo game for 135 bucks

Amazing

*$215 cause if you bought the Aigis Edition that doesn't bring The Answer.

But like

They marketed this as just the original game as a "complete experience". No FeMC route btw.

Atlus thinks people dumb as hell. "Yeah we weren't gonna do it but the fans convinced us too" like they didn't have a trailer ready a month after release.

$35 for fucking nothing bro, even Three Houses' DLC pass had more stuff.

And like, The Answer was part of P3FES. So they took something out of the game to sell it back at you lmaooooooooo. 

Atlus will never be them

Atlus overcharges for DLC, Monolith Soft makes their DLC too cheap for the amount of stuff they put in there (both of these are cheaper than the P3R DLC).

9 hours ago, Sidereal Wraith said:

A dramatization of Wraith’s reaction when hearing more details about UO’s plot:

Wraith what do you think of this image

[Acacia Sgt]

Okay, done with the sewers. Will continue tomorrow.