FFtF topic quality

[Cynthia]

I already said I generally avoid it. If I get a report that hasn't been resolved, I do my best. Otherwise, is it supposed to be a whole lot better than GFaqs?

All that does is creates more and more issues that you're ignorant on, then you have to spend time playing catch up to figure out where judgment is needed, and by then the problem escalates.

[TLSothe]

Hey Fox, why don't you try doing your job? It's a good thing. Being a Moderator means you moderate.

Maybe you need a defition for the word?

Edit: Yeah, too harsh I guess. I tend to overstep like this, old habits die hard, eh? I'll be less harsh...

Edited November 29, 2008 by Blue Fox of Water

[Cynthia]

Hey Fox, why don't you try doing your job? It's a good thing. Being a Moderator means you moderate.

Maybe you need a defition for the word?

Let's not point the finger at her. As it isn't entirely her fault, its all the people who spam there's fault, and the other staff members who share the blame.

As I do give Fox credit for actually trying at least once, regardless of being successful or not, she made and effort, she just stopped trying after that. Mostly because she had insufficient help.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Cynthia

[TLSothe]

Let's not point the finger at her. As it isn't entirely her fault, its all the people who spam there's fault, and the other staff members who share the blame.

Well, of course. The ones doing what we try to stop carry a good amount of blame, as well as the other Staff. It isn't like (Most) Of them do the whole Moderation ordeal themselves.

Edit: Fox did try once, but she failed, sure. But is stopping trying going to help anything? Fail, try again, fail, improve yourself, prepare better, try again, repeat.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Blue Fox of Water

[Florete]

What's funny is that I previously heard from someone that any moderator who logs on for maybe an hour every other day and addresses current issues is a good enough moderator. I do more than that, yet I'm being told how to do my job?

GameFAQs may be trolled up, but some of what happend there IS serious, I've seen it and been apart of it. I can say the exact same thing for FFtF, and that's all I should need to say.

And yeah, I can't see EVERY damn thread that's created, so I NEED people to report problems. Hell, I was gone for four days this past weekend. You think I was able to look through every single damn topic to sort out problems? If I can't wait for reports, I can hardly even do my job! Especially with the fairly recent influx of members, a LOT of threads are being made. More than one mod can handle. Yes, there are others. Find out what they're doing before criticizing me for not doing my job. Chances are, they are more or less handling it. I know Hanz planned to a while back.

[TLSothe]

What's funny is that I previously heard from someone that any moderator who logs on for maybe an hour every other day and addresses current issues is a good enough moderator. I do more than that, yet I'm being told how to do my job?

GameFAQs may be trolled up, but some of what happend there IS serious, I've seen it and been apart of it. I can say the exact same thing for FFtF, and that's all I should need to say.

And yeah, I can't see EVERY damn thread that's created, so I NEED people to report problems. Hell, I was gone for four days this past weekend. You think I was able to look through every single damn topic to sort out problems? If I can't wait for reports, I can hardly even do my job! Especially with the fairly recent influx of members, a LOT of threads are being made. More than one mod can handle. Yes, there are others. Find out what they're doing before criticizing me for not doing my job. Chances are, they are more or less handling it. I know Hanz planned to a while back.

Get defensive Fox. Swear at us a bit. It makes you look so mature.

We don't want you to see every damn thread made. Just...try. Just waiting for a report is not productive. 90% of the users don't report posts at all. You have to look. I am trying to be as gentle and non-severe about this as I can. But you cursing us out and using caps for emphasis(When bolding does the same thing and looks a bit less severe) doesn't help keep my temper under wraps. I Don't want to be the old Sothe everyone knows and act like an idiot, but damn, you're making it hard.

[Cynthia]

What's funny is that I previously heard from someone that any moderator who logs on for maybe an hour every other day and addresses current issues is a good enough moderator. I do more than that, yet I'm being told how to do my job?

GameFAQs may be trolled up, but some of what happend there IS serious, I've seen it and been apart of it. I can say the exact same thing for FFtF, and that's all I should need to say.

And yeah, I can't see EVERY damn thread that's created, so I NEED people to report problems. Hell, I was gone for four days this past weekend. You think I was able to look through every single damn topic to sort out problems? If I can't wait for reports, I can hardly even do my job! Especially with the fairly recent influx of members, a LOT of threads are being made. More than one mod can handle. Yes, there are others. Find out what they're doing before criticizing me for not doing my job. Chances are, they are more or less handling it. I know Hanz planned to a while back.

Logging on now and then and addressing issues is one thing, but flat out ignoring entire sections is another. Plus we can't have EVERY moderator doing that.

Yes, we are encouraging people to report, but we are also saying that not everything gets reported right away, because of an irresponsible bunch of users, and they become irresponsible from not being attended to by the staff. As much as I detest having to be babysat by staff members, the users here have proven they are incapable of handling themselves without it. Thus all staff members should try a little more to look at more sections to see what is going on.

If the job is too hard for you, then resign. No one is FORCING you to do this job.

You can ask for help too, as it's not as if you can't put a request in for more help. However I have no way of telling if you have already done that or not.

Plus I just said I'm not pointing the finger at you specifically, and I give you credit for what you do.

You understood the conditions when taking the job. So unless you just took it to have power and be higher than everyone, which I highly doubt, as I see you as more sensible than that, then you have to be ready to be addressed with these problems and help compromise about it.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Cynthia

[TLSothe]

Logging on now and then and addressing issues is one thing, but flat out ignoring entire sections is another. Plus we can't have EVERY moderator doing that.

Yes, we are encouraging people to report, but we are also saying that not everything gets reported right away, because of an irresponsible bunch of users, and they become irresponsible from not being attended to by the staff. As much as I detest having to be babysat by staff members, the users here have proven they are incapable of handling themselves without it. Thus all staff members should try a little more to look at more sections to see what is going on.

If the job is too hard for you, then resign. No one is FORCING you to do this job.

You can ask for help too, as it's not as if you can't put a request in for more help. However I have no way of telling if you have already done that or not.

Plus I just said I'm not pointing the finger at you specifically, and I give you credit for what you do.

The bolded ones are things where you stole words right out of my mouth. The rest is just stuff I would've said, but in a different manner.

[Cynthia]

Also, you were one of the people who said we didn't need any more moderators, and now you're telling us you're having trouble doing your job?

[Arch]

If I can't wait for reports, I can hardly even do my job!

And therein lies the problem. How often do members actually report things? I know on my forum there are hardly any reports from members. It's the staff's job to police the members, not the members job to police themselves. You can't expect to have members report things to you because they won't because it's not their job to do so. It's a moderator's job. Now, maybe I just have a high standard for moderators, my staff is extremely good and devoted at their jobs. They don't rely on reports from members to weed out rule-breakers, they go and hunt them down. That's what makes a good moderator, someone who is good and devoted at their job. Now, nobody ever said you had to be alone. That's why there are multiple mods. Mods are supposed to work together as a team to solve problems, just because you have people working on things doesn't mean you can slack and let them take care of it, help them to get the job done faster.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Arch

[TLSothe]

Also, you were one of the people who said we didn't need any more moderators, and now you're telling us you're having trouble doing your job?

Contradicting yourself ftllll RFoF.

[Florete]

Get defensive Fox. Swear at us a bit. It makes you look so mature.

We don't want you to see every damn thread made. Just...try. Just waiting for a report is not productive. 90% of the users don't report posts at all. You have to look. I am trying to be as gentle and non-severe about this as I can. But you cursing us out and using caps for emphasis(When bolding does the same thing and looks a bit less severe) doesn't help keep my temper under wraps. I Don't want to be the old Sothe everyone knows and act like an idiot, but damn, you're making it hard.

I'm not even swearing yet. I swear when I'm angry. I say damn rather normally. Sue me. Oh, and caps are just easier than bold. It depends on my mood which one I use.

I did like the old Sothe, by the way. I'm not saying I don't like Blue Fox of Water, but I did like the old Sothe.

Logging on now and then and addressing issues is one thing, but flat out ignoring entire sections is another. Plus we can't have EVERY moderator doing that.

Yes, we are encouraging people to report, but we are also saying that not everything gets reported right away, because of an irresponsible bunch of users, and they become irresponsible from not being attended to by the staff. As much as I detest having to be babysat by staff members, the users here have proven they are incapable of handling themselves without it. Thus all staff members should try a little more to look at more sections to see what is going on.

If the job is too hard for you, then resign. No one is FORCING you to do this job.

You can ask for help too, as it's not as if you can't put a request in for more help. However I have no way of telling if you have already done that or not.

Plus I just said I'm not pointing the finger at you specifically, and I give you credit for what you do.

I don't flat out ignore it, I'm just not there very often. Hell, I don't pay a lot of attention to any of the General forums, but I look and make sure there's nothing that needs attention. If there is, I take care of it, but you won't find me posting much outside of the Fire Emblem forums. It doesn't mean I'm neglecting my duty.

Yes, you said you aren't pointing fingers, but I needed to address my side of things. Tell me, about how many of the FFtF topics generally contain things you deem to need staff attention?

Also, you were one of the people who said we didn't need any more moderators, and now you're telling us you're having trouble doing your job?

Contradicting yourself ftllll RFoF.

Where did I say we needed more mods?

Edited November 29, 2008 by Red Fox of Fire

[Cynthia]

I'm not even swearing yet. I swear when I'm angry. I say damn rather normally. Sue me. Oh, and caps are just easier than bold. It depends on my mood which one I use.

I did like the old Sothe, by the way. I'm not saying I don't like Blue Fox of Water, but I did like the old Sothe.

I don't flat out ignore it, I'm just not there very often. Hell, I don't pay a lot of attention to any of the General forums, but I look and make sure there's nothing that needs attention. If there is, I take care of it, but you won't find me posting much outside of the Fire Emblem forums. It doesn't mean I'm neglecting my duty.

Yes, you said you aren't pointing fingers, but I needed to address my side of things. Tell me, about how many of the FFtF topics generally contain things you deem to need staff attention?

I'm sure you've seen reports from me. So there's no need to answer that question, as you already know, but to humor you, I see things almost EVERYDAY that don't need to be there, or shouldn't be there. And the point of this topic is that the amount of idiocy in the FFtF section needs to stop, if we reported all of it, then you wouldn't be able to do your job simply because there would be too much job to do.

I am addressing your side of things because you brought it up, I am just making a reply to your statements.

Edit: And if you read that, it says you said we DIDN'T need more moderators.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Cynthia

[TLSothe]

I'm not even swearing yet. I swear when I'm angry. I say damn rather normally. Sue me. Oh, and caps are just easier than bold. It depends on my mood which one I use.

I did like the old Sothe, by the way. I'm not saying I don't like Blue Fox of Water, but I did like the old Sothe.

That surprises me. Not even I like the old Sothe. I was a fucking idiot when I was Sothe. Which is why I refuse to have my name Sothe anymore. Sothe is a persona I have left in the dust, to die, and as such, I prefer to keep the name the same. Just know, I don't mean to specifically target you, I like you, I do. I just like to argue, which is an heirloom from the old Sothe that has yet to die. :P

I don't flat out ignore it, I'm just not there very often. Hell, I don't pay a lot of attention to any of the General forums, but I look and make sure there's nothing that needs attention. If there is, I take care of it, but you won't find me posting much outside of the Fire Emblem forums. It doesn't mean I'm neglecting my duty.

Yes, you said you aren't pointing fingers, but I needed to address my side of things. Tell me, about how many of the FFtF topics generally contain things you deem to need staff attention?

Probably 60%

People act like idiots in FFtF, and flame wars ensue. Basically any topic where Lyle and MaSu both post in, that I post in too gets dangerous, and anything with shuuda and I. Actually, FFtF needs more attention than most other sections.

[Cynthia]

To add to what Blue Fox said, I have nothing against you personally Red Fox, but I disagree with some of the things you are saying and/or doing.

But basically the smart have little to no power, while the village idiot controls the show. We can't keep bending things to please the spammers. If we stop some of the spamming now, and start getting people into good habits and behavior, we won't need as much moderation.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Cynthia

[Florete]

Edit: And if you read that, it says you said we DIDN'T need more moderators.

Exactly.

Probably 60%

People act like idiots in FFtF, and flame wars ensue. Basically any topic where Lyle and MaSu both post in, that I post in too gets dangerous, and anything with shuuda and I. Actually, FFtF needs more attention than most other sections.

Point to as many as you can. Right now.

To add to what Blue Fox said, I have nothing against you personally Red Fox, but I disagree with some of the things you are saying and/or doing.

To each his/her own, I suppose.

[Cynthia]

Basically, we want it so that just because members who post this idiocy outnumber us, doesn't mean they should be allowed to do so and trample us over because they have superior numbers.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Cynthia

[TLSothe]

Exactly.

Point to as many as you can. Right now.

To each his/her own, I suppose.

I can't. Too many idiotic topics are hiding those ones.

[Florete]

I can't. Too many idiotic topics are hiding those ones.

If you can't link me, I can't help you. I just took a quick look and saw nothing fitting your description. I didn't see every thread, but are you getting my point? I don't think they happen as often as you think, just that you're always involved in them.

[Cynthia]

Red Fox, if you say we didn't need more moderators, and now you're saying you're having trouble doing your job, and that without reports it makes it harder, when we got 1 new moderator and 1 new admin, then clearly we DO need more moderators, or more out of the ones we have.

[Defeatist Elitist]

FFtF might be spam, but if it's just a bunch of one word posts than there is no reason for it to be a topic.

Topics about how Moulder fights for his friends, or about random Lord of the Rings quotes, or about how much you love the new smilie are all well and good, but when people start doing nothing but posting "XD", "ok", "lol", "penis", etc, it becomes a problem. If I want to do that I use a chat, because you're right, it's NOT a forum. A forum is not the place for that type of thing. At it's core it's just a fundamental lack of respect, thought, and basic discipline. Even saying "This topic makes me want to eat Gheb's underwear." shows that you've at least spent some time with the idea. It's not always great, but it's not as bad as some of the things we have now.

For example (yey, finger pointing time):

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=9527

Someone posts:

"SO....

SMECKSXHY."

AND THEN QUOTES HIMSELF AND ADDS NOTHING ONE POST LATER.

I've seen this behavior elsewhere as well.

People respond to topics and just say "Yay", "yeah", or something like that. You don't have to post just to acknowledge the topic's existence. :P

Edited November 29, 2008 by ZXValaRevan

[Cynthia]

ZXValaRevan makes a good point. We can't deem these topics, "reportable," because you'll just send something back saying it's spam in a spam forum. So what's the point in reporting them if nothing is done about them?

[TLSothe]

FFtF might be spam, but if it's just a bunch of one word posts than there is no reason for it to be a topic.

Topics about how Moulder fights for his friends, or about random Lord of the Rings quotes, or about how much you love the new smilie are all well and good, but when people start doing nothing but posting "XD", "ok", "lol", "penis", etc, it becomes a problem. If I want to do that I use a chat, because you're right, it's NOT a forum. A forum is not the place for that type of thing. At it's core it's just a fundamental lack of respect, though, and basic discipline. Even saying "This topic makes me want to eat Gheb's underwear." shows that you've at least spent some time with the idea. It's not always great, but it's not as bad as some of the things we have now.

For example (yey, finger pointing time):

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=9527

Someone posts:

"SO....

SMECKSXHY."

AND THEN QUOTES HIMSELF AND ADDS NOTHING ONE POST LATER.

I've seen this behavior elsewhere as well.

People respond to topics and just say "Yay", "yeah", or something like that. You don't have to post just to acknowledge the topic's exsistence. :P

For the record, That was about Aragorn, and his badassness. A serious topic. It was turned into idiocy.

[lolDeath]

If you can't link me, I can't help you. I just took a quick look and saw nothing fitting your description. I didn't see every thread, but are you getting my point? I don't think they happen as often as you think, just that you're always involved in them.

Do you honestly expect us to link you to bad topics? You are the moderator, not us.

[Florete]

Red Fox, if you say we didn't need more moderators, and now you're saying you're having trouble doing your job, and that without reports it makes it harder, when we got 1 new moderator and 1 new admin, then clearly we DO need more moderators, or more out of the ones we have.

I don't recall saying I was having trouble doing my job, just that I can't do it alone. You should understand that. When we got a new mod and admin, I was actually opposed to it, but I didn't pursue it much because I trust in Vincent's decisions.

FFtF might be spam, but if it's just a bunch of one word posts than there is no reason for it to be a topic.

If people can't spam in a spam board, what do you suggest they do there? And yes, your post pretty much suggested people should stop spamming altogether there. I'm not saying it should be only spam, but you have to allow it if that's where it's been told to go.

Do you honestly expect us to link you to bad topics? You are the moderator, not us.

I get it. I'm the mod, so I should do all the work and none of the members should be lifting a finger to contribute. Fair enough. /sarcasm

Edited November 29, 2008 by Red Fox of Fire