Three Hopes General Discussion Thread

[vikingsfan92]

2 hours ago, Sire said:

Out of curiosity, how does losing characters in Classic Mode actually work?
-- Specifically, does it save the data for when one "re-recruits" them (either by recruiting in a different route or starting a brand new playthrough), or does it reset everything back to their initial "starting state?"
-- I have no intention of testing this myself as I simply restart when a character dies (or simply shift to Casual once my Classic playthroughs are done).

Speaking of Casual Mode, any indicators of a special reward/title screen update for doing Maddening Classic in Three Hopes (through NG+ or NG)? While I currently plan on sticking with Classic for my 2nd round of playthroughs on Maddening, I am tempted to shift to Casual to try out HP Threshold builds and not be caught off-guard by potential "one-shots."
-- I know there are title screen updates for finishing routes, which I noticed after finishing my NG+ playthrough.

I have a separate switch profile and haven't played past chapter 4 on it bit I did kill off a charcter just to see what happened. You still can see them grayed out in some menus like convoy and unit info.  Funnily enough you can change there class and give them equipment despite being dead lol. But you can't train them or level them or give them battailons.

So my guess is it keeps that level and classes mastered when they died for ng+ as if you benched them.

Doretha is dead and these are some menu things you can do 

Edited July 19, 2022 by vikingsfan92

[Sire]

21 hours ago, vikingsfan92 said:

I have a separate switch profile and haven't played past chapter 4 on it bit I did kill off a charcter just to see what happened. You still can see them grayed out in some menus like convoy and unit info.  Funnily enough you can change there class and give them equipment despite being dead lol. But you can't train them or level them or give them battailons.

So my guess is it keeps that level and classes mastered when they died for ng+ as if you benched them.

Interesting. I guess they are simply locked off from deployment until they are "re-recruited" again.
-- Thanks for testing!
* * * * *

Played some more Golden Wildfire, having just started Part Two.

Spoiler

Looks like Golden Deer has two separate story arcs, the first dealing with the Alliance and its issues, and the second being the Federation's war with the Kingdom. This is in contrast with the other two routes which focuses on the overall war, and then part two focuses on that faction getting the upper hand.
-- It was interesting to see Gronder Field, but sadly its a re-used map asset. I half expected to keep pushing into Fort Merceus, but then the Almyra invasion happened again.
-- On the topic of Almyra, it would be nice if it was somehow expanded, but considering the focus is on Fodlan I guess it makes sense that they only had two chapters in the spotlight. I guess it feels weird since it happens chapters apart instead of a follow-up, and both focus around Fodlan's Locket. It seems like wasted potential, but with they way the story went, I'm not sure how to incorporate them without major rewrites (such as actually overrunning Fodlan's Locket, so one chapter has Claude beating them back from Alliance lands and the followup is the showdown at the Locket, which is in Almyran hands. This would add an additional chapter to GW, and helps make GW on par with the total chapters like in SB and AG.)
-- On the topic of Part Two and the setup of Claude vs the Central Church, I suppose it can be seen as a bit sudden. In Three Hopes, Part One was all about defending the Alliance from outside threats (Almyra, Empire) and setting up its future. While we know the motivation of the Empire is to crush the Central Church, Claude doesn't offer much indication of this until Part Two hits.
=== I don't quite remember Claude's stance on the Church in Three Houses. I do know character-wise Claude opens up more in Three Houses, valuing the "power of friendship," but in Three Hopes he still seems detached and plays everything as if it was chess. It's great to see the more schemer side to Claude, although I'm sure this drop into morally grey territory upsets those who know Claude as the "friendly guy with memes."

As an aside, I did a support between Ignatz and Marianne, and suddenly Ingrid was brought up due to the topic being about Pegasi. Ingrid can't be recruited outside of Blue Lions, so I'm guessing this is an oversight since I played the Blue Lions route already.

Now for Claude's unique moveset, I'm not too sold on it. Shooting fireballs is great as a class action, but the combos and their timing just seems off. Perhaps its just something for me to get used to, but I found Edelgard and Dimitri's classes far easier to use than Claude's.

 

[Anomalocaris]

Is anybody else encountering an odd issue where their Smithing Stones mysteriously disappear? Mine keep bottoming out at like 1 or 2 for no reason, even though I'm not spending them on anything (I'm exclusively forging Umbral Steel/Mythril weapons at this point).

[Shadow Mir]

On 7/17/2022 at 10:15 PM, Anomalocaris said:

I wouldn't call it tricky per se, but Annette's assumes you've built her as an axe fighter rather than a mage, with her side of the map having nothing but lance enemies.

Exactly what enemies are on her side of the map? Pegasus/Falcon Knights?

[Anomalocaris]

4 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Exactly what enemies are on her side of the map? Pegasus/Falcon Knights?

I believe it was horseback units like Paladins.

[Shadow Mir]

1 minute ago, Anomalocaris said:

I believe it was horseback units like Paladins.

Hmmm... Might not be as aggravating for a mage as Pegasus knights would be.

Also, what's with the supports? Because I find it really odd that some characters have an A support with no C or B beforehand, among other oddities.

[Jotari]

13 minutes ago, Anomalocaris said:

Is anybody else encountering an odd issue where their Smithing Stones mysteriously disappear? Mine keep bottoming out at like 1 or 2 for no reason, even though I'm not spending them on anything (I'm exclusively forging Umbral Steel/Mythril weapons at this point).

This might sound stupid, but are you trading them for other materials? That's where most of mine end up going.

[Anomalocaris]

25 minutes ago, Jotari said:

This might sound stupid, but are you trading them for other materials? That's where most of mine end up going.

...I didn't even realize the Smithing Stones from trading at the Supply Master and the Smithing Stones that actually sit in your inventory were the same currency. That explains it.

Well, I have no other use for Smithing Stones anyway, so it hasn't been a problem, was just worried I was losing them to something else.

26 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Hmmm... Might not be as aggravating for a mage as Pegasus knights would be.

Also, what's with the supports? Because I find it really odd that some characters have an A support with no C or B beforehand, among other oddities.

You can probably handle it with a mage, though you might not get the S-rank if she's too slow at killing them. It really does seem to want you to reclass her into an axe class for Crusher.

There's just fewer support conversations this time around. I think it's fine, since this is an action game, not an SRPG. The previous FE Warriors did something similar where every character could gain support points with each other, but only certain character pairs had conversations (and only at A-rank).

Edited July 20, 2022 by Anomalocaris

[Anomalocaris]

Edit: Accidental double-post.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Anomalocaris

[ZanaLyrander]

You know, we discussed earlier in this thread whether or not Edelgard is right to declare war on the Central Church, whether or not there was a better way to undo the cultural damage the Central Church has done with their caste system and religiously encouraged xenophobia. But looking back, what really frustrates me is that the conflict between Edelgard and Rhea, in both Three Houses and Three Hopes, is essentially entirely military. They never actually engage one another ideologically, both just kinda accepting that the other is evil and needs to die. I'm not asking them to sit down for an organized, proctored debate, but it's frustrating that they make no effort to really explain or justify their stance to one another. Rhea just treats Edelgard as a naive and wicked child who needs to be put down, and Edelgard treats Rhea as a corrupt force of stagnation that needs to be removed from power by any means necessary (though interestingly she doesn't actually want Rhea dead in Three Hopes). It just seems a shame that they don't really call one another out on the stuff that they do aside from broad platitudes.

[Jotari]

4 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

You know, we discussed earlier in this thread whether or not Edelgard is right to declare war on the Central Church, whether or not there was a better way to undo the cultural damage the Central Church has done with their caste system and religiously encouraged xenophobia. But looking back, what really frustrates me is that the conflict between Edelgard and Rhea, in both Three Houses and Three Hopes, is essentially entirely military. They never actually engage one another ideologically, both just kinda accepting that the other is evil and needs to die. I'm not asking them to sit down for an organized, proctored debate, but it's frustrating that they make no effort to really explain or justify their stance to one another. Rhea just treats Edelgard as a naive and wicked child who needs to be put down, and Edelgard treats Rhea as a corrupt force of stagnation that needs to be removed from power by any means necessary (though interestingly she doesn't actually want Rhea dead in Three Hopes). It just seems a shame that they don't really call one another out on the stuff that they do aside from broad platitudes.

This gets particularly hilarious in Azure Moon where Dimitri does try to sit down and talk with Edelgard (though not literally, of course) and somehow neither of them manages to actually say anything.

[Fabulously Olivier]

1 hour ago, ZanaLyrander said:

You know, we discussed earlier in this thread whether or not Edelgard is right to declare war on the Central Church, whether or not there was a better way to undo the cultural damage the Central Church has done with their caste system and religiously encouraged xenophobia. But looking back, what really frustrates me is that the conflict between Edelgard and Rhea, in both Three Houses and Three Hopes, is essentially entirely military. They never actually engage one another ideologically, both just kinda accepting that the other is evil and needs to die. I'm not asking them to sit down for an organized, proctored debate, but it's frustrating that they make no effort to really explain or justify their stance to one another. Rhea just treats Edelgard as a naive and wicked child who needs to be put down, and Edelgard treats Rhea as a corrupt force of stagnation that needs to be removed from power by any means necessary (though interestingly she doesn't actually want Rhea dead in Three Hopes). It just seems a shame that they don't really call one another out on the stuff that they do aside from broad platitudes.

How exactly would you expect powerful leaders who are Authoritarian Left and Authoritarian Right to sit down and get along exactly? The two are fundamentally incompatible on a base level, and neither is going to see their world realized with the other in power.

 

And here's the thing. Edelgard (and Claude) is correct. And Rhea is correct insofar as her system cannot continue if Edelgard succeeds.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Fabulously Olivier

[ZanaLyrander]

6 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

How exactly would you expect powerful leaders who are Authoritarian Left and Authoritarian Right to sit down and get along exactly? The two are fundamentally incompatible on a base level, and neither is going to see their world realized with the other in power.

 

And here's the thing. Edelgard (and Claude) is correct. And Rhea is correct insofar as her system cannot continue if Edelgard succeeds.

I don't want them to sit down and get along, I want them to yell at each other and call each other out for the shit they're doing. It can be during battle, from across the battlefield before the fighting starts, whatever. Just more complex arguments than 'you're evil, die' would be nice. The characters point out that Rhea is responsible for inequality, xenophobia, lack of social mobility, etc. But none of them ever say that to her face. We never hear Rhea try to justify any of it.

Edited July 20, 2022 by ZanaLyrander

[Fabulously Olivier]

1 minute ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I don't want them to sit down and get along, I want them to yell at each other and call each other out for the shit they're doing. It can be during battle, from across the battlefield before the fighting starts, whatever. Just more complex arguments than 'you're evil, die' would be nice. The characters point out that Rhea is responsible for inequality, xenophobia, lack of social mobility, etc. But none of them ever say that to her face.

I wonder why no one wants to tell the execution-happy tyrant that she does bad things. Dimitri is reluctantly complicit in her evil, Claude is a tactful opportunist, and Edelgard knows her foe is a nigh-unstoppable dragon.

 

As for Rhea, she has never at any point in either game attempted to reform or educate anyone on their wrongdoings. It's off to the chopping block, no trial.

[ZanaLyrander]

4 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

I wonder why no one wants to tell the execution-happy tyrant that she does bad things. Dimitri is reluctantly complicit in her evil, Claude is a tactful opportunist, and Edelgard knows her foe is a nigh-unstoppable dragon.

 

As for Rhea, she has never at any point in either game attempted to reform or educate anyone on their wrongdoings. It's off to the chopping block, no trial.

Yeah, in context I understand why this is the case, it's just frustrating that everyone has all these perfectly valid criticisms of Rhea and the Central Church, and she's never in a position where she has to justify her actions. She clearly believes what she's doing is right, she's not evil for the sake of evil. Many would argue she's not evil at all, though I would certainly disagree. It's frustrating that she seems to be allergic to explaining herself.

[Fabulously Olivier]

2 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Yeah, in context I understand why this is the case, it's just frustrating that everyone has all these perfectly valid criticisms of Rhea and the Central Church, and she's never in a position where she has to justify her actions. She clearly believes what she's doing is right, she's not evil for the sake of evil. Many would argue she's not evil at all, though I would certainly disagree. It's frustrating that she seems to be allergic to explaining herself.

Rhea is absolutely evil. Sympathetically so. She has valid motivations. That just makes her an anti-villain. It's Edelgard that skirts the line between anti-hero and anti-villain.

 

The person who is in the best position to call her out, and in some ways has, is Seteth. His input on the morally dubious nature of her crest stone experiments is good writing.

[ZanaLyrander]

3 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

Rhea is absolutely evil. Sympathetically so. She has valid motivations. That just makes her an anti-villain. It's Edelgard that skirts the line between anti-hero and anti-villain.

 

The person who is in the best position to call her out, and in some ways has, is Seteth. His input on the morally dubious nature of her crest stone experiments is good writing.

Honestly, Seteth's relationship with Rhea has always frustrated me. He calls her out on some of her morally questionable actions, but she basically brushes him off and he just accepts it, continuing to support her regardless.

[Archeleon]

It just feels like Seteth is too beholden to what Rhea did in the past.

Spoiler

Referring to her time as Seiros and I guess "saving" everyone from Nemesis. He may even be afraid of her.

Even if he doesn't agree with her he just folds his judgment up into a paper airplane and launches it off the cliff.

No one is able to check Rhea with words and she doesn't feel the need to listen to anyone. It is pointless to speak to her. All the other leaders can do is try to dismantle what she built around the Church of Seiros. Dimitri can't pull this off with the kingdom as the faith is far too important to them (he admits to this himself). Claude doesn't have a truly unified force to achieve much.

Spoiler

Three Houses Edelgard is able to pull it off with the help of TWSID and only because they hate Rhea even more.

Three Hopes Edelgard is the only one capable of doing so and she had to be extremely brutal and cutthroat about it.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Archeleon

[ZanaLyrander]

10 minutes ago, Archeleon said:

It just feels like Seteth is too beholden to what Rhea did in the past.

  Hide contents

Referring to her time as Seiros and I guess "saving" everyone from Nemesis. He may even be afraid of her.

Even if he doesn't agree with her he just folds his judgment up into a paper airplane and launches it off the cliff.

No one is able to check Rhea with words and she doesn't feel the need to listen to anyone. It is pointless to speak to her. All the other leaders can do is try to dismantle what she built around the Church of Seiros. Dimitri can't pull this off with the kingdom as the faith is far too important to them (he admits to this himself). Claude doesn't have a truly unified force to achieve much. Three Houses Edelgard is able to pull it off with the help of TWSID and only because they hate Rhea even more. Three Hopes Edelgard is the only one capable of doing so and she had to be extremely brutal and cutthroat about it.

The real problem with Rhea is that she is utterly convinced that she knows better than everyone else, yet goes out of her way to avoid sharing that knowledge, actively lying to the world about their history. It makes it all the more frustrating when she goes off about how even a thousand years later humans remain little more than fools, when she's been actively working to ensure that is the case.

[Archeleon]

16 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

The real problem with Rhea is that she is utterly convinced that she knows better than everyone else, yet goes out of her way to avoid sharing that knowledge, actively lying to the world about their history. It makes it all the more frustrating when she goes off about how even a thousand years later humans remain little more than fools, when she's been actively working to ensure that is the case.

I think it's because she was woven such a ridiculous premise that compromising any aspect of it is risky to maintaining the Church of Seiros and its belief system. She has to shut down any dissent as quickly and completely as possible.

[Jotari]

7 hours ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

How exactly would you expect powerful leaders who are Authoritarian Left and Authoritarian Right to sit down and get along exactly? The two are fundamentally incompatible on a base level, and neither is going to see their world realized with the other in power.

That's easy. You offer them Poland.

[Sire]

Slowly making progress of Part II of Golden Wildfire and am starting to make plans for my 2nd round of playthroughs with F!Shez & F!Byleth, on Maddening Difficulty.

However, I have a question. How are the avatar genders handled when changing them in a new playthrough?
-- I remember hearing that Shez still retains all unlocked abilities and classes, but just can't reclass into the gender-locked classes. (This means you can have Essence of Darkness on a F!Shez, despite it being learned from the Dark Mage class as M!Shez.)
-- Does the above also apply to Byleth (and the "Spoiler Bonus Character")? This means that as soon as I start the file, does it automatically updates the "Other" category with their swapped genders?
=== I ask this so I can keep up on my class masteries. M!Shez mastered all classes available while my M!Byleth already mastered the male-locked classes. "Spoiler" is still working on his, which is a little slow due to the lack of Training Ground access and being restricted to Record Battles...

Thanks in advance!

[Archeleon]

4 minutes ago, Sire said:

Slowly making progress of Part II of Golden Wildfire and am starting to make plans for my 2nd round of playthroughs with F!Shez & F!Byleth, on Maddening Difficulty.

However, I have a question. How are the avatar genders handled when changing them in a new playthrough?
-- I remember hearing that Shez still retains all unlocked abilities and classes, but just can't reclass into the gender-locked classes. (This means you can have Essence of Darkness on a F!Shez, despite it being learned from the Dark Mage class as M!Shez.)
-- Does the above also apply to Byleth (and the "Spoiler Bonus Character")? This means that as soon as I start the file, does it automatically updates the "Other" category with their swapped genders?
=== I ask this so I can keep up on my class masteries. M!Shez mastered all classes available while my M!Byleth already mastered the male-locked classes. "Spoiler" is still working on his, which is a little slow due to the lack of Training Ground access and being restricted to Record Battles...

Thanks in advance!

Abilities aren't gender-locked so you can equip them as long as they don't require a gender locked class. F!Shez keeps Essence of Darkness and Dark Mage's Ploy but can't use ploy because it requires Dark Mage/Bishop.

[ZanaLyrander]

4 minutes ago, Sire said:

Slowly making progress of Part II of Golden Wildfire and am starting to make plans for my 2nd round of playthroughs with F!Shez & F!Byleth, on Maddening Difficulty.

However, I have a question. How are the avatar genders handled when changing them in a new playthrough?
-- I remember hearing that Shez still retains all unlocked abilities and classes, but just can't reclass into the gender-locked classes. (This means you can have Essence of Darkness on a F!Shez, despite it being learned from the Dark Mage class as M!Shez.)
-- Does the above also apply to Byleth (and the "Spoiler Bonus Character")? This means that as soon as I start the file, does it automatically updates the "Other" category with their swapped genders?
=== I ask this so I can keep up on my class masteries. M!Shez mastered all classes available while my M!Byleth already mastered the male-locked classes. "Spoiler" is still working on his, which is a little slow due to the lack of Training Ground access and being restricted to Record Battles...

Thanks in advance!

Yeah, any abilities you've learned stay unlocked, even if the character can't use that class anymore. And yes, their gender immediately updates in the Other category.

[Aedan7479]

A couple things I noticed on my second playthrough of Azure Gleam

After Chapter 10, Myson says something about Epimenidies' core, implying it's how Shez has his powers, which raises HUGE questions, and in the Final Chapter, Thales says "all we want is a world with out rulers". These titbits are to fun spot, but I can't help but feel the developers are purposely holding back information. Though it is fun to speculate.

Also, if we have a rough idea of Jeralt's age now (golden wind spoilers):

weird how much important info is in mid-battle dialogue.