Robin V Corrin

[Butterfly Pink]

... even for your siblings, you should not go back.

This is really easy to say as a third party. However, had it been my own sibling calling me home? I wouldn't betray him. I love him. If I did find it in my heart to do so, it'd be due to cowardice, not intelligence: fear for my life over loyalty to my sibling.

Garon wasn't a nice guy...

I have a friend who's father, after losing thousands on a contract repairing a church due to a crooked preacher keeping the money himself instead of paying for the man's hard work, began cooking meth. The fumes from doing so drove him mad. He'd beat my friend, threw him against walls, and would do great physical harm over the smallest slight.

When that same man got cancer, his son, my friend, dropped out of college and was by his side until he died. Some might argue it would have been "smarter" to stay in college, not to forgive this man who did such terrible things to him growing up, but that boy loved his father, despite all that, and was there as his father lost the battle against cancer.

I don't think it is up to us to determine what was right or wrong in that situation, despite what the narrative tells us. I apologize for the personal anecdotes, however I find it difficult to understand that was should blame Corrin for choosing the family that raised him, despite their flaws, when even today there are people and circumstances that show the same sort of selfless love and familial bonds that Corrin might have felt when he chose Nohr.

[TheWerdna]

This is really easy to say as a third party. However, had it been my own sibling calling me home? I wouldn't betray him. I love him. If I did find it in my heart to do so, it'd be due to cowardice, not intelligence: fear for my life over loyalty to my sibling.

I have a friend who's father, after losing thousands on a contract repairing a church due to a crooked preacher keeping the money himself instead of paying for the man's hard work, began cooking meth. The fumes from doing so drove him mad. He'd beat my friend, threw him against walls, and would do great physical harm over the smallest slight.

When that same man got cancer, his son, my friend, dropped out of college and was by his side until he died. Some might argue it would have been "smarter" to stay in college, not to forgive this man who did such terrible things to him growing up, but that boy loved his father, despite all that, and was there as his father lost the battle against cancer.

I don't think it is up to us to determine what was right or wrong in that situation, despite what the narrative tells us. I apologize for the personal anecdotes, however I find it difficult to understand that was should blame Corrin for choosing the family that raised him, despite their flaws, when even today there are people and circumstances that show the same sort of selfless love and familial bonds that Corrin might have felt when he chose Nohr.

See, I think most are not blaming Corrin for that choice, more of everything that comes after.

Conquest should have been about Corrin trying to minimize casualties from the inside (which he sort of does early on then kind of forgets about) while building up support for overthrowing Garon. Like, there are a couple rebellions he deals with, we could have him go "look, guys, I am totally planning to rebel at some point. Hold off for now until we are ready. Plus Hans and Iago should have been offed as soon as possible. The minute they kill people Corrin tried to spare he should just straight up stab them and then go "yeah, there was some enemies left who killed them, sorry dad"

Maybe even this route would lead to overall less deaths, but at the cost of Corrin having to do evil stuff and is personally worse off in the end. Have it be that, yes, from an end justified the means way he did make the right choice, but in terms of morality did not.

That would have made an interesting story.

[Thane]

See, I think most are not blaming Corrin for that choice, more of everything that comes after.

I blame him for both. If you head back to the country ruled by the man who tried to kill you twice and is invading of an innocent country, then you've got some issues. I would've been fine with that if the narrative actually treated Corrin that way though, but we all know that didn't happen.

[Azure Sen]

This is really easy to say as a third party. However, had it been my own sibling calling me home? I wouldn't betray him. I love him. If I did find it in my heart to do so, it'd be due to cowardice, not intelligence: fear for my life over loyalty to my sibling.

The situation's nowhere near that clear-cut. Corrin's just found out that the Nohr siblings (or at least Xander) have been lying to him all his life, that the father he was taught to love killed both of his real parents (yeah, I know, Sumeragi's not his real dad, but Corrin doesn't know that yet), abducted him and locked him away from the rest of the world, had his birth mother killed right in front of Corrin's eyes, used him as a living weapon to kill his own mother, is a brutal tyrant that has tried to kill him twice (three times depending on who you think the hooded man was acting under the orders of), and his siblings have just made it clear that they don't believe him.

[Hunter Nightblood]

The situation's nowhere near that clear-cut. Corrin's just found out that the Nohr siblings (or at least Xander) have been lying to him all his life, that the father he was taught to love killed both of his real parents (yeah, I know, Sumeragi's not his real dad, but Corrin doesn't know that yet), abducted him and locked him away from the rest of the world, had his birth mother killed right in front of Corrin's eyes, used him as a living weapon to kill his own mother, is a brutal tyrant that has tried to kill him twice (three times depending on who you think the hooded man was acting under the orders of), and his siblings have just made it clear that they don't believe him.

Jesus, you would think Corrin would be in (completely justified) angst city after all of that.

[Luankachu]

I prefer Robin. If we're going to have a self-insert, I'd rather them not be idiots. Not only that, but Robin actually feels like a character to me instead of just a blank-slate like Corrin is, specially after reading this post:

http://maverickz3r0.tumblr.com/post/57117847539/why-did-grimas-vessel-have-to-be-a-nice-guy

The situation's nowhere near that clear-cut. Corrin's just found out that the Nohr siblings (or at least Xander) have been lying to him all his life, that the father he was taught to love killed both of his real parents (yeah, I know, Sumeragi's not his real dad, but Corrin doesn't know that yet), abducted him and locked him away from the rest of the world, had his birth mother killed right in front of Corrin's eyes, used him as a living weapon to kill his own mother, is a brutal tyrant that has tried to kill him twice (three times depending on who you think the hooded man was acting under the orders of), and his siblings have just made it clear that they don't believe him.

Let's also not forget that under Garon's direct orders, Hans has (seemingly) killed Gunter, who was more of a parental figure for Corrin than Garon ever was according to the supports.

[mikethepokemaster]

I blame him for both. If you head back to the country ruled by the man who tried to kill you twice and is invading of an innocent country, then you've got some issues. I would've been fine with that if the narrative actually treated Corrin that way though, but we all know that didn't happen.

IS is to blame for cutting corners and making Fate to black and white if you ask me. Xander says everything not black and white there a moraly Grey to War. I mean have we been playing the same game, it so black and white morality it hurts. Edited May 17, 2016 by mikethepokemaster

[Sunwoo]

IS is to blame for cutting corners and making Fate to black and white if you ask me. Xander says everything not black and white there a moraly Grey to War. I mean have we been playing the same game, it so black and white morality it hurts.

IS may be to blame, but they also made the story that way. I mean, we can all moan and complain about the "could have beens" and "had so much potential", but what we got is what we got. Bad writing or not, we can only judge the characters by what we are given, not what could have been.

[Silverphantom88]

Corrin is literally the Marie Sue character. At least Robin had their snarky personality going for them.

Design wise- Male Robin > Male Corrin Female Robin < Female Corrin

[blah the Prussian]

Robin, for all his self insert ness, is a tactical genius. Corrin is no such thing. Robin never commits objectively evil acts because the plot demands it. Corrin, in Conquest, does. In terms of gameplay, Robin simply has more diversity. Robin cleans up.

[Alastor15243]

I could go on and on about all of the things that make Corrin a terrible character, but I'll focus on the one area where Robin is obviously infinitely better:

Believability.

I BELIEVE that Robin is the sort of person people would defer to for tactical decisions. I BELIEVE that Robin is the sort of person who could pull off the sorts of amazing strategies that the player can, and on higher difficulties must, make use of to win the day.

Hell, even for all of my issues with Kris, it's at least made clear that they're really good at strategy.

...With Corrin... their status as leader and player character is just madness. I don't feel like I'm actually playing as Corrin even though the game explicitly states that I am. I feel like a split personality of theirs that takes over during battles to carry their idiot ass to victory, while at all other times they kinda just flop around from point A to point B like an extremely confused blind puppy while everyone else is essentially playing babysitter (often at the cost of their lives) while simultaneously praising them as a borderline messianic figure. Though this behavior is more pronounced in Conquest, it still somewhat applies to Birthright, and even in Birthright it still irks me immensely that we're given nothing in-story to indicate that Corrin is any good at strategy AT ALL.

...That said, from a gameplay perspective I like Corrin slightly more. They're more balanced, have a cool branching promotion, and have the same class access in the long run while making it more of an effort to get it. I also like that they get their own legendary weapon.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Alastor15243

[warchiefwilliams]

There is nothing I can add that hasn't already been said, but here we go.

Perhaps it is because I see more of myself in Robin. We both read for fun and love learning new things, we both study tactics, we both occasionally lack self-confidence and we both tend to insert ourselves into social situations that we are completely unprepared for (I know I can't pair up wyverns!). If nothing else, I saw Robin as a natural progression from a character like Mark, the tactician from FE7. Going from being a background character only occasionally referenced to a deuteragonist is no easy feat, and I thought that with Robin was well done in this regard. Gameplay wise, Robin is a wee bit overpowered thanks to the their ability to be any class and their kid/s inheriting that boon, but all well, the eugenics system of Awakening was fun to play with. I was looking forward to what IS could put out for Corrin. I figured they knew how to handle a player-character now.

Boy, I was about as wrong as Chamberlain when he said "Peace for our time."

Corrin, well I find it really hard to relate to Corrin. I can't relate to a character which causes me to yell at the screen at the sheer absurdity playing out before my eyes. As Alastor put it, I felt like half of a personality. My role was simply to ensure that this piece animu shite didn't get everyone killed during the battles. The other half of their personality was busy blindly following garbage plans (Especially in Conquest) or trusting people that even the most inbred of individuals would question, let alone trust said suspicious individuals leading them into a death trap. I feel like so many problems scattered throughout Fates can be traced back to Corrin, or at least how Corrin's character was written. Which is a damn shame, because I think that Corrin (especially Nohr Princess F/Corrin) is a very aesthetically well-done design.

TLDR: I much prefer Robin for their character and their story role, though I will concede that Corrin is far better balanced gameplay wise..

Edited July 13, 2016 by warchiefwilliams

[eclipse]

I see the replies. I see a dead horse.

Please let the horse rest in peace.