Legendary Archer: Lucina

[Vaximillian]

3 minutes ago, mcsilas said:

i hope i don’t get Azura since i just got her as well last week. Although a non -Atk would be okay but i’m more interested in the other two blues

also huh, between this and the Triangl Advantage banner in one of the daily summon banners, this would actually be the best time to get an Azura if you were missing her and want her I guess

I got my first Azura on her and Corrin’s BHB banner, and my second Azura don’t remember when. I don’t really need a third one, heh.

[Mau]

Meh not a fan of yet another Lucina alt. Don't care much for her art either, if characters gets alts I'd at least like them to get diverse art (e.g. the two Hinokas look really different so I mind that less), but this just looks like the other non-event Lucinas, but now with a bow. But even if her art looked very different, it's still the 5th Lucina while we could've just gotten a second Micaiah instead, which I would've preferred. Oh well, it saves me from focusing on blues next to greens.

I think I'm just going to fully focus on green, I'd really like another Winter Lissa as mine has the worst IVs sadly. Wouldn't mind getting L!Lyn I guess, simply cause I don't have her yet, but doubt I'd ever use her. I fear for LA!Lilina though, as I don't care for her, already have her, and she doesn't have anything useful when it comes to inheritance either really.

I'll pull for blue when there's no greens, cause I really need Shanna for Desperation (why is she so damn rare for me), and would like Ishtar for Odd Atk Wave fodder. Kinda wanna try for colorless too though, as I'd also like a Bow Hinoka with better IVs...

[Ice Dragon]

4 minutes ago, Florete said:

I know we can't tell how many people are simply ambivalent, but why does that matter? I said female characters get exponentially more hate.

Because you're completely ignoring the existence of people who like the characters.

Female characters get stronger opinions. This means in both directions, not just negatively.

I don't believe it's misogyny for people to hold stronger opinions of one sex over the other as I'm pretty damned sure people in general tend to have stronger opinions (both favorably and unfavorably) of the sex that they are attracted to.

[Johann]

19 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Because you're completely ignoring the existence of people who like the characters.

Female characters get stronger opinions. This means in both directions, not just negatively.

I don't believe it's misogyny for people to hold stronger opinions of one sex over the other as I'm pretty damned sure people in general tend to have stronger opinions (both favorably and unfavorably) of the sex that they are attracted to.

Come on dude, it's pretty disingenuous to both sides this, especially when gendered and sexist terms like "waifu" and "thot" appear quite a bit in the community. Don't go downplaying sexism with pedantry.

[Sunwoo]

7 minutes ago, Johann said:

Come on dude, it's pretty disingenuous to both sides this, especially when gendered and sexist terms like "waifu" and "thot" appear quite a bit in the community. Don't go downplaying sexism with pedantry.

Speaking of which, there really is no male equivalent of ... that t-word. Likewise, the only really male equivalent of a term like "slut" is "player". Which tends to be used in a positive way compared to "slut". So, like, sexism is an issue. The extent of which it is an issue, I'm not going to bother arguing over.

[Humanoid]

Mimbo

[TheWill]

4 hours ago, Zangetsu said:

That's rich coming from the guy who believes Lyn deserve getting a 5th alt.

You call toxic, but I'm the guy who did try to get like & understand the franchise, but it's far more insisting to have a "Us Vs Them" mentality.

Don't put words in my mouth. I didn't say Lyn deserves a fifth alt, in fact I explicitly said Lyn has too many alts as well. I was simply highlighting how ridiculous it is to think Lucina "deserves" to have as much alts as Lyn, it's a very warped line of thought. How about... neither "deserve" to have five alts as of this moment because it's too many?

And I don't know why you're distinguishing yourself away from the toxic "Us VS. Them" mentality hoard when your first post was literally "IN YOUR FACE 3DS HATERS". That attitude is just as problematic as the series "elitists" or "Awakebabies".

[Ice Dragon]

1 minute ago, Johann said:

Come on dude, it's pretty disingenuous to both sides this, especially when gendered and sexist terms like "waifu" and "thot" appear quite a bit in the community. Don't go downplaying sexism with pedantry.

The fact that I'm a straight male isn't sexism. The fact that I have stronger opinions about the qualities I like and dislike in females (because that's the sex that I'm attracted to) than in males is not sexism.

 

Maybe people don't like the fact that these are the fifth versions of Lyn and Lucina and it has nothing to do with Lyn or Lucina themselves or their sex. I think people are coming to conclusions on far too less information and are trying to make the situation overblown by pulling the sexism card prematurely.

I'm not downplaying sexism. I'm saying that pulling that card out here was inappropriate and caused needless escalation.

It would be just as inappropriate to call me racist if Basilio were implemented in the game and I didn't like him because his stat spread didn't fit my play style. Yes, Basilio is black. No, his being black is obviously irrelevant to my decision.

[redlight]

12 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

Speaking of which, there really is no male equivalent of ... that t-word. Likewise, the only really male equivalent of a term like "slut" is "player". Which tends to be used in a positive way compared to "slut". So, like, sexism is an issue. The extent of which it is an issue, I'm not going to bother arguing over.

I think the only one that's negative I can recall is gigolo. I guess it speaks volumes when you even try to google promiscuous man words and don't get much words with as negative of context as female ones

[Raven]

I would say that the dislike bar on the video is the way it is because of a few factors that've been mentioned already by a few people:

1. It's Awakening, again.
2. It's another Lucina, besides masked Lucina, base Lucina, Spring Lucina, and Brave Lucina.
3. It's not Micaiah, or some other Lord from a less represented game in the series
4. It's not an OC.
5. Ridiculous kit, with Swift Sparrow on a 9th female unit, still locked to 5*.
6. Shameless bait with less than a month to go before the Brave banner lands by appealing to the droves of Awakening fans.

[Zangetsu]

7 minutes ago, SlipperySlippy said:

Don't put words in my mouth. I didn't say Lyn deserves a fifth alt, in fact I explicitly said Lyn has too many alts as well. I was simply highlighting how ridiculous it is to think Lucina "deserves" to have as much alts as Lyn, it's a very warped line of thought. How about... neither "deserve" to have five alts as of this moment because it's too many?

And I don't know why you're distinguishing yourself away from the toxic "Us VS. Them" mentality hoard when your first post was literally "IN YOUR FACE 3DS HATERS". That attitude is just as problematic as the series "elitists" or "Awakebabies".

Oh I'm done trying to be reasonable. It's high time I embrace all that toxicity not just from the Fire Emblem community but the internet as a whole. I'm done trying to understand one perspective & the other, it amounts to absolutely nothing in the end! You can tell me how dumb alts are, but if you're honestly telling me alts are worst to happen then you have no idea how many times IS could've pulled a dick move. Now I have to witness Hector being on the path on becoming a controversial unit just because he's likely to have 5th alt? Apparently it so much easier to complain what IS doing wrong with the game rather than GOD FORBID enjoying the game. Because no one is patient enough to wait for their characters to be in the game. You really think characters like Rath is never going to be in the game? But does anyone remember how slim it really is to get those units? It's honestly would've been so funny if it wasn't so unbelievably irritating to see how entitle the fanbase has become.  Although, it is funny how much better Serene Forest is compare to all the other website. It's hilarious even.

 

I'm not pretending I'm any better than anyone in the Fire Emblem community. Hell, I'll admit I'm just horrible as they are. It started with CYL Gauntlet doxing & it's cemented with this trailer

[Ice Dragon]

One more thing I'd like to add before I head off to bed:

Robin has virtually the same number of downvotes as Hector and Ryoma despite being female (~500). Any argument that Lyn and Lucina have a significantly larger number of downvotes than other recent Legendary Heroes because they are female will ultimately fall flat until someone can explain why Robin doesn't have a significantly larger number of downvotes than Hector or Ryoma.

 

Actually, looking at the numbers again, I'm pretty sure that both Lyn and Lucina now having five versions is the only reason why they have the massive number of downvotes. I don't think being popular (didn't happen with Ike), being female (didn't happen with Robin), being divisive (not sure how to measure this), or being colored bows (only other thing they have in common?) are anywhere near enough of a reason only the two of them are having this occur.

Though I'm wondering why Ike and Ephraim managed to get so few downvotes compared to Ryoma. Alt fatigue, I guess? Both Ike and Ephraim made it in before we got hit by alts in full force (Eirika was implemented before Ike, but Chrom was after Ephraim).

 

So to reiterate in case I'm not being obvious enough. Sexism is a problem, but it's not this problem.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Ice Dragon

[redlight]

@ZangetsuIm not trying to be rude or anything, but chill. If there isn't a particular member you can't get along with you can just use ignore option. If you're feeling tense then do something to relax. I personally like to relax by taking long walks while listening to audiobooks.

[Vaximillian]

I’m more wondering why Hector didn’t get as many downvotes, twice. Twice he failed to bring anything new to the table, still staying a boring axe knight with a boring Armads, and yet he’s adored. Lyn and Lucina all bring variance to teams and they are reviled.

[redlight]

4 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

I’m more wondering why Hector didn’t get as many downvotes, twice. Twice he failed to bring anything new to the table, still staying a boring axe knight with a boring Armads, and yet he’s adored. Lyn and Lucina all bring variance to teams and they are reviled.

As Ice mentioned, F!Grima didn't get nearly as much hate and it boils down to both women having 5 alts now

It's worth mentioning that masked Marth was a character you could vote for in CYL

[Vaximillian]

7 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

As Ice mentioned, F!Grima didn't get nearly as much hate and it boils down to both women having 5 alts now

It's worth mentioning that masked Marth was a character you could vote for in CYL

Grima and Hector were lazier than Lyn and Lucina. Grimas were reskins of regular Robins, and Hector was same old Hector with same old Armads and movement time.

Which is why I call new Lucina Lucina#4, not Lucina#5. Masked Marth is not an alt of Lucina.

[NekoKnight]

12 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

I’m more wondering why Hector didn’t get as many downvotes, twice. Twice he failed to bring anything new to the table, still staying a boring axe knight with a boring Armads, and yet he’s adored. Lyn and Lucina all bring variance to teams and they are reviled.

Disappointing that he didn't have more variance but I think people are happy to have more Elibe representation in alts and Hector is a popular character. We'll take more of what we can get.

Edit: And the Hectors have different playstyles even if they are the same class.

Edited July 30, 2018 by NekoKnight

[Zangetsu]

@silveraura25 I know you're not trying to be rude. Hell, it's a sound advice, but I'm so tired of all this complaining! And for what!? One of the most popular character getting her 5th alt!? Does this somehow impede Kliff being in the game? And now Hector is on his way on becoming a controversial character because how inevitable a 5th alt is for him?

 

It doesn't matter how well or enjoyable anything is, what carries any conversation is always the complaints.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Zangetsu

[Vaximillian]

6 minutes ago, NekoKnight said:

Disappointing that he didn't have more variance but I think people are happy to have more Elibe representation in alts and Hector is a popular character. We'll take more of what we can get.

Lyn is a popular character and increases Elibe representation in alts. How does it work? Not even the inevitable Hector#4 seemed to have made any dent in Hector’s fanbase. When Eirika got an alt just before the CYL2 midterms, her positions got nuked. How does it work, again?

[Paris]

30 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

I’m more wondering why Hector didn’t get as many downvotes, twice. Twice he failed to bring anything new to the table, still staying a boring axe knight with a boring Armads, and yet he’s adored. Lyn and Lucina all bring variance to teams and they are reviled.

I think it's because of several reasons. 

1. Lyn and Lucina have the most amount of alts and both have five. Currently, Hector has two less. 

2. Lucina is one of the most prominent representative of 3DS FE. 

3. Gameplay wise, Hector is one of the best legendary heroes. He's min maxed, good personal weapon, armor unit, gen 2 BST and unique skill making him good for arena play. Sure, Lyn and Lucina may be more unique but they won't score as high as him due to lower BST, can't abuse VF/BF and steady breath. 

I don't think any of these reasons are adequate justifications for the lack of creativity behind Legendary!Hector. After all, he had Wolf Berg and at the very least, Lyn and Lucina offer something new to the table. 

Hector could become controversial if his CYL!Hector still has Armands and he gets another alt (maybe?). 

At this point, I think Hector is overly attached to Armands. It wouldn't hurt him to utilize another weapon for an occasion. 

Edited July 30, 2018 by Paris

[Raven]

Personally the recurrence of Armads doesn't bother me because it's simply a name at the end of the day. The effects between each Armads are vastly different, which is nice.

It would truly suck if all Hector alts used the same original variant of Armads. That would definitely be worth complaining about.

[Humanoid]

I'd certainly be fine with axe Hector, axe Hector on a horse, and axe Hector on a pegasus.

As for the downvotes on the video, we can also assume that a certain proportion of them are there to express general dissatisfaction with the game as opposed to the banner specifically. I mean the last FEH channel wasn't particularly well-received, with the arena changes in particular drawing a lot of ire.

Patch 2.6.0, which was announced just prior to Lyn's legendary banner, had some controversial changes too. The bonus points for fielding blessings in AA, the butchering of the allies menu, and the home screen labels.

[NekoKnight]

39 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

Lyn is a popular character and increases Elibe representation in alts. How does it work? Not even the inevitable Hector#4 seemed to have made any dent in Hector’s fanbase. When Eirika got an alt just before the CYL2 midterms, her positions got nuked. How does it work, again?

Lyn has greater alt fatigue, which I think is the issue here. Eirika had the unfortunate circumstances of 1, being the first alt on regular banners (which made people think "she already got an alt so she doesn't need CYL") and 2 she was a completely made up class that could have been an actual new SS character.

As @Paris mentioned also, Hector is a great unit, no matter what version he is. Berserk Armads and Thunder Armads are unique and powerful upgrades to what was already a widely beloved launch unit.

Edited July 30, 2018 by NekoKnight

[Cobalnite]

Need... Azura... merges...

[TheWill]

 

3 hours ago, Zangetsu said:

I know you're not trying to be rude. Hell, it's a sound advice, but I'm so tired of all this complaining! And for what!? One of the most popular character getting her 5th alt!? Does this somehow impede Kliff being in the game? And now Hector is on his way on becoming a controversial character because how inevitable a 5th alt is for him?

No offence, but you kind of have to get over it. People are complaining, for at least in their opinion, justified reasons. They're not complaining for fun, they're complaining because they're unhappy with designs made by IS.

Obviously, when people aren't happy, they're going to complain. And evidently, a lot of people are unhappy with certain aspects of Lucina's release considering she has the worst like-dislike ratio since the games inception. Heck, it's not even limited to Lucina's release, even the FEH channel had a significant dislike ratio due to the (IMO) frustrating arena changes.