Schoolteacher Mafia

[eclipse]

Oh, sorry, today feels like a Wednesday. Lemme amend that.

[Kaoz]

I'll answer this one because it covers the others too from what I've seen.

1. Can’t sub? Why would that be? The simplest explanation is he meant he doesn’t want to, but the word choice could yet be telling.

2. What /reasons/? If it’s personal reasons, he would’ve said that, nobody would’ve minded. Are these reasons connected to the game?

3. This seems rather blasé, not to mention it’s been a day already and still no thoughts.

1. That's far from the simplest explanation, because if I didn't want to I wouldn't have needed to bring it up in the first place and could have just left it at being busy. I can't sub out because eclipse doesn't let me and I'm not allowed to hydra with Cam either. In the scenario that I would have to be subbed out for inactivity (0 posts during a day phase), I get killed instead, hence my vote post from D2 despite not having read anything.

2. My reasons are none of your business.

3. You're not getting any anytime soon either because I don't feel like playing at the moment. I still haven't read D2, skimmed D3 just now. From what I've seen you guys haven't addressed the extra kill tonight (since Marth/Blitz was likely Neko's work, so there's one left over), so you might want to do that (unless it's another vig that claimed D2). Lynching inactives is also laughable at this point because you're likely still lacking in information overall and won't get a lot of new info that way due to a lack of associative tells. Manix, do you know what sheeping means, and if so would you like to point out where I did it even once this game?

Will consider claiming if people want me to, might vote at some point.

[Grace]

Kaoz you do realize that Rocker isn't dead and that was an oracle reveal?

[Grace]

tbh I'm not feeling like doing much but something is interesting;

Kay targeted Helios and failed. Since Shinori was redirected to Elieson, I'm thinking that maybe Helios had a safeguard on him. Next best question is: why? Or does Helios have some other effect (read: unlikely given Paper flipped part-Ascetic cult) that blocks abilities on him?

actually this is making me wary of Helios fsr and requires looking into.

[CT075]

and I'm not allowed to hydra with Cam either

****NOT PLAYING****

that probably wouldn't have helped with activity in any way whatsoever considering that i'm also being swamped

****END NOT PLAYING****

[Kay]

Hrm ok. Bal's response have been pretty reasonable and I'm going to back off for now, at least partially because of Shinori's point about scum not wanting to target someone who's claimed commuter. Moving on to...

##Unvote

##Vote:Kay

Kaoz has just not been around at all as opposed to you who come in, drop one line posts that give very little that's actually helpful and disappear again without giving reads or dropping a vote or anything. Which is all very unhelpful. So, I'm happy with my vote here.

Kaoz is hosting a game, he's around in terms of being online. I'm making a bit of effort to play even when I'm not very motivated to. Hence the small posts. He isn't, and basically said, nope, screw you, when asked to do more. How am I less helpful?

People I haven’t covered yet:

Most townish

Manix: He just feels really safe to me. His reactions seem genuine enough, and his content is mostly concise and memorable.

Role: Something exotic, if claiming it gets him modkilled (seriously, what’s up with that?)

Balcerzak: Apart from his being blocked N1, he hasn’t done anything to attract my attention. He’d be lower down, but I think it’s unlikely that several people would come to the same conclusion he did.

Role: Something worth putting on a claimed townie, so not safeguard or redirector. Probably an investigative role, to see if he’s on the level.

Scorri: Between the bickering and the “sorry I haven’t given much” posts, she’s provided quite a bit of content. Definitely on my reread list after the next reveal. She hasn’t done much to clear herself, which puts her in the lower half.

Role: could be anything.

Kay: Similar to scorri without the aggression or the content, since her reaction to Mancergate was the same. Therefore I don’t think both would be scum, so I’d rather lynch the less daring one.

Role: Not safeguard, obv.

Kaoz: His content posts have been few and far between, and in my mind, he has the least justification for his quietness. There’s also the matter of the post below.

Role: could be anything.

Least townish

1. Can’t sub? Why would that be? The simplest explanation is he meant he doesn’t want to, but the word choice could yet be telling.

2. What /reasons/? If it’s personal reasons, he would’ve said that, nobody would’ve minded. Are these reasons connected to the game?

3. This seems rather blasé, not to mention it’s been a day already and still no thoughts.

I don’t know if I should vote him since he’s not even my biggest suspect, but we’re still a long way off a hammer, so…

##Vote: Kaoz

Why the heck are you trying to guess unclaimed roles that way? Also, what else would Kaoz mean by reasons? Also, uh, you just listed people from least to most scummy with Kaoz at the bottom, how is he "not even your biggest suspect"? And who is?

[Kay]

Furthermore, there's no reason to just jump on a wagon for the sake of a hammer since there's plenty of time left in the phase. Anyway correct me if I missed something indicating that Baldrick is town, but that post was pretty much 100% scummy imo.

##Vote: Baldrick

[Baldrick]

@Kaoz:

1. I still don't get why you're not allowed to sub out. Did you ask about it and eclipse said no? Or does your role prohibit subbing like Manix's prohobits claiming? Either way, that's the end of that.

2. In hindsight, that was rather rude of me. I apologize.

3. Inactivity is antitown, not scummy so scumhunting based on it, let alone lynching, is stupid and I don't like it one little bit. But what am I supposed to do? Vote for somebody who's posted a lot and I think is town? Tunnel my one serious suspect who I don't have any particularly compelling argument for? But at least I've gained a little information.

##Unvote

[Baldrick]

Why the heck are you trying to guess unclaimed roles that way?

I consider it an easier way to do role speculation. From the events and reports regarding what happened, we can work out what roles are likely to exist. Then we consider what we know about each player, and eliminate what roles they can't be. We can still do PoE for roles easily, and the analysis is more efficient and less reliant on guesswork (we don't know if the role exists, but we do know the player exists and has a role).

Also, uh, you just listed people from least to most scummy with Kaoz at the bottom, how is he "not even your biggest suspect"? And who is?

There are five people not on my list, because I have analysed them before. One I dismissed as town yesterday, his claim basically proved; one has been proved town beyond all doubt; two have reasonably solid claims to their name. I'll let you work out who remains, I'd rather not let him know I'm watching him.

Furthermore, there's no reason to just jump on a wagon for the sake of a hammer since there's plenty of time left in the phase.

Read what I said carefully. My intention was to avoid a hammer; the reason I decided to vote is because it was unlikely to result in a hammer. If I thought my vote could trigger a rush of votes towards a hammer, wouldn't I have voted for my biggest suspect?

[charlie_]

go town

You worry too much

You make yourself sad

You can't change fate

But don't feel so bad

<Prims> oh she just left but

<Prims> turb mentioned that somebody posted a post of my from a mafia game on tumblr

<Prims> so yeah

*mine even

Wow did my role PM mean actual rats? I thought it meant like rats as in underlings

uhhh shouldn't it be ~48 hours and not 24?

Be quiet, all of you.

---

Baldrick's role spec and argument with Kay really doesn't help the town out at all. Also, "I don't want him to know I'm watching him" sounds like something opportunistic scum would say, as soon as a wagon takes off you claim he's your last scumspect. Kaoz's lack of content and then dropping in today without dropping a vote just to defend himself. I disagree on the point on inactives because we don't want them being the last players alive at MYLO, and they're a possible way for scum to coast, so they're harmful to the town in either alignment. Baldrick's last few posts and vagueness in his last suspect strike me as a bit scummier though.

##Vote: Baldrick

[Kay]

Read what I said carefully. My intention was to avoid a hammer; the reason I decided to vote is because it was unlikely to result in a hammer. If I thought my vote could trigger a rush of votes towards a hammer, wouldn't I have voted for my biggest suspect?

I interpreted "we're a long way off from a hammer" as meaning "my vote is needed for a hammer and I won't be able to push a lynch on someone else". Otherwise, why wouldn't you vote for your biggest suspect anyway? We're well past ED1, pressure votes at this point are somewhat silly anyway, especially on someone who's plainly just not bothering to play.

And yeah, Baldrick, it is a good way to do role speculation, which is necessary since when? In fact, it's generally considered scummy. Now, this may be a case where it's useful to a limited extent, but what you're doing is definitely not so good. For example, IIRC Balcerzak hasn't claimed an investigative role at all, why do you want to openly make an observation that he's likely to have one, therefore painting a target on his back?

[scorri]

Baldrick: How many games have you played in exactly? Role spec is rarely if ever useful for town. If this is your first game, I suggest going and reading some past games to see what I mean. Figuring out roles just paints a big target on power roles.

Kay: Well, until Kaoz's most recent post, honestly to me it looked like you were more active lurking as opposed to Kaoz who was just straight up not contributing much. After his last post, his attitude is irking me, but he's still at least being honest that he's not contributing as opposed to you who up until your push on Baldrick was just giving us one liners or occasionally a short paragraph.

[Helios]

##Unvote

##Vote Kaoz

His last post can be translated as a "fuck you town you're not worth my time".

[Shinori]

I would like to point out something about the safeguard. okay so he doesn't target the cop I get that even though mafia wouldn't even know that we had safeguard... why didn't he target me

[Shinori]

Helios vote on kaoz is terrible.

[Helios]

Relax it was off my phone and I hate typing huge posts on touchscreens. But really though what more do I need to say? Kaoz has posted little to no content to speak of, hasn't helped scumhunt, has done the bare minimum ingame, sheeps votes because he doesn't want to read the thread, and has a completely antitown attitude to boot. His last post was just defense and a "fuck you town". At least Kay and Bal are putting more effort towards the game than that. So what's so bad again?

[Shinori]

Oh hey, wait a sec.

No one claimed redirected on Day 2. I blocked Helios Night 1.

Now day 3, I was redirected. WIERD? YEAH I THINK SO.

Especially when you add on the fact that kay says she targeted Helios and was blocked and the safeguard supposedly wasn't on me which is wierd.

I'm gonna say that helios is a redirector and scum safeguarded him so I couldn't block him then just redirected me to elie.

##Unvote:

##Vote: Helios.

Unless someone else has a reason that there was no redirect day 1 but there was one on day 2.

Not to mention his vote on Kaoz is absolutely awful.

In fact I'll take some time to get the whole Helios case together from his day 1 and 2.

[Helios]

Sigh. Let's get this started then.

1. Why is my Kaoz vote bad?
2. Claiming that I'm the redirector and that scum have a safeguard is grasping as all hell. There's so many other possibilities, like the redirector hitting a safeguard, redirector hitting a passive role, the person who was redirected was an inactive or just didn't want to claim, or the redirector idling.
3. Anything you want to say about my play D1 has been defended and shot down in my posts D2, so chances are anything you're going to say has already been said and answered. At this point you're just tunneling, possibly due to emotion from the interactions we had D1, which is just bad and lazy play, so I ask that you focus on the topics at hand.

[Shinori]

Sigh. Let's get this started then.

1. Why is my Kaoz vote bad?
2. Claiming that I'm the redirector and that scum have a safeguard is grasping as all hell. There's so many other possibilities, like the redirector hitting a safeguard, redirector hitting a passive role, the person who was redirected was an inactive or just didn't want to claim, or the redirector idling.
3. Anything you want to say about my play D1 has been defended and shot down in my posts D2, so chances are anything you're going to say has already been said and answered. At this point you're just tunneling, possibly due to emotion from the interactions we had D1, which is just bad and lazy play, so I ask that you focus on the topics at hand.

1. You simple said in your post "His last post can be simply "fuck you town" and you said he hasn't done much scum hunting." Albeit I agree he is pretty scummy, and I have a scum read on him as well but its an easy bus target if you are scum. also if you look at his day 1 his day 1 can be seen as a little townish. It basically seems like your whole case on him started after people started pressuring him and he made that last post.

2. Claiming that you are a redirector and scum has a safeguard isn't grasping as all hell. There is defintely a redirector and there is quite possibly a safeguard if we are to believe kay. I'm sure the inactives could claim it now if they had been. Yes there is a possiblity that it hit a passive ability, but i doubt the redirector idled or hit scum, considering that they redirected me. That means that they are a scum redirector and they had no reaoson to idle and there is no way they would have redirected their buddies. However the biggest part of the issue with the night 1 redirect why didn't they redirect nekorex?

3. This is a lie. This is a complete lie and part of it is an appeal to emotion. Anything said about your day 1 was nulled by your soft claiming day 2. That was why attention was removed from you. I'm thinking about this logically from my point of view which puts scum amongst 6 targets I think. I'll check my spread sheet in a second. You are one of those 6 targets.

Now question how about this helios.

Can you explain why Kay was blocked when targeting you? Or do you think she is lying? If it's the truth then there was definitely a safeguard on you, and why would they be on you instead of me if they were town? Scum would use the scum safeguard either on their kill target or to help their teammate not be roleblocked. Which seems more likely with the safeguard on you?

[Helios]

1. You simple said in your post "His last post can be simply "fuck you town" and you said he hasn't done much scum hunting." Albeit I agree he is pretty scummy, and I have a scum read on him as well but its an easy bus target if you are scum. also if you look at his day 1 his day 1 can be seen as a little townish. It basically seems like your whole case on him started after people started pressuring him and he made that last post.

Relax it was off my phone and I hate typing huge posts on touchscreens. But really though what more do I need to say? Kaoz has posted little to no content to speak of, hasn't helped scumhunt, has done the bare minimum ingame, sheeps votes because he doesn't want to read the thread, and has a completely antitown attitude to boot. His last post was just defense and a "fuck you town". At least Kay and Bal are putting more effort towards the game than that. So what's so bad again?

2. Claiming that you are a redirector and scum has a safeguard isn't grasping as all hell. There is defintely a redirector and there is quite possibly a safeguard if we are to believe kay. I'm sure the inactives could claim it now if they had been. Yes there is a possiblity that it hit a passive ability, but i doubt the redirector idled or hit scum, considering that they redirected me. That means that they are a scum redirector and they had no reaoson to idle and there is no way they would have redirected their buddies. However the biggest part of the issue with the night 1 redirect why didn't they redirect nekorex?

Claiming I'm redirector and scum has a safeguard IS grasping. You can't know for sure whether or not someone would have claimed, and you also forget that someone may not even realize they were redirected if they ended up targeting the same person they wanted to (say redirecting Elieson because they thought he was softclaiming cop towards Prims who looked obvtown D1 rather than one of their buddies). That's just an example of what I'm trying to say and would honestly be pretty lucky if THAT happened, but you get the point. I agree that they probably didn't idle though. Again, they could have just hit a passive ability. You also forget that we all theorized there was a safeguard, and everyone said that the safeguard should target NekoRex. If that's the case, WHY would the redirector target NekoRex and fail their action instead of messing with someone else?

3. This is a lie. This is a complete lie and part of it is an appeal to emotion. Anything said about your day 1 was nulled by your soft claiming day 2. That was why attention was removed from you. I'm thinking about this logically from my point of view which puts scum amongst 6 targets I think. I'll check my spread sheet in a second. You are one of those 6 targets.

Not a lie at all and I could care less about using pathos since all people will do is complain about me using it to my advantage and I'll feel bad (which is ironic yes). You're the only person who caught that I was softclaiming anything so no, that's not true. Prims thought I made good posts in answer to any accusations, Elieson felt that I defended myself well enough that a third party was a better idea to kill off than me, and everyone else who was voting me sheeped their vote so that attention would stay off them (hint: Paper and Kay). Pretty sure out of the six targets you had at the beginning of the phase I WASN'T listed in there.

Now question how about this helios.

Can you explain why Kay was blocked when targeting you? Or do you think she is lying? If it's the truth then there was definitely a safeguard on you, and why would they be on you instead of me if they were town? Scum would use the scum safeguard either on their kill target or to help their teammate not be roleblocked. Which seems more likely with the safeguard on you?

1) Kay could be lying. There is no evidence to say that she isn't.

2) You could be lying and blocked her (though I kinda doubt this and it's part of a super speculation idea I thought of that involves you being scum along with Elieson and a scum!safeguard)

3) Safeguard could have been on me since they aren't tunneling and realize that I'm town, then took into account you pointing out I softclaimed something like a protection role and didn't want anything to happen with that (hint: like a certain someone hooking him :P).

4. Kay could be like an SK or something that tried to kill me, but I was protected and thus her action failed.

Your key flaw in this theory is that you think Kay is town and that I'm scum, which is purely speculation and if even one thing is wrong your entire theory is wrong (and I know for sure half of it is wrong).

[charlie_]

Your key flaw in this theory is that you think Kay is town and that I'm scum, which is purely speculation and if even one thing is wrong your entire theory is wrong (and I know for sure half of it is wrong).

How so?

[Shinori]

I said 7 targets that could have done the kill Night 1.

I didn't say 6 targets that I thought scum were amongst.

SK even though only two kills night 1?

I highly doubt you are a protective role considering the doc is revealed and no one chose to safeguard me. I get the reason for supposedly no targeting the cop I guess, (even though if there was a town safeguard scum wouldn't know unless they had a cop that inspected it).

Like why would the safeguard not target me?

Also Kaoz if you are going to be as inactive as you are going to be, I feel like you should claim.

I also feel that rocker should get in here and out his targets since he is a revealed doc but he hasn't posted this entire phase I don't think.

[Helios]

I'm town, therefore why would a scum safeguard target me? If I was targeted by a safeguard (which there still isn't any proof of though) they'd have to be town as well.

[Shinori]

Why wouldn't a town safeguard target me if they didn't want to target elie?

Also, what's to actually say you are town? Frankly the only thing you have to say to prove you are town is "Hey I'm town, I know I am so I am."

[Helios]

I said 7 targets that could have done the kill Night 1.

I didn't say 6 targets that I thought scum were amongst.

SK even though only two kills night 1?

I highly doubt you are a protective role considering the doc is revealed and no one chose to safeguard me. I get the reason for supposedly no targeting the cop I guess, (even though if there was a town safeguard scum wouldn't know unless they had a cop that inspected it).

Like why would the safeguard not target me?

Also Kaoz if you are going to be as inactive as you are going to be, I feel like you should claim.

I also feel that rocker should get in here and out his targets since he is a revealed doc but he hasn't posted this entire phase I don't think.

SK at this point would be grasping don't get me wrong, and what happens this night phase would decide whether or not that's a possibility or not.

Just because there's a doc doesn't mean there isn't another protective role. Setup/role speculation isn't smart play which we all already know.

You realize that if you were safeguarded then you couldn't be protected by a doc or other protective role and would be an easy kill target right? You realize that there's a higher possibility of a scum!safeguard IF they DID target you because that would practically be a hitman kill, right?

Agree that Kaoz may as well claim and that Rocker should talk. Just because you're a cleared townie doesn't mean you should just coast.