Pokémon uPick Mafia - Day 4

[Grace]

also honestly at this point i cbf'ed defending myself any longer and hopefully my flip will help you find the mafias

no bitching about my flip when it happens though, because you had been warned

[Grace]

okay i checked finally, and yeah crysta has been voteparking. again

does this sound familiar yet?

##Unvote

##Vote: Crysta

may as well make this useful at this point. Not Me Over Me but seeing this shit for the second time just is not okay

Okay, so I fucked up and Crysta is actually town sue me. Firstly, I agree with whoever (Marth?) said that she's never wall posted as scum before but she's not town because it's a wallpost, but moreso because the reads in it flow from her earlier content (or at least what I can remember of it, I'm not going to do ISO's lol). That being said, I'm going to reply to her reads anyways because some read as scummy in a vacuum which still bothers me despite my overall read on her.

also this is scummy as fuck. he moves his opinion to "idk" territory so he can get away from that case for whatever reason.

i kinda wanted to call this out earlier but i thought i might sit on it and see if i feel better about it. i still don't

[Shin]

I've noticed that Crysta and Manix have suddenly started to pay attention to each other when they're both under fire. They're both cross-voting each other after trying to put a case on me. Another thing is that they both seem pretty apathetic to it, with Crysta still not caring if I'm lynched over Manix and Manix providing a case on Refa that feels more substantial than Crysta after giving a weak Crysta vote.

Not saying that they're definitely scumbuddies, but it's a vibe that I'm really getting. I mean, if one did flip scum, it would look kinda bad for the other.

[Bluedoom]

Come on, Shin.

Did you even forget about the Gaius vote? lol

[Grace]

what a scumpost shin

like god i've seen some but that takes the cake

tell me, why would i even vote refa at this junction? there's not enough time to get a lynch on him even if i was dead sure on him

[Grace]

there's a bunch of buzzwords that don't consider the context of the situation. less than 12 hours? you're suggesting i put my vote somewhere where it's completely useless.

something about high standards

also supposing i'm buddies with crysta and the wagon somehow turns, how does that help me if i'm scum? i probably just get lynched tomorrow anyway if crysta flips scum so... enlighten me?

[Grace]

please tell me i'm not crazy that shin's post was objectively terrible

[Prims]

???? are there less than 12 hours remaining right now? I thought we had 24 hours. I'm barely paying attention today because I wasted all my time playing Pokemon Showdown, if we're that low on time I'll do an actual quick read though (have been checking thread but not really thinking about stuff)

[Shin]

Come on, Shin.

Did you even forget about the Gaius vote? lol

Cut the smug, chum. Manix's reason for voting Gaius was weak and his own justification was "he might have been scum".

what a scumpost shin

like god i've seen some but that takes the cake

tell me, why would i even vote refa at this junction? there's not enough time to get a lynch on him even if i was dead sure on him

Playing town isn't about not getting lynched, it's about finding scum. Your case on Crysta is weak and comes across as "not me". Whilst it's natural to not want to be lynched, I would have strongly expected more productive play. I'm not saying that you should embrace being lynched, but your self-preserving attitude sits very badly in my eyes.

there's a bunch of buzzwords that don't consider the context of the situation. less than 12 hours? you're suggesting i put my vote somewhere where it's completely useless.

something about high standards

also supposing i'm buddies with crysta and the wagon somehow turns, how does that help me if i'm scum? i probably just get lynched tomorrow anyway if crysta flips scum so... enlighten me?

If Crysta flipped scum, there'd be at least some distance between the two of you. It was badly executed, but considering your previous interactions, it's a possibility that cropped up in my mind.

[Shin]

please tell me i'm not crazy that shin's post was objectively terrible

Yes, you're crazy!

[Grace]

im bad, there's +24 hours to what i was remembering

don't mind me, but point still kinda remains that it's not like any other push at this point is going to amount to anything, particularly since no one cares about my cases at all

[Grace]

Your case on Crysta is weak and comes across as "not me".

Not Me Over Me

holy shit it's like you don't read

[Grace]

also as town, yes the priority is to lynch mafia but stopping your own lynch when you're under fire is perfectly valid since you know what your own role pm says

i too think i should roll over and die without at least trying :sarcasm:

[Prims]

BT was bugging me though, if Boron's vote on Manix is easy why do you like it? what makes it good? why call Manix's play "null aside from two points" if he was the person you were going to vote?

the way BT keeps cutting people slack while voting them looks insincere when his vote is there anyway... + idk what makes Boron's claim scummy so it looks like he wants an excuse to vote off the big wagon. in any case BT why is Boron still your preferred vote now that you've dropped the role-related case if you found her "null-scum" up until the claim?

[Shin]

im bad, there's +24 hours to what i was remembering

don't mind me, but point still kinda remains that it's not like any other push at this point is going to amount to anything, particularly since no one cares about my cases at all

If you actually presented a solid case, it'd be different. I've seen a tonne of games where scum have been caught in the last 24 hours after it looked like the lynch had already been decided.

Saying "not me over me" doesn't justify the case, even if you explicitly state it.

[Shin]

also as town, yes the priority is to lynch mafia but stopping your own lynch when you're under fire is perfectly valid since you know what your own role pm says

i too think i should roll over and die without at least trying :sarcasm:

It was more that I expected you to actually continue to contribute beyond "not me", even under fire.

[Prims]

it's weirding me out there's no counterwagon here. I was gonna say manix's claim is town because a scum decoy / roleblocker would just have decoy as their safe fake but I'm also wondering if he has to be maf being bussed since everybody agrees on the lynch and man idk I'll think about this tomorrow

[Prims]

actually BBM was already basically even night roleblocker so I'm probably just overthinking things as I'm not sure why those roles would co-exist?

[Prims]

I think BT is scum if Manix is town

#LiningUpLynches2k16

[Grace]

just think if i could put 6 roleblockers in one setup doesn't mean it's not possible

i feel like the roleblocker thing was tacked onto my role to make it seem like a mafia claim, ngl

i was probably never going to use it in practice because decoy'ing does basically the same thing (huzzah redundancy)

[Prims]

the way BT keeps cutting people slack while voting them looks insincere when his vote is there anyway... + idk what makes Boron's claim scummy so it looks like he wants an excuse to vote off the big wagon. in any case BT why is Boron still your preferred vote now that you've dropped the role-related case if you found her "null-scum" up until the claim?

I just realized this is worded stupidly because he only has voted one person

it bugs me that BT cuts people slack while suspecting them, it looks insincere because he is going to vote them anyway, so it doesn't matter

like, are they scum or town or null or are you waffling or what? why point out what looks good about them if it's not related to any point you're making?

[Strawman]

@Strawman: I don't really get any fencesitting in any of the posts you listed, unless you mean fencesitting is finding neither Boron or Gaius scummy (which is still a stance so wat?). Boron's case was an early case and she expressed pretty clearly that she found the build-up of the Blitz wagon concerning so I wasn't surprised when she began to poke in that direction. You seem to be finding us bad for not hard-defending; he was present in the thread so that didn't seem necessary.

Mmm, how do I explain this. I'm reading a lot into things, but it was like there was decent resistance to an LG wagon in theory, but those people didn't try hard on a counter wagon. Its like, appearing to not support the lynch, but not minding if it goes through. But yeah, if anything I can give you it only works in hindsight and is super hypocritical since I was just not there at all.

People kept on mentioning above that they thought that Boron wouldn't mistake her role as vigilante as scum. What I don't get is why that makes more sense as town. Can people explain that?

On one hand: As scum your scum buds could notice, question, correct, etc their understanding of the role. So Boron mistaking it comes as as very unfiltered.

On the other hand that can be faked (not so much faked but imagine in the scum discussion Boron mistaking it then getting it worked out) by just rehashing the same sort assumed discussion in thread to make it look genuine. The counter to this is why that is necessary. Its not scummy to understand your role correctly.

So not why would you mistake your role as scum, but why would you fake mistake your role publicly as scum?

I mean everyone can ask SB questions/clarification about their role in their own PM.

[Grace]

im going to sleep now

let me pose a question though, at everyone: outside of me/crysta, who is your strongest scumread, and why? only one person unless you're feeling adventurous

[Refa]

Just woke up like thirty minutes ago. Finishing post now, but how much time is left?

[eclipse]

I'm awake.

People kept on mentioning above that they thought that Boron wouldn't mistake her role as vigilante as scum. What I don't get is why that makes more sense as town. Can people explain that?

Eclipse's CC was moreso regarding conflicting actions, right? Yeah, I agree that's more likely to be town because it's putting her slot at risk for some vague potential benefit (yeah, people like me are townreading her now but it wouldn't carry Scum!Eclipse throughout the game).

Manix's claim is null for me. I legitimately don't have anything more to say about it. I don't get why he targeted Blitz (as opposed to an active player) and role blocker sure is a role.

Boron could've used her role earlier to lynch Manix, instead of coming out with it. Also, it's because of how my role works - mafia usually doesn't get lynch control (in worst case scenario, we're talking ending the day phase after two votes) on top of night kills.

I'll eventually figure out stronger scumreads and town reads, and I'll let THAT carry me the rest of the way. Since there's some more stuff, especially the interactions between Shin/Manix, I might have something today!

The more I think about it, the less inclined I am to think that Manix is mafia because of it. It would be pretty easy to sit on the decoy part, without revealing the second half.

I've noticed that Crysta and Manix have suddenly started to pay attention to each other when they're both under fire. They're both cross-voting each other after trying to put a case on me. Another thing is that they both seem pretty apathetic to it, with Crysta still not caring if I'm lynched over Manix and Manix providing a case on Refa that feels more substantial than Crysta after giving a weak Crysta vote.

Not saying that they're definitely scumbuddies, but it's a vibe that I'm really getting. I mean, if one did flip scum, it would look kinda bad for the other.

aaaand a Shin post I don't care for.

The vibe I get from THIS post is to subtly push Manix while reminding people that Crysta might be scum. Yes, I might not have had a lot of surety/conviction/a priority list, but if that makes me scummy in your eyes, this kind of pushing makes you scummy in mine.

Come on, Shin.

Did you even forget about the Gaius vote? lol

Manix has a lot of posts.

Strawman has a post.

Shin has a post.

And THIS is all you have to say?

it's weirding me out there's no counterwagon here. I was gonna say manix's claim is town because a scum decoy / roleblocker would just have decoy as their safe fake but I'm also wondering if he has to be maf being bussed since everybody agrees on the lynch and man idk I'll think about this tomorrow

You're about to get one. You also sound about as confused as I was about 24 hours ago. So, rather than comment on things, who do you want lynched today, and why?

just think if i could put 6 roleblockers in one setup doesn't mean it's not possible

i feel like the roleblocker thing was tacked onto my role to make it seem like a mafia claim, ngl

i was probably never going to use it in practice because decoy'ing does basically the same thing (huzzah redundancy)

The reason why I dropped enough crumbs to make a loaf of bread is because my claim sounds like a scum role. Also, there's certain roles that are better blocked than redirected (like killing roles).

im going to sleep now

let me pose a question though, at everyone: outside of me/crysta, who is your strongest scumread, and why? only one person unless you're feeling adventurous

I'll let my vote do the talking, thanks.

---

I'm not feeling a Manix lynch at all. The interaction with Shin that I wanted is finally here, and it feels like Shin wants Manix to both answer everything and push a case, while Manix has only been doing the former. However, the frustration I hear in Manix's posts towards Shin feels more like annoyed town than defensive scum. While I don't really care for that one Shin post I quoted, he's not the top of my scum list.

As before, I'm not scumreading Crysta, though I do want her opinion on the Shin/Manix convo earlier, since she stated that she doesn't care which one of them goes belly-up.

While I'm okay with BT's explanation regarding my role, I'm not so fond of how Boron seems to be the only person worth talking about. If Boron were to mysteriously drop dead, who else would be worth lynching?

Remember how Crysta commented about a lot of things without really doing anything mid-late D1, and apparently that was a scummy thing? Guess who's doing it this phase?

@Prims: You're probably right about the part where her questions don't get her anywhere. Not sure what to think about the activity or her wall post, really.

I'm not voting atm, more so because I would just default to Manix/Crysta anyway and they already have wagons on them. I thought of voting Boron to pressure her to give non-blitzwagon reads but then she claimed dayvig so lol.

Dunno who else I'd vote. Some flaker like Strawman? I'd go Manix>Crysta atm.

That was on page 17. There's been a good deal of content since, and Marth's activity consists of:

- asking BT about Boron

- commenting on Strawman by citing meta

- comment on me and questions for Boron

- snide comment to Shin

Feels like he's fading into the background now that attention is off of him, and I don't like it at all.

Here's the honorable mention:

But then Marth is like, the most actively scum hunting player imo right now.

On reread, Marth feels like he's off to the sides more than scumhunting. Also, Strawman, who's scum? I know you've been busy, but you've said surprisingly little in the last two posts, which are the longest ones you've made this day phase (and before you beat yourself up over that mislynch, I'd be pushing hard for a Gaius lynch today if he'd survived).

##Vote: Marth

Lynch priority, JUST FOR SHIN:

Marth > Strawman (before I hear "but that came out of nowhere", that comment about Strawman being a vig shot wasn't a joke) >> Shin > Manix

To clarify: The only way I'm voting Shin/Manix is if there's not enough votes for a minimum lynch.