PKL

^ Do it. It's about time for more dondon.

I would love the above way of tiering. Needs more bottom tier though.

I loved the Stahll Wars known as Gen 3. Crocune <3 I also enjoyed Gen 4 and played it very seriously. The power creep was weird at first but I adapted. Then came Gen 5 and I had no interest. Tried to get into it but I just didnt enjoy the new meta at all.

Both have amazing bossquotes in the desert. Joshua's being a bit better. So I'll decide them as units. Cormag wins because wings.

Stahl is a pretty solid unit though. Despite his spd problems. I guess it's true in a way but having a good Stahl + a good Cordelia is actually pretty cool as I demonstrated in one of my playlogs. Stahl can get to like Level 12 before Cordelia joins without favoritism (although he wants Kellam to be deployed I guess which is bad) a switch in from Cordelia to Stahl can be pretty powerful at taking down bow users that threaten her and he gives her massive bonuses she wants, makes a good Severa and Cordelia also provides him with bonuses he wants (spd and res). EDIT: Sorry if my post is constructed weirdly. I sometimes have poor english grammar due to english not being my main.

Correct me if im wrong but: wouldnt the normal Legions have like 120 hit total? IIRC, they have like 16 skl in that map. 18 being the best and only the top Legions have 18 skl. That means like, Swordmaster Ryan vs them would be: -15 hit due to Weapon Rank Bonus loss -10 hit because of C Swords vs Axes +10 avo because user is a Swordmaster +26 avo from Ryan's spd +5 (? i dont remember his lck) avo due to ryan's Luck +10 from Marth Support +10 from Rody Support He would be facing like 34 hit. Palla would be a lot worse at dodging though. But I reckon a Swordmaster Catria with Palla and Marth support could do the same as Ryan and face bad hitrates. Idk, it seems possible to just wall them but it would be extremely tricky. Maybe if your Ryan had less def than your other Swordmaster Wallers it would be possible as he could lure them to him, ORKO some of them while the others just take one hit only if they cant reach him. But that doesnt seem to be the case. A promoted Swordmaster Caeda would do well too I think. Idk, you shouldnt have saved so you could experiment with this ;_; I wanted a lame Turncount Ch10x as Ive never seen it get stalled.

20/10 Sumia with S Fred Bases: 18 hp 6 Str 3 Mag 11 Skl 11+2 Spd 8 Lck 5 Def 7 Res Lance D Growths: 75% hp 45% Str 25% Mag 70% Skl 70% Spd 60% Lck 30% Def 40% Res + stats from levels gained: 21 hp 12.6 str 7 mag 19.6 Skl 19.6 Spd 16.8 Lck 8.4 Def 11.2 Res + Dark Flier promo: +3 hp +1 str +4 Mag +1 Skl +2 Spd +1 Def + 3 Res Tome E = 42 HP 19.6 Str 14 Mag 31.6 Skl 32.6+2 Spd 24.8 Lck 14.4 Def 21.2 Res + Frederick S Support (+6 Str +1 Skl +1 Spd +6 Def +1 move) 42 HP 25.6 Str 14 Mag 32.6 Skl 33.6+2 Spd 24.8 Lck 20.4 Def 21.2 Res Now let's see Cordelia: 20/10 with S Stahl I chose the same level because 20/8 is leaning towards Sumia favoritism. In reality I think a full team trained Sumia will be at the same level or 1 more level than Cordelia by the time she joins. Otherwise you are crossing favoritism territory and feeding all the kills to her and none to Fred. Which is unrealistic considering a switch to Fred can be nice from time to time given Sumia's spd pair up and his better durability. Bases: 25 HP 9 Str 3 Mag 13 Skl 12+2 Spd 9 Lck 8 Def 8 Res Lance C Growths: 90% HP 60% Str 20% Mag 60% Skl 60% Spd 45% Lck 45% Def 35% Res +stats from levels gained: 19.8 HP 13.2 Str 4.4 Mag 13.2 Skl 13.2 Spd 9.9 Lck 9.9 Def 7.7 Res +Dark Flier promo: +3 HP +1 Str +4 Mag +1 Skl +2 Spd +1 Def +3 Res Tome E = 47.8 HP 23.2 Str 11.4 Mag 27.2 Skl 27.2+2 18.9 Lck 18.9 Def 18.7 Res +Stahl S Support (+6 Str +5 Skl +5 Spd +6 Def) 47.8 HP > 42 HP 29.2 Str > 25.6 Str 11.4 Mag < 14 Mag 32.2 Skl < 32.6 Skl 32.2+2 Spd < 33.6+2 Spd 18.9 Lck < 24.8 Lck 24.9 Def > 20.4 Def 18.7 Res < 21.2 Res So Cordelia is beating Sumia in Str Def and HP and is about tied with Sumia in Spd. If they receive an Energy Drop, a Dracoshield and a Seraph Robe, as well their tonics: 52.8 HP > 47 HP 33.2 Str > 29.6 Str 11.4 Mag < 14 Mag 32.2 Skl < 32.6 Skl 34.2+2 Spd < 35.6+2 Spd 18.9 Lck < 24.8 Lck 28.9 Def > 24.4 Def 18.7 Res < 21.2 Res With a Javelin and A Lances their Atk is 37 Atk and 33 respectively. Cordelia can also pull off Dark Mage decently well. Which means Nosferatu and in this tier list, Nosferatu is literally the easiest way to play the game. She doesn't even make the game harder by demanding training when in Dark Mage because she actually has nice stats barring the Tome rank. A Spirit Dusted base Mag Spd Tonic Cordelia with a Mag pair up can ORKO enemies in C10 with Flux last time I used her. Her mag growth is a bit on the bad side I think, but it's sufficient due to how many things you can do to fix offensive issues in this game. Don't forget Nosferatu can even be forged and in turnless we're gonna have money forever. Not to mention, there's a few Spirit Dusts around in this game. She can also pull off Merc, possibly easier than Dark Mage because she's more physically oriented and that gives Sol, which makes the game easier. Training her in that isnt even hard either because of her already solid stats. Horace and Celes also underestimate Cordelia's base stats. At base in her next chapter: Paralogue 3, she can take down the archer in the mountains and kill the fighter in the same turn. She can also survive and 2HKO the pegs for some quick exp. 2 levels for her in that map isn't exactly hard to do tbh. In turnless, Ive gotten her 4 levels and in a 3 turn I've gotten her 2 levels while she also contributed. Let's not forget that she has versatility going for her too. She can pair with Kellam for THWOMP. She can pair with Ricken if going the Dark Mage route to fix her mag. She can pair with Stahl for massive Str skl Spd def boosts. She can pair with Sumia's beloved Frederick for the same boosts Sumia receives, etc. She has a lot of options. Sumia on the other hand, REQUIRES Frederick to be trained, which isnt even guaranteed to happen in a turnless environment. Other people want Fred in turnless, including but not limited to: Chrom, Miriel, Sully, Virion. Her other support options, barring a reclassed Cavalier Chrom, are all pretty bad and dont fix her defensive issues. So, uh, how is Sumia>Cordelia in this tier list again? The possibility of Nosferatu alone should put her above Sumia.

You could've lamed it with Swordmasters. I reckon your Palla, your Ryan and someone else could choke the point at the beginning for like, forever. EDIT: You LTC'd a map. Run's over for me ;_;

Yeah Geno would be cool. I would love Sakurai forever if he revived Geno but I dont see it happening honestly.

I have a feeling Aeine made this thread to troll nonLTC players. :/

Said by Reflex himself, who's played every other Peach from the US :P Kie from Japan is IMO better than him from watching his vids. That guy has a crazy Peach.

I guess in such a tier list Nosferatu enemy phase skipping no care in the world would be the best thing ever.

I want a forum section just for LTC Also, something Ive learned: dont make tier lists accurate if youre good at making tier lists. It kills discussion if the tier list is already agreed upon. Like my FE13 tier list that got 0 discussion and all it received was posts saying I agree bla bla (barring Miriel/Ricken's placement). Having a few controversial/questionable tier placements could spark discussion.

Don't worry. I untied it again.

The first impression I got was that they're shocked at something. POSSIBLE MARIO NEWCOMER TEASE?

I deleted my vote so it's not tied anymore :)

Unless it saves a turn. But I mostly dont like killing off characters. I guess I did lie because I kill tharja all the time in FE13 and that one instance in FE12 H2 LTC where I had to sacrifice Warren to 7 turn Ch5.

Wow, I derped. I thought this was another favorite character thread lol. SCRATCH THE ABOVE POST. I never let anyone die. Although the ones I mentioned I'd let die even less!

From Jugdral: Fury, Ethryn, Finn, Lex From Elibe: Miledy (wow I just realized shes the only one from FE6), Marcus, Fiora, Farina, Sain, Lucius, Lyn, Louise and Pent From Magvel: Vanessa, Tana, Syrene, Eirika, Innes, Seth, Neimi, Larachel From Tellius: Marcia, Rolf, Tanith, Sigrun, Soren, Edward, Mia, Nephenee, Micaiah, Jill, Nailah, Titania, Oscar, Calill From Archanea: Palla, Caeda, Ryan, Marth, Cain, Abel, Jagen, Gordin, Luke, Cecille, Etzel, Athena, Minerva, Kleine (enemy only sadly), Katarina From Ylisse: Cordelia, Cherche, Stahl, Tiki, Lucina, Say'ri

Excel is arguably the 2nd best Peach and I play him all the time. He prefers to fight an MK over Marth any day. :/

Don't worry, with the amount of money we have left after MACEDONDON and HIS MOM, no one will be able to forge for a while :P

I mean that Pokemon Cynthia is beating the bad Cynthia, you know the FE Cynthia. That terrible unit. Also YES RALLY ETHRYN And Cynthia (Pokemon Champion)

Peach is ok in brawl. She just has a bad Matchup vs Metaknight and Marth. The first one being crucial. She basically shouldn't win ever vs metaknight :/ She also has her problems with killing and getting juggled because of how floaty she is and the lack of a disjoint in her down air. But she's solid when it comes to combo game, applying pressure, has good spacing tools and nice mobility on top of a good recovery and a projectile.

As long as Link keeps his same moveset and Sakurai doesn't buff his recovery and makes him more solid he will sadly keep being low tier :/. But I have a feeling he will be Mid Tier in this game. First step for Sakurai: buff Grounded upb to melee status and make his recovery better/on par with other recoveries if they are nerfed in general in Smash 4 compared to brawl.

Lugh is much much better. Lilina is useless unless you rig her 35 spd growth. Lugh's mag growth is sufficient and his spd growth is a lot better than Lilina's.