Vorena Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I figured they would be getting lower levels if you were going for efficiency. Athena and Caeda can double stuff when they cannot. You have MU as well for multi-purpose stuff. You get a couple of bows users who are your only indirect except for MU mage or archer or Merric. And Cain is straight up better than both for prologue 8. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 1. Well of course Rody loses if you sandbag him. Little Wexp? 2. How is Luke in any better a situation than Rody? Both have worse bases than Draug. Should we both just assume that they're both worse just because Draug shows up and is a rent-a-cavalier? I just showed that both can be universally better while bieng damn near identical. Well, luke has better bases, and thus can be fed kills much easier than rody. Rody doesnt catch up/beat luke's stats for a long time. Rody's only selling point over luke is an easier time getting to C lances for dragonpike/ridersbane. While luke will have armorslayer and wyrmslayer but will probably have a worse matchup against horsies. Im convinced that rody is better than draug now though. Level 4 is too low an estimate if hes being trained. Level 6-7 is more like it and a level 7 rody definetely has draug beat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Well, luke has better bases, and thus can be fed kills much easier than rody. That is one hell of a voided measurement. For the most part, neither are so slow that they're getting doubled (aside from myrms, which due to lances and rank killing through the triangle, Rody is better against), the only real difference is like a single bit of damage against axe users. These "greater bases" of which you speak are a single point. Luke is not Marcus here, can we stop acting like he is? Rody doesnt catch up/beat luke's stats for a long time. Prologue 6/7 is a long time? Im convinced that rody is better than draug now though. Level 4 is too low an estimate if hes being trained. Level 6-7 is more like it and a level 7 rody definetely has draug beat. That's all I wanted to hear because I wasn't arguing Rody as better than Luke, merely mostly equal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sage Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I have to agree that Rody getting to level 6 or 7 by the end of Prologue 8 is not all that unreasonable, because I managed to get Luke from level 2 or 3 to level 6 while taking 11 turns. And I know, lol 11 turns when Colonel M made 9 to 10 turns the standard turncount, but whatever. If Luke can get to level 6 by the end of prologue 8, then Rody can as well since the two are effectively identical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 That is one hell of a voided measurement. For the most part, neither are so slow that they're getting doubled (aside from myrms, which due to lances and rank killing through the triangle, Rody is better against), the only real difference is like a single bit of damage against axe users. These "greater bases" of which you speak are a single point. Luke is not Marcus here, can we stop acting like he is? Prologue 6/7 is a long time? That's all I wanted to hear because I wasn't arguing Rody as better than Luke, merely mostly equal. Hmmm...true. Rody has an easier time with myrmidons (and thieves), although ideally, both of them shouldnt be facing them much if they want to live. Btw, im just getting into tier list debating so if i make a silly argument, Dont flame me too much. :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Don't mean to flame you and I'm sorry if I came off like I was. Measuring in a void tends to be a mistake most make. Guilty of it myself, so no worries. Anyways people, I want to bring up something, namely stat boosters. There's 3 in the base shop right from the start, 3 from what you get throughout the game, and 3 at the end secret shop before the Dragon's Altar. 9 total of each one. That is a lot, as you may notice. Now everyone always says that "Marth could get screwed, and he needs to be tip top shape for Medius". This is true, but shouldn't always be statically assumed since it implies Marth is always screwed. So yes, it is a possible precaution, but what if he doesn't need it? We're not gonna let them go to waste are we? So, then comes the question. 9 of each. What do we do with all of it? Let's take Speedwings as an example, because speed in this game more than any other in the series makes or breaks you. Now we know obvious ones. Sirius and Minerva. That's 2. What do we do with the other 7? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Its ok. And no idea what do with those wings/statboosters. I cant see anyone in particular (other than srz and minerva, but you already mentioned them) WANTING them other than scrubs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Well me and SDS were discussing stat boosters and how Marth needs a lot of them, then we remembered that the arena guarantees stats, tied for 3rd is Speed and he has 385% total growth, Strength only being 5 behind. I can be assumed that with things like the dragons in midgame giving a lot of exp and proper arena usage, Marth should be generally average anyways, and at worst would only need like 2 wings, which he can always buy at the altar secret shop with 1 to spare. Even with Strength considered, he only needs 19 for Medius (since I think you have to rig a crit for Marth anyways, and that's the bare minimum), which if we assume that by some miracle Marth gains no strength, he only needs 6 of the 9 Energy Drops. But still, I think Marth needing every single stat booster possible is a bit of a myth we need to just drop, especially if dropping it lets us use resources to make a more effective team throughout the rest of the game. So even if we assume 2 wings for Marth, that leaves 7 to spend. Any ideas? I mean, Minerva, Sirius and Paula tend to be automatic, but anything else tend to spring to mind? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 @grandjackal- I agree that screwed marth BS should just stop. I mean, shouldnt we assume that the maturity drop is going on marth anyways? I find maturity drop marth really hard to screw. 70% str and 75% spd isnt exactly easy to get screwed on...And that situation will never happen. I doubt marth wont gain str for like, 20 levels with a 70% growth. Marth is more likely to not need those resources than to need them to kill medeus... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 @grandjackal- I agree that screwed marth BS should just stop. I mean, shouldnt we assume that the maturity drop is going on marth anyways? I find maturity drop marth really hard to screw. 70% str and 75% spd isnt exactly easy to get screwed on...And that situation will never happen. I doubt marth wont gain str for like, 20 levels with a 70% growth. Marth is more likely to not need those resources than to need them to kill medeus... Since you only need those stats for Medeus, it seems like you'd rather have the Maturity Drop on someone else so it can be useful throughout the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Since you only need those stats for Medeus, it seems like you'd rather have the Maturity Drop on someone else so it can be useful throughout the game. I can say just the converse: since you only need those stats at the end of the game, you'd rather spend your early money on stat boosters for units that are actually useful throughout the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Hardin Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 This is pretty minor but Dolph and Macellan should be switched. Now Macellan is the better one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 free silvers is unordered because they're all pretty much unusable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) I'm pretty sure Free Silvers is just jointime order since they're all useless in H3 anyway there's no point in actually trying to arrange that tier. Brad you ninja >:| Edited June 13, 2012 by Fat Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Mac > Dolph anyway since Mac opens a door. What does Dolph have to say to that!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Mac > Dolph anyway since Mac opens a door. What does Dolph have to say to that!?! Dolph uses his mighty frame to stand on a fort and fight off prevent reinforcements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Pardon my noobness, but Ive noticed Cecil and Linde is in high. Arent they...OHKO'd by everything. I can see how Aura's massive chip helps, but what is Cecil doing? Lady Sword? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 SDS has a Hardin for Linde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sage Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 SDS has a Hardin for Linde I guess you could say He'd like to get Hardin her http://mirrors.rit.edu/instantCSI/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Linde with an Angel Robe can make effective use out of the boost thanks to starting with Nosferatu (kinda). As for Cecile, it's been shown that she can catch up well enough by the end of prologue that she isn't one shotted. She still gets hit hard yeah, but yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Pardon my noobness, but Ive noticed Cecil and Linde is in high. Arent they...OHKO'd by everything. I can see how Aura's massive chip helps, but what is Cecil doing? Lady Sword? cecile isn't OHKO'd with any sort of durability boost (even the +2 def from RP is sufficient to pull her out of OHKO range on average IIRC) and has better unpromoted offense than the other altean cav alternatives Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 cecile isn't OHKO'd with any sort of durability boost (even the +2 def from RP is sufficient to pull her out of OHKO range on average IIRC) and has better unpromoted offense than the other altean cav alternatives Ah, I see. Forgot to give her an RP or any lunatic boosters for that matter. Its probably too late to pick her up now in my playthrough... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Hardin Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) Mac > Dolph anyway since Mac opens a door. What does Dolph have to say to that!?! Not to mention Mac's B Rank in Bows or Great Growth rates. Its only Macellan's base stats that hold him back. Edited June 14, 2012 by Emperor Hardin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrhesia Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) These bases are 'holding him back' approximately eighty fucktons. They're comparable to the likes of Navarre, who showed up approximately 'ages' ago. In Lunatic? It really isn't worth trying to order him anywhere except the vague handwave of 'even Norne spits in his face and wipes her ass on his bald shiny head'. I used a lot of quotation marks in this post. Edited June 14, 2012 by Furetchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Hardin Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) These bases are 'holding him back' approximately eighty fucktons. They're comparable to the likes of Navarre, who showed up approximately 'ages' ago. In Lunatic? It really isn't worth trying to order him anywhere except the vague handwave of 'even Norne spits in his face and wipes her ass on his bald shiny head'. I used a lot of quotation marks in this post. Yeah I'm aware of his crappy ass bases, I'm just saying his growths are really good just not enough to make up for his horrible base stats. Too bad there's no unpromoting in this game. Edited June 14, 2012 by Emperor Hardin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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