Colonel M Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I just can't ignore that Tormod's bases are marginally better than theirs, and the fact he joins in midgame doesn't really help. Also, personally, I prefer the other two mages' potential to contribute early. What potential and what contribution? Costing you turns to train them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 What potential and what contribution? Costing you turns to train them? I already stated I'm not an efficiency nut, so I'm not answering this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I already stated I'm not an efficiency nut, so I'm not answering this. Even if you're not an efficiency nut, you're going to tell me training Soren and Ilyana is much easier than plowing some BEXP into Tormod for better results? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) Even if you're not an efficiency nut, you're going to tell me training Soren and Ilyana is much easier than plowing some BEXP into Tormod for better results? ...I also don't really care for BEXP (especially if I deem the conditions to be ridiculous, such as stealth [i'll admit that I never was any good with stealth, and if I really wanted stealth, I'd play Metal Gear Solid or something, but that's beside the point] or chapter 15 [i'm just no good with pacifism strategies]); in addition, I'd much rather work with a unit who comes earlier, that's all. And once again, as this is hard mode, you don't get BEXP for clearing a chapter. Even if it's not necessarily easier, this is just where I stand. Edited April 30, 2012 by Metal King Slime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 ...I also don't really care for BEXP (especially if I deem the conditions to be ridiculous, such as stealth [i'll admit that I never was any good with stealth, and if I really wanted stealth, I'd play Metal Gear Solid or something, but that's beside the point] or chapter 15 [i'm just no good with pacifism strategies]); in addition, I'd much rather work with a unit who comes earlier, that's all. And once again, as this is hard mode, you don't get BEXP for clearing a chapter. Even if it's not necessarily easier, this is just where I stand. Even in Hard Mode, you get BEXP for chapter clears. Everything that gives BEXP in Normal Mode also gives BEXP in Hard Mode; just less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) Even in Hard Mode, you get BEXP for chapter clears. Everything that gives BEXP in Normal Mode also gives BEXP in Hard Mode; just less. You do? I was checking the BEXP page and saw this: Bonus EXP rewarded for "Clear bonus" isn't available for Hard Mode. Edited April 30, 2012 by Metal King Slime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 you still get a lot of BEXP in this game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 You do not get BEXP for clearing chapters in Hard Mode. And considering the amount of BEXP you're probably dumping into Marcia, Mist, and Jill at the very least, plus a level here and there for other units, using a full team of 10+ does not really leave a lot of BEXP free on Hard Mode. OFC, I normally dump a couple hundred into Nephenee because I like her that you could switch over to Tormod, but eh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zman Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Tormod joins very under-leveled with stats that are only slightly better than Ilyana's at base, meaning he will need a good chunk of BEXP (Around 300~500) to become useful. He has pretty good growths, the unique skill Celerity, and is the only mage that can get a 50% strength and defense growth by giving him 2 BEXP at a time. Tormod has some good support options, and every support excluding Sothe will give him a full +atk support. 7.5/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aku chi Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 What potential and what contribution? Costing you turns to train them? How about contributing heavily towards two of the most efficient clears of C15, among other things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) How about contributing heavily towards two of the most efficient clears of C15, among other things? What other things? Being obtuse everywhere else? I mean looking at these clears for example, one requires a "Super Soren", which sounds like taking BEXP and dumping it into a toilet, the one with 11 Mag / 20 total durability... Which is accomplished with base level Ilyana I think with a Spirit Dust / couple of levels. Even so, you'be already mentioned Jill + Marcia and Marcia solo. Considering that 9/10 times we would rather dump BEXP into good units like these two, I'm not seeing the major relevance of Soren / Ilyana here aside from being alternatives and nothing more. Edited April 30, 2012 by Colonel M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aku chi Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 What other things? Being obtuse everywhere else? Soren can help with the C7 rout, both can help get C9's Restore, both can help get C11's Dracoshield or Elwind, both can help with C12's rout, both can help with C13's de facto rout, and both provide nice vision bonuses in C14. I mean looking at these clears for example, one requires a "Super Soren", which sounds like taking BEXP and dumping it into a toilet, the one with 11 Mag / 20 total durability... What do Soren's base stats have to do with how good of a candidate he is for Bexp? Marcia has terrible base stats, but that's no argument against giving her Bexp. Quite the opposite. If one happened to have great stats, Bexp wouldn't be necessary... Even so, you'be already mentioned Jill + Marcia and Marcia solo. Considering that 9/10 times we would rather dump BEXP into good units like these two, I'm not seeing the major relevance of Soren / Ilyana here aside from being alternatives and nothing more. It is enough that they are efficient alternatives. But there are plenty of relevant playthroughs where only one of Marcia&Jill are trained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I'm going to work so I can't respond to everything right meow but... What do Soren's base stats have to do with how good of a candidate he is for Bexp? Marcia has terrible base stats, but that's no argument against giving her Bexp. Quite the opposite. If one happened to have great stats, Bexp wouldn't be necessary... I meant that base Ilyana could do the 2 turn clear unless she needs more Spd on top of the aforementioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Let's see... He's an underleveled mage which is "Est done right" in my books; joins midgame, but with great end results. I mean, you get a Mage with 8 MOV!? And can function like a mounted unit thanks to Celerity; which means he can catch up to your angry mob of high MOV units and staffbot things upon promotion! At least he doesn't suffer from meh combat syndrome that Mist usually has unless she has Magic Swords. Supports, supports... Devdan's kinda "eh", and the likely one is Calill; and Sothe sucks. 7.0, the bias point is already placed in there since he's so amusing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aku chi Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I meant that base Ilyana could do the 2 turn clear unless she needs more Spd on top of the aforementioned. Oh. If Soren or Ilyana can make a huge contribution without much/any training, all the better, no? As for Spd, it appears that 8 AS is required to avoid being doubled by the Hawk. Ilyana indeed has this at base. Soren needs 1 Spd or 1 Str proc in addition to 1 Def or 1 HP proc to avoid being 1RKO'd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.M. Gei Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Not to mention training Tormod is even LESS of an issue in non-efficient play. Backwards logic much? but Colonel M, Raven, that's too hard for poor Metal King Sperg's mind to comprehend :< anyway, 7.5/10; he's pretty good despite what the naysayers say, 8-move siege tomes is pretty valuable and something unique to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZemZem Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share Posted April 30, 2012 Guys, this thread is for rating Tormod, not discussing Soren and Ilyana. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renall Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 He's basically a Mage Knight, able to keep pace with much faster units which is something no other tome user who isn't given the Boots (and who would do that?) can claim. He's not bad statistically either, with pretty good growths and remarkable durability for a mage (which, admittedly, isn't saying much, but sometimes it matters). But that start level... he really wants BEXP. He could certainly be worth it, but it's something to think about. Plenty of good units get a pass on that though so I figure he deserves it too. Still, he comes late enough that being underleveled is a more significant problem unless given BEXP. 7/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Guys, this thread is for rating Tormod, not discussing Soren and Ilyana. Throw MKS's vote out, and I'll be more than happy to stop. Also, yes aku chi. That is correct. Though you may want to note that in your playthrough strats that they need 9 Spd if possible. Well, for Soren anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Amusing/10 Seriously, he's got horse movement without the stupid terrain penalties. He can early promote after 300 BEXP (assuming you didn't use your Seals elswhere). And unlike a certain other 8-move staff user, he's not locked to swords. 7/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKL Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Pretty damn good 7/10. Has a very fast reyson support that gives him more attack. Hes pretty good for siege toming (is that a word?) stuff and his awesome move means he doesnt get left behind unlike all the other mages. His BEXP situation is pretty good too, what with joining after jill/marcia/oscar/kieran/astrid all got all the BEXP they wanted. He also joins after you get all that pacifist ch 15 BEXP...om nom nom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZemZem Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share Posted April 30, 2012 Throw MKS's vote out, and I'll be more than happy to stop. I see your point, since it seems a little...yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) Even if you're not an efficiency nut, you're going to tell me training Soren and Ilyana is much easier than plowing some BEXP into Tormod for better results? I don't get this. If we don't assume efficiency then Celerity looses most of it's value. And then Tormod is much closer to being a crappy mage like Soren or llyana. And MKS gave Tormod a better score then Soren already, anyway. Edited April 30, 2012 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.M. Gei Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I don't get this. not surprised that you don't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) not surprised that you don't You are a nice person. Edit: I'm sorry for using loosing my temper there. I interpreted the above statement as a personal insult. I think I am a bit on the edge this evening. Edited April 30, 2012 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.