How difficult is Awakening?

[Anouleth]

I think the only point against the effectiveness of Nosferatu tanking in this game is that it's not instantly effective(compared to say FE12 where Linde can do it effectively instantly). Due to it's half healing Sariya to begin with and Henry(due to his really low speed) don't actually perform amazingly well with Nosferatu.

Well, it's probably pretty ridiculous in a casual playthrough, much as stuff like double Earth supports or General Sedgar or Nosferatanking were in previous games. In that sense you could say that it makes the game much much easier. But I don't know if it will turn out to be the optimum strategy.

[BBM]

Would you say it's reasonable to have a level 10 Dark Mage!MU by the time Sariya joins? Or are MU's stats better than Sariya's by enough of a margin to make up the difference?

[Anouleth]

Would you say it's reasonable to have a level 10 Dark Mage!MU by the time Sariya joins? Or are MU's stats better than Sariya's by enough of a margin to make up the difference?

I imagine it's a mixture of War Knowledge from Strategist (lots more EXP), plus better supports, plus more time to build them, plus more stats.

Name   HP    Str   Mag    Skl	Spd	Lck	Def	Res
MU     41.30 11.20 18.80  12.10	14.90	13.90	14.30	14.30
Sariya 30.00 5.00  14.00  7.00	13.00	3.00	13.00	10.00

This is 10/10/1 MU versus 10/1 Sariya.

[cheetah7071]

Would you say it's reasonable to have a level 10 Dark Mage!MU by the time Sariya joins? Or are MU's stats better than Sariya's by enough of a margin to make up the difference?

The early game doesn't reward rushing straight to sorcerer because you just don't have the nosferatu tomes yet. I'd rather get MU to 10/15 grandmaster so Mark (and his/her other child if applicable) can be rainbow cry bots right off the bat, and then change seal them into sorcerer from there. I personally got to rainbow cry around chapter 10 or so I think? I was at 10 strategist -> 15 grandmaster -> 4 dark pegasus going into the chapter before lucina joins, which was really annoying because lucina kept accidentally inheriting movement cry.

Edited June 8, 2012 by cheetah7071

[BBM]

Ah, makes sense.

[Ema Skye]

Miriel and Libera can both go Dark Mage, and they seem pretty comparable to Sayria. Libera can't Nosferatank right away due to E tomes, but his bases are pretty effective. Looking at their averages, I'd say they both are better than the innate Dark Mages, if only due them having 10 more levels on them. Miriel seems like the best since she joins the earliest, and she doesn't have weapon ranks to build like Libera. But Libera crushes all three in bases, and can compete with Anouleth's MU above.

This is 10/1 Sariya vs 10/10/1 Miriel vs 1/10/1 Libera vs a 12/1 Henry.

Name	HP	Str	Mag	Skl	Spe	Lck	Def	Res
Sariya	30.00	5.00	14.00	7.00	13.00	3.00	13.00	10.00
Miriel	38.00	5.15	18.35	16.35	17.35	15.00	12.95	15.20
Libera	46.55	13.70	21.50	18.40	16.50	14.05	15.15	20.60
Henry	34.00	7.00	17.00	17.00	10.00	10.00	16.00	8.00

[Westbrick]

The early game doesn't reward rushing straight to sorcerer because you just don't have the nosferatu tomes yet. I'd rather get MU to 10/15 grandmaster so Mark (and his/her other child if applicable) can be rainbow cry bots right off the bat, and then change seal them into sorcerer from there. I personally got to rainbow cry around chapter 10 or so I think? I was at 10 strategist -> 15 grandmaster -> 4 dark pegasus going into the chapter before lucina joins, which was really annoying because lucina kept accidentally inheriting movement cry.

On Lunatic, you don't have nearly enough time or available experience to be messing around with class trees. Remember, every chapter you aren't capitalizing on Nosferatanking is a chapter which demands heavy Frederick use, marginalizing how much experience your best units are getting per chapter. And seeing as lategame Lunatic is effectively a one-pair army, Rainbow Cry isn't all that helpful.

But Libera crushes all three in bases, and can compete with Anouleth's MU above.

This is 10/1 Sariya vs 10/10/1 Miriel vs 1/10/1 Libera vs a 12/1 Henry.

Name	HP	Str	Mag	Skl	Spe	Lck	Def	Res
Sariya	30.00	5.00	14.00	7.00	13.00	3.00	13.00	10.00
Miriel	38.00	5.15	18.35	16.35	17.35	15.00	12.95	15.20
Libera	46.55	13.70	21.50	18.40	16.50	14.05	15.15	20.60
Henry	34.00	7.00	17.00	17.00	10.00	10.00	16.00	8.00

I can't imagine Miriel is leveling up anywhere quick enough to be useful as a Shaman, but that Libera looks pretty sexy. I'll have to try that out for Lunatic+.

[Psych]

You also have Tiamo, but I'm not quite sure how well she can do.

[Anouleth]

On Lunatic, you don't have nearly enough time or available experience to be messing around with class trees. Remember, every chapter you aren't capitalizing on Nosferatanking is a chapter which demands heavy Frederick use, marginalizing how much experience your best units are getting per chapter. And seeing as lategame Lunatic is effectively a one-pair army, Rainbow Cry isn't all that helpful.

I can't imagine Miriel is leveling up anywhere quick enough to be useful as a Shaman, but that Libera looks pretty sexy. I'll have to try that out for Lunatic+.

Libera is better than that because he gets LM bonuses.

You also have Tiamo, but I'm not quite sure how well she can do.

Tiamo's magic is abysmal and she has to play catch-up with tome rank. Think starting at 10/1 with 5MAG base, E tomes and 30% magic growth.

Edited June 9, 2012 by Anouleth

[Westbrick]

Libera is better than that because he gets LM bonuses.

Wow, didn't realize NPC units received those kind of bonuses. That just makes him even more appealing!

[Anouleth]

Wow, didn't realize NPC units received those kind of bonuses. That just makes him even more appealing!

All units do, regardless of what they start off as. Libera's bonuses are admittedly very minor, though.

BTW, if you want to calculate averages, you can download a spreadsheet for them here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Alt0Cd8wyCpLdGduRUZjbUR5bUFjZEJHLVdqaXozZXc&pli=1#gid=0

There's still some missing data for certain classes, though.

[cheetah7071]

On Lunatic, you don't have nearly enough time or available experience to be messing around with class trees. Remember, every chapter you aren't capitalizing on Nosferatanking is a chapter which demands heavy Frederick use, marginalizing how much experience your best units are getting per chapter. And seeing as lategame Lunatic is effectively a one-pair army, Rainbow Cry isn't all that helpful.

I can't imagine Miriel is leveling up anywhere quick enough to be useful as a Shaman, but that Libera looks pretty sexy. I'll have to try that out for Lunatic+.

Yeah I know. I wasn't advocating the dark pegasus splash. I was actually advocating 10 strategist/15 grandmaster/1 sorcerer--you delay the nosferatanking for 5 levels and in exchange get rainbow cry during the weird midgame overlap before you start soloing but after the kids start showing up.

[arvilino]

Wow, didn't realize NPC units received those kind of bonuses. That just makes him even more appealing!

Every character from Grego&Nono onwards gets them in Hard and Lunatic, significantly increasing as you progress(you'll notice a massive difference between base Basillo and Flavia between modes).

[Westbrick]

All units do, regardless of what they start off as. Libera's bonuses are admittedly very minor, though.

BTW, if you want to calculate averages, you can download a spreadsheet for them here:

https://docs.google....ZXc&pli=1#gid=0

There's still some missing data for certain classes, though.

Much appreciated; I'll definitely be using this in the future.

Yeah I know. I wasn't advocating the dark pegasus splash. I was actually advocating 10 strategist/15 grandmaster/1 sorcerer--you delay the nosferatanking for 5 levels and in exchange get rainbow cry during the weird midgame overlap before you start soloing but after the kids start showing up.

Nosferatu is a D tome, so you're really delaying Nosferatanking for more like 12-13 levels. That's a fairly significant time delay.

[cheetah7071]

Much appreciated; I'll definitely be using this in the future.

Nosferatu is a D tome, so you're really delaying Nosferatanking for more like 12-13 levels. That's a fairly significant time delay.

Except that MU will be using Tomes in strategist/grandmaster, and will likely have A rank tomes by the time he/she becomes a sorcerer?

[Westbrick]

Except that MU will be using Tomes in strategist/grandmaster, and will likely have A rank tomes by the time he/she becomes a sorcerer?

I'm assuming a worst-case scenario where the player only uses swords while a tactician; even then, it'll only take a couple levels to get that tome level up. You're right that if the player uses tomes, there's even more of a reason not to wait to switch to Shaman, as those are just extra levels you could be capitalizing on Nosferatanking.

[cheetah7071]

I'm assuming a worst-case scenario where the player only uses swords while a tactician; even then, it'll only take a couple levels to get that tome level up. You're right that if the player uses tomes, there's even more of a reason not to wait to switch to Shaman, as those are just extra levels you could be capitalizing on Nosferatanking.

Nosferatanking isn't even important that early. I played all the way up to Renha's chapter before getting bored, and didn't even feel the lack of Nosferatu until the boat chapter--until then, MU was invincible anyways just on sheer strength of stats.

[Balcerzak]

I think the only point against the effectiveness of Nosferatu tanking in this game is that it's not instantly effective(compared to say FE12 where Linde can do it effectively instantly). Due to it's half healing Sariya to begin with and Henry(due to his really low speed) don't actually perform amazingly well with Nosferatu.

FE12 Linde is OHKO'd at base. She can't Nosferatank without help, in my experience.

[Westbrick]

Nosferatanking isn't even important that early. I played all the way up to Renha's chapter before getting bored, and didn't even feel the lack of Nosferatu until the boat chapter--until then, MU was invincible anyways just on sheer strength of stats.

...?

You're clearly not talking about Lunatic, where every early chapter is a living hell and Nosferatu can't come soon enough.

[Only My Unit]

Btw, how hard can a Spotpass/Streepass player team be? How many characters are allowed on it?

[Westbrick]

Btw, how hard can a Spotpass/Streepass player team be? How many characters are allowed on it?

Many SpotPass teams can be very difficult, especially those like Alvis and Sigurd. The number of characters allowed, interestingly enough, depends upon where the SpotPass team shows up on the world map, not simply which SpotPass team you're engaging; each map spot has its own deployment limit, and I've seen it range from 6 to 12.

In fact, have these been compiled yet? If not, I can get started with a couple chapters:

1 -> 8

8 -> 9

10 -> 12

13 -> 10

Edited June 9, 2012 by Westbrick

[dondon151]

FE12 Linde is OHKO'd at base. She can't Nosferatank without help, in my experience.

you give her the SDS treatment where she gets as many angelic robes and favoritism as you can muster

[Remnant Sage]

I've got these numbers so far :

P - 6

1 - 8

2 - 8

3 - 8

4 - 8

5 - 8

6 - 9

7 - 9

8 - 9

9 - 9

10 - 10

11 - 10

12 - 10

13 - 10

14 - 11

15 - 11

16 - 11

17 - 12

18 - 12

19 - 12

20 - 12

21 - 12

22 - 12

23 - 12

24 - 12

25 - 12

S1 - 8

S2 - 9

S3 - 9

S4 - 10

S5

S6

S7

S8

S9 - 12

S10

S11

S12

S13

S14

S15

S16

S17 - 12

S18 - 15

S19 - 15

S20 - 15

Haven't gotten all the children yet. My guess is that missing side quest chapters have a deployment limit of 12 for Spotpass/skirmish battles.

[Othin]

On Lunatic, you don't have nearly enough time or available experience to be messing around with class trees. Remember, every chapter you aren't capitalizing on Nosferatanking is a chapter which demands heavy Frederick use, marginalizing how much experience your best units are getting per chapter. And seeing as lategame Lunatic is effectively a one-pair army, Rainbow Cry isn't all that helpful.

I would hope you would have some more options. I'm at Ch9 in my Lunatic run, and both Krom and MU are promoted and about as competent as Frederick, aside from his Silver Lance and flight. Seems to me that as the game goes on, you can train more and more characters to catch up and help out, unless you choose not to and go the boring tiny-team route.

And just as I noted on Gamefaqs, I really am inclined to think that the tiny team played just as much of a role as the Nosferatu use in trivializing the game, even if it wouldn't have been enough on its own. So there probably is more to learn here: Sorcerers have without a doubt the best combat in the game, but they may not be as broken on less-boring full teams on Lunatic.

On the other hand, on HM, they're absurd no matter what.

Btw, how hard can a Spotpass/Streepass player team be? How many characters are allowed on it?

On Lunatic, Sigurd's SpotPass team contains this guy:

Great Knight

LV20

HP 80

Str 51

Mag 4

Skl 35

Spd 33

Luck 32

Def 45

Res 9

Move 7

Sword A, Lance A, Axe A

Silver Axe (+8 Mt, +20 Hit)

Vantage, Luna

His battle stats are:

Atk: 75

Hit: 163

Crit: 17

Avo: 65

The others aren't any less scary. Two of the Paladins have forged Brave weapons.

[Only My Unit]

Holy crap. I'm going to need my best combinations to survive. It's a good thing my primary team will consist of a few good magic users for taking them out (though I'm scared to think of a Sorcerer with broken skills using a forged Il and Noseferatu combo).