"I just want to know one thing!" - FE13 Edition

[Mousse9]

My Olivia has gotten to lvl 10 as Dancer, should I reclass her to something else now (I'm thinking Myrmidon), or should I keep her as Dancer until later? I seem to very rarely use her Dance option, and I want to develop her Skills. She'll need to be able to survive combat first, hence the Myrmidon route. So, reclass now, or wait?

[Dual Dragons]

My Olivia has gotten to lvl 10 as Dancer, should I reclass her to something else now (I'm thinking Myrmidon), or should I keep her as Dancer until later? I seem to very rarely use her Dance option, and I want to develop her Skills. She'll need to be able to survive combat first, hence the Myrmidon route. So, reclass now, or wait?

I usually go Pegasus Knight --> Dark Flier. As a Myrmidon, unless you're willing to invest in Levin Swords (or, if you have DLC, Ragnell), she'll be restricted to swords for a time, and going either Swordmaster or Assassin locks her into one-range or two-range weaponry (unless you get the two weapons stated earlier). Assassin may be good as her final class but you should probably get Galeforce for her son first, since he'll be locked out of getting Galeforce otherwise.

Was there someone you were planning to be her husband? Olivia's a squishy unit but has high Speed and Luck growths. If you're worried for her to survive combat, have a husband for her who will buff her defenses a little.

For future reference, Dance may be good as "infinite" experience, much like staff experience. Making her into another combat unit means she is splitting experience with other characters that don't have the luxury to "infinite" experience (like Chrom).

Edited September 7, 2014 by Dual Dragons

[Mousse9]

I have a ton of fliers right now. Sumia, Cordelia, Cherche, Panne and Nowi (both reclassed as Wyvern Rider). I am going to get Galeforce for her, but I kinda thought she'd be way too squishy as Pegasus Knight without at least some good combat skills. So getting Galeforce at the earliest possibility is the best way?

I've paired her up with Frederick, he's a tank. Though he seems remarkably oblivious to her charms, so to speak.

So, Pegasus Knight 10, Dark Flier 15, then something else? Is the Dancer any good as final class?

[Roivann]

Dancer is arguably her best final class, if only for it's unique utility. If you're looking for her to see combat, maybe assassin? I wouldn't recommend having her be a combat unit, though.

[Mousse9]

I think for now I'll focus on getting Galeforce for her, that'll take a while. The other units are getting to lvl 20, I'll need to start thinking about what to turn them into. Anyway thanks for the info.

[Dual Dragons]

I have a ton of fliers right now. Sumia, Cordelia, Cherche, Panne and Nowi (both reclassed as Wyvern Rider). I am going to get Galeforce for her, but I kinda thought she'd be way too squishy as Pegasus Knight without at least some good combat skills. So getting Galeforce at the earliest possibility is the best way?

I've paired her up with Frederick, he's a tank. Though he seems remarkably oblivious to her charms, so to speak.

So, Pegasus Knight 10, Dark Flier 15, then something else? Is the Dancer any good as final class?

I'm not sure it's the best way; but, because of the Cumulative level thing (especially in higher difficulties), it could be harder to get her Galeforce if you delay it for too long.

I'm actually not sure how Fred is as Inigo's father. I've done Chrom, Libra, and Stahl and they're good as well. Stahl in particular: he is pretty close to Chrom's mods and classes; Inigo just won't get Rightful King.

Dancer's great as a utility class. Only Olivia can ever be a Dancer. This game kind of doesn't support it, though, because of its Route/Defeat Commander missions. I really wouldn't want her to be another combat unit, but if you must, Assassin might be her best combat. She doesn't even have to be in the frontlines permanently. Her access to Swordfaire (through Swordmaster) could make her stick with forged swords and really reap Swordfaire's benefits. Pass + Galeforce can be good if you need to get rid of a pesky enemy behind another and have her switch back to her partner.

Personally wouldn't use Lethality but she has decent enough Skill for that too; especially if she's an assassin.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Fred!Inigo works like a charm. Don't worry about him.

What do you mean, the game doesn't support dancing due to the frequency of Kill Boss maps? Those maps are where Olivia is most useful- she extends your movement by letting you move again, which greatly increases the range from which you can snipe the boss. I don't think Cht.21 on Lunatic No Grind would be possible to 1-turn without her (it would at least require a ton of Staffbots).

[Dual Dragons]

Fred!Inigo works like a charm. Don't worry about him.

What do you mean, the game doesn't support dancing due to the frequency of Kill Boss maps? Those maps are where Olivia is most useful- she extends your movement by letting you move again, which greatly increases the range from which you can snipe the boss. I don't think Cht.21 on Lunatic No Grind would be possible to 1-turn without her (it would at least require a ton of Staffbots).

I wasn't trying to say Dance isn't useful. More like because of the overall lack of non-fighting related missions (Seize, Escape, Talk to X, etc.), Dance's uses are limited in Awakening. As I've noticed in my Lunatic run, enemy reinforcements tend to act a lot more in the same enemy phase that they arrive. If one doesn't know when reinforcements come in a chapter, Olivia might just get slaughtered in a turn you thought you were completely safe.

Though this is coming from someone who's doing their first Lunatic run and had gone in without memorizing reinforcement data. In my future Lunatic(+) runs, I hope to know reinforcement data by then.

Sorry if that bit was confusing.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Well, the idea with reinforcements is that you simply never give them an enemy phase to arrive in. There are only two Route chapters after the first story arc, so as long as you have the right tools to clear those two (and beat the final boss), it's possible to skip over half the game with Olivia and Staffbots.

But yeah, that's hardly something you should be doing unless you place more value on clearing the game than playing the game.

Oh, and a tip on reinforcements: they always come from either forts, stairs, or the edge of the map, and they never come on turn 1 (excluding the final chapter and a few DLC maps). So if you don't see any forts or stairs, stay away from the edge!

[Dual Dragons]

Well, the idea with reinforcements is that you simply never give them an enemy phase to arrive in. There are only two Route chapters after the first story arc, so as long as you have the right tools to clear those two (and beat the final boss), it's possible to skip over half the game with Olivia and Staffbots.

But yeah, that's hardly something you should be doing unless you place more value on clearing the game than playing the game.

Oh, and a tip on reinforcements: they always come from either forts, stairs, or the edge of the map, and they never come on turn 1 (excluding the final chapter and a few DLC maps). So if you don't see any forts or stairs, stay away from the edge!

Haha. I could possibly save myself less restarts and headaches if I didn't have the mentality of "KILL ALL THE THINGS FOR EXP"--which does include waiting for all reinforcements. I need to learn that the effort to kill enemies in Lunatic is not directly proportional to the EXP I will gain. And having uncapped stats by Endgame is not bad.

That's good to know. Thanks. I always knew about forts and stairs, and sometimes I get surprise-attacked from the edge reinforcements. Especially if the enemies come from the area I start the map from.

I really need to learn about benefits and costs.

I guess I'll ask a question here.

I want to attempt Lunatic(+), possibly a No Grind run. I know probably one of the most efficient ways to do so is to have Robin (F) x Chrom, Lucina, Morgan, and just a whole bunch of staffbots/rallybots. But I'm a little irrational and like to use Chrom!Inigo, which I know means Olivia's going to need to get trained fast so Lucina isn't screwed.

I'm thinking of not attempting this on my first run (probably going efficient Chrom x FeMU) but in another one. For future reference, though, what would be a good way to train her? Dancer (lv. 10) --> Pegasus Knight --> Dark Flier (Galeforce) --> Dancer?

Edited September 8, 2014 by Dual Dragons

[Czar_Yoshi]

Ah, the whole "can I make Chrom/Olivia work in Lunatic(+) nogrind" problem. I've spent quite a while on this, and while it's barely possible, it is indeed possible to pass Lucina Galeforce from Olivia in Lunatic+ nogrind (and by extension, have it on Olivia and Inigo, making it possible to route some of the later chapters through offense instead of turtling if Avatar also has his wife pass down GF). Your route will be Dancer 30-> DF, and you'll need to plan ahead significantly (stockpile as many healing items as you can, and get a forged beastkiller and optional helpful Arms Scroll (and a Second Seal, of course)). Massive Wall-O-Text coming up.

Basically, what you need to do is enter Cht.11, have a heavily defensive pair (usually a +Def Avatar supported by a high level Manakete/Dark Knight, you want around 40+ Def if possible) take down the Thief, remove their weapon (either through Galeforce or using a weapon that's been manipulated to 1 use and having nothing else), and then facetanking all the enemies on the map while Olivia Dance Spams her way to Lv.30 and then reclasses to DF. Your goal is to break all the enemy weapons- be prepared to Rescue Avatar out of the mess to restock on Elixirs to kite for a bit 9and pick up the reinforcements, who will otherwise target the rest of your team). Olivia can then feed on all the exp- she needs D Lances for Cht.12, so either have her fight with a Bronze Lance or give her an Arms Scroll (then she can switch to Tomes).

For Cht.12, she wants a GL Chrom support, preferably with as high of Spd and Lck as possible. She also needs a +5 mt Beastkiller, and the more weapon ranks she has the better. Chrom can have his Rapier forged if you want, but it usually isn't necessary. Basically the two of them need to clear out the entire pocket of goons on the left themselves on turn 1- you can one-shot someone who lacks Pavise+ with a Dual Strike on player phase, so there are four to take down. Olivia can typically take only one hit, so if there's more than one Counter/Hawkeye you have to reset. Pavise+ is very annoying too and is why you might want a forged Rapier. Vantage+, Pass, Aegis+ and usually Luna+ are harmless.

You then need to set two mighty tanks- probably your Avatar and the support from Cht.11 (they don't need to be that strong, since each one will only be taking around 2-4 battles per EP)- in the two-wide chokepoint directly above where you begin (unequipped). The idea here is that enemies without Pass will pile up behind them, while ones with Pass will come through them and attack from behind. You need to get all of your non-combat units into the bottom right corner for EP (and able to survive the handful of enemies that can reach them from above). On turn 2, Rescue Olivia to the right corner and kill everything with whatever it takes.

Before ending turn 2, take a look at whatever used Pass to get below your chokepoint. If it's a Bow Knight, kill it with one of the tanks, and then have them trade weapons with eachother to unequip again. If it has Counter and will attack at 1-range, put one of the squishies in the corner in it's range- something that can do damage, take the Counter and it's attack, and neither die nor get the KO. If it has neither Counter nor a Bow, leave a full health Olivia in it's range.

Turn 3: Have Olivia finish off whatever it was, and Rescue her back into position if needbe. Keep an eye on the tanks' health. Lather, rinse and repeat until all the Pass enemies are dead. From here, there are two ways to safely unravel the traffic jam (which is better will depend on how much Counter you're dealing with). First, you can send an unequipped unit north from the corner to pull goons one by one for Olivia to fight- though make sure to check all ranges so you don't accidentally pull a Bow Knight and something else, and also watch out so the foe doesn't wind up still in it's allies' range. The second way is to have the two tanks take a step back, and put squishier units directly behind them- your goal is to lure ranged units to the front who will attack the squishies instead of the tanks, opening up clean shots on them (once you kill all the ranged units, Olivia can safely kill everything from behind the tanks).

Par.4: It's OK to save this Paralogue for Olivia if you want to. There's not enough exp here to merit not training her in Cht.11, but there's enough to give you quite a bit of leniency with allowing other units to help dispatch stuff in Cht.12 (you usually get at least two Pass units at once, and it's nice to have a second unit for them). Don't save Par.1, 2 and 3 though- 1 is needed for the Rescue Staff (for Cht.5), and 2 and 3 make great places for training staffbots for Valm. You should be pretty overleveled for it by now, or at least enough to take a more normal approach to combat.

Cht.13: Use the strat in Interceptor's log (rush to the lower right hand corner and turtle), except with Olivia bias when sniping approaching units. There's no safe way to feed her all of this map, but she should only need a few more levels so just take what's safe. Whenever she reaches 15, you can do whatever you want with her- Galeforce turns her into a pretty big combat asset, but she can also go back to Dancer which is very helpful on this map.

[Armanyte]

Can someone explain to me the current opinion on Lon'qu!Severa. I've looked around and heard responses ranging from great to "God awful why would you do that?" So what's the current consensus now? If I did go with this pairing what should each parent pass down?

Edited September 8, 2014 by Armanyte

[Elieson]

Lonqu as a parent to Severa gives her top knotch Speed/Skill mods, and access to the Myrmidon tree. She gains access to Vantage and Astra for an offensive proc, as well as Swordfaire, but it's largely unappreciated, since she already has Lancefaire, and lances are generally better anyway.

IMO it's not a bad thing to have Lon'qu!Severa, but Severa really wants a parent with access to Cavalier, for Luna access, and Stahl gives her that + Myrmidon. Sure she gets -3 speed compared to Lon'Qu, but Str and Def are improved, and that counts just the same. Stahl gives Astra+Swordfaire anyway (since he has the Myrm tree, giving him Swordmaster), so if you really wanted to go Hero or Pal/GK with swords, you could do that.

Ideally:

Stahl!Severa

@Lancefaire

@Luna

@Vantage

and whatever else like Galeforce and Limit Breaker

Edited September 8, 2014 by Sara.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Can someone explain to me the current opinion on Lon'qu!Severa. I've looked around and heard responses ranging from great to "God awful why would you do that?" So what's the current consensus now? If I did go with this pairing what should each parent pass down?

She's tied for best with Virion!Severa and slightly above Vaike/Stahl!Severa.

Generally, she's got three sets she can do: Wyvern Lord (LB/GF/LF/Vengeance/All+2) paired with a Berserker, which gives her enough Spd to double anything in the game along with a huge amount of mobile power, Hero/Assassin (+Avo skills) as one of the best dodgetanks in the game, and Hero (LB/GF/SF/Vengeance/Anathema or All+2) which is a good set for trying for 100% Dual Strike, and generally very strong.

Stahl!Severa is nice and all, but doesn't capitalize on any of Severa's strengths and instead turns her into another Noire/Kjelle with slightly different mods. Severa has a lot of niche-filling potential, and Stahl!Severa doesn't realize it well.

Keep in mind, anyone who automatically says units without Luna are worthless and Stahl!Severa is supreme is still in a mindset that was popular a year ago where Galeforce and Luna are mandatory on every unit, even going to such silly extremes as giving Luna to hard supports (who will never use it) in place of Faires.

Sure she gets -3 speed compared to Lon'Qu, but Str and Def are improved, and that counts just the same.

Def counts for nothing in Apo.

Also, Vantage is generally useless in Apo unless you're using Vengeance and have 100% DS in a class with Tomes. Stahl!Severa isn't getting that any time soon. If you do want to use her, she should have LB/GF/SF/Luna/Astra as a Hero (if you make her a Paladin, she'll fail to hit 75 Spd without a SM support (40(base) +3(mods) +10(LB) +10(Rally) +8(Berserker support) +2(tonic) =73), and SMs are bad).

[Mousse9]

Hello again. I've got questions about promoting and reclassing certain characters. Most of my chars are now lvl 19-20, and since I haven't done Chapter 14 yet, I don't have access to Second Seals (which I think come after Chapter 16?), so my reclassing is limited. That said, here goes:

Vaike. Hero to lvl 15 for Sol and Axebreaker (though IMO Axebreaker is optional), then reclass to Barbarian for Despoil, then promote to Berserker with Axefaire for his final class. Any good?

Cherche. Wyvern Lord lvl 15 for Quick Burn and Swordbreaker, then to get some useful Skills, reclass to Troubadour for Resistance +2 and Demoiselle (Demoiselle seems iffy though), then War Cleric lvl 15 for Renewal (though I question the usefulness of Renewal, as a flying unit, she'll probably be deep in enemy territory, out of range of healers), final class would be back to Wyvern Lord.

Gregor. I have absolutely no idea. Hero for Sol, but other than that, I don't know. Reclass to Myrmidon then Swordmaster for Astra and Swordfaire (for sword-using Heroes)? Or go for Barbarian, then Berserker for Axefaire (for axe-using Heroes)? Mind you, currently I only have 4 Second Seals, I have to be very careful with them.

Any advice on these three?

I'll add more once those hit lvl 20 as well. (I probably should just play, it's Normal Casual Mode...)

[Czar_Yoshi]

As I said before, reclassing from promoted classes to base classes makes it likely that you'll wind up wasting levels due to being statcapped. Especially in Cherche's case, she should reclass to Troubadour (if you really want it's skills), promote, and then switch back to Wyvern Lord.

Also, few adults have many useful skills. If you want to hop around for full skillsets, wait until you get more children, who have roughly twice as many options as the first gen units.

[Mousse9]

As I said before, reclassing from promoted classes to base classes makes it likely that you'll wind up wasting levels due to being statcapped. Especially in Cherche's case, she should reclass to Troubadour (if you really want it's skills), promote, and then switch back to Wyvern Lord.

Also, few adults have many useful skills. If you want to hop around for full skillsets, wait until you get more children, who have roughly twice as many options as the first gen units.

Well, crap. I'll have to blaze through the next 3 chapters to get Second Seals then. With a whole bunch of chars that are close to max level, heh... You live and learn...

[Czar_Yoshi]

Or recruit Severa, Inigo or Nah. Their Paralogues sell Second Seals and are available from Cht.13 onward.

[Mousse9]

Oh wow, the depth of optimization possible is rather staggering. I never thought having TOO MUCH choice would be bad, LOL.

Inigo: Olivia would have to go Peg Knight - Dark Flier for her to pass down the female only Galeforce. She's a Peg Knight lvl 9 currently, so she has a ways to go yet. Takes too long.

Nah: Donnel is married to Nowi, so either Aptitude, Armsthrift (he's a Merc right now), or male-only Counter, but that means he'd have to reclass to Fighter then promote to Warrior. Takes even longer than Olivia. Dangit, Aptitude, Armsthrift and Counter ALL sound good.

EDIT: Sol sounds good too, but with Donnel as father, Nah can get that on her own.

Severa: I'm thinking of having Kellam as Cordelia's husband. Cordy's a lvl 1 Dark Flier now so I'd have to get her to lvl 15 to pass down Galeforce, but Severa herself can go Peg Knight so it's not absolutely necessary.

Since I realize I've already kinda screwed up the optimization thingie, I'm thinking of getting Kellam and Cordelia to marry first, and then do Severa's Paralogue. Inigo and Nah can wait for Galeforce and Counter.

EDIT #2: Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I take from all this advice is that there is a dichotomy? Either get the parents a good skillset and screw over the kids, or blitz the parents to the class with the skill to pass on, leaving them with few skills, and get kickass kids?

Edited September 9, 2014 by Mousse9

[Shadow Mir]

Oh wow, the depth of optimization possible is rather staggering. I never thought having TOO MUCH choice would be bad, LOL.

Inigo: Olivia would have to go Peg Knight - Dark Flier for her to pass down the female only Galeforce. She's a Peg Knight lvl 9 currently, so she has a ways to go yet. Takes too long.

Nah: Donnel is married to Nowi, so either Aptitude, Armsthrift (he's a Merc right now), or male-only Counter, but that means he'd have to reclass to Fighter then promote to Warrior. Takes even longer than Olivia. Dangit, Aptitude, Armsthrift and Counter ALL sound good.

EDIT: Sol sounds good too, but with Donnel as father, Nah can get that on her own.

Severa: I'm thinking of having Kellam as Cordelia's husband. Cordy's a lvl 1 Dark Flier now so I'd have to get her to lvl 15 to pass down Galeforce, but Severa herself can go Peg Knight so it's not absolutely necessary.

Since I realize I've already kinda screwed up the optimization thingie, I'm thinking of getting Kellam and Cordelia to marry first, and then do Severa's Paralogue. Inigo and Nah can wait for Galeforce and Counter.

EDIT #2: Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I take from all this advice is that there is a dichotomy? Either get the parents a good skillset and screw over the kids, or blitz the parents to the class with the skill to pass on, leaving them with few skills, and get kickass kids?

Counter and good cancel each other out, sadly.

[Mousse9]

Wait, WHAT cancel eachother out?

[Shadow Mir]

Wait, WHAT cancel eachother out?

In layman's terms, I'm saying Counter is a bad skill.

[Mousse9]

Wait, seriously?! Automatically returning damage when a character is hit, is pretty awesome IMO. Can you tell my WHY it's bad in this game?

[Shadow Mir]

Wait, seriously?! Automatically returning damage when a character is hit, is pretty awesome IMO. Can you tell my WHY it's bad in this game?

It only works on adjacent enemies. Strike one.

Related to that, most of the enemies you'd have to worry about aren't likely to get right in your face to attack. Strike two.

You'd have to take a lot of damage to get anything out of it, and that's no bueno. Strike three.

Edited September 9, 2014 by Levant Caprice

[Mousse9]

Does this count on Normal-Casual Mode as well?

I've been reading up more, and people say instead of Counter, have Donnel pass on either Aptitude (for better leveling), or Underdog (because Manakete lvl 30 will always be lower level than the enemies in the late game).