Super Smash Bros Universe Mafia

[Prims]

speaking of which people need to get their actions in asap so the night ends soon. i've already sent in mine

[BBM]

I've sent in mine too.

[Shinori]

it's gonna be fun claiming at the start of d3 and sending scum into damage control 8)

With this much time to plan and to set up fake claims I doubt you and the other scum will have to go into damage control. You keep saying things like this as if you are trying to distance yourself from scum as if you are obvtown, but you aren't and just because you claim doesn't mean you are obv town.

[Prims]

though honestly, right now it feels like i'm setting myself up for a jan-kill.

town!psych, if that happens, don't let my legacy die. you are our only hope :< (unless you're scum and i'm just an idiot)

[Subieko]

I still think nolynching in some situations is just fine considering the circumstances, let's lynch between two power roles or ninja power lynch someone else in the last hour, It seems stupid and illogical to do that.

That being said I would have preffered a Prims lynch last night but no one wanted to even question him at all.

Look. I thought Prims' double fakeclaiming and other flailing around was stupid but it just doesn't make sense for him to be scum under the circumstances. Consider two cases, one where SB is scum and one where SB is Town. If SB is Town, then his claim is true and scum!Prims would have no reason to freak out trying to save him; in fact, Prims is the one who pushed for SB to claim in the first place. He could easily have sat back and let SB get lynched instead of urging people to vote you instead. If SB is scum, on the other hand, then scum!Prims would be his scumbuddy trying to save him, in which case it makes zero sense that prior to SB's claim Prims was voting for him. That wagon didn't have that many votes and wasn't even his preferred one, there was no reason for a scum!Prims to bus scum!SB at that point instead of trying to get another lynch. Only like two people would've needed to switch votes for that to happen.

So basically, Prims being scum does not match with his behavior regardless of SB's alignment.

[BBM]

I also have no clue how my action will work in conjunction with Iris's next night, bleh. Most likely, neither mine nor Elieson's actions will work properly.

[Shinori]

SB is town scenario and prims doesn't want to be at fault for being on the wagon of lynching a watcher, Scum!Prims would know SB wouldn't be mafia and would therefore believe the watcher claim, and would not want shit for for lynching the inactive town watcher who he pressured to claim. Thus he switches to me originally trying to get everyone to swap to me but when that didn't happen as easy, go for a tielynch/unvote at the end to get SB killed.

Actually IIRC didn't prims tell people to no longer vote me at one point in time when it was a tie and him and blitz would have a 1 v 1 go at it or some bullshit? That along with the ninja unvote pairs up for a scummy maneuver to get town watcher lynched wouldn't you think?

[Shinori]

nobody unvote at deadline, if there's a NL we go into flint / prims 1v1 tomorrow

HERE WE GO.

[Grace]

itt: Prims is still hypocritical

no really. Between the powerwagon on Shinori (which he specifically said is bad for town) and that, it doesn't look great.

[Subieko]

SB is town scenario and prims doesn't want to be at fault for being on the wagon of lynching a watcher, Scum!Prims would know SB wouldn't be mafia and would therefore believe the watcher claim, and would not want shit for for lynching the inactive town watcher who he pressured to claim. Thus he switches to me originally trying to get everyone to swap to me but when that didn't happen as easy, go for a tielynch/unvote at the end to get SB killed.

Actually IIRC didn't prims tell people to no longer vote me at one point in time when it was a tie and him and blitz would have a 1 v 1 go at it or some bullshit? That along with the ninja unvote pairs up for a scummy maneuver to get town watcher lynched wouldn't you think?

You are simultaneously arguing that Prims is scum who wanted to avoid being on a Watcher lynch and scum trying a weird gambit to get the Watcher lynched. These scenarios cannot both be true and arguing both of them makes it look like you just decided Prims is scum and are willing to use any possible rationalization for it.

In any case, Prims is the one who pushed for SB's claim. He had no need to do that if he was scum. Further, of everyone who was online at the time, he was the MOST active in trying to get the lynch off SB. He drew tons of attention to himself and caused you, Manix, and Blitz to all start saying he was scum. Given that SB had been scummy earlier it would have been much easier to doubt the claim and then do damage control after the flip rather than making himself a target of suspicions while also keeping a Watcher alive. What you're suggesting is just not a good strategy for scum.

[Prims]

if i wanted bananas lynched, why didn't i just switch my vote to you then let the retards who weren't going to let you get lynched get rid of bananas without me getting my hands dirty instead of creating a huge ruckus over it?

[Prims]

manix if you're not going to stop being paranoid then just find an obvious townie (psych or excellen) and sheep to them for the rest of the game instead of making me deal with this bullshit

[Grace]

It's called scumslipping, Subi. Given the amount of pressure at phase end, it's entirely possible. Plans can fall apart under pressure.

Also a reminder that scum watchers do exist. I will harken back to the days of Schoolgirl, where I tried to keep my scum!rolecop alive, but failed to. Given how SB has acted, I'm still fairly convinced he is scum, and don't want a possible scum!watcher to stay alive (see reasons why I thought Kay may have been scum!rolecop in this game)

[Grace]

ie: I still find SB scummy, but there may be better targets tomorrow

And no Prims, I'm not sheeping because I'm not lame. And besides, why should I listen to you anyway? You're not making a good impression this game.

[Prims]

It's called scumslipping, Subi. Given the amount of pressure at phase end, it's entirely possible. Plans can fall apart under pressure.

you're grasping

[Prims]

You're not making a good impression this game.

yes which is why i'm scummy because obviously scum would want the town to hate them so they get lynched.................................

i'm just being an asshole because i'm frustrated

[Grace]

I'm saying it is a possibility, not that it is exactly what happened. Don't make assumptions.

[Grace]

At the first post, for reference

Whatev, I'm done discussing for now, gonna wait for D3 to put everything forward that I need to

[Prims]

you, blitz and shinori have to make up insane theories to justify your case of scum!prims. this should be the first sign that you're wrong.

of course blitz and shinori are scum anyway and won't actually be reasoned with since they don't know how to pick battles they can win

[Subieko]

It's called scumslipping, Subi. Given the amount of pressure at phase end, it's entirely possible. Plans can fall apart under pressure.

Also a reminder that scum watchers do exist. I will harken back to the days of Schoolgirl, where I tried to keep my scum!rolecop alive, but failed to. Given how SB has acted, I'm still fairly convinced he is scum, and don't want a possible scum!watcher to stay alive (see reasons why I thought Kay may have been scum!rolecop in this game)

That would be less of a slip and more of a full-blown meltdown though. Dude was seriously freaking out over the lynch.

And again, if you think SB is scum, then scum!Prims makes even less sense, because Prims was on the SB wagon earlier. And at that point SB had like, what, 4 votes on him? If Prims and SB were scumbuddies it would not have been hard for Prims to keep arguing for another lynch--he had even said he preferred Scorri over SB. Why vote his own teammate? That seems like a stupid move for the scum team.

I didn't like the powerwagon on Shinori earlier on either, and I thought Prims' end-of-day got pretty ridiculous, but I just do not think it makes logical sense for Prims to be scum in this situation. And him and SB as scumbuddies makes even less sense--if either of them flipped scum it would be curtains for the other. Plus doing crazy stuff like double fakeclaiming and pretending to dayvig Blitz seems way too attention-getting for scum. I realize Prims is a good player and maybe he could get away with that but still, that would be pretty crazycakes.

Apparently he's going to do something on D3 to prove he's Town or something though? Or whatever he's talking about with his unlynchable thing. So we will have more info then.

I also want to bring up Folgore Pink's Tracker claim again--FP said he tracked SB N1 and got SB as idling, SB says he was actually Watching Prims, Prims confirms SB's result. I know SB said he doesn't visit, but his role PM doesn't say that so...can SB confirm if that was host-given info or if he just assumed that? And do Watchers usually not show up on Tracker reports? I thought they did, and if they do there are obvious problems here.

[CT075]

town!psych, if that happens, don't let my legacy die. you are our only hope :< (unless you're scum and i'm just an idiot)

oh shit

town is screwed

[Kriemhild]

idk about scum!Blitzy but I'm more confident about scum!Shinori than any other scum reads. And I'm very confident of Town!Prims.

Subieko, what Shinori was trying to say was that scum!Prims wanted to know Town!Bananas role and then decided not to lynch him/her since we might suspect a scum!Prims for trying to lynch a Town Watcher. He's suggesting that scum!Prims chose to ward off suspicion on himself instead of pushing for a Town Watcher lynch. In any case, I disagree with that since his posts don't seem to be of that nature. If anything, he probably looked super scummy to a whole lot of players, so I'm pretty sure that trying to look good in front of everyone was not one of his top priorities near the deadline. Basically, I really think he's Town.

[Blitz]

Thanks Iris for outing your role

now Manix, do you have an active role?

also, Shinori, let the poor boy {Prims} off the hook for now, he has a fight with me tomorrow and he will need all the strength he can get

btw, I have my lab finals tomorrow and won't be here until like 3PM, as in 1 hour after phase starts, hope you wait up Prims.

if anyone wants me to answer something specific, go on ahead and ask

[Shinori]

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=33724&view=findpost&p=2056031

Still want some sort of answer though based off of that. He said no one unvote at phase end yet that's what he did.

[Kriemhild]

I also want to bring up Folgore Pink's Tracker claim again--FP said he tracked SB N1 and got SB as idling, SB says he was actually Watching Prims, Prims confirms SB's result. I know SB said he doesn't visit, but his role PM doesn't say that so...can SB confirm if that was host-given info or if he just assumed that? And do Watchers usually not show up on Tracker reports? I thought they did, and if they do there are obvious problems here.

Watchers normally show up on Tracker reports but keep in mind that this game implements a priority list. So the roles are designed to observe visits of either higher or lower priority than the Tracker/Watcher (which one it is depends on the mod). It is therefore very likely that either the Tracker won't see the Watcher visiting anyone, or the Watcher won't see the Tracker visiting anyone. Unless the roles were designed such that one of them observes actions of lower priority (and has high priority), while the other observes actions of higher priority (and has low priority), but I doubt that's the case.

If you think about it that way, it makes sense for the Tracker to miss the Watcher. But that implies that the Watcher should definitely be able to see the Tracker if they have the same target.