Super Smash Bros Universe Mafia

[Subieko]

I thought about this too (like proving Tables' role, since his results have been kind of vague), obviously, but no one wants to be on the same stage as me. ):

My problem with using your role to prove claims is that you have to wait an entire night, and it requires the second person to either give up their action, let it get used blindly, or have claimed their role. It just seems impractical.

Isn't universal backup suspected as a somewhat common mafia fake?

Eh, I don't feel too good about Marth's claim.

Is that actually what he's claiming though? Tbh my theory was that he took on Kay's role because that's the idol Piplup was cheering for, since King Dedede is a penguin...I realize this theory is dumb though. But anyway before we start speculating about whether Marth's claim makes sense I'd like to know what it actually is.

[Shinori]

I currently see marth as scummy as all hell just as I did day one. Thus why my vote is still on him. I explained all of my reasonings and I don't really like his response in return to me.

[Iris]

Reread what Blitz said, can he please be more clear? kthx, and also explain what you did with Shinori's redirectorness last night. :/

And did anyone else notice that scorri's scum Role PM lacked a night action line? That's just curious.

Isn't universal backup suspected as a somewhat common mafia fake?

Eh, I don't feel too good about Marth's claim.

It was Subieko's fakeclaim in CPM. Manix believed it for a while. 8) Anyways, I've seen it been used, though, like Kay was one in the original SFMM, but I don't think it's too common. Would prefer if he posted full claim. Marth easily has the weaker claim of the 3 Pokemon vanillas, though.

My problem with using your role to prove claims is that you have to wait an entire night, and it requires the second person to either give up their action, let it get used blindly, or have claimed their role. It just seems impractical.

Obviously, I realize this. That's why low-profile lynches like tracker would be good to check, etc.

Also last night I finally evolved into Venusaur. My role seems exactly the same, but in the area my night action would go, it just says I am ready to fight. I think that if me or another pokemon are on the same stage something might happen, but also my flavor mentions my knowing Solar Beam, so I'm going to keep going to Mushroom kingdom, and see if I can get any powers from the sun or something.

If it's anyone, it's most likely Charizard, since Charziard vs. Venasaur battle is super epic. Can't really see the same happening with Manaphy or Piplup.

Oh, and since this was ignored:

SERIOUS BABABAS-- YOU, YES YOU:

I also want to bring up Folgore Pink's Tracker claim again--FP said he tracked SB N1 and got SB as idling, SB says he was actually Watching Prims, Prims confirms SB's result. I know SB said he doesn't visit, but his role PM doesn't say that so...can SB confirm if that was host-given info or if he just assumed that? And do Watchers usually not show up on Tracker reports? I thought they did, and if they do there are obvious problems here.

Please follow Subieko's instructions and report what they tell you, thanks~!

[Kriemhild]

I've been thinking a bit, and here's what I came up with.

Imagine this. Let's say you just joined this game and was selected as Mafia. scorri is your scumbuddy, who has two High Jumps. How would you plan to utilize her High Jump?

Now, with roles like Janitor and Ninja, it's usually a good idea to use their abilities ASAP, because once they die, you can't use their abilities anymore so saving them for later could potentially be a huge waste. By that logic, High Jump should be used early on, since you can't guarantee that scorri will be alive if you wanna use it later instead.

But unlike Janitor and Ninja, High Jump isn't an ability that you can stick onto any kill and potentially benefit from it at least a little. It's purpose is to kill someone on a different stage, so it makes no sense at all to use High Jump if there's already a Mafia member on the same stage as the target, since they could just kill the target directly instead of wasting High Jump ammo. Rather, High Jump should be used to kill a target when there are no other Mafia members on the same stage. This would cause players to either suspect the other players on the victim's stage (all Townies), or seriously consider the possibility of stage-bypassing. Both these mindsets are beneficial for the Mafia, the first because Townies become suspected, and the second because they don't have to worry about being suspected of killing their target later on when High Jump isn't involved.

Too straightforward and predictable? Should scorri die, everyone will know that High Jump has two uses and if they suspect she used if on both N1 and N2, they can start suspecting players from N3 onwards. Knowing this, it would be a better idea for the Mafia to try deceiving the Townies instead.

And by that, I mean they will NOT use High Jump on both N1 and N2. Yes, that means that at least one Mafia member will have to be on the victim's stage, but it probably won't lead to a lynch. Not when the possibility of stage-bypassing gets more and more likely as the game continues on. And if the Townies think that the two shots of High Jump were used on N1 and N2, they will be deceived by the High Jump that was actually saved for later. By not using High Jump in a predictable manner, the Mafia can either fool the Townies to make the incorrect assumption that High Jump was used N1 and N2, or they make the Townies uncertain about when the High Jumps were used and therefore, stop caring too much about who else was on the victims' stage.

On N2, me and Excellen were alone together. This was the perfect opportunity for them to try and frame me. Let's assume that scorri didn't die. If you guys don't end up lynching me, you definitely won't find it suspicious for players to be on the victims' stages on future phases either, allowing the Mafia to kill without High Jump without worrying about being on the same stage. If you lynch me, and if I flip Town, you'd have not only mislynched, but stage-bypassing would be confirmed. Both of which would be beneficial for the Mafia.

Basically, what I'm trying to say, is that if I were Mafia, I likely wouldn't use High Jump on both N1 and N2. I think the Mafia killed normally without High Jumping in one of these two nights. This leads me to suspect Subieko, Strawman, and Proto. Especially Subieko, with her scummy role. I really think Subieko is Mafia killing Naggy N1, and then tried to frame me N2. If you guys wouldn't lynch me, you wouldn't suspect Subieko of killing either. If anything, Townies may have assumed that High Jump would have been used N1 and N2, thus CLEARING the N1 Fountain of Dreams players. Subieko is now scummier than Shinori from my point of view and you guys all know how much I want Shinori lynched.

[Kriemhild]

...that last post of mine turned out much bigger than I intended. No, I didn't say a lot of things, just kept repeating the same points over and over.

tl;dr - I really don't think Mafia used High Jump on N1

[Shinori]

Proto you tell me why you are self voting. Right now.

=|

I didn't say anything about this at first because I thought you were just trolling and I still think you are, however you could easily be mafia trolling us in some sort of situation just to confuse us. Either way it's stupid and tell us why you are voting yourself. IF you are unable to tell us why you are voting yourself post something how sexkay is on top. oftierlistsofcourse

Proto.

[Kriemhild]

And did anyone else notice that scorri's scum Role PM lacked a night action line? That's just curious.

I believe the reason behind that is because her ability wasn't an extra action. It was a modifier to the Mafia's kill. It'd be too broken if that was an EXTRA kill.

If it's anyone, it's most likely Charizard, since Charziard vs. Venasaur battle is super epic. Can't really see the same happening with Manaphy or Piplup.

So like, if I'm with Psych on the same stage, I'll end up frying him? Even if he goes to Mushroomy Kingdom for sunlight, I still benefit from the sun as well, by powering up my super-effective Fire attacks, as opposed to speeding up a 4x-resistant Solar Beam.

btw notice that Psych evolved from Ivysaur to Venusaur, whereas Proto started as a Charizard from the very beginning? The reason why is quite obvious, but as to how Kaoz intended to design the roles...

[Psych]

So like, if I'm with Psych on the same stage, I'll end up frying him? Even if he goes to Mushroomy Kingdom for sunlight, I still benefit from the sun as well, by powering up my super-effective Fire attacks, as opposed to speeding up a 4x-resistant Solar Beam.

btw notice that Psych evolved from Ivysaur to Venusaur, whereas Proto started as a Charizard from the very beginning? The reason why is quite obvious, but as to how Kaoz intended to design the roles...

Maybe if we do fight, then if I was an Ivysaur you would win, but if I'm a Venusaur I will win. So like that could make some sense since I have to evolve.

Anyway, come to Mushroom Kingdom tonight Proto. I want to see what'll happen.

[BBM]

I think Proto will lose the battle, as his role PM requires him to visit all the stages to become more powerful, which he hasn't done.

[Prims]

hey anybody want to lynch marth for the worst fakeclaim ever?

cuz i do

##Unvote

##Vote: Marth

remember if i die: blitz still isn't town

[charlie_]

I just made an assumption and tried to think of any it could make sense if she was telling the truth. I don't know how the priorities work.

[Prims]

elie, why did you claim under no pressure?

most players have already claimed pointless roles likes yours. by claiming at random, you're helping scum narrow down the important people who they need to roleblock and/or shoot. i don't see scum intent in this but it was definitely a bad move if you're town

stuff you've done that i actually do see scum intent in: why did you drop marth completely then go voteless for the first half of d2, it's like you randomly stopped caring about everything. when you started posting walls again most of your reads were neutral and you didn't really have conviction on anything, including your wagon hop.

were the irl issues from the start of the day? i was under the impression you were available up until you posted them, meaning you didn't really have an excuse for your apathy early on that day, just later

i also wish we could stop lynching people for being dealt roles that look scummy but are easily proven when we could be lynching people who are scummy (blitz) or actually talking out of their ass with their roleclaim (marth). this goes for you, elie. why would you vote iris for having an anti-town role when you yourself were given an anti-town role as town?

[Prims]

bananas, vote somebody who you think is scum. just because everybody thinks you're town doesn't mean you should stop playing the day game

[Prims]

we realllllllllly shouldn't have 5 voteless players 24 hours in, ok

if anybody wants a detailed case on why i think marth's claim is complete bullshit then i can provide it but i don't feel it's necessary at this point in time

[Grace]

I would be on board with a Marth lynch, really.

##Vote: Marth

That D1 play was not great, remember? And besides that, I don't actually remember a lot of his posts off hand. Doesn't look great. Also making claims that aren't quite factually correct... hmmmmmmmmm

[BBM]

So you'd prefer lynching Marth over Blitz today? Marth will probably be the first person whom I vote for if Blitz somehow manages to convince me once he comes back that he is town, but I think Blitz is worse right now.

[Prims]

main reason i want marth dead is that psych's roleclaim should have been enough to make proto look better, marth's was an oddball and looked like an attempt to gain cred from everybody else claiming pokemon

furthermore i think scum would've been more interested in rolecopping me than town after i was very likely to claim today if it became blitz vs prims. scum would want to know in advance since it'd be an ace up my sleeve while town would just wait patiently

[charlie_]

I'll make a vote when I have time to look closer at some things.

[Kaoz]

Votals

[3] Marth: Shinori, Prims, Manix

[2] Blitz: BBM, Psych Shinori, Subieko, Prims

[2] Iris: Elieson, Subieko

[1] Proto: Proto

[1] BBM: Marth

[1] Elieson: Strawman

[1] Manix: eclipse

Voteless: Iris, Serious Bananas, Cap'n Flint, Tableskitty

Phase ends in 48 hours and 37 minutes. Remember to choose a stage for the night.

[Prims]

what happened to psych's vote?

[Paperblade]

Who?

[Kriemhild]

Guys wanting to vote for Blitzy, please stop. He's not scummy at all. Seriously, stop.

[Kriemhild]

Quick question, has scorri ever claimed before she died?

[Grace]

Quick question, has scorri ever claimed before she died?

I don't think she did, from memory.

[Kriemhild]

Alright, I just found someone scummier than Shinori/Subieko. There is a very high possibility that Impy/I eat tables is scum.

Okay, let's first assume that Impy is Town. Look at Night 2.

===

Impy: Okay, I have two people that I can track. Who should I pick? First, there's Strawman, whose ability lets his target perform his action twice. This ability has been confirmed publicly. He has two possible targets: me or scorri. If he targets me, I'll get an extra message from the hosts. If he targets scorri, I won't get an extra message from the host. Which means I'll know who his target is without having to track him. Besides, there's not much benefit in knowing who he upgrades. So... I should track scorri, who never claimed, and has a completely unknown role. I should see who she targets.

scorri: Okay, because of the above logic, there is no way Impy is going to target Strawman. She's going to try tracking me. If I High Jump now, I can kill Excellen. But wouldn't Impy know? Would she see me target Excellen, who will be revealed to be killed? Or would she see that I disappeared, which is still suspicious? Either way, she won't see me idling or targeting her/Strawman. If I High Jump now, she'll likely rat me out and have me lynched. On the other hand, if we send someone else to kill on their own stage, they probably won't get lynched because players are seriously considering the possibility of Mafia kills bypassing stages. So it should be safer to just kill normally without High Jump...

===

But... that's not what happened, is it? According to I eat tables, scorri DID disappear from the stage. Why the heck would scorri let herself be exposed to a Tracker by High Jumping? It just doesn't make sense. Unless... Impy/I eat tables is scum.

===

Impy: Okay, I'm not gonna claim I tracked Strawman because it'd be a very stupid idea to track him instead of scorri in this situation. So, I'll claim I tracked scorri and saw her visiting me/Strawman/nobody [depends on scorri's prepared fakeclaim]. No one will find that suspicious because I/Strawman won't experience anything negative. scorri wouldn't even be pushed to roleclaim.

scorri: Since Impy will provide an alibi for me, I won't be suspected of jumping across stages. Which means this is the perfect time for me to High Jump and kill somebody. All right!

*scorri dies

Impy I eat tables: Uh oh, everyone knows she can High Jump now, looks like I can't claim that she targeted me or Strawman. Well, since she flipped scum and her role is revealed, I don't have to try hiding the fact that she can High Jump. I'll just openly claim that I "lost track of her", thus implying that she disappeared from the stage, which should make sense since she really did High Jump out of the stage...

tl;dr - scorri would not have felt safe about High Jumping when there was a Tracker tailing her last night. Unless the "Tracker" is actually her own scumbuddy.