RTU discussion thread

[Tamanoir]

Gregor's scores are fine; I can see him averaging at around a 5. He gets to be pretty decent after a class change or promotion, though there most likely won't be any resources available for him right away.

Having him averaging as 4-5 would be fine. No higher than 6. I gave him a high note at first, because I think less than 3 would be underestimated.

Gregor is mediocre, but he's in no way bad.

My idea of scoring is 0-2.5 : Bad (That's where Donnel and Virion go). 2.5-5 : Mediocre, not really good (Gregor can fits there). 5-7.5 : Good unit.7.5-10 :Excellent. May be rounded up. I would have given him a 5-6, if he didn't have had scores that low...

[Hawk King]

^ So you think all but 5 units in the game are good? realative to what? How can you call the 3rd - 5th worst units average - good?

And Nowi getting these high ratings is absurd. She is like a 6 Movement Kellam who comes several chapters later. And has a harder time of getting exp. I don't care if she is amazing when you turtle and grind for her to get exp. If we play like that then every character would get 9's and 10's.

Bearclaw is getting ridiculous with his ratings. Gives Panna a 4 for seemly no reason and then Nowi a 10 despite Nowi having less availability, a slower start, and less upside.

I wouldn't be surprised if he tried arguing that $10 dollar bills were more valuable than $100 dollar bills.

[Da Bear]

Bearclaw is getting ridiculous with his ratings. Gives Panna a 4 for seemly no reason and then Nowi a 10 despite Nowi having less availability, a slower start, and less upside.

Maybe because I honestly think she's better than Panne? I'm sorry but taking one of my first second seals is a lot bigger to me than anyone else apparently.

And Nowi getting these high ratings is absurd. She is like a 6 Movement Kellam who comes several chapters later. And has a harder time of getting exp. I don't care if she is amazing when you turtle and grind for her to get exp. If we play like that then every character would get 9's and 10's.

Odd. Because I never turtle or grind and yet she's always like my best unit. Maybe LM is making me think too highly of a tank but a 10 makes a lot more sense than a 3.

You do realize her speed is better than Kellam's right? So is her strength for that matter. She also has 6 move which >> 4 move and has consistent 1-2 range. I have trouble taking you seriously if you actually think there's a valid comparison to be had.

[Chiki]

I think people rate Nowi highly because she's a loli. She's completely overrated.

[Da Bear]

I think people rate Nowi highly because she's a loli. She's completely overrated.

<_< I don't see why you think this... I hate lolis. I like Nowi as a unit thanks to her stats being so great.

[Chiki]

You're the same age as Nowi is (physically). I don't blame you for liking her... heh heh.

[Da Bear]

You're the same age as Nowi is (physically). I don't blame you for liking her... heh heh.

<_< I don't feel attraction to video game characters... it's stupid and people who do should feel ashamed.

[Tamanoir]

^ So you think all but 5 units in the game are good? realative to what? How can you call the 3rd - 5th worst units average - good?

And Nowi getting these high ratings is absurd. She is like a 6 Movement Kellam who comes several chapters later. And has a harder time of getting exp. I don't care if she is amazing when you turtle and grind for her to get exp. If we play like that then every character would get 9's and 10's.

Bearclaw is getting ridiculous with his ratings. Gives Panna a 4 for seemly no reason and then Nowi a 10 despite Nowi having less availability, a slower start, and less upside.

I wouldn't be surprised if he tried arguing that $10 dollar bills were more valuable than $100 dollar bills.

Is it refering to me ? I think every units are good.

I think Gregor is average - good, but I can understand the people who call him average - bad.

He may be the 3rd worst unit after Virion and Donny, but he's far better than them. He can actually counterattack and do some damages.

Saying he's equal to an unit who dies in one hits, and one who is unable to counterattack or gain exp is unfair. He has decent buff and decent average damage input. His Pair Up, helps Nowi surviving in their starting chapter, so he have some uses.

Same thing with Nowi, except the only thing stopping her to kill stuff is doubling issues.

Nowi starts as a lower level, so gaining Exp is pretty easier for her.

She may have a hard time killing an ennemy, but she can weakens them and finishing them easily

I think people rate Nowi lowly because she's a loli.

Fixed.

People rate her highly because she's a Manakete, and Manakete are an awesome class.

Same reasons people rate Donny so badly, because Villager sucks...

If she started in absolutely every other class, she'll be worthless, but being able to tank hits like cray and counter attacking at 1-2 range is priceless.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Pedoclaw has a special feeling for Nowi that goes beyond bondary of time and space, so much that it is said that during the dark times of Shadow Dragon, Pedoclaw pick a Nowi to pray while wearing speedo

It is said that Pedoclaw hated Sheeda because Sheeda has Spear of Win that allowed people to beat H13, of course Pedoclaw did not believe in Sheeda like it should be because he wears speedo, hence why he gone through genetic mutation 13 times into the being that is now known as Pedoclaw13

And he still wears a speedo

[Da Bear]

Pedoclaw has a special feeling for Nowi that goes beyond bondary of time and space, so much that it is said that during the dark times of Shadow Dragon, Pedoclaw pick a Nowi to pray while wearing speedo

It is said that Pedoclaw hated Sheeda because Sheeda has Spear of Win that allowed people to beat H13, of course Pedoclaw did not believe in Sheeda like it should be because he wears speedo, hence why he gone through genetic mutation 13 times into the being that is now known as Pedoclaw13

And he still wears a speedo

This is the strangest post I have ever read. Especially since I've never worn a speedo.

[Chiki]

No, Nowi truly is unusable crap. If you played like a turtle, you could make Virion useful, too.

If you go fast, you see how crappy Nowi really is.

[Tamanoir]

No, Nowi truly is unusable crap. If you played like a turtle, you could make Virion useful, too.

If you go fast, you see how crappy Nowi really is.

And you're wondering why everyone see you as an arrogant elitist....

Virion starts medium-bad, in an awfull bases, and has truly mediocre stats. He have zero ennemy phases, and crappy deffensive power anyway.

But yeah, this is the exact same thing as someone who can tanks pretty well, have great growths, and have a perfect ennemy phase, sure enough. Leveling up Nowi is perfectly useable, she'll learns easily one level in her starting appearance, especially if you Pair her with Gregor (That's easily one of his main uses).

She may not deserves a 10, but having one of the best class of the game automatically gives you quite a lot of point.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

I actually have a decent success with Virion >_>

[Chiki]

Yawn personal attacks. You really hate people saying bad things about that loli huh?

Nowi starts medium-bad, has awful bases and truly mediocre stats, too. You need to baby both Virion and Nowi, and if you don't care about the number of turns you take, you have an infinite amount of time to do so. Both can be as tanky as you like. Virion can change classes and become a tank too.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Chiki

[Da Bear]

I actually have a decent success with Virion >_>

NO! BAD JSND! NO TALKING ABOUT PERSONAL PLAYLOG LIKE IT MEANS EVERYTHING!

[Inference]

I think people rate Nowi highly because she's a loli. She's completely bad.

Fixed. :(

She needs a lot of training. And even after you give it to her, she's still not a great unit. There's no excuse for being bad when you join and OK when you're trained. Completely counterproductive.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Nowi's entire quality is about trivializing EP heavy chapter

Which is.... none. Or Paralogues if you played those

[Tamanoir]

I think people rate Nowi highly because she's a Manakete. She's completely overrated.

Now, really fix'd. The question isn' what you think about Nowi, because Nowi as herself is pretty bad. Hardly better bases than Donny, but comes far later. Nobody will deny that.

The main point when you rate Nowi is what you think about Manaketes. If you plan to give more or less the same rating to Tiki (+1 or -1), then I'll understand. (Tiki have better bases, but come far letter, in a chapter where her usefulness is negative).

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Tiki's joining chapter is effectively chapter 19

And she is one of the best unit in that chapter

[Rewjeo]

Yawn personal attacks. You really hate people saying bad things about that loli huh?

what is this

Anyways, Nowi really, really is not that hard to train unless you're blitzing the entire game, which you really seem to be unable to grasp is not the only condition under which units can be discussed. You keep saying things about how bad she is and how useless she is once she's trained up because she doesn't help you 1-2 turn boss rush chapters without realizing that most people don't do that. Yeah, yeah, I know you have talked about yourself playing casually and whatever, but every time Nowi gets brought up, even in the tier list thread which is clearly not an ltc tier list you talk about how she doesn't help with that. If you're, say, playing efficiency with the intent to recruit all (nonchildren) characters, all you have to do to train her is dump her in front of some reinforcements for a chapter or two after she joins, and then she's good to go. Add in spotpass/renown, and you can even buy her a dragonstone+ to help.

[Randa]

No, Nowi truly is unusable crap. If you played like a turtle, you could make Virion useful, too.

If you go fast, you see how crappy Nowi really is.

Two things about this comment.

1. Don't under any circumstances compare nowi to Virion. Virion is mediocre after 8 levels, a second seal, and a decent pair up. Nowi is good after a defensive pair up. Completely different cases.

2. You wonder why people think you are an arrogant elitist. You pretty much just said that if you play like a turtle she can become useful. No. If you play at anything less than top speed she can very easily be usable. In the same thought you also said that when you play at top speed, and only then, do you see her true nature as a crappy unit. You are implying with this statement that the only way to truly see characters or truly play the game is to play at top speed or as its better known LTC.

I mean nothing personal by this I'm just pointing out why your logic is so flawed. Your saying there is only way to play. At the same time your looking down on people who play slowly. I hope you can understand why people get annoyed by this.

Yawn personal attacks. You really hate people saying bad things about that loli huh?

What went through your head when you said this. In one sentence you incorrectly claim that someone is personally attacking you, when in the next dozen or so words you actually insult them, not like before where your the only one thinking its an insult. You are up front saying that they are obsessed with a character in a video game. Which one of you two is actually insulting the other.

I apologize if this seems mean but I just had to get this off my chest.

Good day.

[shadykid]

Yawn personal attacks. You really hate people saying bad things about that loli huh?

my irony meter is flashing.....

Nowi's "investment" in turn cost or whatever is mild in comparison to a lot of the cast anyway, and afterwards she tanks everything with 1-2 range (6 move, yeah, but still)

[Ema Skye]

Nowi requires very, very little work if you know what you're doing and you're not Olwen (LTC makes most units terrible). Her growths are among the best in the game. Once leveled she can come close to 1-shotting so even if she's not doubling she can often still KO fairly easily with dual strikes. I find durability stats to be the most important stats in this game because all you need speed-wise is enough to double and attack is kind of easy to fix (mind Nowi's got amazing attack so...), her defenses are probably the best in the game 1st-generation wise and her speed can be enough to double if you give her a support like; Gaius, Gregor or Lon'qu. Overall she's pretty amazing.

How much little work does Nowi need?

Apparently 5 levels in Ch.8 is little work, considering she gets 2HKOed in that map. ABOOSE ABOOSE ABOOSE

Nope, she's not one shotting.

The first enemies NOWAI oneshots is the Ch.12 Thwomps because she doubles them. She lacks the 39 attack to be able to OHKO every enemy until then.

She needs 16 speed to have a shot at doubling most of the enemies in Ch.9, Ch.10, Ch.11 and Paralogue 4. This equates to +11 speed to come from: Tonics (+2), Support (+4) and levels (the rest, so +5).

I'm totally cool with you giving her points because you like her, but giving her a 10/10 just to balance out other peoples votes is a) terrible reason) and b) reeks of bias.

[shadykid]

The first enemies NOWAI oneshots is the Ch.12 Thwomps because she doubles them. She lacks the 39 attack to be able to OHKO every enemy until then.

this sentence doesn't even make any sense

[Ema Skye]

Well they're the first things she actually beats in a single round of combat. That's what I meant.