Why is LTC hated?

[Trickster]

I believe using your favorite characters and playing at your own pace, whether it's fast, slow, or moderate, is the best way to play.

[eclipse]

Because LTC/0% etc. is played for an accomplishment as well? Casual playthroughs generally aren't.

What one person thinks is a rote warm-up is another person's crowning achievement. When I play IIDX, this is my idea of a warm-up (and I expect myself to pass this song, albeit not with this kind of score; also, flashy light warning):

I do not shit on the person who thinks that passing the song above is a reason to celebrate (I'm more likely to give them a pat on the back). Just because YOU think something isn't an accomplishment doesn't mean that everyone else will think like that. This is one example of seeing things through the eyes of other people.

I believe that having fun with the game is the best way to play.

[Chiki]

I never said it was because I thought something was an accomplishment. What the majority thinks is a challenge is important.

The game itself is simply not designed with LTC in mind. FE6/7 were designed with their ranking systems in mind. I have literally no clue why IS did away with them afterward.

You'd be surprised how beautifully the game is designed for LTCs in some cases. The vast majority of the time you can cover just enough tiles to get a certain number of turns on the map.

[Integrity]

I find it far more frequent that Marth ends turns one square away from seizing.

Stupid Marth.

:|

[Loki Laufeyson]

I've LTC'd FE9 with ROLF, sometimes BROM in my team.

Tell me your secret. Other than BEXP leak, im not seeing how Rolf can much of anything. Even on Normal Mode Efficient play, Rolf has...problems.

[shadykid]

I find it far more frequent that Marth ends turns one square away from seizing.

Stupid Marth.

:|

well yeah, Marth is a loser, what'd you expect

[PKL]

Tell me your secret. Other than BEXP leak, im not seeing how Rolf can much of anything. Even on Normal Mode Efficient play, Rolf has...problems.

Draft LTC in Rolf's case but still. He once helped me 1 turn Chapter 19 alongside Tanith (Killer Brow) and yes, a sizable bexp dump. But when you have no other choice, he wasn't that ineffective (never lost turns because of him, though I did lose some because i had to recruit Jill instead of Marceeuh iirc obviously because I had drafted Jill instead of Marcia).

well yeah, Marth is a loser, what'd you expect

You are now on my enemy list. Good day, sir.

just kidding

Edited June 9, 2013 by Peekayell

[Loki Laufeyson]

Draft LTC in Rolf's case but still. He once helped me 1 turn Chapter 19 alongside Tanith (Killer Brow) and yes, a sizable bexp dump. But when you have no other choice, he wasn't that ineffective (never lost turns because of him, though I did lose some because i had to recruit Jill instead of Marceeuh iirc obviously because I had drafted Jill instead of Marcia).

You are now on my enemy list. Good day, sir.

just kidding

Ahh that makes sense. I still never played a draft...ive been meaning to try but i never do.

[shadykid]

Draft LTC in Rolf's case but still. He once helped me 1 turn Chapter 19 alongside Tanith (Killer Brow) and yes, a sizable bexp dump. But when you have no other choice, he wasn't that ineffective (never lost turns because of him, though I did lose some because i had to recruit Jill instead of Marceeuh iirc obviously because I had drafted Jill instead of Marcia).

You are now on my enemy list. Good day, sir.

just kidding

it's ok, we both agree Palla, Cordelia, and Marcia are awesome

Edited June 9, 2013 by shadykid

[ZaHiro86]

I think it's just because the majority of players don't play LTC, yet strategy on this site is always LTC oriented. I'd like to start seeing tier lists that focus on completion over efficiency (tho LTC tier lists shouldnt go anywhere)

[General Banzai]

Because LTC ubermensche is forcing me to play the game in a way I dont want to play

also they think Lute isnt very good, i mean what the fuck

Death of the author applies especially from a pure gameplay perspective.

Nope, nope nope nope nope nope

we got over the postmodern identity crisis 20 years ago, death of the author is dead, we weekend at bernie'd the author in order to have him prance around like a fleshpuppet on the grave of roland barthes to subvert your narcissistic self-reflexive and utterly isolated ways of making meaning in your life

Edited June 12, 2013 by General Banzai

[Steampunk]

Don't really care one way or another about LTC. Really don't care one way or another about LTCers thinking I'm not playing the game right. If you paid for my 3DS and Awakening, I just might actually give a shit about your thoughts on my play style. Since I spent the money, really I'm the only person I listen to about it. I'm open to tips and advice, but really don't care if I'm not playing the game "properly."

Just for shits and giggles, "Casual" in the most eloquent language of Gamer-ese, refers to a group of gamers who are mindlessly buying creatively bankrupt, cash-in games that are dragging down the "Viddiyuh Gaim Industree." I refer to myself as a recreational gamer so that people realize I play for fun, and don't stand outside Wal-Mart waiting for it to open so I can score the first copy of Monster's Inc Kart Racing. Personally, I really don't care if you say "casual" or "recreational" or whatever word jumps out at you; but considering the implications of a "casual gamer," I can see why some people take issue with others calling them that. There's only one way we can all come together and get along, and that's finding another group of people we can all hate as brothers and sisters. I propose dentists to be the target of our unified animosity.

In all seriousness, I'm part of the casual crowd. Some LTCers asked how that could possibly be fun. Can't speak for everyone else, but I enjoy experimenting. I like trying out different units and approaches. LTC runs don't allow enough flexibility to do that. I also like "flipping" characters. Kinda like flipping real estate: you take a shitty house and turn it in to something nice. I enjoy experimenting with new ways of putting characters to use, and turning characters most people ignore in to legitimately dangerous units. Practical? Not really, but it amuses me and that's the point. Think about it in terms of cars. LTCers want to win the Indy 500. I prefer to PImp My Ride.

Edited June 12, 2013 by Sheik

[Snowy_One]

Don't really care one way or another about LTC. Really don't care one way or another about LTCers thinking I'm not playing the game right. If you paid for my 3DS and Awakening, I just might actually give a shit about your thoughts on my play style. Since I spent the money, really I'm the only person I listen to about it. I'm open to tips and advice, but really don't care if I'm not playing the game "properly."

Just for shits and giggles, "Casual" in the most eloquent language of Gamer-ese, refers to a group of gamers who are mindlessly buying creatively bankrupt, cash-in games that are dragging down the "Viddiyuh Gaim Industree." I refer to myself as a recreational gamer so that people realize I play for fun, and don't stand outside Wal-Mart waiting for it to open so I can score the first copy of Monster's Inc Kart Racing. Personally, I really don't care if you say "casual" or "recreational" or whatever word jumps out at you; but considering the implications of a "casual gamer," I can see why some people take issue with others calling them that. There's only one way we can all come together and get along, and that's finding another group of people we can all hate as brothers and sisters. I propose dentists to be the target of our unified animosity.

In all seriousness, I'm part of the casual crowd. Some LTCers asked how that could possibly be fun. Can't speak for everyone else, but I enjoy experimenting. I like trying out different units and approaches. LTC runs don't allow enough flexibility to do that. I also like "flipping" characters. Kinda like flipping real estate: you take a shitty house and turn it in to something nice. I enjoy experimenting with new ways of putting characters to use, and turning characters most people ignore in to legitimately dangerous units. Practical? Not really, but it amuses me and that's the point. Think about it in terms of cars. LTCers want to win the Indy 500. I prefer to PImp My Ride.

OMG! You DIDN'T stand outside to get the first copy of Monster's Inc. Racing? What a total n00b! Sully is the best, but if you can unlock Woody in the door skateboarding level he totally pwns!

Joking aside (there is seriously a Monster's Inc. Racer? Or did you just make that up?), yea, that's pretty much the problem. 'Casual' is really more of an insult in gamer-talk on the whole, but there is no real 'term' for people who don't just goof off and play movie games, but at the same time, don't obsess over high scores and the like. 'Average' is about as close as possible.

[Redwall]

'leisurely' sounds innocuous enough

[Espinosa]

Because LTC ubermensche is forcing me to play the game in a way I dont want to play

also they think Lute isnt very good, i mean what the fuck

So what is Lute very good at according to yourself?

[Chiki]

[Snowy_One]

So what is Lute very good at according to yourself?

IMO, she's got an amazing personality and I've had a LOT more luck with her than any other FE character.

[Florete]

Really don't care one way or another about LTCers thinking I'm not playing the game right.

When has anyone ever said this?

This question goes to anyone who has ever made this complaint.

In all seriousness, I'm part of the casual crowd. Some LTCers asked how that could possibly be fun.

I've never seen an LTCer ask that.

[Steampunk]

I've never seen an LTCer ask that.

I never said they were people on this site. Some friends of mine (IRL and on other sites) think that if you're not "going balls to the wall," you shouldn't even bother and have asked me why I prefer a more laid back approach to gaming. It seemed relevant, so I shared my thoughts on the "hardcore vs casual" gaming phenomenon.

Edited June 13, 2013 by Sheik

[algae]

we got over the postmodern identity crisis 20 years ago, death of the author is dead, we weekend at bernie'd the author in order to have him prance around like a fleshpuppet on the grave of roland barthes to subvert your narcissistic self-reflexive and utterly isolated ways of making meaning in your life

Can I just say that this is one of the best things I've read? Not as a gamer reading about metagames, but as a lit student?

[MacLovin]

Banzai's an ENGLISH MAJOR.

also, there's a good point.

When did some LTC player try to force LTC?

I think we're mixing up stuff with drafts and whatnot.

[Narga_Rocks]

So, am I bad for siding with Olwen/Chiki on the use of the term "casual" not being some evil phrase? Personally I might expand on the definition of non-casual, though, depending on what he includes there. But I think I'd agree that finishing a support library still falls under casual.

I just don't see what's wrong with being called casual. I'm a casual player of most games. Except FE and FF5.

Let's have an "Am I casual" topic where everyone posts what they did in their playthrough and Olwen says whether or not he calls you casual. I think that'd be fun.

[Espinosa]

Or an even better idea: have Olwen evaluate the casualness of Interceptor.

[Snowy_One]

So, am I bad for siding with Olwen/Chiki on the use of the term "casual" not being some evil phrase? Personally I might expand on the definition of non-casual, though, depending on what he includes there. But I think I'd agree that finishing a support library still falls under casual.

I just don't see what's wrong with being called casual. I'm a casual player of most games. Except FE and FF5.

Let's have an "Am I casual" topic where everyone posts what they did in their playthrough and Olwen says whether or not he calls you casual. I think that'd be fun.

The problem is that it groups someone who clocks in 400+ hours on Civ V on deity who doesn't play competitively with the old granny playing Farmville on the library computer. Or someone like me who has been debating the FE tiers since FE9 came out with Joe Smoe who dallies on maps to build supports simply because I don't care about LTC. There are two distinct levels of gamer here. The 'leasurely' who play a lot and are good but don't care for the competitive scene, and the casual who care only for quick rushes of pleasure and can barely tell the difference between using Norma or Will in Tales of Legendia (or, worse, only knows a game by 'That Mario game where he turns into a plane' type stuff).

Edited June 18, 2013 by Snowy_One

[Randa]

So, am I bad for siding with Olwen/Chiki on the use of the term "casual" not being some evil phrase? Personally I might expand on the definition of non-casual, though, depending on what he includes there. But I think I'd agree that finishing a support library still falls under casual.

I just don't see what's wrong with being called casual. I'm a casual player of most games. Except FE and FF5.

Let's have an "Am I casual" topic where everyone posts what they did in their playthrough and Olwen says whether or not he calls you casual. I think that'd be fun.

One lets see how well that thread would go. But more importantly, casual itself is not offensive what makes people upset is that we encompass everybody who doesn't do challenge runs into the same category. To put in awakening terms, the casuals are everything below lunatic +. No matter how much Chiki refuses to admit it lunatic can be relatively challenging.(I don't care about your MU solo). What basically happens is that lunatic mode is then said to be about the same as normal. You can see why people don't like the term. And to answer the original question with this people dislike LTC because it classifie people in ways they don't like. Edited June 18, 2013 by Randa