Inception Mafia

[Grassbridger]

Whee let's do a post. I reread the thread with more detail than I did

Sorry about inactivity, I should be around more starting tonight/tomorrow.

-Strege's #32 made me uncomfortable, even for RVS, tone issue idk

-Manix should just idle his role if he's town, but I don't see why scum!Manix would claim that way, so I'm leaning town there.

-Shinori's reaction to Manix but-then-dropping-RVS-vote was weird. If you don't want to vote Manix, fine, but I find it strange that you'd choose to make an RVS vote when you acknowledge that there's real content.

-Don't like Prims right now. The thing with calling Quote a scum candidate before they had any real posts is weird, and there's some general tone things I don't like but can't put my finger on.

-Eury made a list post with lots of spoilers... With so much content to comment on, and commenting on most of the major posters, why did Eury feel the need to comment on SB's one post? And why not me or scorri, who also had one post each?

-Quote: You've had weird vibes from me in literally every game we've played together. Don't remember if you played in my only scum game.

-@Eury #179. Did you forget that Vhaltz claimed mayor as scum in, uh, I forget which game actually? Anyway, Eury's tone overall seems like town at this point and Eury always gets into tunnelfights with people.

-Strege, if you think arguing about Prims' caling Quote a "likely scum candidate" has gone nowhere, why did you raise a pedantic, relatively unimportant point about the original post? Also, it's not a good assumption to assume scum play ideally. Duh.

-Parrhesia's "story of the thread so far" post contains 0 reads and reads like padding.

Scumreads: Strege > Prims, also vaguely Parrhesia and Shinori

[Grace]

grass where is your vote?

also hi i'm awake and have been for a while, but i have like, nothing new for the table rn

[scorri]

Sorry I've been kind of out of it, I was sick/asleep for the first 24 hours, around some yesterday and just... not functioning well today. I've alerted the mods of this, would be considering asking for a sub if not for the fact that we apparently have none willing to play.

My vote on Objection was because his post was *bad* It was him being a hypocrite and making an easy vote. I see no reason to change it.

[j00]

14 pages guys

I'm back, give me some time to read this

[MRDRHAWK]

so evidently since I'm not subbing out due to the lack of willing subs I may as well give quick thoughts on things before I get yelled at or something

-Furet seems to play with genuine frustration (and I totally agree with it in this game, which has been awfully gay) which seems pretty townie, though the lack of meaningful content (i.e, reads and whatnot) is a bit concerning. Overall would not support a Furet lynch.

-Objection's continuing his stellar streak of looking genuinely bad with limited content; would support his lynching today.

-I feel a bit better about Rein based off his recent posts. He makes genuine posts about Via & Eury (especially the latter's poor scumhunting to that point), and notes that several cases on him at that point were bad. Don't want to lynch him yet by any means.

-Via's giving me bad vibes, mostly from the general lack of reads, buddying up to Manix (though this is not new so idk why I get bad vibes from this) and the fact that his reactions don't feel like genuine frustration like the aforementioned Furet's. Not sure if I'd support this lynch today, though; would rather wait for flips + associative reads.

-Eury's semi-tunnel on Manix comes off as parroting Prims to a degree, which is bad, as well as her tone indicating that she's not very serious about this game. Also, what the hell was with that "oh, was that a breadcrumb" line in #205? I definitely want this elaborated on. Currently would support this lynch as well.

-Prims. Hoo boy, Prims. He's playing up to some sort of meta, I suspect, but there's a number of things I don't like about his content:

1. BS reaction test. This is especially bad because he also gave off a sense of backtracking when he said that what he was pulling early on was a reaction test, which just makes it look like he's saving face.

2. His reasoning for the Shinori townread. Like, okay, I think Shinori's town too, but what the hell leads you to believe that frantic posting = loose-lipped town? If anything, that's more of a scum tell, but Shinori's content doesn't suck so whatever.

3. Admits to a desire of sheeping Strege/SB on me before I asked for a sub. Like, seriously? Are you just not going to bother forming a better read on someone who had a building wagon at the time?

4. Trying to push Bizz as a wagon for... some reason. I mean, the case is solid enough at first glance, but I'm kinda wondering why he decided to wagon Bizz all of a sudden as opposed to going at another, larger wagon that had a better chance of coming out successful. Kinda jumpy imo, but maybe I'm just overthinking this one so w/e.

So yeah, ##Vote: Prims for the time being.

Nobody else I really feel like discussing since I'm not feeling much from anyone else.

Lynch priority imo is Prims > Objection > Eury > everyone else.

also I'm still pretty darn gay

[Strege]

-Strege, if you think arguing about Prims' caling Quote a "likely scum candidate" has gone nowhere, why did you raise a pedantic, relatively unimportant point about the original post? Also, it's not a good assumption to assume scum play ideally. Duh.

I think ignoring the word "likely" is the root of that argument and that kind of thing bothers me a lot in general. I don't want people to continue to believe objectively incorrect things when they are basing reads off of that information. Also, I've heard people make that assumption with the argument that it is necessary as a point of comparison, and that otherwise most arguments fall apart. Anyway, I wanted to hear Eurykins's thoughts and I had a gut impression that that question would help me read her better.

Euklyd: hasn't had much to say. He hasn't posted enough that I'm really concerned about this, but it's getting close.

Objection: is concerning. I feel like he's padding with description and including limited interpretation. He doesn't say that he finds Quote or Prims scummy or not, just that he's waiting to see Quote's Prims case, which bothers me. Unironically asking the classic question "why shouldn't we lynch you?", for a lack of effort when a lot of people are lacking content, is almost scary. I don't see an active scumhunting effort in his posts.

Shinori: slightly better than before. I see his side of the initial Manix thing but I have some bad vibes, particularly from his Rein case which feels awkward and opportunistic.

Rein: I don't see his early content as leaning either way but I'm currently reading him as somewhat scummy. I don't like his Shinori case because:

- It's argued sparsely for the magnitude of the read.

- It misrepresents Shinori's argument as being "Rein voting Manix is scummy" when it's really "Rein not having many scumreads is scummy" (whether or not that point is fair is another argument).

- The dismissiveness aside, I see Shinori's response to Refa as pretty thorough.

Rein then goes on to have pretty generic opinions on Objection, Eurykins, and Poly under pressure of lack of reads.

Refa: has me a little wary. The cases on Poly and Shinori seem pretty safe, and the numerous defences of Rein confuse me.

Eurykins: In addition to my previous comments (which I get the impression I'll get a response to soon) the way she commented on Rein in her last post looks weird for a townread (accusation versus questioning).

Eurykins > Objection > Poly > Rein > Shinori > Refa

Even if he's subbing out, I see Poly as a better lynch than a few people because some substantial interactions do exist and I think he's fairly scummy. I need to reread Manix and Quote but I need to get a thing or two done IRL first.

[Strege]

Cut by Poly by like nine minutes, wow. Why do you think Objection is bad? Your point 2 misses the lack of calculation that Prims noted. I think asking for elaboration on a probably-role-related breadcrumb is bad.

More later. I should probably reread Prims too but I've been avoiding it because his meta's messing with me and he's written a lot of words. :/

[Refa]

Yeah, I am here. Will post something substantive after dinner. Noticed you mentioned Polydeuces, is he going to sub out or just continue playing?

Paperblade, whenever you get on, can you post one of those Generic Timer things? Thanks.

[MRDRHAWK]

Cut by Poly by like nine minutes, wow. Why do you think Objection is bad? Your point 2 misses the lack of calculation that Prims noted. I think asking for elaboration on a probably-role-related breadcrumb is bad.

More later. I should probably reread Prims too but I've been avoiding it because his meta's messing with me and he's written a lot of words. :/

Objection's content just blows in general. Specifically, the lack of it (only two votes, mostly both targeting Furet), sheeping someone else's thoughts (and quoting them to basically echo, no less) and already seemingly tunnelling Furet, which imo looks bad.

Eury sucks at crumbing if that's a rolecrumb, then, because the part where the crumb occurred had nothing mentioning roles in any facet.

Noticed you mentioned Polydeuces, is he going to sub out or just continue playing?

I'm still hoping I can get a sub, but if not then I'll just go #YOLO up in this shit. Doesn't seem like myself or Scorri are getting subs any time soon.

[MRDRHAWK]

two posts gah

fuck I'm so gay it actually hurts

[Paperblade]

Votals

Rein (2): kirsche, Shinori

Eurykins (3): Manix, Strege, Rein

Levity (2): SB, Prims

Manix (1): Eurykins

Prims (3): Levity, Euklyd, Poly

Parrhesia (1): Objection

Objection (1): scorri

Not Voting (5): Grassbridger, j00, Kay, Parrhesia, Refa

trying to figure out countdown timer thing

the only sub I have is Boron and she can't sub in for a couple days, sorry guys

Edited January 20, 2014 by Paperblade

[Grassbridger]

Oh wow I went away without realizing I had forgotten to vote. Was going to

##Vote: Strege

and his last post is a bit better but not enough to change that. The difference between "likely scum candidate" and "scum candidate" is, to me, not even noteworthy that early in the game, and if anything "likely scum candidate" is stronger than "scum candidate", which would invalidate that point.

[Prims]

-Don't like Prims right now. The thing with calling Quote a scum candidate before they had any real posts is weird

1. BS reaction test. This is especially bad because he also gave off a sense of backtracking when he said that what he was pulling early on was a reaction test, which just makes it look like he's saving face.

Are you reading the thread? Sorry but I've explained this over and over.

My claims of a reaction test COULD NOT HAVE BEEN BACKTRACKING BECAUSE THERE WAS NO WAY FOR ME TO JUSTIFY MY BIZZ SCUMREAD AS A SERIOUS VOTE. Do you seriously think I went "hmmm this guy who didn't post anything serious yet is obviously scum" as Mafia with the intent of lynching them off of nothing?

RE: the rest of Poly's #280:

2. Scum cares about the way they look and typically goes out of their way to make their posts look good so people won't lynch them. Shinori did not give a fuck about how he looked and was just posting whatever was on his mind. Also, having different logic from you doesn't make me scummy.

3. I thought their case was good but I didn't have anything to add to it that they hadn't already said. I had formed a read on you; it was that you were scummy.

4. If the lynch is "unlikely to go through" then it's going to stay that way unless I make an effort to get my scumread lynched. Not pushing somebody you think is scum because their lynch doesn't have much support is only understandable during deadline crunch. This doesn't mean anything.

his case on me feels like an easy one to push tbh

Is this why SB and I are the only people voting you?

Most of the game is basically ignoring my case unless it's to make up some BS about why I'm scum.

Also stop playing the victim, if you're an "easy target" because you don't have any reads then read the damn game instead of talking about how you need to read people but then not doing it or whatever. My case on you isn't even because you don't have any reads, it's because your push on me and interactions with me are fake as fuck.

yes I still thought Manix is scummiest at the time and that's why i was voting him. shinori's vote is like this too because apparently i HAVE to have found someone scummier than manix at the time??

Why was Manix still the scummiest to you at that time? He had said a lot of other stuff since the ED1 case and there had been other people talking about other things to you just sorta let it all slide to talk about people mad at you.

Rein seems really detached to me this game, I'm willing to switch to him if nobody wants to lynch Via.

Grass why is Strege the scummiest player for some semantics argument (which town can make) despite the actual content he's been putting out? How does this case even flow logically in terms of "Strege is mafia"? What the actual fuck?

[Percivalé]

dont call it playing the victim that's another sore spot too sorry

and that's not what I'm trying to do but w/e

I'd say other things but I dunno it feels like there's really no point to it because I'm still gonna think Prims is scum anyway. It doesn't make me think he's scum any less when he tries to dismiss my entire case on him as fake ~_~

[Prims]

Ugh. Actually, if they were mafia, I think Via would be responding a lot more "offended" / indignant to my attacks on them. I do think their play is scummy from like, an objective PoV though so I will be kicking myself postgame if they turn out to be mafia and I can't meta right.

##Unvote

##Vote: Rein

You don't seem to care about your reads. Please care about your reads if you are town.

Grass, kirsche and Objection are bad but Objection is the only one I can see getting wagoned. Grass bugs me though because you know he's going to be voting me at deadline for the same shit I've already explained 500 times; the Strege case is weak and not going to turn into a wagon but hey if he makes that vote now he doesn't have to look like he's wagon hopping. Poly seems a bit more legit after the reprise of his case on me even if it's bad, so I wouldn't support that lynch now.

Mostly I just wanna get some real wagons going since we're at < 24 hours from deadline (which I won't be around for).

Cut: OK dude but I'm town and if you think I'm scum and you're town then you're dumb peace

[Grace]

lol prims is doing the same thing as he did before (which via kinda already pointed out)

also that last post feels like something he did in masquerade. just a thought, and it's giving me a bad vibe.

[Grace]

i'd remember that shit because he wagonhopped to me with similar kinds of logic back in masquerade, just to save his scumbuddy. whether via is his scumbuddy is beside the point, it's the fact that he's jumping wagons with questionable logic

[j00]

negative utility roles should be claimed as soon as possible if possessed by town, because said roles usually mess up results and actions and by claiming we avoid town wasting actions, unnecessary claims and general confusion. tailor is like a miller to rolecops, visible doublevoters might as well claim early since they're obvious, though I'd probably shut up if I knew it was hidden

tl;dr: I disagree with everyone having issues with D1 claims about scummy/unhelpful roles

that said, I'm ascetic and -something-


via and manix should stop responding to attacks and questions to the other part, catching logical inconsistencies is fine and all but the way they jumped on prims and keep refuting accusations on the others is being really buddy-buddy here, let people defend themselves please

making a big fuss about a random rvs comment saying "oh you're scum btw", proceeding to call prims scummy, and then keep asking prims about "why do I seem x to you" is being too self-concious for my liking, one-line cases in rvs are worthless unless you actually responds to them
furet's posts are also bad and self-concious but his posts about D1 being useless as well as never ever seeing him play suggests that isn't used to mafia, and isn't bothering me as much as via, who's far more experienced

the eurykins and manix's arguments are getting increasily nitpicky with the definition of risks and all which are null, but stuff like

If you want me so badly lynched, then go vote happy on me all you want, Curly. I will say that there is absolutely nothing to gain from my lynch, and by your reactions/trying to wagon me off, I'm willing to bet that at least half of the people I have on my priority list/reads are probably scum.

is just pointless and provocative and doesn't help your case

just skimmed the thread so I'll posts comments on others as I ISO but via was the one who caught my attention the most in a bad way

##Vote: Quote

[Prims]

I want to say j00 is town off claim because Paper hates scum ascetics lmao. why mention the "something" though instead of letting scum just think you're asectic

smh @ Via wagon growing right after I jump off though

It is taking all my willpower not to make a snippy remark at Manix. I guess I'm sort of doing it anyway by saying this.

[Grace]

fite me prims

i can take it

[Prims]

ok

quote from THOUGHTS QUICKTOPIC (actually it's just my role PM but I want to be all ironic):

I swear Manix scumhunts by throwing darts at a list of people who said something slightly negative about him then running through their posts with a fine-toothed comb for things he can paint as bad.

[Grace]

also i'm really not interested in the via wagon today, at all. final answer

[MRDRHAWK]

I'm, like, some weird watcher variant

Like, it sounds as if you guys all get informed of who my target is or something like that. I'm not 100% sure what the second part means, but yeah I'm pretty sure I'm a watcher/follower.

[Grace]

lol prims

[Prims]

I'm, like, some weird watcher variant

Like, it sounds as if you guys all get informed of who my target is or something like that. I'm not 100% sure what the second part means, but yeah I'm pretty sure I'm a watcher/follower.

uh what

Why claim with 0 votes?