Code Geass Mafia - Game Over

[Refa]

He may not have actually said that his vote was a reaction test, but he did say that the reasons for his questions (which I assume includes the one he asked Eury when he voted her) were to get some real content from them. Wouldn't that be a reaction test?

Also, the reason I'm voting Poly isn't just because I don't get his suspicions. Rather, I feel that he's throwing around statements that put suspicion on certain people but not following through on them. For example, why is Eury grasping at straws and is she scummy for it? What about Blitz/Junko interactions does he not like to the point he thinks one of them is scum? It just seems like very shallow suspicions or finger-pointing, but no real thought into it, like he's avoiding committing to anything.

Well, reaction tests are like where you do something specifically to provoke a reaction. He was just asking her a question, which seemed different to me anyways (even if yeah, they both kind of have the same purpose to get more information). Anyways, this is just semantics so not a big deal.

Why do you think he'd throw suspicion on those particular people as scum? Like, I agree that his suspicions are shallow (at least until he comes back in and explains them), but I'm not seeing the scum intent there.

I don't like how she reacted to Paper's scum hydra theory. Sure, it's not definitively known whether SB would allow 3 Town Hydras or not, but this is Day 1 and we don't have any other definite information. So I wouldn't just disregard the idea as being "dumb" right off the bat. Well, considering that the scum hydra theory makes her one of the three lynch targets, I'm not surprised that she'd try to break that logic (even if she were Town), but I still think she looks worse than PoetMitsuki.

Proto, what do you think of Boron's content? From what you've analyzed, you think that she'd refute Paper's theory as either alignment so like...I don't really get what your issue with her is. Please understand.

[Refa]

Can i just say how horrible this logic is, and that I should probably vote you for saying something so utterly ill-informed?

##Vote Formina Sage

What's horrible about his logic? That's the basis for my townread on Poly as well (ideally, it'd be great to have a stronger read on the player's actual content, but considering how little of that there is, you take what you can get).

[Eurykins]

Time to play a minor bit of catch-up (and god, these hydra slot postings wonk up the re-reads more than I feel it should warrant. :/).

[MRDRHAWK]

OKAY FUCK SORRY I WAS TUBING AND STUFF.

I SUSPECTED EURY WAS GRASPING A BIT BECAUSE OF HER TONE (OR THE TONE I GOT ANYWAY) WHEN SHE WAS PICKING AT PROTO'S "SUSPICIONS" ABOUT MY CLAIM. SEEMED LIKE A WEIRD ASS THING TO JUMP ON AT THE TIME.

REREAD BLITZ/JUNKO AND I CAN ACTUALLY SEE THAT EXCHANGE OCCURRING BETWEEN TWO TOWNIES, AND NEITER HAS BEEN PARTICULARLY SCUMMY IN ANY WAY AFTERWARDS, SO I'M THINKING BOTH ARE NULL.

PROTO IS FLAVOURSPECCING WHEN FLAVOUR SHOULDN'T PARTICULARLY MATTER BUT HE'S NOT SCUMMY FOR IT, JUST PLAYING WONKY. REFA IS DOING THIS TOO, FROM WHAT I CAN TELL, SO WHATEVER. IF BOTH FLIP SCUM I'LL RAGE, ESPECIALLY SINCE I DON'T THINK EITHER OF THEM ARE SCUM.

HYDRAS ARE FUCKING WITH MY READING, NEED TO REREAD EURY AGAIN, BUT FOR NOW ##UNVOTE.

[MRDRHAWK]

HOLD UP I JUST REREAD GP AND HER POSTS ARE REALLY FUCKING BAD IMO

SHE SAT ON AN RVS VOTE ON ME FOR A GOOD TWO-THREE PAGES AFTER WE MADE ACTUAL CONTENT POSTS WITH THE EXCUSE THAT IT WAS A PLACEHOLDER, WHICH SEEMS LIKE A COPOUT BUT WHATEVER. SETUP SPEC IS USELESS BUT SHE BUGGED PAPER ABOUT IT FOR SOME REASON (I THINK IT WAS IN DEFENSE OR SOMETHING). SUBSEQUENT VOTE IN HER NEXT BIG POST FELT LIKE MASSIVE OMGUS AND WAS ADMITTED AS BEING IRRELEVANT.

SHE ALSO TALKS ABOUT VOTING ELIE BUT (IIRC) NEVER GAVE ANY REASONS FOR IT EVEN THOUGH BORON PRESSED FOR THEM? COULD BE JUST PICKING A RANDOM TOWNIE TO TRY AND GET A WEIRD ED1 WAGON ON EVEN THOUGH ELIE'S DONE NOTHING SCUMMY (OVERREACTION TO PROTO ASIDE, WHICH CAME AFTER THAT POST OF GP'S).

##VOTE: GP

[Refa]

Fair enough on the ED1 Eury issues. It'd be cool if you could reread her, especially some of her later posts which are more telling than her early ones. Why did you think the Blitz/Junko exchange was a scum/scum exchange at the time though?

Flavorspec isn't great but I'm pretty sure it's just a thing Proto (and I, unfortunately) do but in my defense, there wasn't much more to read from your slot at the time!

Your first point on GP is good and I'd be interested in seeing her response, but she never actually suspected Elieson (it was just an unfortunate name mix up on her part).

[Sunwoo]

Why do you think he'd throw suspicion on those particular people as scum? Like, I agree that his suspicions are shallow (at least until he comes back in and explains them), but I'm not seeing the scum intent there.

Well, to my knowledge all of Eury, Junko, and Blitz are relatively easy people to pick on. But more than that it was more that it looked to me like he was just grabbing onto anything that looked bad and pointing it out to contribute without really contributing, if you know what I mean?

I see that Poly came back and elaborated though, so let me rethink my opinion on him.

Proto, what do you think of Boron's content? From what you've analyzed, you think that she'd refute Paper's theory as either alignment so like...I don't really get what your issue with her is. Please understand.

… I somehow missed the part where he said that he thought I'd do the same thing I did "even if she were town". So, uh, Proto? Please explain how I am worse than Green Mitsuki since you're apparently voting me for something you think I'd do as either alignment.

I haven't eaten all day so I'm going to disappear for a bit.

[MRDRHAWK]

I THINK WRT BLITZ/JUNKO IT WAS A TONE THING THAT MAINLY HAD ME SUSPICIOUS, BUT REREADING IT MADE ME SECOND-GUESS WHAT I WAS THINKING THERE AND I ULTIMATELY DECIDED IT WAS A NULL POINT.

GP ALSO HAD NO REAL REASONING FOR SUSPECTING EURY (WHO SHE SAID SHE ALSO CONSIDERED VOTING AT THE TIME) OR FOR VOTING PAPERICK REALLY EITHER.

[Junk]

Yeah although baldricks question wouldn't exactly work on scum I feel that if he asked the question on town and they happened to say yes it would start something up. IMO people would discuss the vote and hopefully at least be able to get some semblance of some discussion especially since we would be able to get a reaction out of the voted and gouge something from that.

What I meant by blitz exaggerating baldricks question was when he said that baldrick was overreacting when baldricks grand meltdown was... asking if eurys vote was serious.

Also I don't really understand your part about you agreeing with me on baldrick being unable to contribute at the time? What was blitz calling him out on then? He was saying that his questions contributed nothing and were an overreaction.

I am having trouble understanding the GP case.

Don't have many reads except for Blitz. :/ I like refa though so far because I feel his tone is genuine

okay gtg again :/ (i'll be able to post more on Sunday)

[MRDRHAWK]

HOLY FUCK I FORGOT ABOUT JUNKO HE WAS ACTUALLY SERIOUS ABOUT BLITZ HOLY SHIT LEMME REREREAD THAT SHIT

[Zkirsche]

It's late and I'm just up to be in the hunger games but Refa how can you not understand why I think you're misrepping GP I literally summarised what I thought GP said and compared it with what you said?

[Refa]

Yeah, but I don't see why it's a misrep at all.

[Refa]

Yeah although baldricks question wouldn't exactly work on scum I feel that if he asked the question on town and they happened to say yes it would start something up. IMO people would discuss the vote and hopefully at least be able to get some semblance of some discussion especially since we would be able to get a reaction out of the voted and gouge something from that.

What I meant by blitz exaggerating baldricks question was when he said that baldrick was overreacting when baldricks grand meltdown was... asking if eurys vote was serious.

Also I don't really understand your part about you agreeing with me on baldrick being unable to contribute at the time? What was blitz calling him out on then? He was saying that his questions contributed nothing and were an overreaction.

I am having trouble understanding the GP case.

Don't have many reads except for Blitz. :/ I like refa though so far because I feel his tone is genuine

okay gtg again :/ (i'll be able to post more on Sunday)

Oh, that's actually a fair point regarding Baldrick's questioning. Hadn't really thought of that. Yeah, that's reasonable for Blitz exaggerating. He can defend himself on that front lol. Well, there's a difference between saying that someone should contribute more (which Baldrick really couldn't have done at the time) and saying that they're faking contribution (which is generally something town doesn't do). I don't view Baldrick's efforts as faking contribution though. You can start getting reads by like questioning other players about things that bother you or you don't understand. I mean, that's what I'm doing, even though my only scumread at the moment is Eurykins and the only other people who are bothering me are Bluedoom/kirsche (Bluedoom for what Baldrick said, and kirsche is more of a gut read because I don't like his push on me). Everyone else is either town or null, and trying to get less null reads haha (but most of them haven't posted in like forever so it's hard...).

[Eurykins]

Getting this out of the way 'cause who cares to sit on silly RVS votes? (Yes, even you, Elie, aren't worth voting on for that long, unless you actually warrant me srsly voting yer ass.)

##Unvote

Thoughts on da playerbase so far (Ohman, is this the return of the wallposts already?! Stay tuned to find out!):

- RD: (Only has one post, so life is made so much easier. Ty RD. <3)

- I find it odd (but null in terms of side-vibes atm) when someone says "It's been so long since I've been town/scum" (though I doubt anyone would outwardly say the latter, minus in RVS/joking/non-srs scenarios). It comes off with a weird vibe, along the lines of "I would/wouldn't do this as town/scum" sort of statement, so not sure how to fully take it.

However, I'm not caring much (in general- not just addressing RD's comment on it) for the chat in general of "Oh, I do/don't think that the mod/creator of the game would/wouldn't roll all of the hydra slots as scum/town," since there's not really much to be garnered from slot(?) speccing, I feel?

Tl;dr: Not much to see/hear, and so not much to be garnered from his posts. Moar posts pls.

- Baldrick/PB Slot (Ohboy, first hydra slot to look into):

~ Baldrick's Posts

- Kinda felt a bit quick with this remark to semi-force us out of RVS, but cannot fault someone in itself for attempting to do so.

- Seems like a decent chunk of questions to help keep the thread moving along, and prod vote(?) on Bluedoom is fine.

~ PB's Posts

- Except you will be lynched alongside him if he screws you/himself over with his posts. Gotta keep your hydra-buddy in line!

- Terrible/reckless player slot(?) specc'ing and should really stop.

- Don't really understand the logic much here and not much to back it up either. I also wouldn't fault someone for objecting to an idea (like "Let's remove all of the hydra slots 'cause we're bound to hit some scum in t here, since they're logically not all going to be town/scum" sort of shit).

- Wrt this post:

> Hydra's are only "more powerful" when the hydras themselves actually seem to coordinate/work well together. From what I've seen from yours/Baldrick's posts, you two conflict in more than one area, and seem to actually hinder/negatively affect what I'm altogether reading/receiving as a whole from your player slot. So I don't know/see how hydras would be considered "overpowered' or otherwise "super strong" whether they are all town-sided/scum-sided, because more people posting = more things to consider as a whole. (Quantity doesn't necessarily mean quality.) This is also why I find the whole speccing over the slots to be a waste of time as a whole.

> I find it a bit distasteful in general that some people are posting about being lazy as a reason for hydra'ing. It's meant to let certain people work together and to hopefully keep consistent activity levels within the game/thread, not to enable one of the players to cover the other (in the case of one being purposefully flaky). :/

Tl;dr: Baldrick's posts (though fewer than PB's) feel better to me than the latter. It's muddling this player slot alot for me, as I'm not really fond of what PB's been posting/saying as a whole, so a slightly negative vibe currently.

- Refa:

- Decent line of questioning, and hrrrm? Was what I said earlier in response what you figured i would or no?

- half-decent vote on GP (with semi-reasonable logic).

- Wrt my reaction, I saw no need in responding in any sort of irate/annoyed response? Tbh, I was more confused as to how/in what manner I was being noted as grasping, as it seemed to come out of left field randomly (so I was left more like, "o_O????" than "I NO GRASPING- Y U ACCUSE ME OF GRASPING?! D<" sort of reaction).

> Also, why would you expect me/town to become aggravated over something that was: A. Something small (me talking to Proto/asking about the matter), B. He didn't have a hugely condemning/accusatory tone about the claimed grasping (so wouldn't, at least from my PoV, trigger any sort of reason to become aggravated/defensive by any means), and C. never said that it made me look bad/scummy/was reason for me to suddenly be lynched or something? [Tl;dr: I'd find it more odd if someone had a more explosive/aggravated reaction towards Poly's notion than not, because it wasn't worth getting aggravated over?]

> I'm not sure I agree with you with the notion towards Junk- asking if someone's vote is serious or not reveals a matter of intent/seriousness/commitment towards a case/vote, which can aid in finding/weeding out scum (via interactions with other scum). Secondly, if someone says at one point, "It was a serious vote" but later on (due to someone's line of questioning) insists that it was merely a joke or only a half-serious vote, then inconsistencies can arise, I feel. It may not be the strongest means/ways to catch or otherwise trip up scum, but it has its uses.

- Eury "issues"... you make it seem like I have a problem or something. Realtalk: So what did my later posts (possibly including this one in itself?) imply/give to you, in terms of more information/reading me, Refa?

Tl;dr: Though there are blatant areas in which I disagreed with his notions/logic, I'm not sensing real scum intent, minus the weird vibe that he voted me based on... seeming "unresponsive/non-aggravated" towards Poly's odd grasping claim?

- Elieson:

- Makin' excuses already for poor activity? Gawd, Elie, get with the program. Like I'm one to talk, lol- LoL ranked games op.

- I do agree that this logic by Formina was poor.

Tl;dr: I want to hear more from Elie, 'cause there's like, no real content to sift through.

- Polydeuces (....The caps, they burn my eyes....):

- The comments on Blitz/Junko are pretty vague (not much description of how/why their interactions were bad), and also not much is said about Baldrick.

- I chose to inquire at the time because it was the only interesting thing (to me) that was happening (and, as stated earlier, the way he typed/asked felt weird to me, as the way you stated being a Miiller didn't seem out of the ordinary). Blanket statements on Junk/Blitz, along with Refa/Proto, makes this post as a whole feel pretty empty. Not much elaboration/thought put into most of the comments, I feel.

- Probably the most prominent person/case on a person he's mentioned since the start. Though I appreciate/enjoy the more in-depth notion/comments on someone (wrt their activity/presence/actions within this game), seems oddly explosive of a post (has been posting pretty vaguely on most others until this point).

Tl;dr: Minus GP case/vote, it's a bit difficult to follow his line of logic (when there are so many gaps/blurbs of ????/blanket statements/null reads being mentioned) sometimes, but that's not unusual from a lot of "Poly play" I've seen in the past. Would like to hear/see more elaboration if/when possible (and less caps, if at all possible- my eyes would very much thank you for it).

- Bluedoom:

- Pot Meet Kettle. Hypocrisy is great. (Not only had you not voted at this time, but also had 0 content while she herself actually DID have a vote/other content. Pretty bad imo.)

- "Despite I myself having put nothing forth at the time of making this vote/post, I am dissatisfied in what you have put forth." -Bluedoom Why do you only seem to be addressing/criticizing GP at this time, while blowing more blurbs about a non-existent Baldrick wagon?

- There is no real reason to be role/flavor/any sort of speccing period at this point, or any point in the game.

Tl;dr: Harps on GP for no vote, comments on it being a bad one (which is debatable- I've yet to read into GP at this point in my post), but as a whole never really brings much of anything to the table himself. I'm smelling a lot of hypocrisy with his posting, and pretty shallow gameplay as a whole. Yes, there are others like him who are slacking in meaningful posts, but the fact that he's criticizing someone for not voting (who actually had a vote, no less) and otherwise not doing much else but pointing fingers at GP = not liking this slot atm. Seems pretty shady.

- Blitz:

- Baldrick points/vote seems to be pushing possibly a bit too hard, but doesn't seem unusual in itself for fairly early ED1 posting/thoughts. Elieson notions were also warranted, given Elie's sparse posting content at the time.

- I... sorta(ish) see the Baldrick/Elie line trying to be drawn here...? But the logic is a bit quirky/hard to follow, imo. Not sure if it's a bit too grasping for a connection though.

- Somehow I feel like a lot of the "suggestions" here are actually pretty poor. IE. Fakecasing, running with the PB's "Oh, hydra slots are probably scum" specc'ing, etc.

- Can't a prod be given to someone who's active/online and posting? (It can basically be a shout-out to get their attention [away from what they may have been posting about prior] and refocus the line of questioning/response to a different direction?)

Tl;dr: I feel an odd tunneled vision wrt Baldrick from his posts- and not much else wrt the rest of the player base. Would like to hear more whenever possible.

- Kirsche (Yay, another short ISO):

- I'm okay with this post.

Tl;dr: Not much to see/read, would like to hear more, but nothing wrong with what's posted so far.

- Proto/Formina Sage (Disregarding posts I've already asked about/responded to):

- Wrt this post:

> I'm not overly fond of the logic used with Poly at this point (with the whole Orange thing, whatever that's supposed to mean with the flavor), given how things really shouldn't be role/flavor/player slot specc'd as a whole.

> I'm not overly fond of the Boron slot vote either. It seems based on the concept of "Boron reacted poorly to the (rather poor, imo) PB Hydra theory, by stating openly that it's a pretty dumb idea", while also stating, "Boron looks worse that Mitsuki slot" (So it seems as though your vote/logic is all stemming from the basis of "The creators of this game must've made at least one of the Hydra slots scum". Which is nothing more than mindlessly dogging a thrown out concept against Hydras by one of the Hydras (and you seem to be considering that "Paperblade posted this logic, and thus I'm looking at Mitsuki/Boron player slots for the mostlikely hidden scum(s) within").

> Vision as a whole seems tunneled on the hydras, and (as you yourself commented on with your last post) not a whole lot of other content regarding anyone/anything else.

Tl;dr: Most of the later posts seem to be running under the PB's hydra shit, which is really skewing a lot of what I'm hearing/seeing in your posts. Not overly fond of it personally, and I'd like to hear more of your thoughts as a WHOLE (what do you see/hear/read from each person/player without the thought of "SCUM MUST BE IN ONE OF THE HYDRAS" affecting your post in the process). Also, disregarding Mitsuki's posts in the Mitsuki/GP player slot is also a semi-reckless thing to do, and should probably not be done. They are playing the game as a HYDRA, which means the read on the player slot should be read as a whole based on BOTH of their posting/contributions, not just whomever seems better/easier to read.

- Junko:

- I can... sorta follow the line of logic wrt Blitz here, but I don't agree that someone saying "If X is town/scum, then Y is liable to flipping scum/town by association" is necessarily a scumtell. It can be executed in a scummy manner (to line up mislynches) yes, but it can also be used to identify and notice specific sorts of interactions that may be based upon whether X or Y are town/scum.

- Next few posts seem to be mainly aimed at supporting Baldrick/going after Blitz back n' forth.

- Not garnering a whole lot else from this post. sadly.

Tl;dr: I'm having a legitimately hard time reading into Junko, aside from sticking up for Baldrick and defending him from Blitz's notions. Possible associations here between Baldrick/Junko, but too early for me to be confident in; would like to hear more from him if/when possible.

- Boron/Eclipse Slot (Whoo- hydra #2):

~ Boron's Posts

- Y u haz fever? That's not good. :( Realtalk:

> Agreed on PB thing.

> Reasonable Poly notions/vote.

- Fair logic/notions here.

- I'm not sure how to take the "easy to be picked on" thing... :'( But I suppose I can agree with that notion to some extent from past experiences.

~ Eclipse's Posts (N/A)

Tl;dr: Without Eclipse having posted much content, my read on this slot is purely based off of Boron's contributions. That being said, the overall tone/vibes of her posts are good, logical is reasonable/solid, and otherwise seems good to me.

- Green Poet/ Mitsuki Slot (LAST HYDRA, DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUN):

~ Green Poet's Posts

- This post... feels weird to me. Seems to be speaking against the idea (which I find okay) but then is like, "But I'll consider doing so anyways later if I feel the want/need to"...? Non-commital, as most others have stated already.

- This post also mildly confuses me.

> Poly vote (from earlier) seems meh at best.

> "considering switching my vote to either eury or Elie Baldrick" - Where did I come from in your listing? Why do you sound like you're willing to consolidate your vote, so early in the day phase? Just seems out of place, considering mentioning little about myself prior to this post.

- Baldrick vote here feels almost oddly forced here, like you felt the need TO be voting for someone at this time. The notion you said yourself basically seems to shout out, "I'm voting Baldrick slot to not vote for Poly slot."

~ Mitsuki's Posts - (N/A)

Tl;dr: GP's posts have a weird, sporadic vibe to them. There's not a whole lot of commitment/in-depth thought to a lot of the cases/votes being made, and otherwise seems to be very tentative with her gameplay. A bit tough to read as a whole, but is pinging me slightly.

- Kay [Not much to be said about this player slot, since there be NO CONTENT. PLAUSIBLE LURKING SCUM THOUGH?!]

OKAY. HOLY SHIT. Finally done. I blame Shinori for pulling me AFK during my posting for dinner... who da fuq needs foods when you're in the middle of a wall post?! Sheesh....

TL;DR of my reads/priorities currently:

Bluedoom seems to be the worst offender currently, due to the blatant hypocrisy of his posts.

Baldrick/PB slot is on my radar (but behind Bluedoom) due to odd discrepancies and specific (quoted above) things that I didn't like from the PB's posts.

##Vote: Bluedoom

Back to playing some League of Legends... need to get back into Platinum...

[Paperblade]

> Hydra's are only "more powerful" when the hydras themselves actually seem to coordinate/work well together. From what I've seen from yours/Baldrick's posts, you two conflict in more than one area, and seem to actually hinder/negatively affect what I'm altogether reading/receiving as a whole from your player slot. So I don't know/see how hydras would be considered "overpowered' or otherwise "super strong" whether they are all town-sided/scum-sided, because more people posting = more things to consider as a whole. (Quantity doesn't necessarily mean quality.) This is also why I find the whole speccing over the slots to be a waste of time as a whole.

Why should I agree with Baldrick or vice versa?

[Paperblade]

Also how am I scummier than GP?

[Paperblade]

holy fuck the last time I lived to Day 3 was 2013

[Eurykins]

@PB: In general, Hydra's imply that those involved "work together" or otherwise put in a collective effort as a whole. If one person on the hydra is saying "X, Y, and Z is scum, and A, B, and C are all townies" while the other is like, "NAH BRO, A, B, AND C are scum, while X, Y, and Z are town", all that does is create a conflict of a two-headed thing arguing within itself. So at that point, who do we believe? If the hydra doesn't work together and create a somewhat steady flow of information, then what good is it?

That being said, it was likewise odd for a statement like, "I am not responsible for what he may/may have not said/done/posted/whatever," as you two are in one slot. If you work as a proper hydra with the intent to aid town, then it's generally implied that good communication and interaction occurs, and thus there generally shouldn't be many (if any, ideally) conflicts between what party A and B say as the overall player slot response. (And I know there may/will be conflicting in personal playing style or opinions, but if you're working it out with your hydra partner(s), then what should be coming out should still generally be the same information, whether it's compromised between you two or one of you chose to agree with the other in the end as to what will be posted/said in their stead.)

Tl;dr: If I'm seeing/reading something completely black/white between yours and Baldrick's posts, all I'm eventually going to assume is that: A. Crappy communication, B. Really bad teamwork/coordination, or C. Something (whether it's in-game alliances [iE. Being scum] or otherwise) is being done to intentionally create confusion in terms of reading the player slot's stance, reads, cases, everything. Or a mix of the above. All of which compromise any sort of townie effort to understand or otherwise trust the player slot as a whole, which would make us skeptical of keeping said slot around in the later days.

Secondly (Wrt GP): She's behind you because most of what she's done is moreso confusing than outright scummy/negative in my mind. The posts I've read from you for the most part have struck me more negatively than confused over it, thus your slot is ahead of hers. (And the contradictions/differences between your player slot and its members' posts is also what makes your slot seem worse currently to me.)

However, my notions/thoughts on her are also awaiting any sort of contribution from the other half, Mitsuki. So I'll be checking back periodically to see if that changes.

[Bluedoom]

Exchanging multiple townie hydra slots to kill one mafia hydra slot seems like a good deal, but only if we know for certain that one of the hydra slots is definitely maf. otherwise it's basically just random lynching since we aren't certain that one or more maf hydra slots exist.

Maybe if at the end of the day we still don't have anything to go off but this setupspec, I would consider it more at that time

-I think I'm not understanding what paper's saying sometimes. maybe it could be seen as scummy to disagree with paper's analysis that one out of three hydras is definitely mafia from the viewpoint of someone who's made games before? And I don't understand his most recent post much at all

There's probably some connection I'm assumed to be able to make but can't. /shrug

"If there are no mafia among the hydras then Refa is scum" is what I'm getting but idk what leads to that conclusion. Was there ever a case?

Basically I can't follow paper's thinking yet. The sudden sweeping statements + lack of explanation makes it difficult to read him.

##Unvote

##Vote: Paperblade/Baldrick

not thrilled about this vote but it's more relevant than keeping a vote on poly, for whom my previous reason for voting suddenly no longer applies.

These are two posts of GP's that are related to Paper's hydraspec. There's a weird shift in response to that, causation for change being the time when Paper says something along the lines of "If my hydraspec is wrong, Refa's scum" which feels to trivial to be changing opinions as such? I don't even feel like this is a good reason to vote Baldblade. Also, I agree with Poly's reasn for voting her, that she kept her placeholder vote on him even though there was much other stuff going on in the thread, and I was trying to imply this in my last post where I voted but I guess I failed in that aspect.

Proto's vote on Boronclipse is terrible! He's voting that playerslot for disagreeing with the hydraspec, and there's no explanation for how that's scummy, in fact, he admits that Boron would react like this as either alignment. So what else is scummy about them Proto? I think your vote is scummy.

Elieson's vote on Proto is equally terrible! Proto is townreading Poly off of bad logic, fine. But how does this have scum intent? Waiting for a response for this.

@Baldrick: There actually weren't really cases on you if you read ED1, but more like, questions? I think Blitz's case on you was far-fetched but that's also part of his town meta which is why I'm not really reading much into it and I didn't really understand the purpose behind the questions directed towards you, so I don't really have much to say on that.

I've null read you and I think Paper's hydraspec is dumb but its more likely to come from town!blade so I've got a townread on your slot atm.

@Refa: Well early on when there was discussion ED1 it felt like you were busy mostly asking questions and you never made a meaningful vote until about the time I made a vote so yeah.

[Bluedoom]

Oh and I thought abut Paperblade saying Refa's scum if the hydraspec is wrong. CMIIW but are you saying that scum!mayor is there to balance with three townie hydra slots?

I think that hydra= more player power is false and its overrated, IMO. Playing as a hydra is fun though.

[Paperblade]

The hydra stuff isn't part of the setup

wrt Refa I just think he's more likely scum if we're all town because he seemed super eager to go hydra hunting

@PB: In general, Hydra's imply that those involved "work together" or otherwise put in a collective effort as a whole. If one person on the hydra is saying "X, Y, and Z is scum, and A, B, and C are all townies" while the other is like, "NAH BRO, A, B, AND C are scum, while X, Y, and Z are town", all that does is create a conflict of a two-headed thing arguing within itself. So at that point, who do we believe? If the hydra doesn't work together and create a somewhat steady flow of information, then what good is it?

But how is this scummy? If we were two separate player slots this would not be scummy.

That being said, it was likewise odd for a statement like, "I am not responsible for what he may/may have not said/done/posted/whatever," as you two are in one slot. If you work as a proper hydra with the intent to aid town, then it's generally implied that good communication and interaction occurs, and thus there generally shouldn't be many (if any, ideally) conflicts between what party A and B say as the overall player slot response. (And I know there may/will be conflicting in personal playing style or opinions, but if you're working it out with your hydra partner(s), then what should be coming out should still generally be the same information, whether it's compromised between you two or one of you chose to agree with the other in the end as to what will be posted/said in their stead.)

Or we could just both give our thoughts on this stuff to the town? This is basically just you saying I'm playing badly because I'm not playing how you think I should.

Tl;dr: If I'm seeing/reading something completely black/white between yours and Baldrick's posts, all I'm eventually going to assume is that: A. Crappy communication, B. Really bad teamwork/coordination, or C. Something (whether it's in-game alliances [iE. Being scum] or otherwise) is being done to intentionally create confusion in terms of reading the player slot's stance, reads, cases, everything. Or a mix of the above. All of which compromise any sort of townie effort to understand or otherwise trust the player slot as a whole, which would make us skeptical of keeping said slot around in the later days.

If I were scum, why would I want to make it difficult for you to trust me?

[Paperblade]

HI BALDRICK I'M GETTING US LYNCHED

[Sunwoo]

I SUSPECTED EURY WAS GRASPING A BIT BECAUSE OF HER TONE (OR THE TONE I GOT ANYWAY) WHEN SHE WAS PICKING AT PROTO'S "SUSPICIONS" ABOUT MY CLAIM. SEEMED LIKE A WEIRD ASS THING TO JUMP ON AT THE TIME.

Do you still think Eury was grasping and what do you think of her now? Are you leaning scum or town on her overall? Also, since you said you're going to be rereading Junko/Blitz interactions, you should get back to us on your thoughts about before at least phase end.

I'm feeling a bit better about Poly now that he's explained his suspicions. Aside from the Eury thing where I'm not still not 100% certain what he's leaning on her, he at least explained his other thoughts and gave more stuff other than just explaining stuff that I asked him for.

##Unvote

##Vote: Green Mitsuki

I really don't like the fact that she voted Paperbaldrick while admitting she herself didn't like the vote. It feels to me like she doesn't have any actual suspicions and she's only placing a vote down "for the sake of it" while giving herself an opening to back off that slot at the same time.

I'm not happy with Proto's setup spec and I'd like him to expound on why he thinks I'm worse than Green Mitsuki, especially since he basically said he thinks I would react the same way as I did as either alignment - so he's not even calling that a scum tell. Need to hear more from him, because not sure if scummy or just Proto being Proto.

[Eurykins]

The hydra stuff isn't part of the setup

wrt Refa I just think he's more likely scum if we're all town because he seemed super eager to go hydra hunting

But how is this scummy? If we were two separate player slots this would not be scummy.

Or we could just both give our thoughts on this stuff to the town? This is basically just you saying I'm playing badly because I'm not playing how you think I should.

If I were scum, why would I want to make it difficult for you to trust me?

Wrt Set-up: The roles/effective player slot should be that of a hydra should be applicable and effective in this game. AKA. You should be able to communicate with Baldrick, as Mitsuki/GP and Boron/Eclipse can/should be able to. (If that's not the case, then I'm a bit skeptical as to why "Hydras" would even be effective/used in this game if it is not the case).

Think of the overall situation:

You run into a hallway with two passages- left and right- with a Hydra standing by. Hydra has two heads. One head tells you go left, which leads you to a safe passage. Other head tells you to go to right, which leads you to certain death. One of the passageways is incorrect, but which one? Clearly one person/head is working to help you, which is fine, but the other is clearly there to mess with you, or potentially get you killed. And the other one certainly isn't helping you by trying to lead you down the death pit, so it's by simple logic that he's thus antagonizing the situation. But how does the person who's relying on their information know who's telling the truth, and who is lying to them?

This is why it's a dangerous/almost anti-town thing to do as a hydra, for the person(s) within said hydra scattering about its reads/notions/contributions. More heads generally means more capacity to think, process, and otherwise identify material before it's presented- like a group project. Sure, different people present different pieces/their own parts, but everything works towards one main consensus/idea, as opposed to blatantly contradicting itself to where you're left thinking, "WTF did I just read/listen to and what was the point of what I just read/listen to?"

Disagreeing as TWO DIFFERENT PLAYER SLOTS is different than "One Player Slot Offering Two Different Sides/Thoughts And Attempting to Commit to Both at the Same Time". You two have the responsibility of playing the role of ONE potential (as in, you could be otherwise) townie, not TWO. Therefore, the voice should be focused towards one PoV/semblance of cases/votes/etc, not TWO.

Playing differently =/= you completely seemingly contradict what the other is saying/stating. There seems to be little to no disregard for what you two are saying, nor do you seem to give it much thought. If that's the case, then why hydra to begin with? It only makes things harder to read, follow, and otherwise figure out when two different people with two very different intentions/ideas of what to do are going off in different directions in one slot.

"If you were scum" statement moreso seems to apply to your earlier notions (that a few others considered) of "There's probs scum amongst the Hydras- but it's not this slot!". After all, who would dare consider a scum hydra slot entertaining/throwing out that idea for people to consider? It'd seemingly be risky gameplay, but as I looked through the posts, some of them (oddly enough) contained the concept/statements of "So, BETWEEN MITSUKI/BORON SLOTS, WHO'D BE SCUM?", which, for some reason, implies that your own slot isn't a scum hydra slot. Weird, isn't it?

Also, it could be contributed to the fact that you're prone to not necessarily work seemlessly with your hydra partner- who knows? You've not necessarily been known/seen (as far as I've seen/recall from past games with you) to be the type to confer/comply to such restrictions or otherwise perform in the means that should generally be done, and so your gameplay has been sporadic in other games as well.

**Currently though, you're not necessarily in the limelight in terms of the "possible scum lurking amongst the Hydras" though (not nearly as high on the list compared to Boron/Mitsuki atm from what I can see/tell), so in that sense, your gameplay doesn't necessarily have to be/seem safe. Plus, there's always the "Scum wouldn't possibly risk doing X, so I'll do X just because it'll make it seem like I'm not buddying/playing to everyone's good side." sort of logic that some tend to apply to this game- there are many plausible explanations for anyone's actions in these games. We'll just never know until people say things, or otherwise results happen one way or the other.

[Paperblade]

yuri I don't need a thesis on the question, this isn't the SAT you don't get points for writing a ton