Unusual character gender ratio

[eclipse]

Elibe was only one country in the series, and FE2 had enemy male pegasus knights. Thus, I don't feel Farina's explanation is sufficient.

EDIT: Which is why I'm perfectly content with equal opportunity pegasi (and non-promoted foot axe units).

EDIT 2: I thought it was FE2 with the male pegasi? Eh, whatever, it stays.

Edited May 7, 2015 by eclipse

[Thor Odinson]

Except FE don't necessarily share lore between continents, though

If we get another Elibe game (not saying we should) then sure, femalelock pegasi because that is actually explicit to that continent's lore. But everywhere else? Especially considering the male pegasi generics in FE3 and the lack of unpromoted dragon class and pegasi promoting to dragonlord and after all that, Micaelis exists? Not enough to be established lore across the entire FE franchise since the entire FE franchise doesn't even have consistent lore.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

You forgot Minerva. ;/

Anyway, I think some of the gender-locked classes went out the window, thanks to Tsubaki (who I'm positive is a dude, if Kozaki's art style is consistent) and axe chick in Nohr. Progress, I guess?

Dragon Knights don't use axes in FE1

Yeah, I did forget her.

Elibe was only one country in the series, and FE2 had enemy male pegasus knights.

I've played FE2 many times, but I still could be forgetting, but I don't remember any enemy pegasus knights in FE2 whatsoever. (I know that sounds really weird, but I don't remember a single one. Enemy flying units are generally Gargoyles or Dracozombies.)

Edited May 7, 2015 by L95

[Thor Odinson]

Everyone is jelly of dem axe exclusive classes.

At least we have Echidna and Cherche. (Though I don't remember if Echidna's primary weapon rank was axes but I think it was)

Fem barbarian pls, I wanna see a lady running around with all those skulls.

Also yes, Echidna's axe rank is higher than her sword rank.

Remind me to design one for you in about...2 and a half weeks. Can't draw before that, though.

[eclipse]

I've played FE2 many times, but I still could be forgetting, but I don't remember any enemy pegasus knights in FE2. (I know that sounds really weird, but I don't remember a single one.)

This thread is going super-fast. Anyway, I edited my thoughts in (namely, ONE of the early games had male pegasi).

[Mayus]

don't know, honestly the idea of the pegasi to become free-gender don't appeale me. I agrre that in the first time the genderlock of the class was stupid, but after, like, 15-20 years of this at this point I prefer they don't change it, because it has a lore justification. It not precisely excplain why men can't ride winged horsies, but they can't. I'm a lore-whore. XD

I must have missed the part where If was confirmed to take place in a past world.

Also, ''Only Women Can Ride Pegasi'' is a retcon. Mystery of the Emblem had it that both men and women could ride pegasi.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Mayus

[Book of Ereshkigal]

This thread is going super-fast. Anyway, I edited my thoughts in (namely, ONE of the early games had male pegasi).

OH! You're probably thinking of Mystery of the emblem.

I must have missed the part where If was confirmed to take place in a past world. Also, ''Only Women Can Ride Pegasi'' is a retcon.

...well yeah, of course it's a retcon, I didn't think we were arguing that? (...and I didn't mean to imply Elibe had anything to do here, I was just trying to think of where it's explicitly mentioned.) Edited May 7, 2015 by L95

[NekoKnight]

Except FE don't necessarily share lore between continents, though

If we get another Elibe game (not saying we should) then sure, femalelock pegasi because that is actually explicit to that continent's lore. But everywhere else? Especially considering the male pegasi generics in FE3 and the lack of unpromoted dragon class and pegasi promoting to dragonlord and after all that, Micaelis exists? Not enough to be established lore across the entire FE franchise since the entire FE franchise doesn't even have consistent lore.

It doesn't matter if different worlds don't share lore or if there is no explanation for why men can't ride pegasi. The point is, they don't. Except for an early title in the series, all pegasus riders have been female. It's a part of Fire Emblem tradition. Maybe FE14 will be breaking that tradition but it's been almost 100% solid before that.

[Thor Odinson]

It doesn't matter if different worlds don't share lore or if there is no explanation for why men can't ride pegasi. The point is, they don't. Except for an early title in the series, all pegasus riders have been female. It's a part of Fire Emblem tradition. Maybe FE14 will be breaking that tradition but it's been almost 100% solid before that.

The point is, outside of Elibe, which has no confirmed connections to the rest of the worlds, there is no explicit lore about it.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Thor Odinson

[Mayus]

It doesn't matter if different worlds don't share lore or if there is no explanation for why men can't ride pegasi. The point is, they don't. Except for an early title in the series, all pegasus riders have been female. It's a part of Fire Emblem tradition. Maybe FE14 will be breaking that tradition but it's been almost 100% solid before that.

That ''early title'' is one of the top selling games in the series, accounting for the bigger user base. Don't dismiss it.

Repeat After Me: IS does not have to include past lore in If.

The point is, outside of Elibe, which has no confirmed connections to the rest of the worlds, there is no explicit lore about it.

Thracia 776 was the first FE to have the ''Only Women Pegasus Knights'' retcon. Edited May 7, 2015 by Mayus

[NekoKnight]

That ''early title'' is one of the top selling games in the series, accounting for the bigger user base. Don't dismiss it.

Repeat After Me: IS does not have to include past lore in If.

Thracia 776 was the first FE to have the ''Only Women Pegasus Knights'' retcon.

Every game before and after FE3 had pegasus riders as female exclusives. So yes, I will dismiss it as being that weird exception. Pegasus riders have been female exclusive for the vast majority of the series and there has not been a single named male pegasus rider EVER. Generic, enemy male pegasus riders in one early title is completely irrelevant.

Edited May 7, 2015 by NekoKnight

[Thor Odinson]

That ''early title'' is one of the top selling games in the series, accounting for the bigger user base. Don't dismiss it.

Repeat After Me: IS does not have to include past lore in If.

Thracia 776 was the first FE to have the ''Only Women Pegasus Knights'' retcon.

Where was it in Thracia? I played the game in Japanese due to the shitty English patch and entirely forgot all the dialogue since i read it separately.

[Refa]

Karin: “Hermes is saying he’ll do his best. Pegasi usually only allow women to ride them, but he says he’ll bear with us for now. Good boy.”

Here's the relevant line. I didn't actually remember it until someone here pointed it out, though.

[Thor Odinson]

Ah, alright.

[Mayus]

Every game before and after FE3 had pegasus riders as female exclusives.

Except the PK sprites in Dark Dragon and the Sword of Light along with Gaiden didn't look like you could certainly call them women instead of men. Nor was it said in Dark Dragon or Gaiden that women can ride Pegasi.

And there was Michalis. A man who was a Dracoknight. Which was a class that promoted from Pegasus Knight.

So yes, I will dismiss it as being that weird exception.

It doesn't clash with DDatSoL or Gaiden.

Pegasus riders have been female exclusive for the vast majority of the series and there has not been a single named male pegasus rider EVER.

There is now.

Generic, enemy male pegasus riders in one early title is completely irrelevant.

According to who?

[NekoKnight]

Except the PK sprites in Dark Dragon and the Sword of Light along with Gaiden didn't look like you could certainly call them women instead of men. Nor was it said in Dark Dragon or Gaiden that women can ride Pegasi.

Are you seriously using shitty sprites from the NES era to suggest there might be male pegasus knights? This is absurd. Maybe they were actually Elves riding pegasi. I mean, we don't have proof to the contrary.

And there was Michalis. A man who was a Dracoknight. Which was a class that promoted from Pegasus Knight.

Wyverns (or dragons) are not pegasi. Dracoknights being tied to Pegasus Knights is a game mechanic. Michalis doesn't need to have ever touched a pegasus, according to lore. Unless he mentioned having ridden one, nothing supports him being a former pegasus knight.

There is now.

Thanks captain obvious.

According to who?

According to me, the guy pointing out that male pegasus knights have never had a significant presence in the series. I repeat: Male pegasus riders have appeared in only ONE title and only as generic, nameless enemies. That's why Tsubaki is contrary to Fire Emblem tradition. Is this a terrible thing? No, I don't hate it, but I liked the flavor added by certain classes being gender-locked.

What a pointless conversation.

Edited May 7, 2015 by NekoKnight

[Tamanoir]

What a pointless conversation.

...That you still continue nevertheless.

Before FE6, there were no female thiefs or shaman girls that used bows while riding a horse. (and for real horseman/ranger you have to wait for FE8).

Before FE9 there was no female soldier (unless you counts amelia in FE8)

And FE13 introduced a new mount out of nowhere (Gryphons), whereas there never had been any gryphons in any other games, especially the early ones.

What a bunch of bollocks, right ?

Edited May 7, 2015 by Tamanoir

[Venterqua]

Hmmm, I didn't notice we had more female characters than male character released. Nice. Representation is always important, and although tropey, Fire Emblem has never necessarily been horrible with gender representation and more couldn't hurt. Hopefully, this time it's not just to raise a next-level superchild army (S-supports are ok, conditionally).

In response to the Hoshido leader, I already think she made some bad decisions. How else did the enemy end up with her child for at least 15 years? Honestly, it'd be interesting if she was trying to get rid of Kamui and turned out to be the antagonist of the Hoshido path. Maybe Kamui is the child of her and Garon, making both grorups of siblings half-siblings. Though, Mom being the enemy would basically copy the antagonist of Nohr, who is most likely Garon...eh, I'd still like it.

As for Hinoka, I'm almost positive that at least one person in-game will ask why he's riding a pegasus and we'll have our answer. I'm kind of eh on genderlocked classes, especially those that don't have a real reason (no, pegasi just don't like men isn't enough for me). I think that exceptions, exceptions being rare, are basically neededd at this point, both to further explain the lore and add something new to the series.

[Baldrick]

Female-only pegasus knights is certainly a thing, but it's not exactly a core feature of the series. If we always kept the flavour as it had always been, we'd still have stuff like armour knights not promoting to generals, and clerics needing to be attacked to gain exp.

Besides, Tsubaki would be the second male pegasus knight in the series after Thany.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

Besides, Tsubaki would be the second male pegasus knight in the series after Thany.

Don't forget Tanith.

(...I don't actually think Tanith looks like a dude at all, but I hear people make the joke...)

[Snowy_One]

I, honestly, see more value in keeping the classes segregated by gender and leaving distinction between the men and women than to allow full gender access and risk trivializing gender all together.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

Classes probably still have alternate caps for different genders. (though if stats are as inflated as Awakening they'll probably make little difference)

Edited May 7, 2015 by L95

[Cysx]

As for Hinoka, I'm almost positive that at least one person in-game will ask why he's riding a pegasus and we'll have our answer.

I wouldn't even bet on that. Again, in the first trailer we see very masculine figures riding pegasi sporting the Hoshido emblem. Not to mention their country could be located in the sky(although I have no idea how Nohr can even hope to invade them if that's the case) if the artworks are to be taken at face-value. Point is, this may be a completely normal thing in Hoshido.

[Thor Odinson]

Classes probably still have alternate caps for different genders. (though if stats are as inflated as Awakening they'll probably make little difference)

I personally like the way Awakening did them, tbh. Personalised caps, I feel, is better than caps based on gender alone. While the male caps tended towards more str/def and female caps tended towards more spd for the most part, it allowed for cases like Virion/Gaius/Lon'qu and Nowi, Panne (ok panne's caps are just ridic) and Cherche to exist because of their character.

I, honestly, see more value in keeping the classes segregated by gender and leaving distinction between the men and women than to allow full gender access and risk trivializing gender all together.

Why do you want to make the distinction that important? The distinction between individuals is far more important and leave gender to design/story/personal interactions.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Thor Odinson

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

one of the few things awakening did right were personal caps, as it gave characters a tad bit more individuality.

not to mention, while i'm a male so you'd think i'd have higher strength and defense, i was actually born with a pretty weak body so those wouldn't be my high point of caps.

what i'm saying is, not every man should have an improved str cap.

Edited May 7, 2015 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai