Zelda: Twilight Princess HD (releases on the 4th!)

[Magical Glace]

Oh that's right. I remembered it as being called sky technology.

[Samias]

In TP-related news, I just finished wrestling with a bunch of Gorons and made my way up to the mines. I totally failed so hard at the bridge scene, but managed to scrape by eventually (after getting knocked into the chasm like 5 times).

To be honest that fight took more hearts off me than any boss battle. He's like, one of two encounters to put me into critical hearts. The only other enemy who has made me feel in danger was the ball and chain midboss because I forgot where his weak spot was...

Every boss in the game has done anywhere from no damage to a heart and a half. I should have played hero mode @_@

[Anacybele]

That was one of the things people used to complain about TP, Samias, I'm not surprised. You know the Zelda cycle, right? People hate on the newest game and praise the one that came before it? It applies to the home console games mainly. People were hating on TP when it had just come out because it was too easy, too linear, the intro was too sluggish, Ganondorf felt tacked on, and so on. Now I see nothing but love for the game and hate for Skyward Sword. I bet you people will start loving Skyward Sword and hating on Zelda Wii U in due time.

Now, I do agree that TP is kind of easy and that Ganondorf felt tacked on in it. But I never minded the linearity or the intro.

Also, people hated on TWW when it first came out too. Now I see nothing but praise for it as well.

Oh yeah, on another note, I finally used my Wolf Link Amiibo. I didn't know I'd only be doing like ten floors of the Cave of Shadows in the first visit. xP Ah well.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Anacybele

[Samias]

Hmmm I don't know. People disliked WW visually but then they grew older and learned what aesthetic was. Twilight Princess has kind of always been the red headed step child, with waggle and BLOOM memes at launch. And it was always easy. Wind Waker is pretty easy too but the boss battles are a little bit more involved. Even the first boss in Wind Waker is one of the more threatening first bosses in the series, up there with Odolwa in Majora's Mask. And of course LTTP was far and away better than its NES counterparts, and OoT was again a radical change, while MM follows completely different themes. Honestly I don't think there is any such thing as the Zelda cycle as all the recent console games have had obvious strengths and flaws. Skyward Sword can have motion calibration issues and reuses too many fights, the sky is boring, and has the most annoying assistance character. Twilight Princess is too easy and is visually super blown out. Wind Waker has too sparse of an overworld and too much time is spent doing nothing between islands. Majora's Mask's timer is too stressful for some and there are only 4 dungeons. Ocarina of Time is perfect isn't LTTP. Actually as a kid I found the horror elements of OOT were too intense. It took all my courage to ever get through the Bottom of the Well.

But as for strengths, Skyward Sword had great dungeons and great characters and the combat was definitely more challenging than TP or WW. Twilight Princess has the most full length dungeons of any 3D Zelda game and some extremely creative new items. Wind Waker has an amazing soundtrack and wonderful visuals and its overhaul on combat was sorely needed. Plus it's the one game to really make the story of Ganondorf seem tragic. Majora's Mask has a rich world and tons of sidequests and has the most sense of urgency in terms of atmosphere. Even the side characters all had stories that unfolded over the 3 day cycle. Also, by excluding Zelda and Ganondorf (or any Zelda/Ganondorf stand-in like Vaati), it was free to explore new motivation for Link. Ocarina of Time has great pacing, with just enough story bits to feel complete but nothing too heavy. It's just a fun romp with a lot of dungeons and a good amount of side content. Link to the Past is easy enough to be completed by anyone, but hard enough to feel rewarding. Also, it's the start of the Zelda formula moving forward. Link's Adventure is uh... it's something. Insanely hard but actually has some really cool ideas for an NES game. LoZ OG is just so confusing I have nothing good to say about it <_< but I know some people like that level of exploration and extreme danger at every turn.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Samias

[Anacybele]

Well yeah, I won't deny that each game has flaws. I just feel like people like to ignore the good things about the newest home console game too much. I can see why people don't like Fi (even though I like her) and all, but Skyward Sword is not a terrible game simply because of a really hand-holdy companion. I enjoyed the gameplay, dungeons, story, and characters quite a bit. The sky could've been better though, I agree with that.

Personally, I found TP's boss battles to be more challenging than TWW's. In fact, TWW is one of the easiest games I ever played period. I didn't die once in my first playthrough except vs Puppet Ganon and that was only one death total.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Anacybele

[Samias]

Well yeah, I won't deny that each game has flaws. I just feel like people like to ignore the good things about the newest home console game too much. I can see why people don't like Fi (even though I like her) and all, but Skyward Sword is not a terrible game simply because of a really hand-holdy companion. I enjoyed the gameplay, dungeons, story, and characters quite a bit. The sky could've been better though, I agree with that.

Personally, I found TP's boss battles to be more challenging than TWW's. In fact, TWW is one of the easiest games I ever played period. I didn't die once in my first playthrough except vs Puppet Ganon and that was only one death total.

I think Stallord and Blizzeta are the only two remotely challenging bosses of TP, other than Ganon. Meanwhile WW Gohma can actually stump new players as you use a relatively non offensive item to indirectly harm the boss, and Kalle Demos's vulnerability ends with a nasty attack if you keep wailing on it whereas TP bosses tend to have a slower recovery. Gohdan is quite aggressive with its energy blasts. Jalhalla and Molgera are extremely easy though. Then Puppet Ganon is quite the marathon, and Ganon at the very end is definitely one of the greatest Ganon battles in Zelda. Also, there's more darknuts in Wind Waker to contend with and they'll use any weapon they can get their hands on. When you have to fight multiple darknuts and a wizzrobe, things get fairly messy. TP barely makes use of its elite enemies. However both games are significantly easier than OoT, MM or SS. Few of the enemies ever deal more than half a heart of damage at a time. It's pretty much impossible to die in any of the fights in either game but WW's tend to take more hearts off me.

[Anacybele]

Once you figure out what to do to Gohma though, it's extremely easy and predictable. Shoot eye, attack, repeat. Been there, done that (OoT Gohma, remember?). Kalle Demos can be taken out in two rounds despite the "nasty" attack. And it's easy to see what to do to it: slice its tentacles with the boomerang. The tentacles themselves can be a bit tricky when they shoot up out of the ground though. Gohdan's energy blasts are easy to avoid, just keep running. And I could go on.

I've actually been killed by Diababa, Morpheel, Blizzeta, and Zant before. I have trouble getting bombs to hurt Diababa. Morpheel's eye thing in the first phase is always hard as hell for me to target. Blizzeta is f-ing Blizzeta. Zant is weirdo crazy Zant. So I always get more hearts taken off in TP.

But everybody's different and finds different things easy and hard. That's that. xP

Edited March 22, 2016 by Anacybele

[Samias]

Yeah, it's hard to die against Kalle Demos, but it's hard to not take any damage whatsoever. I manage to get snagged by the swallow move every so often and the whips are pretty fast. Whereas in Twilight Princess, Fyrus is really pathetic and you can literally lock him in place so he never gets to move. Same with Morpheel part 2. There's not really an equivalent to Morpheel in WW since in WW there's no real underwater content, though. That said Morpheel tetters between depressingly easy (especially phase 2) or "I forgot to take off my iron boots when I got grabbed and now I'm locked in the infinite trap" which happened to me once. Other than that, Stallord, Blizzeta, and Aeralfos are the only dungeon bosses who can't be locked down in hitstun the whole fight.

[Sock]

Other than that, Stallord, Blizzeta, and Aeralfos are the only dungeon bosses who can't be locked down in hitstun the whole fight.

Aeralfos? You're counting mid-bosses too?

Edited March 23, 2016 by Tsamimi

[Samias]

Aeralfos? You're counting mid-bosses too?

Whoops, I meant Argorok. Though Aeralfos probably is tougher than some of the early bosses.

[Kirie]

I was admittedly late to the Zelda train. My first was LttP which I played via emulator sometime in the early/mid '00s, and then TP when it came out on the Wii, so it was really the first of the modern Zelda games I played, and it's always been one of my favourite. I've played almost all of the others since then (only missing the first 2 and Spirit Tracks, and I haven't played any of the remakes/rereleases yet aside from my current TP playthrough) and I think they're all pretty good. None of them have ever felt particularly easy to me, but then my coordination isn't so great, so I'm definitely not the best at these sorts of games anyway. My husband on the other hand is almost professional in his Zelda talent, so he always helps me out if I need it.

Made some good progress in the Goron Mines last night. Gathered all the key parts and started making my way to the boss, but I had to shut down, so I guess I'll have to do a bit of backtracking in the earlier part of the temple to get back to where I was. Mid-Boss was fairly easy but I had a difficult time actually throwing him off the edge for the last attack; he kept bouncing and landing right at the edge so the last hit took me like thrice as long as the first two combined. I feel like it takes me ages to aim with the bow, but I guess I'll get better with that in time. I feel bad killing all the fire slugs because I think they're cute.

[Anacybele]

Next time you have to shut down late in a dungeon, just use Ooccoo. :P

[Kirie]

That... would have been a smart thing to do. facepalm.jpg

[BrightBow]

Personally what I remember most about the game is how irritating it was that there aren't any of those flower whistles near the city gate to call Epona, making traveling the Hylian Fields unnecessary tedious. Especially because you have to either go through the city and leave your horse behind or make a huge detour.

I suppose the remake doesn't give you the portable whistle earlier then the original did?

Edited March 23, 2016 by BrightBow

[Magical Glace]

TWW Ganondorf was very easy...

Really, the only hard part is waiting on Zelda, and that is more a patience thing than anything.

Kalle Demos can be harmed without threat of recovery attack if you just use the boomerang. It takes a bit longer, but cutting the tentacles is easy enough that really doesn't matter much

Most TWW midbosses can be utterly destroyed with the boomerang and parry mastery.

Puppet Ganon Snake is the only truly threatening boss in the game. And that's because aiming your bow is a pain when it moves so fast.

I'd personally argue TP's bosses are harder than TWW's. Or even MM's, since I consider MM a pretty classic harder levels easier bosses.

[DragonLord]

I suppose the remake doesn't give you the portable whistle earlier then the original did?

Nope, it's given after the same event in the remake.

[Zera]

I think Treasure should make the next Zelda game. Then it can be dark like TP, but also be suitably hard. Best part is they'd have a hard mode that changes enemy placements.

I believe Miyamoto once expressed interest in Retro Studios making a Zelda game - I think most folks would love to see that.

[solrocknroll]

I wish I had this, but Pokken took all of my money. I am playing the Wii version right now though and I'm having fun. It's not as perfect as Skyward Sword with it's perfect visuals or music or items, but it's still really fun.

I think Treasure should make the next Zelda game. Then it can be dark like TP, but also be suitably hard. Best part is they'd have a hard mode that changes enemy placements.

I believe Miyamoto once expressed interest in Retro Studios making a Zelda game - I think most folks would love to see that.

These are both bad ideas.

[Zera]

Oh no, they're great ideas. Aren't you that person who didn't like Metroid Prime? I don't believe you are speaking for the majority of people with regards to your views on Retro Studios. Pretty much everything they touch turns to gold, and I'm sure that would also include Zelda.

[Magical Glace]

I think I did something to my hand button mashing during the Ganondorf fight.

Also the Fishing Rod thing is still best.

[Jave]

I think Treasure should make the next Zelda game. Then it can be dark like TP, but also be suitably hard. Best part is they'd have a hard mode that changes enemy placements.

I wouldn't bet any money on that.

[Zera]

That's just a rumor, and it doesn't seem to be supported by anything other than the slowdown of Treasure's release schedule. It's been as long since the last new Treasure game as the last new 3D Zelda game. Masterpieces take time.

[solrocknroll]

Isn't this a topic about Twilight Princess?

Treasure is irrelevant, stop bringing your interests into topics where they don't belong.

I'm currently playing the Wii version, and because of the tiny wallets, is it especially important to find all of Agitha's bugs? Even if I find them all, the wallet's really small still, right?

[Zera]

Twilight Princess

Wallet - 200 (Default)

Big Wallet - 600 (Find 1 Golden Bug)

Giant Wallet - 1000 (Find all 24 Golden Bugs)

Twilight Princess HD

Wallet - 500 (Default)

Big Wallet - 1000 (Find 1 Golden Bug)

Giant Wallet - 2000 (Find all 24 Golden Bugs OR clear Cave of Shadows)

Colossal Wallet - 9999 (Find all 24 Golden Bugs AND clear Cave of Shadows)

The most expensive item in the game is the Magic Armor, which costs 598 rupees. The main reason to upgrade your wallet further is to make the armor last longer, so you can look stunning without being slowed down.

[Anacybele]

Yeah, the biggest wallet is small if you compare to what you get in TWW and SS. Skyward Sword's biggest wallet is the Tycoon Wallet which is exactly like that Colossal Wallet there in TP HD. And I think the biggest wallet in TWW lets you hold 5000 rupees.