What are your thoughts on Localization/Censorship in video games?

[Busterman64]

Now this is something that has had my interest since the "Fates Skin ship" debate before Fates came out(you know, the one where we had to wait days before getting confirmation of Skin ship's removal......for whatever reason). And after Tokyo Mirage Seesion #FE came out, I just had to ask what others think about localization/censorship.

When it comes to Localization/censorship (and this is my personal opinion), while it's something I haven't really payed a lot of attention to until...earlier this year actually( maybe a little in 2015...), my impressions are people seem to be up in-arms most of the time about it.

While I can kinda understand why since people like to get the same content as others do and don't want to treated like we can't handle certain things in a game, but I can't help but feel like it's treated as something as bad all the time. And I personally think it isn't bad all the time.

Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't(like how people appearently back before it's release, Bravely Default was gonna have some Localization changes and some people got ticked......till people found out WHAT and HOW MUCH was changed...for the better. Another example could be...well...the skin ship thing in Fates, but that's something that's been debated about a lot already a couple months back and a good amount of people, including me, were divided on that matter...). Then again, it might be WHO is doing the Localizating/censoring...or not. Not really sure. ;P

So what do you guys think? Like it, hate it, neutral(...spaghetti)? ;P

[EricaofRenais]

Most of the time it does not bother me, I can see times where it might but at least with Fates and #FE I did not have any problems with what they did. I can see why people get mad, but I can't read Japanese so I would rather live with the censorship even if I think it can be dumb sometimes.

[Lethakitty]

depends on a lot of things

1. the change. i can understand things like censoring the swimsuits for lin in xenoblade X because of how young she is, but who thought it was a good idea to make saizo and beruka c an ellipsis off

2. the rating of the game. my main argument is the breast slider in xenoblade X. it is a T rated game in america. so what females have breasts and they are at varying sizes, i dont think the option of diciding how big your bust is would really impact a rating that much. i understand the point is to not recreate lins body-type but there are people in real life with a body type like that though.

3 if it was even nesecary. Localization is to make a foreign work more relatable to the country it is being translated into. face it in america people wouldnt normally eat riceballs so they would be jelly doughnuts insted... however you do need to put the effort in to change it. I am not the type of person to give localizers shit for not keeping it 1 to 1 with the original, it doesnt need to be. also at times Japan is a fucked up country especially for americans looking at it. but Saizo and beruka C had nothing wrong with it in my opinion yet it got changed to just be silence.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Heart of Ice

[Zera]

Well, here you go.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFItIX8SIs4zqhJCHpbeV1A/featured

[sirmola]

I think that one of the goals of localization is to have different cultures have similar experiences with a game, so that the intended experience transfers, rather than being garbled by cultural noise. Editing rice balls to be donuts, is a good example, because they fulfill similar rolls, and most americans have no idea what a rice ball is, so leaving it unchanged would cause unintended confusion and "confusion" is NOT what the developers intended. SKinship is another example.

An example of differing context massively changing a story is the sherlock holmes mystery "the five orange pips". ( avalible here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Five_Orange_Pips ) It's REALY easy for a modern american reader to figure out who the villains are, simply because "KKK" is a MUCH more obvious hint to a modern american than it is to a 19th century british person.

[Topaz Light]

My thoughts on it are a little complex.

Firstly, I am strongly against meaningless changes to anything of significance. I think it's bad to alter the main plot, the characters (at least the plot-important ones), etc. too much. Stuff like Final Fantasy IV SNES's removal of certain unique character abilities in order to simplify (read: dumb down) the gameplay is also something I consider to be detrimental. Basically, don't cut/modify main story stuff (unless the modifications are at the request of the original writer(s)), and don't cut/modify the main gameplay outside of, like, bugfixes and stuff.

However, I do not object to tasteless content being omitted from games. For example, I feel like it was the right call to change the MaMU/Soleil supports in the way that they did, and I'm also frankly glad that skinshipping was removed from the game. On a more general note, removing sexualization of minors is another thing I'll never object to, because frankly that sort of content is disgusting and shouldn't have been in the original game to begin with.

I suppose what it really boils down to how important the cut content is to the experience, and whether or not it's something that I consider to be in poor taste, or an embarrassing/uncomfortably-blatant kind of fanservice. Skinshipping, I don't at all might the removal of because all the practical functions it served were retained, and the "minigame" itself is frankly the sort of thing that would make me embarrassed to tell people that I like Fire Emblem (which is something that Fates still manages to border on doing even without it).

Also, I think people make way too big a deal out of comparatively minor changes. I can honestly live without certain minor things that were in the Japanese version of a game as long as nothing significant was cut. Now, if they're cutting things like sidequests, optional party members, nonoptional party members, important story information, entire plot arcs/routes, etc., then I'll have a problem, but if it's just removing tiny, insignificant things like particularly skimpy optional outfits on characters? Eh, not something I'm gonna miss.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Topaz Light

[Emeraldfox]

It doesn't bother me whatever they change or remove, it more than likely won't affect how much I'll enjoy the game.

The only thing that bothers me is the fact that you called the face rubbing thing, 'skin ship'. Like, are you for real?

[Anacybele]

Most of the time it doesn't bother me either. In fact I usually completely agree with whatever changes have been made. But there have been cases where I thought the censoring or localization was stupid or unnecessary *cough*Tharja in the Awakening beach DLC*cough*

[Augestein]

I find them interesting honestly. Especially more wild ones like Bare Knuckle 3 versus Streets of Rage 3 where the stories are different enough to be worth playing both.

Most of the time it doesn't bother me either. In fact I usually completely agree with whatever changes have been made. But there have been cases where I thought the censoring or localization was stupid or unnecessary *cough*Tharja in the Awakening beach DLC*cough*

Hilariously enough, the edit makes it *more* suggestive rather than less. :D

Edited August 5, 2016 by Augestein

[Anacybele]

Hilariously enough, the edit makes it *more* suggestive rather than less. :D

Exactly, that's what's stupid about it.

[DragonLord]

Localization usually doesn't bother me, and I can't really recall an instance where I really objected to changes. I will say removing core gameplay elements never sits well with me, for example certain parts of the game's story and such.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Localization is absolutely necessary for audiences to really get the most out of a game. So im really ok with it. Like if they just sent over a game that was just translated, i think id be like "uhh wtf how can i even relate to this?" Like, imagine unlocalized Animal Crossing for a moment.

...

Mang, thats just weird to think about.

So yeah im down. As for censorship, a lot of the time it goes hand in hand with localization. For FE14's My Room feature, honestly, it ended up being a really good move for the game in the long run. It helped a lot with critical reception of the game. And really...could you imagine having to continuously pet your guys? Talk about tedious.

[Topaz Light]

The only thing that bothers me is the fact that you called the face rubbing thing, 'skin ship'. Like, are you for real?

"Skinshipping" is in fact a real thing and is what the developers likened the feature to, being reportedly what it was based on. Of course, how much it was based on that and how much they just used that to justify its existence is still up for debate.

It's also shorter than "the face-rubbing feature" and therefore quicker and more convenient to type.

Edited August 11, 2016 by Topaz Light

[Magical CC]

I think that one of the goals of localization is to have different cultures have similar experiences with a game, so that the intended experience transfers, rather than being garbled by cultural noise. Editing rice balls to be donuts, is a good example, because they fulfill similar rolls, and most americans have no idea what a rice ball is, so leaving it unchanged would cause unintended confusion and "confusion" is NOT what the developers intended. SKinship is another example.

Then start learning. It's time to leave your comfort zone to learn something new. It's not like we are still living in the 80s where internet was not as widespread and lacked information. If I play a Japanese game, then I want to experience Japanese culture.

Edited August 7, 2016 by Magical CC

[Original Alear]

A big thing about censorship in games is that a great deal of it is self-censorship. So the question becomes, are we against developers or corporations publishing the games making games to appeal to a market and culture that they think will help the game do well, as well as merely avoid public outcry?

Eh, I dunno. Personally,

but Saizo and beruka C had nothing wrong with it in my opinion yet it got changed to just be silence.

Ya, maybe it becomes an issue when the localizers are substantially messing with the original content of the game just to get a laugh.

I still remember I played a hacked ver of pokemon black and white before it came out in the states, and the mom of the main character talks about how she envies you b/c she didn't go on a pokemon journey, but ultimately wishes you well. It's not in the english version. It might have just been the hacker messing with the script, I'm not sure.

[Topaz Light]

Then start learning. It's time to leave your comfort zone to learn something new. It's not like we are still living in the 80s where internet was not as widespread and lacked information. If I play a Japanese game, then I want to experience Japanese culture.

If you wanna learn Japanese to play games and stuff in their own original language, then that's just fine, you do you and all that, but it just makes you look haughty and annoying when you start insisting that everybody do so. Some people don't have the time to learn another language. For some people (like me) it's just not a big deal to them. Whatever way of enjoying something works best for you is fine, but it's not your place or anybody's to decide what works best for everyone. That's something each specific person has to choose for themselves.

Also, you issued an imperative and then tried to justify it with your personal goals for your own experience with something. That doesn't work.

[Refa]

Localization is necessary, especially when it comes to making the dialogue sound natural. However, changing things like rice balls to donuts or the entire setting of Phoenix Wright to the US is stupid (even ignoring the sequels, the entire justice system in the first game is a parody of the JAPANESE justice system).

Censorship is not, 99% of the time. Usually it's so that 1) They can get a better rating (which I don't agree with, but it's justifiable because they're still a company), 2) Perceived complaints (such as all of the religious censorship Nintendo used to do, which granted made a lot more sense in the '80s but doesn't make quite so much sense when Konami censors Ankhs on their Yugioh cards today...yeah, I know the latter isn't a video game series but it's the first thing that comes to mind lol), 3) No one fucking knows (shit gets changed for no explicable reason sometimes). There's probably some other valid reason that I'm forgetting but these are the three ones that I tend to notice anyways.

[Michelaar]

Short answer: I don't care. I heard many people complaining that Fates' removal of The face touching game made the game stupid and those people actually. cancelled. their. preorder

Nigga what? I am pretty sure those people don't care about the gameplay of fire emblem. If the game is still enjoyable, I will continue to play them.

[Thinks Their Own Way]

The face touching was just plain creepy, no human would ever do that nor would they allow to be touched like that, at least with Pokemon, a lot of them are animal based so it's no different than petting a cat or dog.

I don't have a problem with localization, different countries have different ways of talking to one another so something that sounds good in Japaneses might sound weird in English.

Censorship would be removing story content, gameplay content, themes that they disagree with or if they made Camilla or Charlotte cover up.

[saisymbolic]

Localization depends mainly on what they change, how they execute that change and the end result to me. In the case of Phoenix Wright, I didn't really notice the huge cultural changes they made until after I had beaten the first and second games and started on the third one. It was that insignificant to me because I was mainly focused on the game play, which was not hampered in any way for me. There are some good localizations and some bad ones—but if the core aspects of a game is still present, then I have no problems. I feel like people should accept the fact that, no, not everyone has the inclination to learn about another culture; some people want to go into a game, understand and enjoy it and then go about their way.

Censorship, no. I find that a lot of things that are censored are simple, silly things like risque outfits and, while I will admit that children do not need to see certain things, it is the parents' jobs to research the games and come to the conclusion of if their child should have it or not.

Yeah, I was one of the people that didn't particularly mind the skinship aspect of the game—it's fiction. If I'm gonna be judged for rubbing a pixelated face, then so be it. What I do in a fictitious world has no bearing on what I do in the real world.

[shadowofchaos]

The face touching was just plain creepy, no human would ever do that nor would they allow to be touched like that

While I agree with most everything people are saying good about localization, that I would like to point out that it is a huge assumption on your part on what people do with their intimacy in private spaces with that statement.

While it would certainly be uncommon, never say never in that regard.

Especially since there are a wide array of "acceptable" behaviors in cultures that would abhor you.

Moving on...

Localization is necessary.

It's just as of late, there's more shitstorms because the Internet is more prevalent than ever.

Censorship is about as overused as the term "entitlement" or "elitism" or "Mary Sue".

Localization has examples of atrocities... but it's just like everything else.

Localization teams are not the devil, seeking out to tell you what you can and cannot consume.

They're making it more relatable to people who couldn't care less to dig deeper.

If you want the original, you can learn the original language. That was the way it used to be. You had to import your games.

Edited August 7, 2016 by shadowofchaos

[Magical Glace]

Depends on what's changed and how needed it was, really.

Then there's changes I understand but am sorta against because I'm used to something else even if I understand the change.

Like changing Gabo's name to Ruff in the 3DS localization of DQVII. The change makes sense, the party chooses to call the little wolf pup turned human "Gabo" because that's the first thing he said. Gabo is a sorta whimper onomatopoeia apparently, so picking something that is an onomatopoeia in English makes sense. I'm just used to Gabo and find that name cute so I don't really like the change.

[Quintessence]

Localization is a need for the game to meet different cultures and markets. The idea is to make the game stay the most true to its original self, in terms of dialogue and story.

Regarding censorship, I think people overreact and overstate them. I'm ok as long as the general experience of the game isn't perturbed.

All of these should be addressed between all the stakeholders in order to meet all requirements as much as possible.

[Lord Raven]

Then start learning. It's time to leave your comfort zone to learn something new. It's not like we are still living in the 80s where internet was not as widespread and lacked information. If I play a Japanese game, then I want to experience Japanese culture.

It's extremely difficult and time-consuming to familiarize yourself with the culture and the language of another country especially when you are older, have less time, and have a much less malleable mind. Just because we're not living in the 80s doesn't mean it's very easy for us to grasp an entirely different culture from our own.

[Etrurian emperor]

I tend to have more positive then negative feelings about localisations.

I have nothing but praise for the way Ace attorney and Kid Icarus handles their localisations or how Xenoblade was distinctively British. A good localisation can alter things that just do not make sense for a different culture or are considered tasteless or highly offensive. A child showing some skin isn't considered a big deal in Japan so her potentially skimpy outfit didn't raise any eyebrows. In the west a 13 year old girl in a skimpy outfit is just not done. Even if you don't agree then its at least easy to understand why that was altered.

Localisations can even remove DUMB ideas like magic potions to make you imagine everyone in the opposite gender and which are slipped into your coffee without consent or warp powder malfunction which only sends ones ''spirit'' into a castle. So localisations can also be a second chance to alter things that just don't work very well.

If a localisation focus more on covering skimpy outfits then my reaction is usually akin to ''So what?''. I just ignore it and have a very easy time doing so.

Edited August 9, 2016 by Etrurian emperor