Ayra Update: Where do you stand?

[Charmeleonbrah]

This topic is meant to discuss the unit that launched a thousand shitposts, Ayra.  My slightly incomprehensible title aside, I would like to discuss here our luck on summoning Ayra, as well as if she meets the definition of powercreep.  Additionally, feel free to discuss your Arena experience here: whether she is oppressive, does she "invalidate" the melee infantry pool, etc.

Currently, I have not summoned Ayra, and will in all likelihood not summon her by week's end.  I did get a very unwanted Eldigan, earlier this week, but no such luck with our girl.  I will not spend money on this banner, because even if I spend $100+, there's no guarantee I will summon her.  It's disappointing to not get the unit I wanted, but Lucina is a decent replacement, due to similar stats, and using a similar battle strategy (Desperation attacker).

I believe she is powercreep in the sense that her BST, along with unique skills, are much better than the vast majority of units.  However, I don't feel she is particularly oppressive.  Her magic bulk is low, so you can add her to Memehardt's victim list.  She is pretty easily taken care of in Arena, because of her mediocre bulk, lack of Distant Counter, and limited movement. 

What are your guy's thoughts on this topic? 

 

[Magical Glace]

I didn't pull much for her, but I stand by the opinion that her implementation is both power creep and scummy.  IS lost a lot of trust with the way Ayra was unexpectedly released.

They better hope they can recover it somehow.

[Armagon]

I pulled Ayra on my second try but i was still very pissed at what Intelligent Systems did with her. Unceremoniously putting her in a banner with old units is just wrong. And she's definitely power-creep.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Didn't get her or even try to; the last thing I need is more sword-users when we keep getting them for free from Tempest Trials.

She is definitely kinda powercreep-ish in that she renders obsolete a whole class of existing sword-users, but as mentioned she isn't oppressively so, because, to be frank, the pool of characters she is superior to already weren't very useful. I view both her and Sigurd as honest attempts to make sword-users who are relevant and people will be excited to get, something you can no longer accomplish easily. I'd rather they did it without changing the stat totals I'll admit.

I have no problem at all with her being in a banner with older units and am a bit confused at some of the outrage.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

The way she is released is just all sort of wrong, but Nutcase make a solid reasoning that her banner model is actually okay

 

 

For Arena

 

Ha

 

Ha

 

Melee Infantry

 

That is all

 

I mean Regnal Astra is a dumb skill but everything else is ok. Its just that Regnal Astra represents a mechanic in FEH that i have always been hating since day 1 so i can't agree with it. I whined a shit ton about how Black Knight's Black Luna is a cancerous design and Regnal Astra is simmilar to it

[NSSKG151]

I didn't try to get Ayra and in fact I only have her because I was pulling reds on the long haired gents banner. Mine has a -spd nature though so I probably won't use Ayra.

I definitely think she is one of the better sword infantry users but I still think Ryoma and Ike are better due to distant counter being built into their weapons. I also don't think she is too difficult to deal with as long as you have a blue tome user or a unit with Swordbreaker. But that just might be me because I always go into Arena with at least two blue units like Delthea, Azura and sometimes Nowi.

Again, Ayra is a strong unit but unless they make her part of a Bond Hero Battle or you see her in the Arena with a refresher unit you have to remember that it's easy to outsmart AI.

[Shiki]

What I don't have a problem with:
- She is not a free unit: I don't think people should really expect that IS is giving away free units all the time (even if she was in the trailer). The moment, we saw her skills and Arden, it should have made people think about her inclusion. Yes, there is Clive, who was similarly introduced and became a TT unit but this isn't something I would see as a clear sign from IS for a free unit.
- Strength: Ayra isn't really power creep in the overall sense. She still dies to Reinhardt and her offensive doesn't introduce new trends either. She still dies to bulky Blues, -blade mages or other common threats in the Arena. There is nothing meta-defining about her to make it a problem.

What I have problems with:
- She was in a separate banner with older units: Even with the argument that they need to outsource 1 unit for the TT banner Tailtiu would have been the far better choice (no personal weapon, Blue, not as 'exciting' overall). She has to share her spot with Eldigan and it would have been more sensible to make her share the spot with Sigurd. There was literally to no good reason besides €€€ to separate her from the Holy War banner.
- Personal Weapon & BST bonus: While I say she isn't a problem as a unit I still see no reason to give Ayra this kind of treatment. She might be Genealogy's most favorite female character but there are tons of other popular characters before her. Why does Ayra's Sword have the same stats like a legendary weapon if other named weapons like Berkut's Lance or Legion's Axe don't have that? This makes zero sense and breaks more than 1 trend that IS has followed.

Edited November 4, 2017 by Talandar

[Bartozio]

I don't have her yet, so the chance I'll pull her tommorow is pretty slim.

I don't really mind her stats and skills to be honest. She might be objectively better then a lot of infantry sword units, but that's more a case of IS trying to make infantry sword users better then power creep really. She's not suddenly the best unit in the game, she can at best compete with them.

What I don't like is how they implemented her. All units that appeared in the game without us being able to pull them have been free units before Ayra, so it's natural most players assumed she'd be free as well. Had I known I'd need to pull her, I wouldn't have used so many orbs to get Tailtiu. Had they shown the Ayra banner beforehand, or at least hinted at it, I would have been fine with all of this.

[Charmeleonbrah]

11 minutes ago, Bartozio said:

I don't have her yet, so the chance I'll pull her tommorow is pretty slim.

I don't really mind her stats and skills to be honest. She might be objectively better then a lot of infantry sword units, but that's more a case of IS trying to make infantry sword users better then power creep really. She's not suddenly the best unit in the game, she can at best compete with them.

What I don't like is how they implemented her. All units that appeared in the game without us being able to pull them have been free units before Ayra, so it's natural most players assumed she'd be free as well. Had I known I'd need to pull her, I wouldn't have used so many orbs to get Tailtiu. Had they shown the Ayra banner beforehand, or at least hinted at it, I would have been fine with all of this.

That is one thing that irritated me quite a bit.  I spent a lot of orbs attempting to summon Sigurd, and then a few days later it's announced that Ayra will have her own banner.  I would have preferred to summon for Ayra, so that was a scummy move imo.

37 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

I mean Regnal Astra is a dumb skill but everything else is ok. Its just that Regnal Astra represents a mechanic in FEH that i have always been hating since day 1 so i can't agree with it. I whined a shit ton about how Black Knight's Black Luna is a cancerous design and Regnal Astra is simmilar to it

Black Knight getting Black Luna I think is okay...that is his signature skill, and he is one of the most popular villains in the game.  Ayra getting special treatment is kind of random, though.  My theory is the developers have a hard-on for Ayra, and gave her the special treatment because of that reason.

[Skyla]

This horrible person ruined my 4.75% pity rate so I haven't been able to summon her.

PS. No offence to Gray fans, I know Grays a good unit and all but I'm still bitter over it.

 

Edited November 4, 2017 by Skylorella Con

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

6 minutes ago, Charmeleonbrah said:

That is one thing that irritated me quite a bit.  I spent a lot of orbs attempting to summon Sigurd, and then a few days later it's announced that Ayra will have her own banner.  I would have preferred to summon for Ayra, so that was a scummy move imo.

Black Knight getting Black Luna I think is okay...that is his signature skill, and he is one of the most popular villains in the game.  Ayra getting special treatment is kind of random, though.  My theory is the developers have a hard-on for Ayra, and gave her the special treatment because of that reason.

The problem isn't BK having it for a reason and Ayra having no reason

I could care less about favoritism. If i can ask them for Hardin right now i would ask them for an exclusive Darksphere B slot that gives him one sided guard. and Super Gradivus with Killer effect. The one time you make Favoritism argument for one the other falls apart because i can say why the fuck did BK have Black Luna when Character XYZ doesn't

 

The problem is FUCK CDR

Edited November 4, 2017 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[Balcerzak]

5 minutes ago, Charmeleonbrah said:

Ayra getting special treatment is kind of random, though.  My theory is the developers have a hard-on for Ayra, and gave her the special treatment because of that reason.

Not at all. She has a history of special treatment. See the line of FE4 figures, for example.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

6 minutes ago, Balcerzak said:

Not at all. She has a history of special treatment. See the line of FE4 figures, for example.

I dare say of all non main character of FE4, Finn is the only one that would have any chance to outspecial her but i don't know much about FE4 merchandising

[Charmeleonbrah]

16 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

The problem isn't BK having it for a reason and Ayra having no reason

I could care less about favoritism. If i can ask them for Hardin right now i would ask them for an exclusive Darksphere B slot that gives him one sided guard. and Super Gradivus with Killer effect. The one time you make Favoritism argument for one the other falls apart because i can say why the fuck did BK have Black Luna when Character XYZ doesn't

 

The 'exception to the rule' favoritism never seems to last.  But I wouldn't say BK's stats are powercreep.  He has good speed for an armored unit, but 34 is not that great either.  Not to mention his resistance is complete shit lol.  Without Black Luna he's just a better Draug.

 

11 minutes ago, Balcerzak said:

Not at all. She has a history of special treatment. See the line of FE4 figures, for example.

I wouldn't know.  We never got the gaem in the West. 

Edited November 4, 2017 by Charmeleonbrah

[Roflolxp54]

17 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

I dare say of all non main character of FE4, Finn is the only one that would have any chance to outspecial her but i don't know much about FE4 merchandising

For reference, @Balcerzak is likely referring to the Exceed a Generation set of blindbox trading figures released in 2006 in which Ayra is the secret rare figure of (Sigurd, Tailtiu, Eldigan, Erinys, Lewyn, and Silvia are the standard figures of the series). Ayra's inclusion in Heroes in such a manner (with Eldigan being a fellow focus banner unit) likely references this (and Sigurd and Tailtiu were on a separate banner and Erinys, Lewyn, and Silvia aren't in the game at the time of writing).

[Thinks Their Own Way]

My arena experience with her is that I never see her. But when I do, Reinhardt sends her into the next dimension. I was more annoyed that their was another red unit in her focus. With little fan fare; not the biggest of surprises.

[Okigen]

I'm a bit indiferrent about the whole thing.

I don't have any problem with her not being free. People forget too quickly that IS has been quite generous with free units already. CYL, BK and Arden are all awesome. Arden isn't good-looking, but you can't exactly expect top quality service for free foods. I'm more annoyed by people whining about free Ayras as if IS had the obligation to give top tier free waifus all the time.

However, I'm quite bothered by the way she was released. It wouldn't have been much problem if she was in Sigurd's banner. Given the game had amassed more than $100m of revenue already, one would hope they could sacrifice a bit of profit for the game's longetivity, or to prop up the FE brand to new players. Alas, I obviously don't understand the gacha industry.

[EricaofRenais]

Well I was pretty mad about how she was put in the game and I only did the free pull on her banner because of that.  I have not pulled her yet and personally I don't want to because of how she was put in the game.  I have run in to her in arena but since I always make sure my team has a good blue unit on it I can take her down with ease.  If I ever do pull her she will either be benched of SI fodder because of how I feel about her, if she had been with Sigurd I would of had no problem with her but how she was put in the game was wrong.  Plus because of her I did not get to pull for Eldigan who I actually really want.  

[Alexmender]

I got a 4.25% pity rate on her banner and no orbs left. It's basically impossible to get her now and my pity rate will go to waste so I'm salty about that.

Now onto the unit itself. Ayra is definitely Powercreep, she has the stats to outclass every non Ike/Ryoma/BK/Falchion red sword thanks to her busted stats and there's no denying that. Now my stance on this is that honestly I don't really care about it. In the first place red swords without a unique niche were already bad like it or not. Even without the existance of Ayra your beloved Lon'qu, Tobin and some others were already outclassed because the only reds worth anything are those with DC on their weapons while the Falchion  users at least had the combat medic niche to stand out and Eirika has the buffbot niche which is unique to her in the red area. 

The scummy part was the way IS released her. Having her with old units is annoying but what makes this an awful practice is that they didn't bother to announce her banner, having a top tier unit come 3 days after a new hyped banner with little notice is just a cashgrab and trying to make people spend this way is just.....Yeah, I was really pissed about this and I hope IS never does something as scummy as this.

Edited November 4, 2017 by Alexmender

[Tsak]

Kinda funny. i pulled her, grinded her up on warriors before that left. still haven't used her since, dunno. I'm enjoying my Ryoma i just pulled recently more

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Didn't get me nearly as bothered as I've always been about seasonal units. You can't get another shot at them, not that we know of. People should be mad about that. Power creep doesn't bother me because a lot of the best units and best fodder for units are 5 star locked. There wasn't a change in the status quo when Ayra was released, people are just mad they couldn't get her for free in a GHB event. This just months after they gave us a free CYL unit. Call it a karmic re-balance.

[VincentASM]

5 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

Didn't get me nearly as bothered as I've always been about seasonal units. You can't get another shot at them, not that we know of. People should be mad about that. Power creep doesn't bother me because a lot of the best units and best fodder for units are 5 star locked. There wasn't a change in the status quo when Ayra was released, people are just mad they couldn't get her for free in a GHB event. This just months after they gave us a free CYL unit. Call it a karmic re-balance.

Seasonal units have their issues, certainly. But at least you get a generous window of opportunity and they are widely advertised.

Ayra just appeared out of nowhere mere days after the main Holy War banner and there was basically no good reason for her to be separate from Holy War, considering it was a 3-man banner and she could've been the 4th. Not to mention, by then, most people probably burned their orbs hunting for Sigurd etc.

On a related note, I do think the Halloween banner was released rather unfairly, just days before Halloween starts, while other games tend to release them earlier. So a lot of people probably thought there wouldn't be one. (And of course, I had to burn all my Orbs on Performing Arts, ahaha.)

EDIT

Anyway, my position is mostly unchanged. I am not a huge fan of Ayra, nor do I really want her, but I am very annoyed with how they released her (as mentioned in my 2nd paragraph). Just less annoyed than earlier XD

Edited November 4, 2017 by VincentASM

[Zapp Branniglenn]

1 minute ago, VincentASM said:

Seasonal units have their issues, certainly. But at least you get a generous window of opportunity and they are widely advertised.

Ayra just appeared out of nowhere mere days after the main Holy War banner and there was basically no good reason for her to be separate from Holy War, considering it was a 3-man banner and she could've been the 4th. Not to mention, by then, most people probably burned their orbs hunting for Sigurd etc.

On a related note, I do think the Halloween banner was released rather unfairly, just days before Halloween starts, while other games tend to release them earlier. So a lot of people probably thought there wouldn't be one. (And of course, I had to burn all my Orbs on Performing Arts, ahaha.)

You should have waited until the final days performing arts to be sure whether there was a Halloween banner. Banners have always been a test of self-control, you know this

I don't need a reminder of the circumstances in which Ayra was released. Seasonal banners were not always a month long. The first two were just two weeks long. And that seemed normal since the game was still being updated so frequently with new units. You can still pull Ayra, but you can't pull more than half the dancers in this game. Please accept that I will be infinitely more upset about that

[Jingle Jangle]

I think it was a cheap move, even when I got her for my free summon, it was a scummy move as said by the other members in the thread. At least I don't see her very often in Arena teams.

[Jave]

I'm not bothered by this at all.

Was it a cheap move the way she was released? Of course. But this is the kind of thing you should expect from a gacha game. I can only see it getting worse in the future.

And for the record, I haven't pulled once from Ayra's banner outside of the free pull (which wasn't Ayra or any 5*).