Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

In games (most of them anyway), there's no actor in the game itself. The voice actors are just reading lines in a booth after being given context on them (and sometimes not at all lol). The original voice over is itself a dub, if that makes sense. So, in theory, there should be no reason why any dub should be fundamentally worse than the original language - The original voice actors are doing the exact same thing as the dub actors in the same circumstances.

Though of course, you then have those that do act out the scenes as they record their lines. Not unlike how some CGI scenes also get acted out.

[Armagon]

2 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

And i think it's fair then to prefer a language over the other

Preference is fair, the point is moreso no one good language is better at doing something than the other.

4 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Voices can also tell something about a character or personality - most dubs do not and can not adapt that well, or translate it - no matter the language

That's why good localization is important. Like a Dragon 8 has a Latino character and while there is no Latino dub, the "yare yare" was localized as "dios mio" which is genius.

12 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

ngl Armagon I'm gonna have to side with Bow here, perhaps apply more Endgame Ready Beard to the problem next time.

Does the enemy not disintegrate upon touching Endgame Ready Beard anyways?

[BrightBow]

Ultimately success in Berwick Saga comes down to effective use of your tools. None of that juggernauting stuff.
The first thing I did with the Randomizer was actually to set all character bases to 0.
Didn't make the game that much harder. And while a Ward with 0 personal bases is a sad sight indeed, his weapon levels and skills made him still quite useful.

Not that the point of this exercise was to be a challenge. It was to figure out what the class bases and by extension personal bases even are, so I could more effectively modify them. Since of course the Randomizer only allows you to write game data, not read it.

Unsurprisingly it turns out that Derrick has 0 personal bases. While clearly having much lower than generic growths, as shown by the fact that enemy armors on high levels actually have a higher then 12 defense. So clearly they do not share Derrick's 0% defense growth.

[Interdimensional Observer]

2 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

In terms of relationships I wanna push going forward, I've always had a "Ship them for their designs and dynamic, not their stats" mentality to these games but if we're being honest, the remaining bachelors for any of the bachelorettes kinda bore me so I settled on them a bit arbitrarily. So far I'm thinking Ayra with Holyn, Erin with Jamke and Raquesis with Dew.

You'll be able to make do regardless of pairings. Gen 2 gives you enough units who are good enough that you can get by regardless of the children. -Just don't lose them all.😉

 

2 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

All jokes aside, that sounds pretty damn bad I won't lie. On top of having a ton more boring downtime, the game's decidedly not designed for this kind of thing. Sequential turns would make most of the game a breeze, except maybe for a few very specific encounters where being able to do turn order shenanigans really helps - then it's a lot worse than normal.

I also feel like certain characters would become worse this way. Thaddy springs to mind, he can't move and Steal in the same turn. Would the fragile thief would be much more exposed to harm trying to Steal in the conventional turn system? -And speaking of Thaddy, my bypassing of that crazy-strong jail guard wouldn't work with normal FE turns.

-But go ahead and make this your BS run for 2025.😛

[Codename Shrimp]

3 minutes ago, Armagon said:

point is moreso no one good language is better at doing something than the othe

Growing up speaking multiple different languages i gotta disagree here

Saying something in a language that i usually say in another feels so damn wrong...like really really wrong

Then again

I have like, a language assigned to each topic where i go "yup, this topic is better spoken about in this language" xD

[Acacia Sgt]

22 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Those don’t all look Nubian.

Alpha Gaiden does something similar with Khamen using mechs from other factions, but they're just AI-controlled.

Still, that's actually a cool detail what GC does here.

22 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

It’s an SRW sendoff that I think works for him. It kept the essence of Khamen Khamen’s canonical end, while changing the outward manifestation of it.

Oh so true. Alpha Gaiden just had a more standard battle, though he still had ship doubles. Then after that... well, because of that, it's hard to say if he actually dies, but he certainly doesn't show up again for the rest of the game.

Then there's the fact this happens in the Bad Future. Once the heroes return to the present, Khamen and the Nubians are still in cryosleep in the Earth Cradle. But Braiger never returned for Alpha 2 or 3, so... hard to say what was their ultimate fate. I know the Cradle gets attacked in Sanger's Alpha 2 route, and only he and Sophia Nate survive, so... Alpha 3 is tricky since I don't know how Sanger's appearance goes in the non-Touma routes. One way or another, Nubia gets dealt with off-screen.

[BrightBow]

13 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Does the enemy not disintegrate upon touching Endgame Ready Beard anyways?

No, for a variety of reasons. First, you cannot counter attack if you take damage from an attacker. And while Ward is quite the bulky beard, he is not bulky enough to complete negate axe damage or Spear users using their charge bonus. Double attacks also flatout aren't possible if you are the defender.
2nd, he is also more of a spear user himself. And you don't get your charge bonus if you counter in melee.
3rd, while he could use the Knight Sword he starts with gives him an extra round of combat (given it's high rank requirement, it's effectively his pref for quite a while), he is notably better with Spears than Swords. So at that point you are really just fishing for some extra damage. Which can be valuable, but it's not gonna result in bodies dropping left and right.

[Armagon]

14 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Growing up speaking multiple different languages i gotta disagree here

Saying something in a language that i usually say in another feels so damn wrong...like really really wrong

Then again

I have like, a language assigned to each topic where i go "yup, this topic is better spoken about in this language" xD

Dawg I think that's just you cause I also grew up speaking multiple languages and I didn't feel about it this way.

[Interdimensional Observer]

10 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Saying something in a language that i usually say in another feels so damn wrong...like really really wrong

Then again

I have like, a language assigned to each topic where i go "yup, this topic is better spoken about in this language" xD

The quote "I speak Spanish to God, Italian to women, French to men, and German to my horse" is -falsely- attributed to Holy Roman Emperor Charles V (Charles I of Spain). It's in your Germanity.😜

 

1 minute ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Still, that's actually a cool detail what GC does here.

I do quite like it. Not cross-piloting, but cross... allegiances? Cross VAing?

2 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Then there's the fact this happens in the Bad Future. Once the heroes return to the present, Khamen and the Nubians are still in cryosleep in the Earth Cradle. But Braiger never returned for Alpha 2 or 3, so... hard to say what was their ultimate fate.

Khamen was in the Cradle? I can see that.

Dr. Feff/Fehu wouldn't mind his company. And Khamen's religious fanaticism means he'd totally buy into an apocalyptic bunker/cryofreeze system.

3 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

I know the Cradle gets attacked in Sanger's Alpha 2 route, and only he and Sophia Nate survive,

So much for it being able to survive the end of days.😝 ...TBF that's only true if it's underground.

Braiger in Alpha 2 dealing with Nubia again could've been interesting. The J9 would know well his behaviors, yet Khamen Khamen even at the best of times remains somewhat unpredictable. I predict Khamen would believe he was Orphan's chosen one.

[Shaky Jones]

Wish I could make fun of one side of Berwick arguments and upset Ruben along the way, but I cant bring myself to slog through these shitty ass Tear Ring maps. Holy shit, where did Thracia Kaga go? Why do Gaiden 2? I'm going crazy and I'm not even halfway done. And no, benching TRS and going straight to BS isn't an option, so I'll see you guys on July. 

[Acacia Sgt]

1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I do quite like it. Not cross-piloting, but cross... allegiances? Cross VAing?

Guess that works, heh.

1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Khamen was in the Cradle? I can see that.

Dr. Feff/Fehu wouldn't mind his company. And Khamen's religious fanaticism means he'd totally buy into an apocalyptic bunker/cryofreeze system.

Yeah, as I mentioned before, when the project was abandoned, it was Nubia who picked it up and help finish it. Khamen's plan was to ride out the gravity wave, then emerge in the ravaged world to remake it anew with Project Atum.

However, the Machine Cells going out of control forced them out of the Cradle, where they went to Jupiter to continue the cryosleep. Then they came back to the Earth Sphere.

1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

So much for it being able to survive the end of days.😝 ...TBF that's only true if it's underground.

Braiger in Alpha 2 dealing with Nubia again could've been interesting. The J9 would know well his behaviors, yet Khamen Khamen even at the best of times remains somewhat unpredictable. I predict Khamen would believe he was Orphan's chosen one.

Yeah, its's weird they left that plot point hanging, then seemingly just resolve it offscreen. But then, not the only time Alphaverse would do it.

Hmm... Khamen aiming for Orphan would've been fascinating to see.

[BrightBow]

The German language is pointless and stupid. You don't need a gender for every single noun. No rules to how this shit works either. You just gotta know. Kinda like FE12 and Awakening reinforcements.

[Codename Shrimp]

29 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Dawg I think that's just you cause I also grew up speaking multiple languages and I didn't feel about it this way.

I know others like me who feel similar, but then again we aren't all the same because we grew up speaking multiple languages!

 

Alot of the experiences are shared tho!

23 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

It's in your Germanity

So why don't i speak horse 🤔

19 minutes ago, Shaky Jones said:

And no, benching TRS and going straight to BS isn't an option

Eh

I did that

So can you 😛

7 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

The German language is pointless and stupid

Girl being gender neutral while alot of objects are feminine (or gendered) will never be not funny to me lol

Also Rules? No such thing as you said - you gotta "feel" it

Edited February 7 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Acacia Sgt]

No wonder English is so quirky too. Blame the father!

[Interdimensional Observer]

19 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Hmm... Khamen aiming for Orphan would've been fascinating to see.

"Orphan" is in fact the sacred ship sent by blessed Atum!☀️ -Sure the Reclaimers would think KK is crazy, but he's useful and he too wishes to see Orphan leave the Earth's atmosphere. A fellow traveler who can be allowed to stay, for now.

A Nubian alliance with the Reclaimers would be to their benefit. The Reclaimers' bunker mentality of waiting for Orphan to surface means they aren't very worldly. Nubia can help grab some more distant Plates, and its shady presence everywhere can get whatever other resources are needed until the day of final departure.

19 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Yeah, as I mentioned before, when the project was abandoned, it was Nubia who picked it up and help finish it. Khamen's plan was to ride out the gravity wave, then emerge in the ravaged world to remake it anew with Project Atum.

Interesting. And indeed delightfully eschatological.

19 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

However, the Machine Cells going out of control forced them out of the Cradle,

...And here I thought that with Magus finished in Alpha Gaiden, that the Machine Cells would be functioning perfectly fine. OG2 and what little I know of AG gave me the impression that, besides Magus being awake and not a silent cloistered bio-core, the Machine Cell was entirely finished and stable on its own.

Edited February 7 by Interdimensional Observer

[GuardianSing]

1 hour ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Not really. Voices have emotions and stuff that doesn't carry over to other languages well and/or the dub voices being bad.

And it's not just jp stuff, dubs just feel absolutely wrong. Last time i watched and american movie dubbed in german it was an awful experience, despite the movie itself being good.

That's why localizers and translators have to work together for these kinds of things. Most languages don't have the same fundamental base and so many things end up being lost in translation. If you translate directly without editing, it tends to sound very strange in the language it's being translated to, which is why you have localizers working to change certain wordings or phrases to make it make more sense in said language. Subs do this as well so in either case if you don't speak the original language, there will always be some things lost in translation, not to mention that how characters speak in media is usually completely different from how real people of that language speak it. I recall hearing from an interview with Miyazaki saying that he preferred working with English VAs for his films because it was easier to get them to "speak as they normally would" in roles, with many Japanese VAs he worked with supposedly trying too hard to be dramatic and unnaturally high or low pitch with their voice.

Generally I agree with Ruben. With anything animated everything thing is a dub, even the original language, because the original voice actors won't know about the original author's intent on a certain line anymore than a foreign VA would, and a dub is only as bad as it is neglected by said author or studio.

22 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Growing up speaking multiple different languages i gotta disagree here

Saying something in a language that i usually say in another feels so damn wrong...like really really wrong

Then again

I have like, a language assigned to each topic where i go "yup, this topic is better spoken about in this language" xD

I feel like that's only true if you accept the idea that there exists a default linguistic way to define things right? Because naturally the best way to explain things in a certain language is to explain it...in that language. There is no external vibe meter for languages that ranks how well a certain thing is conveyed in a specific language, it's all about how we individually can understand what is being said. It all depends on what language you are speaking at the moment.

That being said, historically the way languages grow is by feeding off of each other. Since languages have no true inherent standardization, the history of one language is often the history of multiple different languages merging and diverging and continuing to grow today. Case in point, there are a couple Japanese words that most English speakers know of and use frequently, even if there is an English equivalent. So you may be onto something.

[Saint Rubenio]

The Erzheimer scenes are still so fun. Truly so beautiful to watch a friendship blossom between Endgame Ready Beard and the world's dumbest rich boy.

Also beautiful to get four Erzie items in one map. And could've gotten five, but I already had a dark axe from before. Thanks, Kramer. Now to get a gore fork from Faye's paralogue. And then throw both her and Faramir to the bench so I can glue Adel to the active slots and get his spear level to 30.

59 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Not always. Like technically yes, but the OG VA experience, interaction and direction are also part of it...

And dubs tend to fumble at that - and it makes sense when you hear stories on how some dub VA have to read lines alone, or without context, or or or.

 

Well, I did say in theory.

59 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Though of course, you then have those that do act out the scenes as they record their lines. Not unlike how some CGI scenes also get acted out.

Yes, there are some such cases. But then you have games like FE, or all the Square Enix 2D stuff lately, etc. etc.

50 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Does the enemy not disintegrate upon touching Endgame Ready Beard anyways?

Hah! As if. Man is Endgame Ready and yet more balanced than like, any FE jeigan.

49 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

Ultimately success in Berwick Saga comes down to effective use of your tools. None of that juggernauting stuff.
The first thing I did with the Randomizer was actually to set all character bases to 0.
Didn't make the game that much harder. And while a Ward with 0 personal bases is a sad sight indeed, his weapon levels and skills made him still quite useful.

Not that the point of this exercise was to be a challenge. It was to figure out what the class bases and by extension personal bases even are, so I could more effectively modify them. Since of course the Randomizer only allows you to write game data, not read it.

Unsurprisingly it turns out that Derrick has 0 personal bases. While clearly having much lower than generic growths, as shown by the fact that enemy armors on high levels actually have a higher then 12 defense. So clearly they do not share Derrick's 0% defense growth.

Derrick is awesome in a no bases run because his stats are not affected. Everyone, give the man a standing ovation.

46 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I also feel like certain characters would become worse this way. Thaddy springs to mind, he can't move and Steal in the same turn. Would the fragile thief would be much more exposed to harm trying to Steal in the conventional turn system? -And speaking of Thaddy, my bypassing of that crazy-strong jail guard wouldn't work with normal FE turns.

-But go ahead and make this your BS run for 2025.😛

Thaddy would indeed become pretty damn worthless. He'd have to survive a whole enemy phase to be able to steal anything, and the guy can't take a hit at all.

And no. I don't think so. Berwick's more fun this way.

20 minutes ago, Shaky Jones said:

Wish I could make fun of one side of Berwick arguments and upset Ruben along the way

Hello, Shaky.

20 minutes ago, Shaky Jones said:

but I cant bring myself to slog through these shitty ass Tear Ring maps. Holy shit, where did Thracia Kaga go? Why do Gaiden 2? I'm going crazy and I'm not even halfway done. And no, benching TRS and going straight to BS isn't an option, so I'll see you guys on July. 

Please drop the game now, Shakespeare.

8 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

The German language is pointless and stupid. You don't need a gender for every single noun. No rules to how this shit works either. You just gotta know. Kinda like FE12 and Awakening reinforcements.

We got that in Spanish as well. It's the thing that you're taught at such a tender age that you just accept it as fact. But then you really stop tothink about it for whatever reason and realize "hey why the hell is a chair femenine but a stool is male? Who decided that?"

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

A Nubian alliance with the Reclaimers would be to their benefit. The Reclaimers' bunker mentality of waiting for Orphan to surface means they aren't very worldly. Nubia can help grab some more distant Plates, and its shady presence everywhere can get whatever other resources are needed until the day of final departure.

I mean, they're called Reclaimers for a reason. Since they do venture out and, well, reclaim the plates. But yeah.

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

...And here I thought that with Magus finished in Alpha Gaiden, that the Machine Cells would be functioning perfectly fine. OG2 and what little I know of AG gave me the impression that, besides Magus being awake and not a silent cloistered bio-core, the Machine Cell was entirely finished and stable on its own.

Isn't Magus the result of the Machine Cells going out of control? Hence why the cryo-sleep prematurely ended as a fail-safe. Then whoever got out in time avoided becoming infected with them. Remember I'm talking about the initial events, the ones leading to the Bad Future.

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Yes, there are some such cases. But then you have games like FE, or all the Square Enix 2D stuff lately, etc. etc.

I think the closest would be being all together in the recording booth, so you can see how the other actors are emoting and stuff. As well reacting in real time.

2 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

We got that in Spanish as well. It's the thing that you're taught at such a tender age that you just accept it as fact. But then you really stop tothink about it for whatever reason and realize "hey why the hell is a chair femenine but a stool is male? Who decided that?"

I mean, SillA and bancO. Probably that.

[Codename Shrimp]

24 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

because the original voice actors won't know about the original author's intent on a certain line anymore than a foreign VA would

Except if the og author works with the og cast but not the dub

24 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

That being said, historically the way languages grow is by feeding off of each other. Since languages have no true inherent standardization, the history of one language is often the history of multiple different languages merging and diverging and continuing to grow today. Case in point, there are a couple Japanese words that most English speakers know of and use frequently, even if there is an English equivalent. So you may be onto something.

One thing that is also worth mentioning is how culture and language are intertwined and also feed into each other.

A person speaking language could turn into a different person when speaking another language - and i am not talking about word choice here or the person suddenly changing personality (even if that can happen) but how the culture of the (group that speaks the) language makes you feel & perceive said language

I hope i was able to explain this? XD

Edited February 7 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Armagon]

17 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

know others like me who feel similar, but then again we aren't all the same because we grew up speaking multiple languages!

 

Alot of the experiences are shared tho!

I wonder if it's region dependent.

12 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

That being said, historically the way languages grow is by feeding off of each other. Since languages have no true inherent standardization, the history of one language is often the history of multiple different languages merging and diverging and continuing to grow today. Case in point, there are a couple Japanese words that most English speakers know of and use frequently, even if there is an English equivalent. So you may be onto something

There's also Spanglish. How heavy the Spanglish gets depends where you're from but like Puerto Ricans do not have a Spanish word for brown. They just say brown. They do not have a Spanish word for hot dog, they just say hot dog. Even while speaking Spanish. I know this because when I said I wanted to eat a "perro caliente", my coworkers got a bit confused for a moment.

In Venezuela, phrases such as "full day" have caught on (this is relatively new). Full day in this instance means like a day trip or something.

2 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Except if the og author works with the og cast but not the dub

I mean that's just kinda a given a lot of the time.

[Codename Shrimp]

https://old.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/1al9n98/nintendo_says_it_will_overcome_challenges_of/

Ninty what are you cooking

[Armagon]

3 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

https://old.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/1al9n98/nintendo_says_it_will_overcome_challenges_of/

Ninty what are you cooking

It'll have more games at launch than the PS5 has had in four years.

[Interdimensional Observer]

4 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Isn't Magus the result of the Machine Cells going out of control? Hence why the cryo-sleep prematurely ended as a fail-safe. Then whoever got out in time avoided becoming infected with them. Remember I'm talking about the initial events, the ones leading to the Bad Future.

That's not how it was in the OGverse. There, the supercomputer in charge of the Earth Cradle was planned from its inception. Sophia was needed as the bio-core because the Machine Cells were unfinished, I think. Feff used her because it's what happened in AG she rushed headlong into cryosleep after like, the defeat of the DC Remnants in the OG1 midgame, -without first checking to make sure everyone else was going to follow her into deep sleep. There was certainly no Machine Cell craziness, not until the conclusion of the final battle in the Cradle.

...I should check to see if I have any screenshots. But I suppose AG and OG deviated even more than I had already assumed.

[Acacia Sgt]

4 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

That's not how it was in the OGverse. There, the supercomputer in charge of the Earth Cradle was planned from its inception. Sophia was needed as the bio-core because the Machine Cells were unfinished, I think. Feff used her because it's what happened in AG she rushed headlong into cryosleep after like, the defeat of the DC Remnants in the OG1 midgame, -without first checking to make sure everyone else was going to follow her into deep sleep. There was certainly no Machine Cell craziness, not until the conclusion of the final battle in the Cradle.

...I should check to see if I have any screenshots. But I suppose AG and OG deviated even more than I had already assumed.

Yeah, sounds like it's different. Since in Alpha Gaiden they do go out of control, and take over a few individuals like Sophia, then kill most of the cryo-sleepers.