Easiest and Hardest Fire Emblem games in universe?

[Jotari]

We've often debated which Fire Emblems are the hardest or easiest to play, but how difficult are these campaigns in universe? Which Fire Emblem protagnoists had the easiest time of it and which had the biggest uphill battle.

For my own view, I reckon Thracia was probably the most difficult. After all, Leif kind of fails in universe and needs to be bailed out. And not just at the start of the game, like Roy, at the 3/4 mark if not later. And for most of the game he's being hunted and not really able to put up much of a fight at all.

Easiest seems a bit less clear to me. The first one my mind goes to is Marth in Mystery of the Emblem, as the organization of Hardin's forces likely weren't that strong, what with Archanea being destroyed in the last war and most of the competent military figures joining Marth by the end of it. But Marth also had to march an army up the Himalayas while fighting dragons, which doesn't sound that easy.

Another one that might be on the easier side would be Sacred Stones. As Grado's initial advances are stopped after Renais, with them needing subterfuge to take Jehanna and Carcino. Ephraim also manages to destroy the empire rather early on in the story and the remainder of the game is fighting remnant soldiers and monsters.

What do you think?

[ARMADS!!!]

I didn't play FE3 so I can't say about this one but the FE7 lords look like they had an easier time compared to the other lords (and I'd say easier than sacred Stones Lord)

 - They didn't have to chase any Legendary weapon,

 - Didn't have to fight any monster or dragon (only one dragon at the end, the Morph bosses at if they count, the fact that manaketes and morphs show as bosses rather than normal enemies while other Lords are constantly fighting monsters and manaketes, makes me think that FE7 lords had it easier),

 - Their campain is about avoiding a war before it happens so they didn't have to endure an actual war too and neither had to conquer actual countries (only needed to reach the castles),

 - I don't remember many times they were just "a little group" against a big and stronger army (except Laus' chapter I think, and maybe some of the final Lyn chapters) since the Black Fang only sent a few mercenaries (or assassins) per time instead of sending a bunch of generals and whatnot against them at once,

 - Also they had a bunch of help from important people that were being backed up by their countries (by and I mean, the nobles at their to go bit fallen/runaway/refugee nobles, they were people with a bunch of power on the moment).

 Not to say they had it easy, if it wasn't for Denning being a complete imbecil that stabbed a guy before he could give info to Eliwood but failed to look back for 2 seconds to check if said guy had really died, TWICE, then the lords wouldn't even have been able to find about Back Fang's existence or Nergal's plans on first place and he would have won, but still upon reflection, I think their adventure was a lot less hard than any other I can think of.

 

 I reckon Thracia was the hardest too.

 

[Jotari]

24 minutes ago, ARMADS!!! said:

Not to say they had it easy, if it wasn't for Denning being a complete imbecil that stabbed a guy before he could give info to Eliwood but failed to look back for 2 seconds to check if said guy had really died, TWICE, then the lords wouldn't even have been able to find about Back Fang's existence or Nergal's plans on first place and he would have won, but still upon reflection, I think their adventure was a lot less hard than any other I can think of.

I think you mean Ephidel. Denning is the one with the catch phrase. Other that, fair points, I'm largely in agreement.

[ARMADS!!!]

30 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I think you mean Ephidel. Denning is the one with the catch phrase. Other that, fair points, I'm largely in agreement.

Oh yeah, it's Ephidel! I don't know why but I constantly mistake him for Denning😛

 Also on FE7, I was reflecting about the plot and I don't remember a single time they had to use any sort of "risqué (or smart) strategic move" to get out of a sticky situation (like when being persecuted or stuck because of enemies, or trying to take a castle while on lower numbers) or to get the upper hand over the enemy like most other lords do (even though Ephraim makes it look easy to do these, the FE7 lords were never even put on such situations on first place), the smarter thing they must have done was when Lyn's group was attacked at night during Lyn's mode and decided to use the ruins on their favour, I think, but there were never stakes related to following a risque plan, it's just them going after Black Fang and they can stop it anytime if they want (well but then the dragons will be liberated but anyway), sometimes some asssssins go after them and that's it, when they have to do something like rescuing Ninian or Elbert they just go to the place and do it (or not). I love when they use these "smart plans" like when Marth is required to leave a companion behind to save himself (I'm not sure if it's on FE1 or 3) or a bunch of Alfonse moments in FEH, and even Ephraim's stunts (though on Ephraim's case they want to make him look inhumanly smart and sure that everything will always work without consequences- and it always does exactly as he says- so it just looks stupid sometimes, unlike Alfonse who is smart but there's always the question about what will happen if the plan fails and he considers what he can lose, and sometimes it does fail, so it doesn't feel like he's some strategic god). I deviated a bit from the point but anyway, I was just mentioning another sense in which the FE7 lords had it easier, they were never required to do any sacrifice (by choice, some people dying before they could come doesn't count) or risque plan to win or to survive.

Edited December 29, 2023 by ARMADS!!!

[Jotari]

35 minutes ago, ARMADS!!! said:

 I love when they use these "smart plans" like when Marth is required to leave a companion behind to save himself (I'm not sure if it's on FE1 or 3)

Neither actually, that's exclusive to the DS remake; FE11 in accepted numerology.

35 minutes ago, ARMADS!!! said:

or a bunch of Alfonse moments in FEH, and even Ephraim's stunts (though on Ephraim's case they want to make him look inhumanly smart and sure that everything will always work without consequences- and it always does exactly as he says- so it just looks stupid sometimes, unlike Alfonse who is smart but there's always the question about what will happen if the plan fails and he considers what he can lose, and sometimes it does fail, so it doesn't feel like he's some strategic god). I deviated a bit from the point but anyway, I was just mentioning another sense in which the FE7 had it easier, they were never required to do any sacrifice (by choice, some people dying before they could come doesn't count) or risque plan to win or to survive.

Well they do outright fail when trying to rescue Elbert. So that's some credit to Nergal. And their attempts at smarts there by having Leila go on ahead ends up with her unceremoniously dying too. All in all the early mid game is a bit of a downer overall. Maybe some smarter strats would have changed things.

Edited December 29, 2023 by Jotari

[SnowFire]

Of the ones I played, FE7 wins easiest, simply because there wasn't an ongoing war.  Having a war is inherently more dangerous than fighting assassins in the dark, for all that what exactly is going on in FE7 gets a bit misty sometimes. 

In the realm of spinoffs and games I didn't finish, I guess Tokyo Mirage Sessions also doesn't have a war, so it can compete with FE7?  And an oddball answer for easiest is FE Heroes.  Now, FE Heroes does not take its own plot seriously, so far be it from me to take it seriously, but if we foolishly take it even half-seriously for a moment...  on one hand Askr fights multi-dimensional goddesses of death who've already devoured entire dimensions and absorbed the power of the princess of life a zillion times over and other OP-on-paper foes.  But Askr has a collection of literal gods, demigods, dragons, heroes, etc. all mind-controlled to fight for a bland player-standin, and all of them seem totally immune to death & aging while out-of-world too.  And Askr does clearly keep winning these conflicts with basically no casualties, and even when someone dies, the summoner grabs an alternate dimension version of them wearing a silly costume as a replacement.  In other words, it might still be the easiest in the sense of sure, the enemy's power level is one trillion, but our powerlevel is one ultrazilliongillion, like a story written by a 13-year old shonen fan.

My cheaty nomination for hardest of those I've played (no Thracia here, so can't say on that one) is Awakening, simply by the brute fact that Our Heroes canonically lose, and only get a second shot thanks to divine time travel shenanigans.

Edited December 29, 2023 by SnowFire

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Three Houses has you fighting a major battle exactly once a month, always at the end of the month (they just know, with their magic calendar), and only the siege of Enbarr is a consecutive map without being able to unwind at base and enjoy incredible food, a full marketplace, a Hot Spring in the DLC. Chapter 12+13 is another consecutive map until you remember there's a five year time jump inbetween where the greatest theoretical threat is our units becoming too rusty from being out of action. The war of this game is being fought at a more leisurely pace than any individual person's playthrough in real life. Then of course there's Byleth's time travel ability.

I think the only game that may compete with all that is Corrin and his Pocket Dimension. The one that has infinite resources and time does not pass. I also have my doubts about the strength of Hoshido's army if Corrin sieged his whole way up there without taking a single life. Fire Emblem canon is just baiting a response from us at this point.

Hard disagree on FE3, or at least on Book 2. Marth and his army is just a tiny fraction of the Altean force from the get go (Gordin is debatably the most Senior Officer) And while they do pick up powerful allies, they're on the run for nearly half the maps (promoted enemies showing up everywhere to hurry you along). And that threat doesn't end until they're in the unsettled badlands, fighting literal dragons and the barbarian tribes trying to tame them. Miles from civilization, no shops to restock on supplies (except for Anna's secret shops, if Marth has a Players Guide to locate them). It only gets easy when you reach Gotoh and he warps you home. And the gameplay reflects that. When it's back to seizing castles, Book 2 becomes very easy and straightforward until you reach Hardin

FE7's a fair answer on some level, since it is the smallest scale conflict in the series. The Black Fang is an international league of assassins, but Legault shows us the smart ones are already on their way out. Nergal is threatening, but his sanity is waning, and Athos really comes through for us in the end.

Edited December 29, 2023 by Zapp Branniglenn

[lenticular]

I'll say Radiant Dawn, Part 1 as the hardest. I think it has the biggest disparity between where they start and where they finish. What they accomplish isn't as impressive as most other games, but their starting position was so much worse. Most games have us playing as lords or princes, with commensurate resources. Even when we see the rulers of fallen kingdoms, they have diplomatic connections that can provide state-level resources. At the start of Radiant Dawn, we have a small group of five insurgents with minimal resources and connections, and their goal is to overthrow the occupying empire. A surefire losing bet if ever there was one, and yet they succeed.

I agree with Fates as the easiest on the grounds of pocket dimensions. Not only can they step outside of time whenever they need a break, they also have the ability to breed and age up new soldiers for their army instantly.

[ARMADS!!!]

3 minutes ago, lenticular said:

I'll say Radiant Dawn, Part 1 as the hardest. I think it has the biggest disparity between where they start and where they finish. What they accomplish isn't as impressive as most other games, but their starting position was so much worse. Most games have us playing as lords or princes, with commensurate resources. Even when we see the rulers of fallen kingdoms, they have diplomatic connections that can provide state-level resources. At the start of Radiant Dawn, we have a small group of five insurgents with minimal resources and connections, and their goal is to overthrow the occupying empire. A surefire losing bet if ever there was one, and yet they succeed.

 Isn't Thracia like this too? I didn't play the game yet (or rather, played only a bit of the first chapter yet so whatever) but I don't think Leif being a royal ever puts him on a better position than he'd be otherwise or gives him connections or resources (so much on the resources part, that you get the majority of your equipment by stealing it from enemies). I  might be a bit wrong thought.

[lenticular]

7 minutes ago, ARMADS!!! said:

 Isn't Thracia like this too? I didn't play the game yet (or rather, played only a bit of the first chapter yet so whatever) but I don't think Leif being a royal ever puts him on a better position than he'd be otherwise or gives him connections or resources (so much on the resources part, that you get the majority of your equipment by stealing it from enemies). I  might be a bit wrong thought.

No clue. I've never played Thracia and know basically nothing about it. I guess I should have explicitly stated "of the games that I've played".

[Etrurian emperor]

Tracia easily comes off as the hardest due to being a bunch broke rebels fighting off a supremely powerful empire. I guess one could argue Seliph's position wasn't that much easier even if the gameplay doesn't really reflect that. 

Sacred Stones is arguably the easiest. Grado comes across as fairly weak as far as enemy nations go and they collapse a good bit sooner than most such countries do too. 

[Eltosian Kadath]

1 hour ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Tracia easily comes off as the hardest due to being a bunch broke rebels fighting off a supremely powerful empire. I guess one could argue Seliph's position wasn't that much easier even if the gameplay doesn't really reflect that. 

I see Seliph's situation as much better than Lief's for almost the same reason Micaiah's situation is better than Lief's. Both Micaiah and Seliph are given very powerful (in universe at least) divine blood powers to offset the situations they are in, whereas Leif is a lot closer to a normal person than those two (although still has some minor holy blood in him).

 

I guess I can answer the main question as well, but I am not adding much by doing so. If it isn't obvious, I am in the Thracia 776 being the hardest in universe Fire Emblem camp, and think FE7 makes the most sense for the easiest in universe Fire Emblem.

 

[Jotari]

8 hours ago, SnowFire said:

My cheaty nomination for hardest of those I've played (no Thracia here, so can't say on that one) is Awakening, simply by the brute fact that Our Heroes canonically lose, and only get a second shot thanks to divine time travel shenanigans.

Our Heroes don't canonically lose, the losers are an original timeline variation of the Heroes we see. And they lose pretty much purely because Robin betrays them at a critical moment. As far as the present goes for the Awakening gang, it seems they actually have the most trouble with Walhart.

6 hours ago, Zapp Branniglenn said:

Hard disagree on FE3, or at least on Book 2. Marth and his army is just a tiny fraction of the Altean force from the get go (Gordin is debatably the most Senior Officer) And while they do pick up powerful allies, they're on the run for nearly half the maps (promoted enemies showing up everywhere to hurry you along). And that threat doesn't end until they're in the unsettled badlands, fighting literal dragons and the barbarian tribes trying to tame them. Miles from civilization, no shops to restock on supplies (except for Anna's secret shops, if Marth has a Players Guide to locate them). It only gets easy when you reach Gotoh and he warps you home. And the gameplay reflects that. When it's back to seizing castles, Book 2 becomes very easy and straightforward until you reach Hardin

And yet, I think, for the early game, Marth actually didn't have much trouble with it despite being hunted. Jeorge intentionally doesn't attack him and he has seemingly very little trouble putting down the revolts in Grust and Macedon. The only time things get dicey is on Soulful Bridge which was probably very difficult for him. Before and after, however, he's largely dealing with enemies who don't truly want to fight him. Especially in New Mystery where additional allies are joining him every give seconds. As for Anri's way, that's a logistical difficulty and not a military one.

4 hours ago, lenticular said:

I'll say Radiant Dawn, Part 1 as the hardest. I think it has the biggest disparity between where they start and where they finish. What they accomplish isn't as impressive as most other games, but their starting position was so much worse. Most games have us playing as lords or princes, with commensurate resources. Even when we see the rulers of fallen kingdoms, they have diplomatic connections that can provide state-level resources. At the start of Radiant Dawn, we have a small group of five insurgents with minimal resources and connections, and their goal is to overthrow the occupying empire. A surefire losing bet if ever there was one, and yet they succeed.

I think, for the most part though, from what I remember (it has been a long time), the Radiant Dawn gang actually have the way paved ahead of them my other rebellions springing up around the country once they win a few battles. and in the end they manage to settle things using diplomacy by adhering to a higher authority, with Jarod's last stand basically being a temper tantrum they have to stop to preserve civilian casualties. So while they end up rising very high from where they started, they didn't actually have much of a tough time getting there all things considered.

Edited December 29, 2023 by Jotari

[lenticular]

38 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I think, for the most part though, from what I remember (it has been a long time), the Radiant Dawn gang actually have the way paved ahead of them my other rebellions springing up around the country once they win a few battles. and in the end they manage to settle things using diplomacy by adhering to a higher authority, with Jarod's last stand basically being a temper tantrum they have to stop to preserve civilian casualties. So while they end up rising very high from where they started, they didn't actually have much of a tough time getting there all things considered.

My interpretation is that all the other rebellions that spring up and all the troops that flock to their cause are as a direct result of their actions. They make a very specific set of choices which inspire the populous, make smart tactical decisions, and so on. So while they aren't fighting the most difficult fights, the path to success that they have to thread is an extremely narrow one.

Of course, it certainly helps their cause that Micaiah is a seer with magical precognition and can discern the exact path that they have to take. And if anyone wants to argue that this makes it so their fight wasn't a difficult one, then I certainly wouldn't say that you're wrong. But to me, it's more that it was a very difficult situation that Micaiah was uniquely well suited for. I guess my metric is: if you took all the other lords in teh series and put them in the same situation, how many of them would have succeeded? Which I think would be few if any of them, because they don't have Micaiah's prophetic abilities.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

2 hours ago, Jotari said:

And yet, I think, for the early game, Marth actually didn't have much trouble with it despite being hunted. Jeorge intentionally doesn't attack him and he has seemingly very little trouble putting down the revolts in Grust and Macedon. The only time things get dicey is on Soulful Bridge which was probably very difficult for him. Before and after, however, he's largely dealing with enemies who don't truly want to fight him. Especially in New Mystery where additional allies are joining him every give seconds. As for Anri's way, that's a logistical difficulty and not a military one.

Not a military one! How do you fight on an empty stomach? How do you sufficiently prepare a blend of infantry and cavalry to cross deserts, magma valleys, steep cliffs, and snowfields in the same campaign? Only one Human has made the trek, anyone still signed on to this army knows their personal chances must be slim. You think Anri's Way is unsettled because none of those countries got around to it? There's no shelter from towns along the way, just whatever they're carrying on their backs that they can quickly build. What's good to eat, seared dragon meat? Someone's going to raise their hand and ask 'Isn't this sacreligious?' 

[Acacia Sgt]

23 minutes ago, Zapp Branniglenn said:

Not a military one! How do you fight on an empty stomach? How do you sufficiently prepare a blend of infantry and cavalry to cross deserts, magma valleys, steep cliffs, and snowfields in the same campaign?

I'm pretty sure that's what he meant about the problem being logistics.

23 minutes ago, Zapp Branniglenn said:

What's good to eat, seared dragon meat? Someone's going to raise their hand and ask 'Isn't this sacreligious?' 

Now I got reminded that Dagon Fillet is a thing. Valentia, at least, isn't averse to dragon meat...

[SnowFire]

On Fates: Fates is not exactly a tightly-written setting, but...  for whatever reason, using the pocket dimension for shenanigans only really happens once, the initial time with Corrin plummeting and Lilith saving them.  Which weirdly enough, from what we later know, might not have even be fatal given that Gunter survived the same fall in one route (despite the whole fancy timing maybe not lining up perfectly that Revelation talks about?  who knows).  It doesn't really happen again, even in situations where it really should (e.g. Corrin getting inexplicably stranded and Lilith dying to a random Faceless in CQ).  This makes me inclined to say that it can't be used that way, and the part where Corrin was saved was just loose writing to spice things up with drama.  (The alternative is that Corrin is even more of an idiot, which I don't think is intended.)  It's kinda like how in The Last Jedi, a ship goes to Lightspeed as an attack on a fleet - despite the fact that if this "worked" it should have been being done all the time before, so sometimes you just shrug and say "bad writers, but since everything everywhere else ignores this, either that didn't happen or there was some unique circumstance that allowed it to work".

On 3H, re @Zapp Branniglenn: I don't think one battle a month qualifies as leisurely!  Some very intense, hellish campaigns in history have taken place over the 6-8 month period the War Phase of 3H goes through with around a battle a month.  In theory, the player might be doing Paralogues & Skirmish maps, and it sounds like you're taking as canonical that Our Heroes really do head back to Garreg Mach each time which would reduce time even further.  I wouldn't call the Sauna exactly some height of luxury, either - reminder goes here that traditional Japanese inns are built around some sort of sauna / springs, so the cultural connotations are less fancy.  If you said that the GBA FE crews stopped at some random inexplicably Japanese inns along the way in some cross-cultural blend, I wouldn't really consider that as making life any different on th em.

On Awakening, re @Jotari: I feel that saying "Sure, they lost, but it was just because of the betrayal" is like saying after an American football game "Sure, we lost, but it was only because of the turnover."  Well...  maybe...  but it's not like those fumbles / interceptions / trick plays don't "count".  This is especially true when both Robin and Evil Robin are portrayed as a sneaky tactician, someone who'd plan their backstabs carefully - if it wasn't one thing, it'd be something else.  And we do know of at least one other event in the "bad" timeline that went poorly for our heroes - the assassination attempt on Chrom (that "Marth" interrupts in our timeline), although apparently it didn't actually kill Chrom, but was bad enough for Lucina to consider it worthwhile to intervene at.  Even if taken strictly for "our" timeline, it seems that there are various loss condition landmines laying around in the setup of Awakening that Our Heroes cannily avoid. 

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

Hardest: Radiant Dawn. You start out as orphans, and you end up killing God(dess).

Easiest: FE7. There isn't an actual war happening, and while Nergal is powerful, he's not the sanest of foes. Plus, you get aid from a Living Legend - oh, as well as Athos, one of the Eight Heroes of the Scouring. Dude probably dispatched dozens of "Final Boss Fire Dragons" on his own.

11 minutes ago, SnowFire said:

I feel that saying "Sure, they lost, but it was just because of the betrayal" is like saying after an American football game "Sure, we lost, but it was only because of the turnover." 

Wouldn't it be more comparable to a running back taking the ball, turning around, and scoring for the other team? This isn't any sort of "blunder", but a premeditated act of sabotage. Mind you, I don't know if this has any bearing whatsoever on how "hard" or "easy" their journey is.

[AnonymousSpeed]

2 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Wouldn't it be more comparable to a running back taking the ball, turning around, and scoring for the other team? This isn't any sort of "blunder", but a premeditated act of sabotage. Mind you, I don't know if this has any bearing whatsoever on how "hard" or "easy" their journey is.

That sounds like a better metaphor to me.

If your metric of difficulty is victory (which seemed to be the case in the original post, "Our Heroes canonically lose, and only get a second shot thanks to divine time travel shenanigans"), then a last-minute act of sabotage does indeed impact the difficult. That said, it can be a lot harder to lose against the Ravens than the win against the Browns.

Edited December 30, 2023 by AnonymousSpeed

[Zapp Branniglenn]

5 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

I'm pretty sure that's what he meant about the problem being logistics.

They're not mutually exclusive terms. I'm pointing out that what Marth and his entire company of 'Traitors' did was only done once before by a lone Anri. Getting an army of Gordins, Phinas, Bantus and horses across the same trek is hard for a litany of reasons. Not just "we have to slay a bunch of dragons along the way". We can sooner imagine what those marches are like in real life more than we can imagine how hard it is to slay a fictional dragon. That's why I think the context adds to discussions like this.

2 hours ago, SnowFire said:

On 3H, re @Zapp Branniglenn: I don't think one battle a month qualifies as leisurely!  Some very intense, hellish campaigns in history have taken place over the 6-8 month period the War Phase of 3H goes through with around a battle a month.  In theory, the player might be doing Paralogues & Skirmish maps, and it sounds like you're taking as canonical that Our Heroes really do head back to Garreg Mach each time which would reduce time even further.  I wouldn't call the Sauna exactly some height of luxury, either - reminder goes here that traditional Japanese inns are built around some sort of sauna / springs, so the cultural connotations are less fancy.  If you said that the GBA FE crews stopped at some random inexplicably Japanese inns along the way in some cross-cultural blend, I wouldn't really consider that as making life any different on th em.

I don't see a compelling reason why we should ignore what the game is telling us with its Calendar. If we leave for a mission, win, and come back to the monastery on the same day, I believe it. They always have 3-4 "empty" days before and after Mission Day where nothing gameplay or story-adjacent seems to be happening. Consider that the post-battle wind down period before class resumes. Doing three paralogues on a single Sunday sounds silly, but they're not typically billed as being on the same scale as main story missions (even if the enemy counts are comparable). Lorenz asks You and Your Class to join him on a task he was going to do alone and succeed spectacularly at.

And in any case, wars are not just the big castle sieges. There's the marching, assembling and disassembling camp, night watches, scouting, communicating with allied detachments. You don't stop being a soldier when the fighting stops. Three Houses' High School RPG framework implies to us our units don't have to do any of that. It's probably the Knights of Seiros stuck with all the custodial work.

[SnowFire]

On 3H, re Zapp: I feel a lot weighs on authorial "mood" here.  I guess you felt the school side was still a major part of the narrative, but while that's clearly true for White Clouds, I don't think it's accurate for the War Phase, where the school mechanics are basically vestigal and they didn't want to enforce an entire new mechanic.  I think the mood is very clearly a war-is-hell deal where you're supposed to be fearful for your chances (in fact, even when this doesn't make any sense - there's some parts in late Verdant Wind that imply that despite the fact we're conquering the Empire, we're still outnumbered and in big trouble, which is a little weird given how much we've won).

I also think that you can only take so much from the timing.  Did you play Trails of Cold Steel II?  Cold Steel I -> II does a similar-to-3H deal of the prestigious military high school to civil war pipeline.  Minor spoiler here, but for whatever dumb reason, the writers absolutely did not want the characters to age very much, or to have CS2 be its own new year, so the civil war part takes place over an extremely, extremely accelerated period.  Like, maybe a month or two, with the calendar showing that a week passes in-between acts.  You might think that this must mean Our Heroes are being run ragged and exhausted, but nothing can be farther from the truth - they're laying back and enjoying social activities and doing help a guy out sidequests (literally over the course of a MORNING!  Canonically!  It's like "oh yeah, be ready for the battle at noon, here's an airship to fly around for hours doing sidequests first").  Writers be like that sometimes.  So even if you think that a month is still too short, I think the mood that's being set should probably control here.

5 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Wouldn't it be more comparable to a running back taking the ball, turning around, and scoring for the other team? This isn't any sort of "blunder", but a premeditated act of sabotage. Mind you, I don't know if this has any bearing whatsoever on how "hard" or "easy" their journey is.

Not really?  The general point is that you can make any plan look unimpressive by saying "if you take away the most effective thing the other team did, then they aren't so tough."  Well, yeah, but that's not the situation.  More generally, this is still presented as a threat in loop 2; there's the whole "Submit to Grima" stuff, so Robin defecting and turning evil is still a possibility at least in iteration 2, before the Power of Friendship defeats it.  Which is corny, sure, but apparently it's also difficult, given what happened in Iteration 1.

[Acacia Sgt]

You know, I'd like to point out Robin didn't so much betrayed them as instead were outright possessed by Grima. Unless your use of betrayal that's already being implied at.

Edited December 30, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Jotari]

19 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

You know, I'd like to point out Robin didn't so much betrayed them as instead were outright possessed by Grima. Unless your use of betrayal that's already being implied at.

Actually it's probably a bit more complex than that. You see, the only reason Robin even has amnesia is because of Grima's failed attempt to mind meld. So in the original timeline Robin probably had some idea of who he/she was and their connection to Grima. Somehow despite not passing out Ina field they still managed to join Chrom, but it would have been as a rather different character. And from what the dialogue Grima uses, sounds like it was a more willing betrayal. There was, after all, no future incarnation to possess them in that timeline. Only a big mindless dragon body buried in the ground.

[Acacia Sgt]

3 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Actually it's probably a bit more complex than that. You see, the only reason Robin even has amnesia is because of Grima's failed attempt to mind meld. So in the original timeline Robin probably had some idea of who he/she was and their connection to Grima. Somehow despite not passing out Ina field they still managed to join Chrom, but it would have been as a rather different character. And from what the dialogue Grima uses, sounds like it was a more willing betrayal. There was, after all, no future incarnation to possess them in that timeline. Only a big mindless dragon body buried in the ground.

Yes, I know.

My guess is the "more willing" was more that they didn't put as much resistance, or it was weaker. Since their bonds with everyone non-Chrom was much lower. Precisely since they weren't amnesiac. So instead of just Frederick you had several others being suspicious and stuff. I doubt even the original Robin had any desire to fulfill their "destiny", else they would've long returned to Validar's side. Unless their mother kept mum about the whole thing.

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Yes, I know.

My guess is the "more willing" was more that they didn't put as much resistance, or it was weaker. Since their bonds with everyone non-Chrom was much lower. Precisely since they weren't amnesiac. So instead of just Frederick you had several others being suspicious and stuff. I doubt even the original Robin had any desire to fulfill their "destiny", else they would've long returned to Validar's side. Unless their mother kept mum about the whole thing.

Well one way or the other the original Robin would have been a very different kind of person to the one we know due to not only the amnesia, but how that branched out from a different starting point (I recall, though I don't know if its fan speculation or in the game, that the war against Gangrel lasted longer in the original timeline due to Chrom's injury during the assassination). Any real conclusion on their personality would be pretty speculative as the only definitive thing we can say is that they did fall for Grima's influence.