FE9 Tier list v3

[Interceptor]

I'm not seeing how Mist accumulates a large level lead, if it all, before Tormod joins, with SEXP. If Mist reaches level 7 by C15 without BEXP that means that Mist and Tormod will be consuming the same amount.

Why does she need a level lead? Mist has the advantage of being able to wait until Ch18 to promote, since she doesn't get any useful benefit from BEXP in tier 1. Mist can either lean heavily on CEXP all the way up until the end of Ch17, and then promote to 20/1 with BEXP in Ch18's base, or super-plow BEXP in Ch16's base and spend some time as a capable fighter instead. Or something in between.

Tormod is racing the clock. The more time he spends in tier 1, the further that he is pushing out C Staff rank in tier 2.

What does Mist do after promotion that Tormod doesn't? 1 Mov, but Tormod ignores terrain which is really crucial on some chapters (C25). Tormod has better offense against a number of enemies. It's pretty much just supports, and Mist's aren't always going to be in range (and Tormod's aren't all bad either).

What, are you pushing for Tormod > Mist? That's a riot, what with Mist's availability lead, and clear superiority in supports.

[Dark Sage]

Yes, supports she can't even reach pre promotion. This is why you want to get her up to par early, so she can reap the benefits. Also, why is Mist exempt from getting snow plows of BEXP, but Tormod and Rhys somehow aren't? And she does need the BEXP or else she'll, you know, die.

[Shadow Mir]

But she can't even get near her supports pre-promotion because they're all high move.

Anyway, the point is to even be a viable staff user, she needs BEXP. For the staves, you forget Rhys exists, so he can take away some of Mist's uses. Basically, it's more efficent to use a healer who heals a decent amount and can use Physic faster than a level one cleric who can heal only slightly more than initially. That's not to mention that Rhys for the most part will be ahead of Mist in level, so he'll promote faster.

Also if her weapons are filled with like 10 use weapons and such, she's gonna run out really quickly and then she'll be defenseless. Not to mention, like I said, not all forges are swords.

Rhys may promote faster, but he has much less to offer than Mist does. And I WILL laugh at you if you even think of mentioning a forge for him. Oh, and Rhys has bupkis for supports, pretty much.

She's a supporting combatant, NOT a primary one.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Interceptor]

But she can't even get near her supports pre-promotion because they're all high move.

If you're not going to use Mist as a part-time fighter, she can promote whenever she hits level 10.

Anyway, the point is to even be a viable staff user, she needs BEXP. For the staves, you forget Rhys exists, so he can take away some of Mist's uses. Basically, it's more efficent to use a healer who heals a decent amount and can use Physic faster than a level one cleric who can heal only slightly more than initially. That's not to mention that Rhys for the most part will be ahead of Mist in level, so he'll promote faster.

Nobody in their right mind is promoting Rhys except in his most efficient comparison, just like the most effective way to use Mist involves giving her favored access to heals over Rhys. They are basically mutually exclusive in the long run, so it's no problem.

Also if her weapons are filled with like 10 use weapons and such, she's gonna run out really quickly and then she'll be defenseless. Not to mention, like I said, not all forges are swords.

What part of "Mist is not a primary fighter" do you not understand?

[Dark Sage]

Nobody in their right mind is promoting Rhys except in his most efficient comparison, just like the most effective way to use Mist involves giving her favored access to heals over Rhys. They are basically mutually exclusive in the long run, so it's no problem.

See I was under the impression excessive favoritism was bad. Silly me for thinking so.

Anyway Rhys unlike Mist doesn't need to be promoted to be more useful. He has nice staff rank that accumulates quickly, so he'll physic a lot more than Mist and a lot earlier. He's also a bit of a naturalist, since he's not so dependent on external resources and supports the way Mist is.

Mutually exclusive? They perform the same duty! They need the same staves. Like I said, why should I use Mist when I have a completely superior healer right off the bat and one who doesn't need a shit ton of resources to get good. If Mist can be promoted by Chapter 19, I don't see why Rhys can't considering how he's at a higher level and has better availability.

What part of "Mist is not a primary fighter" do you not understand?

The part where you keep hyping how awesome she is in combat. Also, if she's going to be supporting, she needs to be in the front lines, so she'll likely be attacked, and thus, the forges get completely drained.

[-Cynthia-]

Why does she need a level lead? Mist has the advantage of being able to wait until Ch18 to promote, since she doesn't get any useful benefit from BEXP in tier 1. Mist can either lean heavily on CEXP all the way up until the end of Ch17, and then promote to 20/1 with BEXP in Ch18's base, or super-plow BEXP in Ch16's base and spend some time as a capable fighter instead. Or something in between.

Tormod is racing the clock. The more time he spends in tier 1, the further that he is pushing out C Staff rank in tier 2.

They're going to use the same amount of BEXP to get to 20/1. Tormod might want it sooner I guess, but who cares? We just got a ton of BEXP from C15 anyway.

Why is getting to C rank so urgent? I thought the entire point of this Mist>other healers was that she could use non-Physic staves to heal due to Mov.

What, are you pushing for Tormod > Mist? That's a riot, what with Mist's availability lead, and clear superiority in supports.

No, but a tier's worth of difference for pre-promotion healing and supports? (who are not getting bonuses from Mist all the time)

Edited July 21, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[Shadow Mir]

See I was under the impression excessive favoritism was bad. Silly me for thinking so.

Anyway Rhys unlike Mist doesn't need to be promoted to be more useful. He has nice staff rank that accumulates quickly, so he'll physic a lot more than Mist and a lot earlier. He's also a bit of a naturalist, since he's not so dependent on external resources and supports the way Mist is.

Mutually exclusive? They perform the same duty! They need the same staves. Like I said, why should I use Mist when I have a completely superior healer right off the bat and one who doesn't need a shit ton of resources to get good. If Mist can be promoted by Chapter 19, I don't see why Rhys can't considering how he's at a higher level and has better availability.

The part where you keep hyping how awesome she is in combat. Also, if she's going to be supporting, she needs to be in the front lines, so she'll likely be attacked, and thus, the forges get completely drained.

Rhys's staff rank advantage is irrelevant early on. I couldn't care less about Rhys's being able to use Physic earlier since you don't get a Physic early. In other words, Rhys's staff rank advantage is pretty much just for show.

Rhys may require less resources, but he also has a lower payout. As for them being mutually exclusive, you're either using one or the other. And even if Rhys is promoted by then, what does it change? The fact that his durability is rock-bottom? Not a chance. Rhys also is practically dependent on Physic staves, and I don't care about Rhys's extra Physic range if he's having a hard time even leveraging it without having to have the unit that you wish to heal pull back just so Rhys can heal them.

EDIT: Enter Narga... Carpet-bombing imminent.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Dark Sage]

20/1 Mist: 17.5 Magic

20/1 Rhys: 21.8 Magic (most likely 22 magic)

4 points difference. Mist has eight move right? In that case, their about equal in range. If it's 9 move, then Mist is only superior by a range of one, though admitedly, it does build up as she moves. Nevertheless, it's not like her range is that much better, and he can heal more anyway. Plus he gets to use status staves earlier.

As for efficency, he helps in the early chapters and consistently outperforms Mist throughout her entire Tier 1 existence. If it was potential that decided everything, Nino would be higher than Erk, which is bullshit.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Dark Sage

[Shadow Mir]

20/1 Mist: 17.5 Magic

20/1 Rhys: 21.8 Magic (most likely 22 magic)

4 points difference. Mist has eight move right? In that case, their about equal in range. If it's 9 move, then Mist is only superior by a range of one, though admitedly, it does build up as she moves. Nevertheless, it's not like her range is that much better, and he can heal more anyway. Plus he gets to use status staves earlier.

As for efficency, he helps in the early chapters and consistently outperforms Mist throughout her entire Tier 1 existence. If it was potential that decided everything, Nino would be higher than Erk, which is bullshit.

And that proves what exactly? Status staves aren't all that common, so that point is worth bupkis. You don't start seeing status staves until what, chapter 20? If Mist doesn't have at least B rank by then, you're doing it wrong.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[-Cynthia-]

Healing for 14 a pop is a little shabby, but this only lasts for about 2-3 chapters. Once Mist gets Mend there's not much difference beween her and Rhys until she promotes.

Maybe Tormod up instead of Mist down?

[Dark Sage]

It disproves somewhat 'zomg mist has teh better range with staves because purely of move and higher magicz mean nothingz lololololol.'

So far, you've proved nothing and only called my arguments bupkis. Point is, Rhys can also use the status staves to much better effect. He's like a siege tome user in that regard.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Dark Sage

[Shadow Mir]

It disproves somewhat 'zomg mist has teh better range with staves because purely of move and higher magicz mean nothingz lololololol.'

So far, you've proved nothing and only called my arguments bupkis. Point is, Rhys can also use the status staves to much better effect. He's like a siege tome user in that regard.

Rhys may be able to use the status staves to better effect, but... really? Is that all...? Silence isn't all that useful (after all, the targets it's meant to be used on are the ones it's liable to NOT work on), and Sleep isn't much use when my units are bulldozing whatever gets in their path (and it doesn't help that enemies that are actually threatening that I'd want put to sleep are few and far between).

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Dark Sage]

Nosferatau is great. He targets resistance if he does attack which is nice. He has phenomenal range and heals for a vast amount with Physic. His support list isn't bad at all with the likes of Titania, Mia and Kieran. That's pretty good, although yeah, he does have a hard time keeping up consistently like Mist at Tier 1.

He's also along longer and is more useful during his existance. Being the only healer early on does wonders for his efficency.

Point is, Rhys doesn't need much to become good. He just needs a bit of BEXP and some CEXP to be useful long term. His payoff is a great healer with some nice chipping and support abilities. Purge and Status staves are always useful. Plus early game healer. Mist on the other hand not only needs lots of BEXP, but she also needs to steal heals from Rhys, she needs many Arms scrolls, and she needs her support list to stay back a lot just so she can reap the benefits. Her output is nice in the end, but the effort outweighs the reward in this case, so point goes to Rhys.

[Shadow Mir]

Nosferatau is great. He targets resistance if he does attack which is nice. He has phenomenal range and heals for a vast amount with Physic. His support list isn't bad at all with the likes of Titania, Mia and Kieran. That's pretty good, although yeah, he does have a hard time keeping up consistently like Mist at Tier 1.

He's also along longer and is more useful during his existance. Being the only healer early on does wonders for his efficency.

Point is, Rhys doesn't need much to become good. He just needs a bit of BEXP and some CEXP to be useful long term. His payoff is a great healer with some nice chipping and support abilities. Purge and Status staves are always useful. Plus early game healer. Mist on the other hand not only needs lots of BEXP, but she also needs to steal heals from Rhys, she needs many Arms scrolls, and she needs her support list to stay back a lot just so she can reap the benefits. Her output is nice in the end, but the effort outweighs the reward in this case, so point goes to Rhys.

"Nosferatu" and "great" don't belong in the same sentence. Also, Rhys gets stuck with pretty much the worst weapon type with the exception of knives, which is not a good thing. And that's ignoring the fact that Rhys has only 6 move, meaning that he isn't seeing much, if any, combat. Not helping is the fact that Rhys's Strength is virtually nonexistent, which, when combined with the fact that Rhys is pretty slow, is a recipe for disaster. Also, while Rhys's support list may not be all that bad, who on it honestly cares to support him??? I can only think of one person.

Purge doesn't come until very late, and the point about status staves isn't worth mentioning on account of already having been countered.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Dark Sage]

Berserk staff?

Also even if he is stuck with shitty weapons, he targets resistance plus he has great magic growth. I know he doesn't see much combat, but it's still a point in his favor.

How about early game efficency? He's much more efficent than Mist. He gets Physic faster and has better range. Mia and Kieran could concievably want him.

[-Cynthia-]

Kieran tends to be out of range a lot, and gets better/same bonuses from Marcia/Oscar. Mia is a good partner though, at least from her end.

By the time Physics show up Mist will probably be able to use them.

Edited July 21, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[Shadow Mir]

Berserk staff?

Also even if he is stuck with shitty weapons, he targets resistance plus he has great magic growth. I know he doesn't see much combat, but it's still a point in his favor.

How about early game efficency? He's much more efficent than Mist. He gets Physic faster and has better range. Mia and Kieran could concievably want him.

Doesn't exist in PoR.

Doesn't make his combat not suck.

Mia could want him, yes. But I fail to see why Kieran would take Rhys over Marcia, who gives him the same bonuses, but doesn't force him to slow down. And I already said that Rhys's getting Physic faster is practically irrelevant, since by the time Physic staves start showing up, Mist will probably be able to use them.

EDIT: Ninja'd by Cynthia....

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Sol Hiryu]

Except that Rhys gains nothing out of supports. Titania and Kieran want other people and have too great a move advantage for Rhys to keep up. Mia is plausible, but because of Rhys' fragility, he's not likely to be up on the frontlines to give her support. He'd only probably get people like Rolf or Ulki, who have no one else better to get if they're in play, which is unlikely.

Nosferatu would be great, except, you know, it damn near pushes Rhys to negative AS. It is absolutely suicidal to even have Rhys attack something, unless he's finishing something off, because he will never, ever double--unless he's only using something like Light, which is laughable in itself. Unlike Mist, he does not have supports that will increase his durability, only one that will increase his attack...which is pointless, because he shouldn't be attacking seriously in the first place. He's barely decent as a supportive attacker, which, again, he's outdone by Mist.

Physic range is nice, but again, he's beat out by Mist. Move advantage + Physic + Canto is still a lot better than just better Physic range by itself. In fact, I'd go so far to say that Rhys is entirely reliant on Physic to keep up with healing; with everyone rushing ahead, it is very difficult for him to keep up with only 6 Move when he is promoted.

Rhys is only 'good' when both he and Mist are unpromoted and are your only healers for a while. Unfortunately for him, there's not much to get out of promoting him--all he gets is Light magic, and due to his horrible move and defensive stats, he's going to be shunted to your backlines for most of the maps in the game.

[Dark Sage]

Point is, if he can concievably be compared to Mist, there's something wrong here.

[-Cynthia-]

Well he's also pretty useful when Mist isn't around. Team durability is pretty low and he's the only healer around.

Best way to use Rhys offensively is a forged light , that way you can keep his AS to a level where he at least doubles some things while having decent Mt. Light tomes are stupidly expensive for some reason, but PoR tosses us wads of cash. He's not a great offensive unit, since he's forge reliant and is borderline on the doubling, not to mention bad durably, but it's sort of salvagable.

[Dark Sage]

And Mist still requires more resources anyway, so it's not like Rhys is so bad in that department with his forges.

[Shadow Mir]

Well he's also pretty useful when Mist isn't around. Team durability is pretty low and he's the only healer around.

Best way to use Rhys offensively is a forged light , that way you can keep his AS to a level where he at least doubles some things while having decent Mt. Light tomes are stupidly expensive for some reason, but PoR tosses us wads of cash. He's not a great offensive unit, since he's forge reliant and is borderline on the doubling, not to mention bad durably, but it's sort of salvagable.

A forged light tome is financial suicide (costing over 20K ftl). Why should I pay an arm and a leg just to have Rhys not suck offensively?

And Mist still requires more resources anyway, so it's not like Rhys is so bad in that department with his forges.

See above.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ein Lanford

[Narga_Rocks]

Tormod getting 14 heals in 3 chapters seems reasonable to me. A few chapters do take shorter than that I guess, so maybe 4, depending upon what chapters they are.

I'm still wondering where you got 14 from. Can you show me your (inept attempt at) math?

10 * 3 = 30 wexp.

Now he has D in 10 goes.

How in the hell are 4 staff uses getting him 40 wexp for a C? In order to get to a C for physic, he is going to need 10 + 14/8 (8 comes from the 5 wexp staves). Unfortunately, only torch and unlock (doesn't really exist) are actually +5, and Tormod doesn't get any FoW chapters and thus can't even use the damn thing. Hence, Tormod needs 24 staff uses to get to C. I believe I said this earlier. I hate getting ignored when I am correcting math, since that means that people still spout incorrect conclusions until they finally pay attention. Pay attention.

Also Mist has crappy move pre-promotion, so she finds it hard to heal because she needs to stay back to avoid dying, let alone not being able to reach the others.

Um, do you realize that you are bringing up two conflicting issues? You can't have both at once. If she can't be keep up to the 9 move units then they are plowing through and the nearby stuff is dead. At that point, she has no need of staying back to avoid dying because there is nothing there to kill her, duh. Conversely, if she needs to hang back because there are enemies, then your units are nearby dealing with them. Hence she has no problem being able to reach them.

Also, heal first, then attack. You have a bunch of canto-ing gods. A fair amount of the time, Mist can simply use 1 range staves and heal first. Your units kill everything and move on. And now Mist isn't in danger (everything nearby is dead) and she got her heal on.

Rhys may require less resources, but he also has a lower payout. As for them being mutually exclusive, you're either using one or the other. And even if Rhys is promoted by then, what does it change? The fact that his durability is rock-bottom? Not a chance. Rhys also is practically dependent on Physic staves, and I don't care about Rhys's extra Physic range if he's having a hard time even leveraging it without having to have the unit that you wish to heal pull back just so Rhys can heal them.

For clarification on the "mutually exclusive" bit, if you are trying to train both up to promotion at once you are going to fail at both of them:

http://www.special-dictionary.com/proverbs/keywords/chasing/

The hyena chasing two antelopes at the same time will go to bed hungry.

Malian Proverb

If you start chasing two hares, you will catch none.

Russian proverb

Learn from the Russians or go hungry.

You train one or the other. There is zero competition for staves among Rhys and Mist. The unit you are using gets the best stuff. The unit you aren't training seriously gets bupkis or whatever is left over. Mist has greater final results, too, by the way, and hence with little significant difference between them once Mist gets to D staves I question the wisdom of worrying about Rhys. Leaving him as a guy who uses Mend and hangs around Mia whenever he can is perfectly fine and takes no bexp and no good staves and is most likely his most efficient use. If there is no Mia then there is even less purpose to his existence.

EDIT: Enter Narga... Carpet-bombing imminent.

We'll see how well I do.

They're going to use the same amount of BEXP to get to 20/1. Tormod might want it sooner I guess, but who cares? We just got a ton of BEXP from C15 anyway.

Why is getting to C rank so urgent? I thought the entire point of this Mist>other healers was that she could use non-Physic staves to heal due to Mov.

No, the point is that she can use both. We get a few physics along the way, but not as many as previously assumed since you likely don't have time to set up all the physic grabs. Physics are still helpful and Mist should have one. Her advantage is that she can use those, but most of the time she can run up to the front and heal someone directly. Well, that and providing supports and the occasional player phase attack + canto to kill a weakened enemy or ORKO with SS a full hp enemy. And before you say "ranged tome" again, what a waste. Mist can take something out with a crappy iron sword (if it was weakened) and run forward to the front line and you think it is preferable to blow a precious 5 use tome on it? Why in God's name would you do that?

As for bexp, Mist can use less if you wait until chapter 18. Tormod will take even longer to get C (or B for Rescue) if you hold out for bexp savings. Moreover, he'll be a terrible combatant compared to all your promoted units if he's hanging at level 12 or 13 or something. Mist heals no worse than she would otherwise, really, so she isn't actually stinking up the place.

No, but a tier's worth of difference for pre-promotion healing and supports? (who are not getting bonuses from Mist all the time)

Why ever not? Mist can hang near the front pretty much everywhere but Largo's first chapter, right? Why wouldn't they (particularly Titania and Boyd)? Jill might have trouble in some chapters, though, whenever flying over stuff is cool. And canto-killing is better than Tormod's siege killing at least as often as access to sieges is actually useful. Tormod falls behind when he kills things without siege weapons. Mist doesn't. And she has physic in case your team needs to split up. She can physic, it will take Tormod a rather long time to get 24 staff uses.

See I was under the impression excessive favoritism was bad. Silly me for thinking so.

Why? Why were you under the impression that applying resources where they provide the biggest benefits could possibly be a bad thing? Is it best to not give anyone more than a tenth of your overall resources? Should we dump bexp on Rhys and Titania and Lethe early on simply because we don't want to give the other units more than their fair share of bexp?

Anyway Rhys unlike Mist doesn't need to be promoted to be more useful. He has nice staff rank that accumulates quickly, so he'll physic a lot more than Mist and a lot earlier. He's also a bit of a naturalist, since he's not so dependent on external resources and supports the way Mist is.

Um, Mist = Rhys after a few chapters without any added resources. Once she gets Mend, the differences are minor. By the time you get Physic, Mist can use it. 7 chapters for 24 uses gets a C. How is she not getting ~3 uses per chapter? And then she goes and promotes and saves physic uses while Rhys is dependent on them.

Mutually exclusive? They perform the same duty! They need the same staves. Like I said, why should I use Mist when I have a completely superior healer right off the bat and one who doesn't need a shit ton of resources to get good. If Mist can be promoted by Chapter 19, I don't see why Rhys can't considering how he's at a higher level and has better availability.

Why should you use Mist? Because Rhys will never ever be good. At least, not anywhere near as Mist is if you put your finger on the button a little. Why would you prefer him when Mist does almost the same job for a while and then by chapter 18 blows him out of the water (even if you made a different game and applied all those resources on Rhys instead). She has a little blip for her first 10 heals since she can't use Mend and then there is no problem.

The part where you keep hyping how awesome she is in combat. Also, if she's going to be supporting, she needs to be in the front lines, so she'll likely be attacked, and thus, the forges get completely drained.

"awesome"? Did you see him saying that? I noticed you didn't pull a quote. You know why you didn't? Because he never said it. Also, 3 back from the front lines rather limits the number of attacks. She'll get attacked sometimes, but not nearly enough to cause problems. It's not that she's awesome in combat. Used sparingly, the SS makes her awesome, yes. Aside from that? She is passable, which is really all you need from a primary healer sometimes combatant type of unit. The point is that she isn't terrible at combat and thus being near enough to the front lines to apply her supports is efficient rather than inefficient. Nobody ever said she was awesome. In fact, if I felt up to it I could probably find a post or two of Int's where he says very similar things to what I just said. When you read his posts, are you merely seeking out things to jump on or are you reading with an open mind? I strongly suspect the former.

It disproves somewhat 'zomg mist has teh better range with staves because purely of move and higher magicz mean nothingz lololololol.'

How slowly do you progress across maps? 8 move with 8 range compared to 6 move with 10 range is an easy win for Mist. Know why? One turn later she has 24 range and he has 22. Then 32 and 28. Now, she won't always take full move, but it only takes one turn and she's now outdistancing him. This point was also made like 4 pages ago. Did you jump into the conversation without reading up? I mean, I'm not asking you to go back a month here. It's like a day. Come. On.

So far, you've proved nothing and only called my arguments bupkis. Point is, Rhys can also use the status staves to much better effect. He's like a siege tome user in that regard.

Right. Let's waste a sleep use on something that Oscar/Jill/Kieran/Titania/Mist are about to ORKO. Good job. Have any other neat ideas?

and no, Kieran does not want Rhys. Why the hell would he want a support for turn 1 and 2 that he doesn't get afterwards. And if you think Mist has trouble surviving on the front lines, check out Rhys. The best he can do is pull out Nosferatu and get doubled. It will actually raise his survivability a little, given how as long as he is 3HKOd it turns 3 rounds into 4 or 5. Do the math if you don't believe. As long as he can pull more damage than the enemy, it has the potential to extend his life as long as he starts 3HKOd (against some but not all enemies, this is true). However, he's also not doing as much as Mist with the SS. And there still hasn't been a good argument to not at least use hammerne on it once. 49 uses of SS is awesome. And then she pulls out the Runesword for two turns of godliness. Okay, it's not a lot of godliness, but that's more than Rhys ever gets.

Also, how is he "much more efficient". Exp into Rhys is like a black hole. You get no return. The point is only to keep units healed, and after 10 heals Mist does Good Enough. Until then? Nobody is asking you to drop Rhys. In that time, if you really really need more hp healed, use Rhys. I think Rhys' early game healing and 10 heals once Mist appears does not outweigh 8 move, epic supports, ORKOing nearly anything with SS in an emergency or general use (sparingly), ability to kill + canto so as not to fall behind. I don't see how Rhys can even compete. A tier gap is justified.

Also, the tier list does not allow codes, and therefore berserk staff isn't relevant.

Oh. My. God. Are you honestly supporting the idea of Rhys with a forge? Have you even checked to see how expensive even +4 mt is? If you are suggesting maybe +1 mt and -whatever wt needed to reach 1, then fine. I can live with a forge like that, I suppose. Though that should obviously mean that if you are willing to waste a chapter's forge on him, you shouldn't have any reasonable issues with doing the same for Mist (and monetarily you can afford a much better forge for her). At least a +3 mt forge can be made with a wt reduction to allow her to use it without AS loss. But you know Mist's biggest advantage for forges? She can get hand-me-downs. There are no other units that use Light forges, so you are making a forge uniquely for a terrible combatant (lucky to double anything) and can't even make them particularly strong.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Narga_Rocks

[Dark Sage]

I guess I did get carried away there.

It was Cynthia who suggested the light forge anyway. I don't really support it, but meh.

Anyway, the point was that Mist takes up too many resources. She needs Arms Scrolls, lots of BEXP, dependent on supports. Eventually the Sonic sword is going to run out, and then she's going to get beaten badly. Offense outside of forges is terrible, defense isn't particularly good even with supports and getting her to the point to compete with Rhys? Lots of BEXP dumping.

Rhys has phenomenal early game. Mist's early game is crap. Look at all that BEXP I have to feed her. That's expensive. And it just makes her comparable to Rhys. Basically, you're doing all that just to make her a Rhys clone at Tier 1. Whoop de doo. Then at tier 2, she's overdependent on forges and SS. SS is strong and nice, but it's not going to last forever, and they're rare.

I guess I shouldn't be doing this. It's been awhile since I've played FE9, so really, I should probably bail now.

[Sol Hiryu]

Dependent on supports? Seriously? When everyone on her support list wants her for her support anyway?