I Can't Believe It's Still Not SFMM2 Minimafia - Randomlynch Wins

[Blitz]

well, that sounds like a very bad idea cause half of you won't believe me, the other half will just want me lynch even more

[Helios]

When did I not care that there were votes on me? I didn't realize I had any votes on me until all of a sudden I was at L-1, to which I responded "wtf I'm at L-1?" and gave out opinions and all that.

[Paperblade]

well, that sounds like a very bad idea cause half of you won't believe me, the other half will just want me lynch even more

You always are supposed to claim when you are about to be lynched

[Blitz]

well, it just seemed to me that way

[Paperblade]

I'm just saiyan

[Ether]

##Unvote: Cap'n Flint

##Vote: Manix

Early hammering is bad, and you still need to talk for the same reason Flint did. As for not liking my post, not much I can do 'bout it I guess. Not many other leads as of this moment, and I already had the vote on you.

[Paperblade]

hi Ether

[Ether]

hi Brad.

[eclipse]

now kiss

[Ether]

Well if you insist~ C'mere Brad~

[Paperblade]

k babe

[Paperblade]

but yes I would like thoughts from Ether considering he was the first to vote Blitz

[Ether]

Pretty simple, really. Flint put Helios at L-1 and it was way too early for it IMO. So I voted Flint for some pressure. When Flint for to L-1, I switched to Manix to put them both at L-2 since his vote on Helios was also fishy.

I'm interested to see where people go between the two, personally. And I'd like to hear more from both.

[Grace]

Okay, I'm here.

And yes, I can see why you people aren't happy with me. It's perfectly reasonable.

And be damned if you think I'm going to hammer Blitzy. No. Way. Am. I. Doing. That.

But really, I don't have much to say right now. I need to fish through the thread to see what I can pick out.

Also, leave questions after the beep.

*beep*

[eclipse]

First, what are your thoughts on everyone else?

Second, who would you like to see lynched today?

Third, what do you think of Paperblade's points?

[Grace]

Right, a reason to begin my notes page. Lovely.

1)

Player thoughts:

Manix: hai town

Eclipse: Neutral

Paperblade: leaning scum

Ether: Neutral

Aere: Neutral

Blitzy: leaning scum

Helios: Neutral

Rapier: Neutral

Shinori: Neutral

Basically, I'm not really getting much in the way of reads right now. Having more information would help.

2)I'd like to see Paper or Blitzy lynched, but we can't afford to hammer too early, so I'm not going onto Blitzy yet.

3) I'm assuming you mean this:

lynching lurkers/inactives tends to be a dumb idea

Okay, let me address this now. You sound like you're trying to avoid getting the inactives lynched. This could be for one of two reasons:

1) You know that the inactives are lurkscum scumbuddies

2) You don't want to mislynch town PR's.

The problem here is, what good is an inactive town PR? Tip: It isn't. And that way, you still manage to get some information, even though it isn't under optimal circumstances.

Hi Blitz

I'm not sure what to think of the random votes on people without votes early. I feel like votes should be placed on someone to pressure them into talking and I feel like random 1-of votes don't do much for that

but then again

RVS

But if those random 1-votes pile up, eventually you get to a wagon point, where the pressure is then present. Which then in turn leads the person to have to defend themselves. Hence, reactions can be analysed. I think you're being a bit simplistic in this situation. Ignoring the other possibilities.

##Unvote, ##Vote: Manix

I really really really dislike your last post.

Why? Because I made an honest mistake? Geez, some people are hard to please. I will note again: I have done this before, also by mistake.

##Vote: Paperblade

For logistic reasons above. My reasoning for this vote is mostly for his logic wrt to inactives.

[eclipse]

There's, like, seven pages of people talking. You can do better than that. Blitz's vote hopping wasn't helpful because his logic was "you're here, say something, kthx, moving on". This isn't meaningful pressure. However, this isn't quite enough to drive a lynch, IMO. I somewhat agree on your points about Paperblade, but I think your lack of player opinion's worse ATM.

Until you can do better than two-thirds of the game being neutral, my vote stays.

[Prims]

Votal Time !!

Blitz (3) - Helios, Rapier, Aere

Manix (3) - eclipse, Paperblade, Ether

Ether (1) - Blitz

Paperblade (1) - Manix

Rapier (1) - Shinori

Not Voting: Nobody!

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. You have about 20.5 hours left in the day.

Edited May 16, 2012 by Prims

[Grace]

There's, like, seven pages of people talking. You can do better than that.

Aside from... oh I don't know, the fact that there really hasn't been much actual content to talk about. We have the RVS, fine, but I cannot derive anything out of it. Mostly because people don't seem too phased by the RVS, and even if they reached L-1. Maybe because people know that the votes are not likely to stay? I don't know.

[eclipse]

And this is what I mean by "you can do better than that":

Aere - Has been doing a wonderful job of doing his best not to participate. He intentionally put Blitz at L-1, but I see this as "I'm voting for who I think is scummiest", and not necessarily a scum move. However, he was very guilty of doing the same in my mafia, and I get the feeling he didn't read my postgame thoughts on him. I'll give him one last chance to say something, but if it's not meaningful, I'm not opposed to lynching him.

Blitz - This is RVS gone horribly wrong. The point of RVS is to get inactive people to talk, not whoever's on at the same time. With the wagon that formed on him, I'm slightly inclined to think that either he's town or his team hates him.

me - Hi. I'm town.

Ether - This is a bit more active than I normally remember him. He's been willing to explain his votes, so this puts him just on the town side of things.

Helios - With the speed the early wagon formed on him, I suspect he's town, BUT he's not doing as good of a job defending himself as he did in my mafia. I wish he'd stop going off on School Rumble, though.

Manix - Two-thirds of this game isn't neutral. Try harder; I know you're better than that. That vote on Blitz didn't look that great, and given how you've tried to justify yourself, I'm not overly inclined to move my vote (yet).

Rapier - I'm glad he's been taking some of the stuff I said to heart, but I didn't like his Helios vote, since Helios was actually in the topic doing stuff. He needs to be a bit more active.

Paperblade - Comes in, does very little, whines about inactives, leaves. I didn't care for him pushing Blitz to claim, either. This isn't winning him points, and he's another person who I'm not completely averse to lynching. The only reason why I don't want him lynched at this very moment is because he's been putting some reasoning behind his votes, which is better than a lot of others can say.

Shinori - Doesn't want inactive players lynched, and is inactive himself. HMMMM!

[Grace]

(Quick protip: I never voted Blitz. Maybe you were thinking of Helios?)

Hmm, okay then.

I need more time to think about this.

[Paperblade]

Okay, let me address this now. You sound like you're trying to avoid getting the inactives lynched. This could be for one of two reasons:

1) You know that the inactives are lurkscum scumbuddies

2) You don't want to mislynch town PR's.

The problem here is, what good is an inactive town PR? Tip: It isn't. And that way, you still manage to get some information, even though it isn't under optimal circumstances.

Or the hidden third option: Lynching inactives means that we are killing people who don't have opinions or interactions about or with anything, which gives us nothing to go with on later days.

There is no correlation between inactivity and being mafia/town. If you would like to go look at a significant data size of mafia games to prove me wrong, good luck. I'm sure that every example of an idler being mafia will be matched by me finding an idler that was town, probably from the same game. In fact, considering the number of town and scum aren't equal, I'll say I can find *two* for each one you find.

Also inactives get subbed so whining that they aren't contributing and never will so we should lynch them is dumb. If they're never going to do anything you are effectively no lynching (which is a bad idea for town except at mylo) to remove the chance that they come back and do something useful (also a bad idea if you're town). So you trying to dismiss 2 is also dumb. In fact, Prims has strict guidelines on how it works.

But if those random 1-votes pile up, eventually you get to a wagon point, where the pressure is then present. Which then in turn leads the person to have to defend themselves. Hence, reactions can be analysed. I think you're being a bit simplistic in this situation. Ignoring the other possibilities.

Blitz was changing votes so fast that no one had a chance to actually pressure anyone. It was an empty gesture.

Why? Because I made an honest mistake? Geez, some people are hard to please. I will note again: I have done this before, also by mistake.

I was referring to this

And now to actually figure out a good vote.

You could have voted anyone for any reason because it was still RVS. Why do you need a good vote? If you placed one down on someone who had 0-1 votes and they somehow got pushed to lynch and were town while you were gone no one would realistically blame you. What are you afraid of?

##Vote: Paperblade

For logistic reasons above. My reasoning for this vote is mostly for his logic wrt to inactives.

roffle

[eclipse]

(Quick protip: I never voted Blitz. Maybe you were thinking of Helios?)

Hmm, okay then.

I need more time to think about this.

Yeah, sorry 'bout that.

[Grace]

Or the hidden third option: Lynching inactives means that we are killing people who don't have opinions or interactions about or with anything, which gives us nothing to go with on later days.

Cool story, remind exactly how many people are inactive right now? One at most, if that (Rapier). And hey, guess what? Everyone seems to have some sort of interaction with at least one other person, iirc. Look, information! (Which I will need to review, myself)

There is no correlation between inactivity and being mafia/town.

hai lurkscum. See: Me in SG mafia. It's just the fact that lurkers generally give the impression of lurkscum to me. Lurking townies are just plain unproductive (like me right now, I'll admit), also not assuming that irl isn't interfering. Townies should talk if they can (again, I'm not the best example).

Blitz was changing votes so fast that no one had a chance to actually pressure anyone. It was an empty gesture.

Hmm, I guess so. :/

I was referring to this

You could have voted anyone for any reason because it was still RVS. Why do you need a good vote? If you placed one down on someone who had 0-1 votes and they somehow got pushed to lynch and were town while you were gone no one would realistically blame you. What are you afraid of?

Aha what? You answered your own question. By me saying a "good vote", I did mean still within the RVS situation. Although, admittedly, I probably should have made sure on the votals before putting Helios at L-1. It was just silly of me.

Currently, I'm not afraid of anything. You can tell by my lack of reads. Yeah, I'm so lame.

[Paperblade]

Did you forget Aere OR ARE YOU COVERING FOR YOUR INACTIVE SCUMBUDDY OMG

and Shinori kind of isn't doing anything either

hai lurkscum. See: Me in SG mafia. It's just the fact that lurkers generally give the impression of lurkscum to me. Lurking townies are just plain unproductive (like me right now, I'll admit), also not assuming that irl isn't interfering. Townies should talk if they can (again, I'm not the best example).

See: You in Golden Sun Mafia and Necktie in Haphazard

All day

Also I didn't like it because there was nothing to go off for a good vote. It was RVS, why do you care about what people think of your votes? If you're town you know you're town fuck everyone else (okay try to not be a psychopath like Kevin or Sho but "making a random vote" doesn't put you in the same boat as them).