charlie_ Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 lol I pretty much gave up anyway, shrug. apparently there was a way I could've won but I didn't see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Oh, well, that's that, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 I think SB could've won if he convinced the town that Prims or Manix was Godfather but so many people were convinced it was him or scorri that it just didn't seem likely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Nice. Had fun playing despite my shoddy D1; thanks for the game, Tables! Did the Mafia and Masons have a quicktopic or was it all in PM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 It was all PM for us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riariadne Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 It was all in PM I played pretty badly when I existed at all, so w/e. gg town Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 So yeah, town overlooked the possibility of Kay being an investigation immune Serial Killer, which if people had realised would fit, could have lead to different lynches etc. etc. and basically, it wasn't town autowin, although it was extremely unlikely that SB could pull it off. Asides from that, I think I'll quote Chaosmaster from before the game began. This came right after setup: CM:also... town is [probably] gonna win Tables: You think? Mafia weak player wise or...? CM: not necessarily weak, but the town has Prims (Witch), Paperblade and Blitz (Flint) who are all strong in those roles as long as they put in the effort. I don't know how good Strege is though Town had a lot of the (established) better players, and they got either reasonably lucky with their reads, or mafia gave themselves away too easily (take your pick of which you prefer). Powerroles wise, this exact setup could swing either way - I think it was probably a little town sided, but not by much. Cop with no proper doctor could get reads, Vig could should but Vig is always a little unpredictable, while mafia had a roleblocker (killed N1 was a big blow mind) and stalker to find possible RB targets, and Godfather provided cop protection. I think that's all I have to say postgame wise. Witch and a few other town players played a very good game, got a D1 mafia lynch, and followed it through to victory. Mafia were less organised, and lost a key role D1. Some people have already provided some feedback on changes I could make to the setup, which is great. I do agree that it likely leans slightly towards town overall - I should probably look at upping the scumcount? Of course, like any partially random setup, you get some good and some less good games, but overall I think I could tweak this and have it work again. That's all I really want to say postgame wise. Have a link to the game sheet, I guess. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApPT0N9WtHcKdEY0enR3YXhLYmd2YTc5MVUwcmwxZVE#gid=0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Also, my remaining two abilities were jailkeeper and bomb. I never ended up using them because at no point in the game did I feel I would die over someone else, and I didn't use the jailkeep because ... well, I didn't want to screw with a power role by accident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinori Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 SHEEP THE PRIMS CAUSE IM BAD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 I personally wouldn't up the amount of mafia, that just leads to the game being more swingy. Reducing the possibilities for more town-sided set-ups tends to be better imo. The set-up probably seems a little more town-sided from this game than it actually is, though, since we lynched the roleblocker D1 and then proceeded to roll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Game was pretty much over after N2's actions tbh. I mean, there were possibilities of SB not being scum, but they just werent likely. Manix and Prims both looked a lot townier than SB. Even if a cop scan had scanned SB as town, once it came down to lynching cop clears, SB would go before Prims and Manix for sure. And if you discounted roles and everything, SB was the scummiest, so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 I considered claiming D1 when SSG+Strege claimed since Mason tends to be a good jail target but didn't fsr Guess I should have, but oh well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 Role letters rolled were: I: 2 P: 1 K: 2 M: 2 R: 1 J: 3 B: 0 T: 0 No T's meant the mafia had their strongest possible team, but also the town had their strongest possible team. Well, the most roles, at least. II rolled Cop (could have been tracker), PR rolled Jailkeeper (could have been O Doc and O Roleblocker). JJJ meant there was a Jack of all Trades and an Inventor. Jack had a cop, a jailkeep and a bomb. Inventor had a Jailkeep (protect) and a Roleblock (hinder). Potentially N1 could have had three people jailed and a fourth roleblocked, but it didn't happen. All the other town roles were townies - which meant despite rolling no T's, there were still quite a lot of townies as almost all of the other letters fell together. I haven't done the full calculation but I estimate 5 townies is average, this game had 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 I actually didn't feel better about Prims until late D2 or early D3, honestly, and I didn't completely discount that he might have been the godfather. Manix was super obv!town in D2 and SB was really bothering me. I would've lynched SB anyway before Manix or Prims. Also, Blitz was clear because mason. I wasn't going to worry about Kay being possible serial killer unless the game went on after all the scum had died. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 tbh Strongman is probably stronger than Godfather, so I dunno about strongest team. Godfather is neat but without Strongman doc+watcher would wreck scum if it happened somehow. I'd maybe change the "strongest team" to have a 1-shot variant of the Strongman instead of a goon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie_ Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Mafia:Strege - Roleblocker Rapier - Rolecop SB - Godfather Rein - Vanilla Mafia night actions:N1: Send SB to kill Paperblade Rapier rolecops Boron N2: Send Rein to kill SSG (failed) Rapier rolecops Blitz N3: Send SB to kill SSG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 My apologies for subbing out like that. I'm still waiting for a relevant doctor appointment, and my eyes haven't improved much. Until then, I'll have to hold off on playing. I can help with mod duties, if necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 Hey, Eclipse, the game ended already I'm afraid :P. Strongman is already one shot, actually. It's existence is mostly there to break potential town super combos. Me and Chaos actually had a discussion about, how strong is Godfather, how strong is Strongman, I don't remember exactly what we decided but I know it was at least Godfather>Strongman. I can definitely see the other way around. Maybe next time I'll make mafia teams slightly random or slightly determined by town's power roles? That way they learn a little about the threats of the town but not who or exactly what, and I can nip possible power combos down. I have to admit I never really considered Watcher+Doctor. I probably should. I still don't see exactly what's so great about it - are you bearing in mind (my) Watcher must choose a different player? Because I could certainly see it being powerful if they could choose themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Maybe make godfather vs. strongman depend on what roles the town has? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Theoretically, scum can't risk killing the doc because of the watcher, but can't risk killing the watcher because of the doc. This guarantees the survival of two obvtowns, and if they feel like trying to outWIFOM scum they can break pattern and catch the scumkill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 Ah, right, I get you. I don't think the second point is a particularly strong point mind - scum could at the same time take a risk and hit the Watcher at which point, boom, c-c-c-combo breaker. But the first, yeah that's an issue. Maybe I should prevent Watcher+Doc even being possible. Although I guess it's no worse than Doc+Doc. It does require both outing themselves and the chance there's a doctor given you're a watcher is... hmm... let's see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Maybe add a clause where they can't target the same player two nights in a row? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tables Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 About 36.7%, which is actually high enough for it to be worth removing/nerfing. About 26% of that is PPPP, 10% is PPPPP, so... hmm... agh. PPPP is the main one that needs changing I think. Watcher and two O Docs? That sounds alright... I dunno. I'll think about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 'twas to explain why I subbed out in the first place, Tables dearest~! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Until then, I'll have to hold off on playing.well it's not like my sign-ups will fill any time soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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