19 year old facing 8 years for sarcastic comment on League of Legends.

[FionordeQuester]

So...you guys all know that sort of dude who will say all sorts of politically incorrect, nonsensical, or otherwise totally inappropriate jokes on the internet, right? And of course they never truly mean it, right? The case of this guy, Justic Carter, was one, in which, in response to someone on League of Legends calling him insane, said...

"Oh yeah, I’m real messed up in the head, I’m going to go shoot up a school full of kids and eat their still, beating hearts"

...and then followed that up with "jk" and "lol". Not anything you'd immediately red flag, right?

Well apparently, the cops at Austin, Texas did not think this way. And so, after a Canadian woman called the authorities about this, Justin has been stuck in jail since March, at a half-a-million dollar parole, and is now facing 8 years (there had recently been a school shooting at the time he said this, though he didn't follow the news).

And so, I ask for your support, that you may sign this petition, help this guy out, and ultimately, speak out against an absolutely atrocious violation of our 1st Amendment rights. For anyone who wishes to have more info before signing, here's the article...

http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/27/texas-teen-makes-violent-joke-during-video-game-is-jailed-for-months/

And for those who have decided to sign, here's the petition...

https://www.change.org/petitions/release-my-son-justin-carter-being-prosecuted-for-a-facebook-comment

[eclipse]

Never heard of that site before, so here's one that I think people HAVE heard of.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/03/tech/social-media/facebook-teen-jail/

EDIT: Also, this is at least two weeks old

Edited July 19, 2013 by eclipse

[buttmuncher.ops]

he's probably insane and deserves some sort of rehabilitation for his messed up thought patterns

i say a bunch of crazy shit over the internet too (and do actually suffer from multiple behavioral disorders), but i know where to cross the line. with all the recent "domestic terrorist" attacks happening recently, you just can't give anyone a free pass for the stuff they say.

the point is that no one truly knows what goes on in another person's head and whether or not they're truly serious. there's always a quantum of truth to any joke anyone says, imo.

[FionordeQuester]

he's probably insane and deserves some sort of rehabilitation for his messed up thought patterns

i say a bunch of crazy shit over the internet too (and do actually suffer from multiple behavioral disorders), but i know where to cross the line. with all the recent "domestic terrorist" attacks happening recently, you just can't give anyone a free pass for the stuff they say.

the point is that no one truly knows what goes on in another person's head and whether or not they're truly serious. there's always a quantum of truth to any joke anyone says, imo.

The thing of it is however, even in the off chance that this is true, it's still an attack on free speech. Do you really want the police arresting you for making a thoughtless joke?

[buttmuncher.ops]

The thing of it is however, even in the off chance that this is true, it's still an attack on free speech. Do you really want the police arresting you for making a thoughtless joke?

there's a quote here by somebody "desperate times call for desperate measures"

slander and threats do not fall under your free speech amendment afaik

[eclipse]

Dammit all, I can SEE the argument, but my brain refuses to put it into words. Fuck, let's start with this: What is your interpretation of the First Amendment, in regards to freedom of speech?

[FionordeQuester]

there's a quote here by somebody "desperate times call for desperate measures"

slander and threats do not fall under your free speech amendment afaik

Maybe. I don't entirely disagree with that line of thought...but on the other hand, no weapons or anything were found in his house, and I think they really at least should have done a more thorough invesigation of him (maybe a psychological examination or the sort?) before just deciding to toss him in jail.

I think this situation could have been handled better, basically, and I don't want this to be the norm.

[Florete]

he's probably insane and deserves some sort of rehabilitation for his messed up thought patterns

i say a bunch of crazy shit over the internet too (and do actually suffer from multiple behavioral disorders), but i know where to cross the line. with all the recent "domestic terrorist" attacks happening recently, you just can't give anyone a free pass for the stuff they say.

the point is that no one truly knows what goes on in another person's head and whether or not they're truly serious. there's always a quantum of truth to any joke anyone says, imo.

The comment was in poor taste, that's for sure. I would never say something like that and I don't think it was a good idea for him to say it at all. But come on. It's a joke. An obvious joke. "Insane?" Really? This is LoL players we're talking about here. Just because someone says something stupid doesn't mean they need rehabilitation or, God forbid, to be fucking arrested and jailed for months.

Maybe. I don't entirely disagree with that line of thought...but on the other hand, no weapons or anything were found in his house, and I think they really at least should have done a more thorough invesigation of him (maybe a psychological examination or the sort?) before just deciding to toss him in jail.

I'll agree with that. Checking up on it to make sure it wasn't a legitimate threat would have been fine and good. What's really insane is that this could actually happen to the kid.

[buttmuncher.ops]

Maybe. I don't entirely disagree with that line of thought...but on the other hand, no weapons or anything were found in his house, and I think they really at least should have done a more thorough invesigation of him (maybe a psychological examination or the sort?) before just deciding to toss him in jail.

I think this situation could have been handled better, basically, and I don't want this to be the norm.

ye, i agree that this shouldn't be the norm. if i hate anything in the world, it's people not being themselves, whether it's a serial killer in the making with blood & gore fantasies to repressed full of anger parents sacrificing their dreams for their kids to that kid in school who reads a book and doesnt talk to anyone because they have bigger dreams than being stuck in school.

fact of the matter is, shit (domestic terrorism attacks) happens, and has set a precedent of having maximum preventative protocols in the s.o.p. of the institutions that police and protect the public. that's just the era we live in and people go on with their life stepping on eggshells. i understand you're trying to make a stand here for something different so that people don't have to live scared of their government, but it's just not going to happen.

as for me personally, i'd love to stand with you and add my signature, but i know it won't make a difference; in addition to the fact that i feel the government's s.o.p. is necessary for the people who can't protect themselves from other people in these times, as much as i hate it too.

[Espinosa]

Well, this wouldn't have happened if people weren't paranoid about another occurrence of domestic terrorism happening for obvious reasons. Similarly, somebody recklessly shouting 'sieg heil' in Germany would need to be aware of the country's recent history and how people would react to such 'humour' before pulling off a stunt like that.

[FionordeQuester]

as for me personally, i'd love to stand with you and add my signature, but i know it won't make a difference; in addition to the fact that i feel the government's s.o.p. is necessary for the people who can't protect themselves from other people in these times, as much as i hate it too.

Well, yes, you do want safety for yourself and for your family. But in my opinion, honestly, the best answer there is to not have to depend on the government to begin with. Go to some self-defense classes, get a gun permit, just do SOMETHING to educate yourself on how to protect yourself and your family. Heck, one of the things that made our ancestors so successful was that most everyone, out of simple necessity, knew how to fight and hunt in some capacity, a skill that I think we've lost as a society (now of course, that wasn't the MAIN reason, but it definitely helped!).

I'm not trying to be a crazy, anti-government conspiracy nut here. I'm just saying that having to rely on other people to protect you is not the safest way to live life.

Edited July 19, 2013 by FionordeQuester

[eclipse]

Now imagine if the police wrote it off like a joke, and he went through with it. The news would be all over the police for not catching the "obvious" warning sign in the form of that post.

While I think it's an overreaction (I don't know how long such investigations normally take, but four and a half months seems like a while), I fail to see how it's a violation of our First Amendment rights (unless I have misremembered what the First Amendment covers, which is WHY I asked earlier).

[Esau of Isaac]

he's probably insane and deserves some sort of rehabilitation for his messed up thought patterns

You cannot possibly be serious right now

i say a bunch of crazy shit over the internet too (and do actually suffer from multiple behavioral disorders), but i know where to cross the line. with all the recent "domestic terrorist" attacks happening recently, you just can't give anyone a free pass for the stuff they say.

the point is that no one truly knows what goes on in another person's head and whether or not they're truly serious. there's always a quantum of truth to any joke anyone says, imo.

Fuck that noise. A joke is a joke. Taking something like this seriously isn't just a waste of taxpayers' dollars, it's a waste of a person's life. You think that seventeen-year-old is going to come out of prison after eight years with no diploma, no job, and the slightest bit of direction in life with any intention at all of becoming a productive member of society?

This entire case is a joke and anyone who even begins to support this utter lunacy is beyond help.

Now imagine if the police wrote it off like a joke, and he went through with it. The news would be all over the police for not catching the "obvious" warning sign in the form of that post.

How many of the people reading this think that someone raging in League of Legends and saying these lines is making a genuine statement towards shooting up a school? Or anything beyond rash words that are stated in a community surrounded around incredible competitiveness?

Edited July 19, 2013 by Esau of Isaac

[FionordeQuester]

While I think it's an overreaction (I don't know how long such investigations normally take, but four and a half months seems like a while), I fail to see how it's a violation of our First Amendment rights (unless I have misremembered what the First Amendment covers, which is WHY I asked earlier).

Ah, sorry Eclipse. Here it is...

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances

And if it's the length of the psychological examination that would force them to do this...then why not do it while he's in jail or in some other form of custody? Either way they're sacrificing a huge chunk of his time.

Edited July 19, 2013 by FionordeQuester

[Kngt_Of_Titania]

I don't think there's any way you can think that this ISN'T an overreach and a breach of the first amendment (hell, let's throw in the eighth amendment here too). Have a tentative investigation to make sure he's not actually serious? Sure. Get sent to jail and face a blatantly overdone bail/sentence because an obnoxious Canadian read your post on LoL and reported you to the Austin police like the gigantic douche they are? Hell no.

Hell, if we're going to use the logic "But what if he actually possibly did it? We have to [insert stupid overreaction here] to hedge any risk!" is silly. It would be akin to me getting into an argument with a woman, telling her "F*&% you", and then getting put in jail and registered as a sex offender.

EDIT: Also the argument "Well, Texas is a deeply conservative state that is viciously protective of individual rights, and if THEY jailed him, it's *obviously* justified." is silly as well. Partly because it's dumb logic, and partly because Austin is a deep dark navy blue dot in a sea of red.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Kngt_Of_Titania

[MacLovin]

What stranger-woman goes around looking for things a teen says?

[Raven]

I'm not sure I can add much to what's already been said, but I agree with most here that this is a fucking joke. It was a totally sarcastic response to someone accusing him of being insane. What the fuck's wrong with your justice system?

[eclipse]

How many of the people reading this think that someone raging in League of Legends and saying these lines is making a genuine statement towards shooting up a school? Or anything beyond rash words that are stated in a community surrounded around incredible competitiveness?

Hindsight's like that, and until it's beaten out of society, I don't see it changing. See: violent video games and the Columbine shootings.

Ah, sorry Eclipse. Here it is...

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances

Religion - not applicable

Freedom of speech - will get there in a sec

Press - they're not going after Facebook, so nope

Assembly - LOL (pun may or may not be intended)

Petition - not applicable

The freedom of speech part, IIRC, is so that Congress doesn't make laws that make it illegal to speak out against the government (so you can't be arrested for making jokes about how congress is the opposite of progress, etc.). I think you can be arrested for cold-calling your local police station with a bomb threat; freedom of speech doesn't mean that you're protected from the consequences of your speech. However, I think the consequences in this case may have been a bit overboard.

[Kngt_Of_Titania]

The freedom of speech part, IIRC, is so that Congress doesn't make laws that make it illegal to speak out against the government (so you can't be arrested for making jokes about how congress is the opposite of progress, etc.). I think you can be arrested for cold-calling your local police station with a bomb threat; freedom of speech doesn't mean that you're protected from the consequences of your speech. However, I think the consequences in this case may have been a bit overboard.

Freedom of speech is usually way more powerful than that. Usually, the only cases I've seen where it's been shot down are cases of speech that pose a direct threat to life/safety (or when you make a DIRECT, SPECIFIC, and LEGITIMATE/SERIOUS threat), as in yelling fire in a crowded theater.

He would have had to:

> Named the school specifically, or the students, AND

> Be interpreted as a serious threat by a reasonable/logical human being.

For this action to be even justified under U.S. law.

@Raven: I wouldn't throw stones in glass houses. IIRC, hasn't Britain jailed people for making offensive comments on Twitter/Facebook? From what I hear, the UK has a bigger issue with stupid shit like this than the US. Frankly, I think both countries need to step back and apply common sense instead of paranoia. I, at least, would appreciate it.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Kngt_Of_Titania

[eclipse]

Freedom of speech is usually way more powerful than that. Usually, the only cases I've seen where it's been shot down are cases of speech that pose a direct threat to life/safety (or when you make a DIRECT, SPECIFIC, and LEGITIMATE/SERIOUS threat), as in yelling fire in a crowded theater.

He would have had to:

> Named the school specifically, or the students, AND

> Be interpreted as a serious threat by a reasonable/logical human being.

For this action to be even justified under U.S. law.

In which case, this is either an extremely gross miscarriage of justice OR we are not seeing the entire story (especially since I can't see how some random Canadian would have any stake in some random Texan teen's life). Who wants to take bets on which scenario it is?

[buttmuncher.ops]

Well, yes, you do want safety for yourself and for your family. But in my opinion, honestly, the best answer there is to not have to depend on the government to begin with. Go to some self-defense classes, get a gun permit, just do SOMETHING to educate yourself on how to protect yourself and your family. Heck, one of the things that made our ancestors so successful was that most everyone, out of simple necessity, knew how to fight and hunt in some capacity, a skill that I think we've lost as a society (now of course, that wasn't the MAIN reason, but it definitely helped!).

I'm not trying to be a crazy, anti-government conspiracy nut here. I'm just saying that having to rely on other people to protect you is not the safest way to live life.

i carry a butterfly knife and brass knuckles with me everywhere i go, ever since i was 14. that's how i protect myself, because fuck the police, they haven't done shit for me. the majority of my childhood i grew up in beverly hills for school too, btw.

now i can go into my background and talk about why there's a gun store next to every liquor store in predominantly black neighborhoods in LA, and whether to blame the government or gentrification for it, but that won't mean shit. not everybody's like me and knows how to fight back, but i'd rather not be the sole responsibility for preventing a columbine type of thing happening at my school growing up, and if it means relying on shitty preventative police measures for it, i'm okay with one stupid kid being sacrificed for it.

i agree that there might be more serious threats out there than some lolfag running his mouth, but that's one less dumbfuck that i don't have to deal with in my world

How many of the people reading this think that someone raging in League of Legends and saying these lines is making a genuine statement towards shooting up a school? Or anything beyond rash words that are stated in a community surrounded around incredible competitiveness?

because you see shit like this in professional competitive athletic communities too. football and basketball stars totally running their mouth about harming kids when they talk shit to the other team's players.

gtfo with that noise, there's obviously a connection between violent competitive video games and sick fucks who take that violence to their real world that you dont want to admit here, or rather dont want to see the precedents set beforehand

Edited July 19, 2013 by black op: skyfang

[Kngt_Of_Titania]

In which case, this is either an extremely gross miscarriage of justice OR we are not seeing the entire story (especially since I can't see how some random Canadian would have any stake in some random Texan teen's life). Who wants to take bets on which scenario it is?

I've met people like that Canadian, so I can certainly believe that somebody would go out of their way to do that (especially since my experiences with Canada has given me the distinct impression that the country has a considerably more restrictive view of freedom of speech in general, so there's that as well).

I'd bet it's mostly the former (with the shooting at Sandy Hook being used as "justification"), and maybe a little bit of the latter if the reporter(s) intentionally failed to report small details in an attempt to sensationalize the story a bit.

@black op: I wonder if you'd feel the same way if you were the "dumbfuck" being sacrificed, especially considering the type of police who would arrest this kid would also be particularly interested that you've been carrying around two deadly weapons everywhere since you were 14, openly shout "fuck the police", and then proclaim you'd have no qualms about defending yourself in any way possible if necessary. Hell, we can even use the Zimmerman case as justification for your arrest!

P.S. This kid WAS acting really, REALLY stupid. Not the point, though.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Kngt_Of_Titania

[buttmuncher.ops]

@black op: I wonder if you'd feel the same way if you were the "dumbfuck" being sacrificed, especially considering the type of police who would arrest this kid would also be particularly interested that you've been carrying around two deadly weapons everywhere since you were 14.

ye, because i'm going to have the weapons laid out right in front if they knock, even if they can remotely get a judge to approve a search warrant.

good luck with that

[Life]

Fuck your first ammendment, that petition is retarded. The guy broke a law in the Texas penal code.

(a) A person commits an offense if he threatens to commit any offense involving violence to any person or property with intent to:

(4) cause impairment or interruption of public communications, public transportation, public water, gas, or power supply or other public service;

(5) place the public or a substantial group of the public in fear of serious bodily injury; or

(6) influence the conduct or activities of a branch or agency of the federal government, the state, or a political subdivision of the state.

I can totally back this conviction, unlike the George Zimmerman one. Here is a direct violation of the law, even as a joke. What he said isn't funny whatsoever.

[Kngt_Of_Titania]

ye, because i'm going to have the weapons laid out right in front if they knock, even if they can remotely get a judge to approve a search warrant.

good luck with that

I forgot that the police had to get a search warrant to find the weapons that the kid was going to use to carry out his "threat" before they arrested him.

Oh, wait. They didn't.

(a) A person commits an offense if he threatens to commit any offense involving violence to any person or property with intent to:

(4) cause impairment or interruption of public communications, public transportation, public water, gas, or power supply or other public service;

(5) place the public or a substantial group of the public in fear of serious bodily injury; or

(6) influence the conduct or activities of a branch or agency of the federal government, the state, or a political subdivision of the state.

Read the bold. So no, hardly a violation of the law. There is obviously no intent to do ANY of those things, bad joke or not. Unless we get considerably more evidence that points to an intent to act on his words, you have no case.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Kngt_Of_Titania