Who is your least favorite character in the Tellius games?

[MoonlitSonata]

Well, what did you expect? RD is a sequel, not a standalone game. It's naturally going to be a little confusing if you haven't played PoR.

Huntress' point is a valid one, and as someone who also played FE10 first I understand how she feels. Story wise, FE10 does a terrible job at being open to newcomers who didn't play FE9, as the Greil Mercs barely get any exposure and development within FE10.

And no, "But FE10 is a sequel" is not a valid excuse because there are lots of straight sequels that do a proper job at filling the player with everything they need to know (Ace Attorney games do a good job at this). FE10 doesn't do this, and it's quite a flaw with the game.

Replying to these real quick since I didn't get to stay around long after posting earlier.

First and foremost, RD is a sequel on a separate console from its predecessor, and while said predecessor was compatible with Wii games, by the time I got my hands on Radiant Dawn most major game chains were discontinuing carrying Gamecube games. So getting my hands on a copy of Path of Radiance was a feat to begin with since the only game stores in my hometown until two years ago were Gamestop and EB Games.

Secondly, big YES to what Jave said. Even the tiniest amount of detail in things that the game forces you to read can go a long way. Also, the Ace Attorney series was an example I was going to list on how to exposition a cast in a sequel so its friendly to newcomers, since I had no idea which order to play the games in, and accidentally started on the second game in the series. (I quickly fixed that mistake when I realized.) However, in what I played I knew who each character was, why they were there, and even some character quirks. Radiant Dawn? After the little "Saving Lucia" scene most of the characters that didn't make it onto my final roster I forgot who they were and they surprised me on my second playthrough when they showed up. You can take ten minutes of exposition and it will go a long, long way in any game, as long as you utilise it well.

EDIT: Sorry for posting so late, just wanted to add a few more points to my original post since I was afk during some arguments after.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Huntress

[Anacybele]

Yeah, I suppose you guys have good points there. I would never argue that RD doesn't have flaws anyway either.

[MoonlitSonata]

Indeed. Radiant Dawn is one of my favorites to play for the mechanics, since mechanically speaking, I had to think hard as to who is my least favorite that way. About the only problem I have with RD's mechanics is the support system is meh, I prefer more indepth supports than "How's the battle going?" "Pretty good! Don't die out there!" "Okay!"

But then again that loops back to the writing issue.

[Anacybele]

Yeah, I don't like the support system either, or how pairings were handled. I mean, we got the GBA games where nearly every character that could marry had multiple options for spouses, and a whole bunch of characters were able to marry. A lot of pairings were possible. Then RD only gives us a small handful compared to that and each character that can marry only has one option (and Ike gets no options). Just...wtf.

[Blaze The Great]

I hate Nephenee, Aran master race

In all seriousness, I really dislike Astrid and Makalov. Astrid seemed pretty alright from what I saw of POR, but...what @ her behavior in RD. Just...no.

Danved is fairly forgettable too. I actually do like Nephenee, and I have a strange and ridiculous attachment to Aran.

Also Valtome. Not sure what IS was doing there...

Not to fuel the fire, but I don't really think Ike took Micaiah's spotlight. The writers at IS honestly should have done a better job fleshing out her character and giving her more depth if they had wanted to make her a good protagonist. Granted most RD characters (Aran) don't have much depth, but Micaiah really needed it if she wanted any hope of being a main protagonist. Just my personal opinion.

[Radiant head]

Haha I like Aran, but I have no idea why given how bland he is.

I like RD's support system because I prefer gameplay to story. I like the flexibility to combine any two affinities I want and come up with cool set ups. It's what makes the game so replayable for me.

Edited April 1, 2015 by Radiant head

[MCProductions]

I like RD's support system because I prefer gameplay to story. I like the flexibility to combine any two affinities I want and come up with cool set ups. It's what makes the game so replayable for me.

Honestly, if we had Affinities back, Awakening would have the best support system in the series from a gameplay and story standpoint.

Valtome however, is another can of worms entirely. The only characters I dislike more than him are Tharja and Largo.

That said, I apreciate him more because you don't have to basically say screw continuity to kill him so...

[Radiant head]

Awakening's convos end up getting kind of repetitive and bland because there are so many of them, but yeah I think it balances gameplay better than PoR and story better than RD.

[PuffPuff]

Micaiah is my least favorite. Poorly written, boring as hell character. I wish she wasn't a forced unit, I'd let her die and stay dead. She's too fragile and slow anyway.

Dishonorable mentions: Soren (he's a dick. I mean, I do understand WHY he's the way he is, but I still can't stand it), Geoffrey (booooring. He also loses a few points for being Elincia's only option for a husband when a certain blue-haired mercenary she grew close to exists as well), Mia (annoying, and doesn't even have an appealing design. The only reason I don't lump her with Micaiah is that she does somewhat entertain me in her support with Rhys and I can also see her getting comedic with Boyd)

Oh yeah, I hate Oliver too. In fact, I think I can lump him with Micaiah for least favorite overall. He's just...VERY annoying.

And for non-playable characters, Valtome. No contest. I don't think I need to explain why.

Well...the douches brings clownism to war...these are it...

FE1(NES)

-Kannival (Ch8 Boss)

-Matthis

FE2

-Tozeh (General)

FE3

-Matthis

FE4

-Midayle's Brothers (Kinbois:Warrior, Gandolf:Warrior)

FE5

-Kempf

FE6

-Narcian

-Merlinus

FE7

-Wallace

-(Ch2 Boss: Glass)

FE8

-Gheb

FE9

-Oliver

-Schaeffer (Ch22 Boss)

-Makalov

FE10

-Oliver

-Valtome

-Makalov

FE11

(Same as FE1)

FE12

(Same as FE3)

FE13

-Excellus

Naesala. He was awesome in FE9 as a slimy backstabber villain, but then in the next game they tried to make him cuddly and whiney. And gameplay wise, he's pretty pathetic for a royal that you're depending on to get through the desert chapter.

Sothe is really annoying, though I don't hate him as much as I used to. Still it would have been nice if he would just gtfo and not be forced in the tower.

Boyd. Typical brainless meathead warrior. Mist could do so much better. Or maybe she can't.

Soren: "I cling on to my victim complex so I can justify being a prick to other people, so that I can continue to cling to my victim complex."

Zelgius: Kills Ike's father for no reason, and then somehow we're supposed to pretend he's an antihero and not a psychopath.

Yeah, it's like IS was reading too much Twilight when they came up with that pairing.

THAT'S THE ONE THING THAT I HATE ABOUT THIS GAME!

I can't hate Sothe. He does so much work in part 1 as a unit. He's killing shit, tanking shit, stealing shit, and finding shit in the ground.

I have a hard time separating gameplay and story.

Also Soren "seducing" the silver card out of Aimee made me like the guy a lot more than I did before. It was too funny. "Oh, Rose of Tellius" Soren pls.

Only sucks that you don't get to keep it. Sell it for 2k after getting done with it.

I meant that he grew in PoR and between it and RD.

It is hurtful that they nerfed his Res growth in FE10 which was better in FE9.

But Daein wasn't doomed, and Micaiah later sided with Ike's party. So there obviously WAS a way around the pact's effects, she just didn't want to consider it when she should have.

I liked the idea of the blood pact, but in Micaiah's case, it was handled poorly.

Which was fixed in her DLC episode that she was naive of what's going on and has apologized for her action.

Micaiah

What is this place? Has the fighting ended? Then...that means we've lost... I am yours to command. My name is Micaiah. Do you know who I am?

>Question: Have you heard of Micaiah?

>Yes

Micaiah

You have? Then why don't you tell me about yourself instead?

>No

Micaiah

I hail from Daein, on the continent of Tellius—a world far from here. Some call me the Priestess of Dawn. I am gifted with occasional farsight... But in truth, I had no idea I would meet you and your army here. Just who are you, anyway?

>After Answer

Micaiah

What is your name? Robin, is it? And you are this army's tactician? Tell me, Robin, what sort of tactician are you? What plans have you weaved to secure your victories? If you had to resort to something underhanded and dirty, would you? What if failing to do so would get your comrades killed?

>Question: Would you resort to evil to save a friend?

>Yes

Micaiah

You are strong to be able to make such a choice... I wanted to be strong, too, so I made the same decision. I have been abused and cursed with a hundred insults for some of my actions. I wanted victory for my homeland...and denied myself greatness as a result... Forgive me... Surely you don't want to be burdened by the mewlings of a stranger. But could we keep talking? Tell me more about yourself...

Thank you, Robin. You've taken a load off my heart. If I'd had a friend like you by my side, I might have made a better life. When the fighting is done, why don't you visit my homeland? It's not the loveliest place, but a person like you would make it more bearable. Think it over?

>No

Micaiah

Then you are just. But justice can cost you victory, and defeat can cost you the lives of friends. Are you able to live with that? ...I'm sorry. I'm being a bully. But I could never fully choose, and I made many mistakes as a result. Listen to me. I talk to you as if I've known you for years! We should remedy that. Tell me more about yourself, Robin...

Recruit Micaiah > Yes

Micaiah

All right. Let's go.

I don't really like Heather, I never really used her though, so I don't really know too much about her..

She's one of those characters who hardly had any backstory, if at all. But...she had something that others have not and that's bisexuality.

Did you even pay attention to what was going on? Micaiah pretty much had her hands tied with the whole blood pact thing and couldn't do anything about it. You seriously think she wanted all that crap to happen? Heck, it's not just her, at one point Ike asks Tauroneo what's going on and even he can't give Ike an answer. What would you suggest Micaiah should have done?

I find it baffling that people shit on Micaiah over this, when nothing in Part 3 was her fault. Everything happened because Pelleas literally didn't read the fine print.

Which making him king was a big mistake.

Okay, you want to know why I would like him to burn?

>Stealing Micaiah's spotlight
>More bland than a rock
>One of the most god-awful designs in the series.
>Being forced to kill the final boss, forcing poor Micaiah out of the spotlight for no apparent reason at all. At least let either lord kill her, sheesh. Similarly in FE9, I can't let Rolf kill Ashnard despite his "bow weakness". Granted, other units can harm him, but I only really like one of them (Ena).
>Talked back to the empress despite common sense.
>Finally, he's in SSB and Roy is not. This might soulnd petty, but it angers me enough to make me hate him more than I already did.

And that is why I want nothing more to happen to him than burn in the fiery pits of hell.

Sadly, Roy wasn't chosen as a character, but as an advertisement for a game that we never got.

So basically, you hate him because he apparently gets more spotlight overall than the characters you love (you've expressed liking Roy, Micaiah, and Rolf a lot). That is pretty petty, you know.

I'm a big Daisy fan, but I don't hate Rosalina just because she's been getting spotlight instead. In fact, I like Rosalina.

Sadly, Daisy has been considered dead at this point.

Nintendo has already shown this to hardly have her cameo even in Smash Bros. Not even an asset trophy, but guess what? Waluigi got it! Daisy didn't.

-----

On Topic: For who I dislike most...Lekain.

Edited April 1, 2015 by PuffPuff

[-Cynthia-]

With the whole Ike saying "No problem, it's just a job" thing, I think this the game's weird way of recognizing that the Greil Mercenaries are actually mercenaries. It's easy to forget sometimes, since they don't really take jobs they have moral objections to, or discuss how they're paid, or take specific orders from their employers- the whole mercenary concept isn't really pulled off well IMO.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

gosh all these makalov haters are jelly they can't rock the pink fro~ i'm joking, being in character is fun

[MisterIceTeaPeach]

I knew at once this will degenerate into the topic "Why is Ike the worst character in FE10".

Edited April 1, 2015 by Mister IceTeaPeach

[PuffPuff]

gosh all these makalov haters are jelly they can't rock the pink fro~ i'm joking, being in character is fun

I happen to find his character quite appealing. XD

He always had the calmest mind in critical situations even though they think that he's just a sleeze. Astrid/Stella saw that within him which I think makes them worth to have each other. I happen to use Makalov cuz lol he's fucking Jesus on an orange horse. Pink Jesus horse man.

[Luchi]

As always,whenever Ike is mentioned, a sh*tstorm occurs. (sigh) Anyway, Ike then Sothe for least favourite Tellius characters.

[Sweet_Basil]

Most definitely Ike.

I feel like his presence was very tacked on or forced just to be "cool" and he came across as boring and irritating. I think that the story-arc for part 3 would have been more appropriate had Skrimir been the main focus instead of Ike, after all it was the laguz that started part 3 but they just fade away because of Ike. I also believe all of the newer characters suffered, especially Micaiah, because Ike and the Greil mercenaries received too much spotlight and their story arc extended much longer than part 1 or 2; part 4 is another issue. I believe that if they had focused on the new cast instead of shoving Ike in for the heck of it that the fanbase would appreciate them much more than they do.

Other than Ike there's:

Makalov, I think him and Astrid could have had a great tremendous growth had he changed his habits but they didn't even try.
Volke but that's because I feel he has no depth other than he's mysterious.
Black Knight because his story confuses me. Why did he help Micaiah twice? He ended fighting her team.

[MCProductions]

You know, now that I think about it, were POR and RD originally supposed to be the same game. It would explain so much. I've always played the two back to back so I've never had these plot stealing complaints. Also, the code of POR shows a lot things that were cut from POR that did appear in RD, and several NPC's that had no reason to be introduced in POR (Lekain, Zelgius), suddenly played major roles in RD. I've always played them as the same game and still will, but if they actually were it would explain alot.

[Elibean Spaceman]

Welp, time to ban Ike.

Ugh, this is just not a good topic in general. These kinds always turn bad. I want to try to shift the conversation, but "talk about someone else people can hate" isn't really my thing.

I like Ike, but too much of anything wears on you and I'm getting really damn sick of him lately.

I really didn't intend on this thread to have an argument about Ike, let alone an argument about someone else.

[Magical Glace]

You know, now that I think about it, were POR and RD originally supposed to be the same game. It would explain so much. I've always played the two back to back so I've never had these plot stealing complaints. Also, the code of POR shows a lot things that were cut from POR that did appear in RD, and several NPC's that had no reason to be introduced in POR (Lekain, Zelgius), suddenly played major roles in RD. I've always played them as the same game and still will, but if they actually were it would explain alot.

I'm pretty sure IS just planned Tellius to be a duology from the start.

I mean come on, there was enough evidence to figure out the true identity of the BK and Bertram before FE10 even came out.

[Shadow Mir]

I think the problem with Mak is that they should have shown up cleaning up his act instead of just playing him for laughs. What might have been amusing at first stops being so pretty quickly.

The fact that he drags down Astrid's character is pretty bad as well.

Those are pretty much the reasons I dislike Makalov. Well, that, and the fact that he's a pretty big douchebag with no redeeming qualities to speak of.

Edited April 1, 2015 by Levant Caprice

[-Cynthia-]

Not to say that Ike doesn't overshadow Micaiah, but she has more chapters as main Lord than he does. Micaiah has 11 Part 1 chapters, 3 Part 3 chapters, and 2 Part 4 chapters(16 total). Ike has 10 Part 3 chapters and 3 Part 4 chapters (13 total).

[Eldritch Abomination]

A solid tie between Micaiah, and RD Black Knight.

Micaiah's character always seemed to flat, boring, and annoying to me. And RD Black Knight makes her Mary Sue levels even worse. He was so much more interesting in PoR.

[Bankai]

FE 10 Ike I think he would have been a better character if he had more character development (ex. Ike and company end up fighting a bandit problem. Ike then sees some one who looks like the Black Knight and pursues him leaving the other behind. He end's up the villain's strongest warrior through mind control/magic because of this the player's army ends up having to fight him to free him from said mind control. He then joins you and you learn that the reason he went off alone was Revenge/ Wanting to protect his friends.).

I would like to say that I also think Makalov so have shown signs of trying to break his gambling addiction in RD. Even if it was to show Astrid he know his addictions is bad and he's trying to help that.

[Irysa]

They were fighting soldiers who worked under the employment of the senators. It's not like they were going to war with an army of Donnel. You think Ike disregards civilian safety in RD? Here's a quote from 3-P.

Ike had no intention to get civilians involved in their operations. Ranulf employed the GMs as a guerilla unit to handle some small scale business.

Skrimir's dialogue does not do him any favours here...and anyway, I wasn't trying to say the entire army would be full of Donnels. The point is that it's basically guaranteed that you have people who have no real quarrel with anyone being involved in some manner, that is the nature of war. This is why Fire Emblem defaults to "Evil Empire invades" so much because the ramifications and justifications neccessary to make a War a reasonable option (and a last resort I might add) are absurdly high. The circumstances in Radiant Dawn "justifying" the actions of the Laguz Alliance are complete piffle and a contrivance that are a result of IS needing to recreate a scenario for the Medallion to activate. Brightbow has previously outlined this before, but I'm in complete agreement with him that essentially, Radiant Dawn Part-4 or something to that effect should have happened at the end of Path of Radiance. Getting the entire continent into a war again, one that involves the Laguz who are very aware of the Medallion and refuse to get into conflicts as a result needs a really big catalyst, and FE9 had one. To achieve the situation again in FE10, they turned the Laguz into warmongerers and their commanding officer is an oaf who wants to kill as many humans as possible.

There is no way that the Ike from Path of Radiance would have accepted a massive full scale conflict of this sort. Getting bogged into details about "well Ike kind of implies some concern here" or whatnot is largely irrelevant to the fact he gave the campaign his blessing by signing on and never personally voices complaints against it. Ike was a hero who fought AGAINST the status quo of the world in FE9, in FE10 he endorses it.

I would imagine "unarmed" as any person who is not wielding a weapon. How would it look for the future king of Gallia if hewent around munching on innocents? Or his army? Caineghis would be pissed off. They wouldn't do that. 3-1 was a guerilla operation, I'm sure no one in the either of the two 3-1 houses were hurt. 3-1 is also the only battle in which civilians were present. The convenient plot element is stupid, but its still a justification that's there. Besides, that's a mark against the Laguz alliance and the plot, not against Ike. If the Herons didn't have their convenient plot power, I really don't know how things would turn out. I have a feeling Tibarn would still attack them, Caineghis would probablystay out of it, and Kilvas would do whatever.

Skrimir does not seem like the type to care very much about whether or not some young conscript pissing himself in fear is his opponent or not, all he wants to do is kill people. That's abhorrent period. They're already killing innocents just by campaigning because there are going to be plenty of blameless soldiers in the Begnion Army, and their forces have not actively aggressed against nations in decades. You can't just say that everyone who signed up deserves to die, some probably had no choice. As for the "strike against the Laguz", no it's a strike against both Ike AND the Laguz, see previous point.

By occupy, I mean in the same way Daein did to Crimea or Begnion did to Daein. I don't think Gallia had a Jarod of their own stationed anywhere in Begnion.

You don't need a Jarod around for an invasion of territory that involves displacing innocent civilians not to be morally wrong.

Ike expresses remorse against Zihark, Jill, and Sothe. He expresses it in his own unique way. He makes it pretty clear that he doesn't want to fight them, but he's gotta do what he's gotta do. This is hardly one sided, as everyone he talks to also agrees to fight him in return. There's a mutual respect going on.

Ike is hardly remorseful at all in any of these, and shows very little conviction towards people whom he once fought beside and trusted. He basically just says "oh well, too bad" and gets on with hitting people with his oversized sword. Everyone he fights against actually expresses regret against their situation and even questions themselves in their other conversations. All these indicate is that Ike doesn't give a damn in this game and apparently everyone's on board with that, which is just in contradiction of what FE9 Ike's personality was.

It's pretty clear that neither side will back down, so it's disingenuous to accuse Ike of being some sort of cold hearted warrior with no remorse whatsoever.

The others CAN all back down though. Ike doesn't even get close to showing a bit of actual regret, all he seems to care about is finishing his job, even if it involves killing his friends. I actually do geninuely believe that if Ike in RD actually behaved like PoR Ike, he would have CONVINCED his former allies from Daein to stand down, beause there are plenty in his army who can do it and don't have nearly as much charismatic potential as he did in FE9.

Daein constantly stood in their way. The Laguz and Ike weren't going to just ignore them.

They can't really be "in the way" unless they want to go to Begnion through Daein. All Daein did was launch some paltry guerilla warfare as a distraction. I'm not advocating "ignoring" them, I'm saying there's precedent for not acting as aggressors and simply functioning on the defence against them.

Considering that Ike sympathizes with Ranulf in those scenes, I'm pretty sure he sees where Ranulf is coming from. The way I see it, Ike made his decision to join and he was going to stand by it. He knew what he was getting into, so expressing concern would just be a waste of his time.

I didn't realise characters properly expressing themselves in a story constituted as "A waste of time". We're left dredging through hypotheticals from what we knew about a man from a few years ago, operating under the assumption (that is shown to be shaky) that he has the same kind of principles.

Every action has consequences. Ike knew exactly what he was getting into when he joined up with the Alliance, but he felt that the Laguz are in the right.

Being in the right doesn't mean they had a right to start a war, nor was Ike obligated to take part in one.

The medallion was explained, even if it was in a stupid way, he did express some reluctance into joining because of Sanaki and whoever else in Begnion, but he still felt that they were way out of line.

And invading a country isn't out of line?

Begnion overstepped their boundaries beyond negotiable terms.

Begnion showed no intent of negociating but did not actively function as aggressors. The Laguz CHOSE to attack Begnion when they could have not done so. In addition, if there was ANYBODY to work as an intermediary, then paging Elincia and by extension, Ike to attempt to do something more on the diplomatic side would have made far more sense. You're not just choosing to magically kill the people doing "bad things" here, the decision of an invasion has wide reaching consequences.

The way I see it is like this: this was serious enough for Caineghis to get involved. If there's anyone who would want to avoid war, it'd be him. But he got involved anyway. The war was probably not as easily avoidable as one would think.

Cain getting involved is bullshit and also unrepresentative of his attitude in FE9 and just another strike against the game's lack of respect to it's predescessor.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Irysa

[RidellCrimea]

Ugghh am I the only who doesn't hate any character in the Tellius series?

Micaiah doesn't have the best development, but she's a pretty damn good unit (at least for me). I can't hate her.

Ike is my favorite lord, and he's all around awesome and badass (both as a unit and character, though can't deny that he's pretty much a Stu in FE10). Pretty upset that some people shat over my fav character : [

As for other characters people hate, I don't have anything to say.

Edited April 4, 2015 by RidellCrimea

[Anacybele]

Er, Ike isn't a Stu, even in RD. A Stu is a male character that's perfect at everything, is worshipped by everyone he knows, has no flaws, has special powers or something, that kind of thing. Ike is only really "worshipped" in Crimea and just holds respect everywhere else except for Daein and Daein hates him. Shinon hates him too. And Ike is certainly not good at everything, he's only shown to be talented at swordfighting (and maybe arm-wrestling with those beefy muscles of his. lol). He doesn't have any special powers or nothing either. I will admit though, that RD Ike doesn't show his flaws nearly as well as he did in PoR.

Micaiah has more Stu/Sue qualities than Ike imo, and anyone that says Ike is a Stu but Micaiah isn't a Sue is just...wrong. Not that I think Micaiah is a Sue, I just honestly don't know if she is anymore.

Edited April 4, 2015 by Anacybele