Marriage and Romance Speculation and Discussion Topic

[B.Leu]

When you say plenty, you mean plenty, official, or plenty, independent stuff ? There is a big difference.

Also, Attack on Titan, it was a blink and miss moment, I had to look closer to even ask myself 'Oh, they are in love ?

Maybe there is more and more acceptance toward it in Japan, doesn't change the fact that, one, it's illegal, and two, it's still treated poorly. Ie what Neko and HF said. Not gonna repeat it. :p

Am I the only who find that talking about homosexual marriage in Fire Emblem is somewhat stupid ? I mean, Fire emblem is a series where making children is a gameplay-mechanic. Gameplay. Mechanic.

Also, it's a medieval setting. I doupt that this time was kind to homosexual people.

Edited May 29, 2015 by B.Leu

[ENS]

japan would never do openly gay romance unless its in a VN type game, i'm not sure why people can't comprehend this, i guess they just don't understand japanese culture like us weeaboo's do.

Makalov, I'm genuinely curious about this: why? There's something you know?

it's illegal

What. Can you explain this, please?

Edited May 29, 2015 by ENS

[Terper]

It's illegal for homosexuals to marry in many places in the world, several states included. Ireland, as I'm sure you're aware, just recently made it legal. Does that mean they were treated poorly before this law, that they voted on, went through?

What do you mean "official?" What material would that be?

Of course it could be BETTER, it could be in the whole world, but if all the Japanese media you consume are things like scanlated manga, anime and video games then of course you're not getting the full picture. It's getting better. The ones who still oppose it are cranky old people, same as the majority that still oppose it in the rest of the world.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Terper

[ColdHeartAndASummerDream]

How would you implement gay relationships? Would you select sexuality at character creation?

This. Most people don't seem to realize that that homosexuality is typically treated as comedy and a deviant orientation. Gay marriage is illegal in Japan.

I've already said it once,but I'm not the one making the game, Kamui should have a set pool of romantic supprots,and a set pool of friendships support,you can only have one S rank,and you could choose whether it be romantic or not,so there would be no need to decide sexuality for the main character at all. I don't mean them making confessions to you and you denying them either. I mean like choosing the S-support before viewing it like "platonic" or "romantic",this could totally work between a male and a female character too,so you could have paired non-romantic endings. Sound good or do you find a flaw in this idea perhaps...? It's very likely,I'm only human,I make mistakes ^^

Also,to everyone,yes,I personally think IS would've failed in the romance aspect of the game if they won't include same-sex romance on some level(even IF only implied),but not the game,the game could STILL be amazeballs. I'll just not play for supports. I'll play for story and strategy. :) (or play as F!Kamui).

[RandomPixel]

But if gay marriage is an option we might not get every child char.

But honestly, I only do marriage due to stats and skills, so it won't really matter to me.

[ColdHeartAndASummerDream]

But if gay marriage is an option we might not get every child char.

But honestly, I only do marriage due to stats and skills, so it won't really matter to me.

Maybe there won't be children? Also, there are such things like adoption or surrogate mothers :P

I also just realized Gay Marriage is unlikely due to Kamui being a prince/princess...Oh well...

[Bovinian]

I've already said it once,but I'm not the one making the game, Kamui should have a set pool of romantic supprots,and a set pool of friendships support,you can only have one S rank,and you could choose whether it be romantic or not,so there would be no need to decide sexuality for the main character at all. I don't mean them making confessions to you and you denying them either. I mean like choosing the S-support before viewing it like "platonic" or "romantic",this could totally work between a male and a female character too,so you could have paired non-romantic endings. Sound good or do you find a flaw in this idea perhaps...? It's very likely,I'm only human,I make mistakes ^^

Also,to everyone,yes,I personally think IS would've failed in the romance aspect of the game if they won't include same-sex romance on some level(even IF only implied),but not the game,the game could STILL be amazeballs. I'll just not play for supports. I'll play for story and strategy. :) (or play as F!Kamui).

Would choosing whether the S support is platonic or romantic change the details of the conversation?

If no, then there would literally be no difference between the two.

If yes, then you are essentially saying that characters who are otherwise straight would go gay for Kamui because of that irresistible mysterious charisma? Going with your idea that same-sex romantic options would be limited to Kamui only. Don't toy with the emotions of your fellow soldiers like that!

[NekoKnight]

I've already said it once,but I'm not the one making the game, Kamui should have a set pool of romantic supprots,and a set pool of friendships support,you can only have one S rank,and you could choose whether it be romantic or not,so there would be no need to decide sexuality for the main character at all. I don't mean them making confessions to you and you denying them either. I mean like choosing the S-support before viewing it like "platonic" or "romantic",this could totally work between a male and a female character too,so you could have paired non-romantic endings. Sound good or do you find a flaw in this idea perhaps...? It's very likely,I'm only human,I make mistakes ^^

I dunno, deciding on the spot whether you want to take the last support in a romantic direction or not seems a little awkward. I think it would be interesting if all paired endings, be they romantic or not, were marked with S supports, but they will probably only do it for romantic ones, if S supports come back at all. I'd rather set my sexuality up from the start and let the game tell me who's interested, rather than pick and choose at the final support.

[ColdHeartAndASummerDream]

Would choosing whether the S support is platonic or romantic change the details of the conversation?

If no, then there would literally be no difference between the two.

If yes, then you are essentially saying that characters who are otherwise straight would go gay for Kamui because of that irresistible mysterious charisma? Going with your idea that same-sex romantic options would be limited to Kamui only. Don't toy with the emotions of your fellow soldiers like that!

It would work for the soldiers who were gay/ bi too,duh,because there would only be maybe 4-5~ish on each side,around 10-20%,would be (apparently) statistically correct.

I dunno, deciding on the spot whether you want to take the last support in a romantic direction or not seems a little awkward. I think it would be interesting if all paired endings, be they romantic or not, were marked with S supports, but they will probably only do it for romantic ones, if S supports come back at all. I'd rather set my sexuality up from the start and let the game tell me who's interested, rather than pick and choose at the final support.

Eh,that could work too,I'm really not too worried how they do it,honestly,as long as I have the choice to do so,though I don't want it to impede on those who don't want it either.

[goodperson707]

Also,to everyone,yes,I personally think IS would've failed in the romance aspect of the game if they won't include same-sex romance on some level(even IF only implied),but not the game,the game could STILL be amazeballs. I'll just not play for supports. I'll play for story and strategy. :) (or play as F!Kamui).

Nearly every game that has left japan, seemed to at least to me to have at least one pairing Implying same sex romance, including awakening, wether or not they have a paired ending just affects how blatant it is, which i don't think it needs to be spelled out to be there.

[Bovinian]

It would work for the soldiers who were gay/ bi too,duh,because there would only be maybe 4-5~ish on each side,around 10-20%,would be (apparently) statistically correct.

Yeah, I mentioned something like this earlier in the thread, that it could potentially work as long as there were a couple characters who are canonically gay/bi.

I was just trying to point out the flaw in "including same-sex marriage for Kamui at the very least" since by the way that's worded, it implies that the people that would be able to have a homosexual relationship with Kamui would not normally do so with anyone else.

[ColdHeartAndASummerDream]

Yeah, I mentioned something like this earlier in the thread, that it could potentially work as long as there were a couple characters who are canonically gay/bi.

I was just trying to point out the flaw in "including same-sex marriage for Kamui at the very least" since by the way that's worded, it implies that the people that would be able to have a homosexual relationship with Kamui would not normally do so with anyone else.

That luckily wasn't what I meant,and am sorry if it came out that way ^^

[Venterqua]

When you say plenty, you mean plenty, official, or plenty, independent stuff ? There is a big difference.

Also, Attack on Titan, it was a blink and miss moment, I had to look closer to even ask myself 'Oh, they are in love ?

Maybe there is more and more acceptance toward it in Japan, doesn't change the fact that, one, it's illegal, and two, it's still treated poorly. Ie what Neko and HF said. Not gonna repeat it. :p

Am I the only who find that talking about homosexual marriage in Fire Emblem is somewhat stupid ? I mean, Fire emblem is a series where making children is a gameplay-mechanic. Gameplay. Mechanic.

Also, it's a medieval setting. I doupt that this time was kind to homosexual people.

I'm not sure who you're talking about in AoT (I have my suspicions) as I'm hella behind, but I distinctly remember Reiner and Ymir talking about how gay they are.

And illegal and treated poorly? Sounds like most of America ~5-10 years ago and still some parts of USA today. That didn't really stop the amount of gay media at that time. And it's funny how they say that but homosexual inclusiveness has basically been confirmed for the next Tomodachi Life if I'm not mistaken.

Yes. A gameplay mechanic. In 2 games. Out of 13. That has yet to be confirmed in this installment.

And 1, that depends on exactly where you're talking about. Different cultures, different norms. 2, this is a fantasy setting of IS's own creation so they can include whatever relationships they choose.

All that being said, I'm still not hopeful. I don't think there's an actual good reason to not include other sexualities in IF, as it could definitely work, but IS doesn't need a good reason cause its their game. Oh well, maybe they'll surprise me.

[Book Bro]

Regarding gay options

There's no reason to think children will be back even if marriage as a gameplay mechanic is, so using that as a reason for not including the option doesn't make sense.

"Gay marriage isn't realistic to the setting": it's not a real setting, it's a fictional world, so they're free to say it's common for the world of FEif. Even then, I'm sure people would be fine with just gay relationships and not marriages.

I think the best way would be to have one or two gay characters of each gender that Kamui can support. You can write the first three supports in a way that just builds a friendship for those who "don't want it shoved in their face". I'm no expert on Japanese social issues but I doubt there would be much backlash to something like that.

[goodperson707]

^ uh I'm not so sure, at least to me actually stating it outright either in S supports or endings is a very big step or at least will be seen as such, even though most of the NA released fire emblems had the subject danced around, and had same sex pairings that were quite possibly romantic/sexual (some played for laughs others not so much)actually stating that outright is a big step for any form of media. A good amount of characters in media today seem to me to have their sexuality not stated in the work but implied in it than clarified via creators or actors comments.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

Makalov, I'm genuinely curious about this: why? There's something you know?

What. Can you explain this, please?

well the main reason for this statement goes along side the fact that its illegal, also that Japan's birthrate is at an all time low so to say, heck assuming they maintain their stance on outsiders, which isn't positive mind you and if that birthrate stays the same? we're looking at japan dying out as a country in about 1000 years or so, it might happen sooner with people moving to other countrys, i dunno thats far further stuff.

i have the feeling that japan is trying to do everything it can to raise its birthrate, acknowledging something like homosexuality or gay marriage in a brand of media, a popular one at that (video games, fire emblem in general in big overthere) would very much hurt that goal for them, i shouldn't have to describe how so, not to mention as another user said, its shown as comedy or as a deviant activity, i'm not sure you'd want your homosexual romance to be shown in those lights, but as in a serious and loving relationship, something we just aren't going to get from japan.

main reason why i mentioned VN's is because thats a small market in japan that really only effects the massive otakus that are never going to marry a real girl anyways, and despite what you might hear, Otaku and stuff are a very minority in japan, also did i mention that otaku is a negative overthere? cause it is.

japan's just a very different country with its own set of flaws and problems, its not my country of america where gay relationships are accepted in some areas and even have gay marriage. i want to say this as unironically as possible, but i got the feeling some people don't recognize how good they have it.

[ColdHeartAndASummerDream]

well the main reason for this statement goes along side the fact that its illegal, also that Japan's birthrate is at an all time low so to say, heck assuming they maintain their stance on outsiders, which isn't positive mind you and if that birthrate stays the same? we're looking at japan dying out as a country in about 1000 years or so, it might happen sooner with people moving to other countrys, i dunno thats far further stuff.

i have the feeling that japan is trying to do everything it can to raise its birthrate, acknowledging something like homosexuality or gay marriage in a brand of media, a popular one at that (video games, fire emblem in general in big overthere) would very much hurt that goal for them, i shouldn't have to describe how so, not to mention as another user said, its shown as comedy or as a deviant activity, i'm not sure you'd want your homosexual romance to be shown in those lights, but as in a serious and loving relationship, something we just aren't going to get from japan.

main reason why i mentioned VN's is because thats a small market in japan that really only effects the massive otakus that are never going to marry a real girl anyways, and despite what you might hear, Otaku and stuff are a very minority in japan, also did i mention that otaku is a negative overthere? cause it is.

japan's just a very different country with its own set of flaws and problems, its not my country of america where gay relationships are accepted in some areas and even have gay marriage. i want to say this as unironically as possible, but i got the feeling some people don't recognize how good they have it.

Otaku here and otaku there are totally different. It's not just that they are viewed different,what we see as Otakus are very,very common in Japan,whilst their type of Otaku isn't at all,if I understood correctly,which -i may not have.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

Otaku here and otaku there are totally different. It's not just that they are viewed different,what we see as Otakus are very,very common in Japan,whilst their type of Otaku isn't at all,if I understood correctly,which -i may not have.

nah you got that correct, the otaku we have overseas are different then what they have, or at least i think that's the case, that i'm not 100% sure of.

[Neofranky]

Let's be honest here, someone here actually believed for a second that gay marriage would be in the game? Why should it be in?

[mikethepokemaster]

Let's be honest here, someone here actually believed for a second that gay marriage would be in the game? Why should it be in?

Nindendo is a family friendly corperation so gay relationships was already out of the question. If some fans are gay just play the gender your not.

Edited May 29, 2015 by mikethepokemaster

[Zerosabers]

Nindendo is a family friendly corperation so gay relationships was already out of the question. If some fans are gay just play the gender your not.

Being a family friendly corporation has nothing to do with gay relationships. Especially when they already confirmed it will be in tomodachi life 2.

And saying "just play as the gender you're not" is just stupid. A gay couple isn't trying to imitate heterosexuality, a man and woman together are vastly different than two women or two men. Playing as the opposite gender solves absolutely nothing.

[Raguna]

While I agree that playing as the opposite gender serves absolutely nothing, I do not believe Fire Emblem if will try to add gay pairings. As you have said, the next tomodachi life will include them, but I do not think they would risk doing anything with that particular demographic until after they see the reception and sales of that game which hasn't been released yet.

Maybe a future FE game could include such pairings, but I do not believe it will be this one.

[mikethepokemaster]

Being a family friendly corporation has nothing to do with gay relationships. Especially when they already confirmed it will be in tomodachi life 2.

And saying "just play as the gender you're not" is just stupid. A gay couple isn't trying to imitate heterosexuality, a man and woman together are vastly different than two women or two men. Playing as the opposite gender solves absolutely nothing.

You sound offended by that didn't mean to make you angery. Well it all up to nindendo if they want gay or homosexual characters.

[Espella]

What if they actually made marriage realistic to the time period and you arrange marriages to gain political alliances?

Third path confirmed marrying off all of the Hoshido and Nohr royal family to each other.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Gay marriage is illegal in Japan.

Ewww.

Yet, i dont see how we cant have ambiguous same-sex S supports. They dont have to outright state that its super romantic. All they gotta do is put some subtext in there.

Also this doesnt necessarily mean there is no romance. It just means if it exists, its not going to be the same as Awakening's. S supports can still happen. So can confession scenes. (if same-sex, it doesnt have to be overtly romantic) Its just not going to say "Husband/Wife" on the status screen, maybe. Paired endings have always been a thing since supports have been a thing. So im almost positive paired endings will happen. Given how PairUp is back with probably the exact same support mechanic as Awakening, well...kinda leads people to think there could be romancing and match making. We just dont need to pair for skills and children characters. (thank the gods for that.)

What if they actually made marriage realistic to the time period and you arrange marriages to gain political alliances?

Tbh, im rooting for this really freaking hard, and is the reason i advocate Nohr Royals/Kamui pairings.

Edited May 30, 2015 by Loki Laufeyson