SFMafia's Greatest Hits - Day 6

[Elieson]

If I was wrong on the Prims claim then I guess marth is though honestly I haven't got much on him and would have to read him later tonight. I've just been so confident after yesterphase that BBM/Gaius was scum that I didn't think to look into marth and I townread prims a bit more so ATM BBM/marth

[Prims]

I mean I posted an entire wall of text about why Marth doesn't make sense as scum, how do you explain everything in that post?

[Elieson]

How is omega scum because a hatedmaker/mayorenabler could exist BBM?

[Elieson]

Your huge wall is based on Gilgamesh being predictable. I'll check that out later but Im not inclined to autobelieve it on a skim though

[Elieson]

BBM I think omegas play has been far from stellar but I find itsuper hard to believe that town just doesn't have a delegate protection role

[Elieson]

Also you went from your only case on me being PoE to suddenly having a variety of cases on me, that's what I meant by anything that'd stick

[BBM]

I didn't say that Omega is scum because a hatedmaker/anonmayor could exist. I said that since a hatedmaker/anonmayor does exist means that there's no requirement for Omega's role to exist. Regardless of whether it does or not, the inclusion in Gaius's PM makes sense.

cases I added on you today:

your role action claims not making sense- based on today's info of your action claims

your inconsistency in treating protective roleclaims- based partially on your posts yesterday but also partially on today's info of you claiming a 1x protective role ability

[BBM]

also I guess:

your posts wrt Omega- based on yesterday's info but not completely since he's also a protective roleclaim

and I can add another one:

your inability to find a target other than me- based on today's info

[Prims]

marf / snike / yolo where are you guys I wanna get this shit done, ideally before my day is fully consumed by touhou and I'm too tired to think

YOLO still owes me an Elie read from late D4.....

[Bluedoom]

Prims, IIRC you suspected weapons when he claimed his scan because scum could have possibly had a bookie.

Since we have a c;aim with a bookie shot and you think they're scum, what are your thoughts on Weaponsnike?

[🔥YOLOSWAG🔥]

ill get to you soon prims. that gaius lynch was too terrible for me to tolerate. bbm can get bodied as well

[Prims]

Prims, IIRC you suspected weapons when he claimed his scan because scum could have possibly had a bookie.

Since we have a c;aim with a bookie shot and you think they're scum, what are your thoughts on Weaponsnike?

that was my only theory for why Weapons might fakeclaim a guilty on a town slot. we now know the guilty wasn't fake so it's not relevant.

[Elieson]

I mean I posted an entire wall of text about why Marth doesn't make sense as scum, how do you explain everything in that post?

just finished dinner with kids and i just remembered this

If Marth isn't scum and Snike isn't scum and you aren't scum and omega isn't scum then logically according to you I'm scum and BBM's scum but you're bent on voting me which is making me really unconfident in my TR for you because looking back you spent much of yesterphase/this phase himming and hawwing on BBM and half of your reasons of clearing marth are based on roleclaim stuff. That part I don't have a problem with (the roleclaim stuff) but the other half of it is interactions with Gilgamesh that really aren't worth what you say they are when it all banks on Gilgamesh not bussing, which you can't really prove. It's a huge assumption to clear somebody with and you suddenly waffling on him because of the same rolespec that you used to clear him doesn't maintain consistency and looks like a slip

Granted, I can see marth being more clear on interactions, but it seems just sort of tacked on when looking at your case because you mention it one time and now you're waffling on the other 50% of your own case of his innocence.

my thoughts on marth now that I quickly ISO'd him boil down to him not really posting nonsense being pretty meta!TownMarth, and valid interactions with Gilgamesh (from the slot) that prims stated, that I agree with now that I read more closely into it. I also agree with his sentiments on Omega in terms of having a townie claim but just bad&scummy play (very distracting, not contributing, density of posts including more fluff than content)

Comparatively speaking, Marth is more town by comparison, so I'd have to go with scum!BBM and scum!Prims

I'm not throwing out every idea to get you lynched. If I was I wouldn't have said that you being on both the early lynch wagons wasn't a definitive reason for you being scum. The fact that you went from pushing Omega over play and too many protective role claims to being so positive he isn't scum is what's making me suspect you.

Elie, who do you think is my buddy? You don't think Omega is scum and you don't think Snike is scum. Do you even have a case on Prims?

even if Omega IS town, there still has to be some sort of hatedmaker or anonymous mayor in the game or something, as proved by two early lynches. So there's no reason for Omega being town based on Gaius' flip (which mentioned Mayor, hated, and loved).

1. It just bothers me that you went from yesterphase just saying "i townread everyone else so Elie's scum, I can't even explain it and I'm not really confident in it". You also said in that same post that nobody would vote for omega except for me, despite me stating earlier that I townread Omega for his claim, after an initial one time scumread on omega (after claim) on his claim by only looking at roles and not his content. I'll give you that you weren't throwing every idea out, but having you go from having no coherent case on me to suddenly all of these reasons just makes it look like you're sticking to your posts yesterday and it seems really really forced

2. Also in response to this, i just said it above but it was an initial reaction and after thinking about it I didn't actually think he would be scum!fakeclaiming hated doc

I'm not that confident in my thoughts via prims but I actually have something, which is more than I have towards Marth (see above) so I'm going with that.

3. Town!HatedDoc Omega could not exist after Gaius' flip? This idea doesn't even make sense because it reads like you're just deathtunneling Omega because you haven't seen a flip that you're looking for. This basically reads as "Whether or not Omega is Town, Gaius still existed and the vote shenanigans happened so Omega just can't be town". Do you suspect that he's the hated maker that you're looking for?

cases I added on you today:

your role action claims not making sense- based on today's info of your action claims

your inconsistency in treating protective roleclaims- based partially on your posts yesterday but also partially on today's info of you claiming a 1x protective role ability

re N1 Idle | I don't think using my one-shot rolecop on a randoscan when I was already not following the game all that much due to life issues is that hard to accept. Given the setup, there's little it would get me since it's not like I'd be rando'ing an alliance check (which I'd consider doing)

re N2 Rolecop | I had a reason to target J. I didn't have much reason to target anybody else except to maybe check validity on weapons/Snike (which wouldn't give me alignment confirmation anyway, since I figured anything else would either come out of the woodwork or he'd get NK'd anyway honestly). I also didn't have much reason to save it since I dunno, my other shots weren't doing me much at the time since I didn't even know where to begin considering how to use my decoy or bookie at the time

re N3 Idle; I didn't have any reason to use a shot on a night i assumed it would be wasted on because of J's claim and the outcome if he ended up living until D4

re N4; Bookie | BBM i was scumreading you by phase end yesterphase. Why would I go and target somebody who I said I was townreading?

My night actions might not make sense to you, or you're just bothered by what I did because it wasn't what you would do. Can you say with the utmost confidence that the former is 100% what you're trying to say?

I'll bite on this (continued below)

also I guess:

your posts wrt Omega- based on yesterday's info but not completely since he's also a protective roleclaim

and I can add another one:

your inability to find a target other than me- based on today's info

I'll bite on that too (even though it's more or less the same thing) since at first I did consider him faking before taking it seriously

Now that I've actually been able to sit down and read, I've formed an opinion. I've been out and about since pretty much right after phase start moving a friend into their new house and spent hours moving boxes and furniture, posting where I could. My mind wasn't really set where it should've been for figuring out things for the game

Still, what about yesterday's case that you're just trying to keep going today?

[Elieson]

wow that was longer than I thought it'd be considering offspring is still awake and active

tl;dr

scumteam = bbm+prims

[Prims]

ill get to you soon prims. that gaius lynch was too terrible for me to tolerate. bbm can get bodied as well

I mean you could have made like, any effort at all to stop it.

Elie was also on the Gaius wagon. When are you going to read him?

[Bluedoom]

After some thought, I think Omega+Eli is likely, next to that I'd put Omega+Prims.

Omega+BBM doesn't make sense as a scumteam at all given their D3 and D4 votes and general attitude towards each other. I think Omega's scummier of the two, so that leads me to believe BBM is town. I guess BBM's role of being delayed motivator is p weak as he'd have like what, two people to actually motivate?

If you wanna know why I find Omega scummy, its obvious: He has been BSing the game throughout and Gorf died last night. There's just no way this should've happened unless Omega decided to pull the finger on Gorf and doc someone else. Quite the troll, eh?

Wrt Prims, he's a mixed bag compared to Eli. because there are actions like you know, actually being vocal about Gilg's scumminess, and defending me yesterday which don't make a lot of sense coming from scum, and then there's actions like trying to case weapons at the time when he claimed his scan that just seemed really contrived Also obvsly biased on my part but defending Omega would be a pretty reliable play at this point if he was his buddy since it'd be a lot easy to defend a doc claim and push mislynches from here. Also he hinted that there was more to his role earlier but he's now just a lynchproof. I'm confused as to what this claim is about- on one hand, if he was ever going to be lynched and he hadn't claimed it, that'd be scummy as fuck, but on the other hand, he wasn't under any threat of being lynched anytime soon, so that just makes it look unnecessary???

Now about Eli. I feel like he has been inconsistent with his treatment of the protective claims, just like BBM said. But aside from that, his Night Action claims are shady. I don't understand why you'd USE YOUR INFO ROLE SHOT ON A GUY THAT MADE SOMEONE'S ACTION FAIL. I'm also not a fan of the predict target, or the N1 idle. Ideally this would've been a town claim since scum JoaT flipped, but the fact that he can't even prove all of his actions just makes it suspicious.

[Prims]

seriously yolo you are not in the position to say the gaius wagon was "too terrible to tolerate"

Gaius' full-claim didn't match up with his actions and looked awful to me in context. if you disagreed you should have made literally any attempt to sway people away from that direction other than just asking me why I wasn't voting BBM. even if you thought BBM and I were scum, Gorf and Elie also wanted that lynch and you haven't seemed to exactly be pushing them.

If you were the one person townreading Gaius then don't get on my case for this when you sat there and let him get lynched after claiming a power role. Hell, when you complained about my vote I responded and was willing to work with you!! This is hella frustrating because you're in a position where you're almost certainly town but you're barely playing the game. that's annoying enough when I'm not getting voted because of it.

once again what are you even doing.

[Bluedoom]

Also I'm not really holding the Gaius lynch against anyone atm because lets admit it, the way he handled his Hannah inspect was dumb and scummy.

I guess Elieson going over the top and accusing Gaius of quickhammering to put the town in confusion is a stretch, though.

[Prims]

marf, what do you think about BBM / Elie as buddies?

why was it "wrong" to scumread Weapons on day 2?

I implied there was more to my role to keep scum on their toes so I'd be a potential kill target if they were hunting for power roles. I claimed it because it's effectively negative utility and is also designed to make me look bad whenever I claim it so I thought I'd get it out of the way when it was active.

[Elieson]

holy crap i just realized omega claimed doc in his claimpost not hated doc despite it being d4 and him having no reason to out the superhated part

[BBM]

@Elie- I... don't think you get what I mean about Omega's hated claim and the Gaius flip. I'm not saying it's a reason he's scum, I'm saying it's not a valid reason for him being scum.

I still would have randed on N1 even if I had no clue what was going on, but I guess there are reasons for idling. And I'll admit I didn't realize how early in D4 you switched to Omega being town, so the Bookie target is okay I guess.

BUT wrt your N2 action- I call bs. Asking J one question about his Eclipse vibes was like the entire extent of your interactions with him on D2; choosing to target him out of curiosity makes no sense. Your main D2 scumread was Hannah; you could have targeted her to verify she was only a Neighbour, or you could have targeted Omega or Marth, who were secondary suspicions. Hell, you could have targeted Prims, who you'd suspected earlier in D2 though had dropped by the end mostly.

@prims- tbf omega did say something like "gaius's play doesn't match up at all with his play from when we were scumbuddies" but he didn't push it much.

it's funny that in one line in #886 omega gave more reasons for scumreading prims than he has for scumreading my slot over the entire game.

[Prims]

even if you thought BBM and I were scum, Gorf and Elie also wanted that lynch and you haven't seemed to exactly be pushing them.

or actually BBM wasn't on the wagon. still don't understand why you would just ignore Gorf and Elie if you thought they were town lynching town.

[BBM]

"I'm not saying it's a reason he's scum; I'm saying it's not a valid reason for him being town" is what I meant to say

[Prims]

BBM, given Marf's BPV is only going to activate on nights Shinori can't kill, why would Shinori have a failsafe ability for his kills failing triggered only by the rogue and a 1-shot roleblocker? (and I guess Elie's 1-shot doc but like come on)

I am trying really hard to rationalize a doc not being in this set-up but it just fits in too well with the info we've been given.

[Prims]

I want to just lynch Elieson though.

- Elie has dropped his reads and picked them back up several times over the course of the game. His questions aren't provoking and are usually aimed toward players he's not focusing on. He's lacked presence while people have been dismissing him and has made no strong pushes over the course of the entire game.

- Elie has been on both the wagons that were mysteriously hammered early and has claimed flavor from a game notorious for quickhammers.

- The part of Elie's role that would be the hardest to prove (possibly, Decoy could be a scum role since I doubt they have a full-time RB) is the one that fizzled out. scanning a null read is whatever but why pick the one who somebody's action had previously failed on?