Swirl-Theory Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Agreed with you SO FUCKING HARD on everything. I don't care what people want to do on their own game file. However, I quite dislike double standards and hypocrisy, such as someone declaring their little sisters to be pure and innocent and need to be protected, while screaming that the little brothers are their husbando and they want to bang them. From a female perspective, I do think Sakura and Elise are adorable and need to be protected, while simultaneously wanting to marry the little bros. However, if any guy wants to marry Sakura/Elise then go right ahead, there is literally nothing wrong with that. I don't get why so many people shame others about wanting to marry the little sisters when there isn't anything forceful about marrying them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 So it sounds like the fucked-up power dynamics between sexes that I'd desperately want to see gone. In which case, either upscale every kid-looking character's age, or leave them all alone. As for what I'd do to the royal brothers. . .I'd totally braid Takumi's hair, ask Ryoma for tennis cooking lessons, needle Leo, and attempt to teach Xander how to swim! yarr. I want to put things on Marxander's head, discuss the beauty and dynamics of gothic romance novels with Leo (he'd dig it), ask Takumi how to archery, and compare swords with Ryoma. I also have drawn the line in the sand that im not S supporting Hoshidan siblings. One of my MUs is S supporting Camilla but he is not a self-insert and i am going to write a fanfic about him and Conquest. Kinda GoT style tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiance Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 yarr. I want to put things on Marxander's head, discuss the beauty and dynamics of gothic romance novels with Leo (he'd dig it), ask Takumi how to archery, and compare swords with Ryoma. I also have drawn the line in the sand that im not S supporting Hoshidan siblings. One of my MUs is S supporting Camilla but he is not a self-insert and i am going to write a fanfic about him and Conquest. Kinda GoT style tbh Imagine this as the supports. That would actually be a great idea. Yato vs Rajinto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) From a female perspective, I do think Sakura and Elise are adorable and need to be protected, while simultaneously wanting to marry the little bros. However, if any guy wants to marry Sakura/Elise then go right ahead, there is literally nothing wrong with that. I don't get why so many people shame others about wanting to marry the little sisters when there isn't anything forceful about marrying them. From a female perspective, I find it hypocritical or perhaps inherently sexist that little sisters need to be protected while little brothers can be banged. Takumi and Leon can't be more than 18, it's quite possible that they're closer to 16-17, so it's not like they're super adult anyway. Like I said, I don't care what people do on their own game because it's none of my fucking business. My issue comes when I start seeing double standards. I feel that I can at least understand if people don't try to hide behind some half-assed excuses and just flat out admit that they want to get with a character they like. But I have seen people try to pull stupid hypocritical justifications as to why one thing is okay and another thing that is virtually identical to the first thing isn't. Edited February 10, 2016 by Sunwoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) While that's true, I am honestly very disappointed that so many fans don't give a fuck about the fact that this game was SUPPOSED to be about siblings, not siblings who happened to be fuckable and not related to you and the game continues to act like you're related and the truth of your non-relations never comes up. I mean, wow, I look at the fan art about this game and you'd think the entire point of this game was to marry and have kids instead of a game that was trying to tell a story about family and loyalty vs. blood. I guess what pisses me off the most is that people put romance so above any other relationship ties that they're HAPPY that the game sacrifices its theme as long as they get to bang who they want. Preach it. I'd be kind of okay if it was only the Nohrian siblings, as long as it was done in a tasteful and mature manner (which it wasn't), but breaking the core themes present in the advertisement over their knees by making the Hoshidan siblings not actually related to you because waifus and husbandos was pretty tasteless. Although, I must shamefully admit that I'm a little bias and hypocritcal about this. I mean, I still ship KamuixAzura after ​slaughtering and devouring the essences of a thousand virgins to satiate my bloodlust in a fit of raw, unadulterated rage taking some deep breaths and counting to ten after the reveal that they were cousins. Edited February 10, 2016 by Phillius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swirl-Theory Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 From a female perspective, I find it hypocritical or perhaps inherently sexist that little sisters need to be protected while little brothers can be banged. Takumi and Leon can't be more than 18, it's quite possible that they're closer to 16-17, so it's not like they're super adult anyway. Like I said, I don't care what people do on their own game because it's none of my fucking business. My issue comes when I start seeing double standards. When I said "need to be protected" I meant in a sisterly way (from my perspective) since I don't see them in a "romantic" light so to speak. I'll never be making a male file since I have no desire to marry girls, therefore I treat Elise and Sakura as if they were my own little sisters. I'm aware that Leon and Takumi are pretty young themselves, but being attracted to those characters it's not like I would care anyways since they're obviously ok with your character marrying them. And as I sated as well, it's the same way if you're a guy and planning to marry Sakura or Elise, there is nothing wrong with that at all and people screaming about it being so wrong are just ridiculous tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 PHILLIUS THAT IS SPOILERS, PLEASE COVER IT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) Although, I must shamefully admit that I'm a little bias and hypocritcal about this. I mean, I still ship KamuixAzura after ​slaughtering and devouring the essences of a thousand virgins to satiate my bloodlust in a fit of raw, unadulterated rage taking some deep breaths and counting to ten after the reveal that they were cousins. Ugh, I do NOT understand they they even did this, seriously. It doesn't change the story at all. No one reacts to it or even cares about it. The reveal is utterly pointless and the only thing it really does is make certain people go "WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK". The ONLY thing that makes it less obnoxious than Kamui/siblings is that Kamui and Aqua never saw each other as family. The biggest problem with Kamui/siblings is that the siblings (or at least the younger ones) grew up with Kamui as if they were family or at the very least were told and always believed they were family. Feelings do not shift from familial to romantic just because you find out that you're not related. More so, the premise of Kamui being not blood-related exists ONLY to let Kamui marry the siblings. It's not like you ever find out otherwise! @Swirl-Theory: And I think you're very obviously missing my point. Completely. Edited February 10, 2016 by Sunwoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 I'm walking into shakey territory because I won't lie I basically was a big hypocrite about the little brothers (Takumi included, for a while I wanted to marry him super hard because I essentually thought he was attractive. Now I basically have different biases I'd guess. Now I don't... really care. I basically have one OTP for most of the siblings anyway) I kinda wanna know when the decision to make them S-rankable happened in story happened among the writers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swirl-Theory Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) Ugh, I do NOT understand they they even did this, seriously. It doesn't change the story at all. No one reacts to it or even cares about it. The reveal is utterly pointless and the only thing it really does is make certain people go "WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK". The ONLY thing that makes it less obnoxious than Kamui/siblings is that Kamui and Aqua never saw each other as family. The biggest problem with Kamui/siblings is that the siblings (or at least the younger ones) grew up with Kamui as if they were family or at the very least were told and always believed they were family. Feelings do not shift from familial to romantic just because you find out that you're not related. More so, the premise of Kamui being not blood-related exists ONLY to let Kamui marry the siblings. It's not like you ever find out otherwise! @Swirl-Theory: And I think you're very obviously missing my point. Completely. I wasn't implying that you were saying that it was wrong to marry the little sisters or anything, I just wanted to point out that there are some people that can want to protect the little sisters while still thinking that there is nothing wrong with marrying them. And as for the incest thing Not that it would've mattered with damn Leon since he still had feelings for his own blood sister, it's not that much of a stretch for him to have feelings for his other sister whom he thought was blood related as well. They seriously did not have to add this bit in, it was pointless just like the Corrin/Azura cousin reveal. Edited February 10, 2016 by Swirl-Theory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 PHILLIUS THAT IS SPOILERS, PLEASE COVER IT. Sorry, my bad. I've gotten lax about this kinda stuff. Ugh, I do NOT understand they they even did this, seriously. It doesn't change the story at all. No one reacts to it or even cares about it. The reveal is utterly pointless and the only thing it really does is make certain people go "WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK". The ONLY thing that makes it less obnoxious than Kamui/siblings is that Kamui and Aqua never saw each other as family. The biggest problem with Kamui/siblings is that the siblings (or at least the younger ones) grew up with Kamui as if they were family or at the very least were told and always believed they were family. Feelings do not shift from familial to romantic just because you find out that you're not related. More so, the premise of Kamui being not blood-related exists ONLY to let Kamui marry the siblings. It's not like you ever find out otherwise! I can kind of excuse Camilla and Xander, because they were probably old enough that it would've been to late for the Westermarck Effect to have taken place. I'd also forgive Elise and Leo if they actually acknowledged that those feelings were both taboo and incest in spirit, but it looks like that they're just going 'oh, not related. Cool, lets bang' with no consideration for the fact that the viewed each other as family. I won't comment any further on the surprise cousin reveal (this is meant to be a SFW blog after all) other than that it was stupid and never should've happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ehrzeth Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) I wasn't implying that you were saying that it was wrong to marry the little sisters or anything, I just wanted to point out that there are some people that can want to protect the little sisters while still thinking that there is nothing wrong with marrying them. And as for the incest thing Not that it would've mattered with damn Leon since he still had feelings for his own blood sister, it's not that much of a stretch for him to have feelings for his other sister whom he thought was blood related as well. They seriously did not have to add this bit in, it was pointless just like the Corrin/Azura cousin reveal. [ /spoiler] that last paragraph please Edited February 10, 2016 by Ehrzeth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swirl-Theory Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) [ /spoiler] that last paragraph please Yeah, thanks. Edited, I completely missed the last one, sorry. Edited February 10, 2016 by Swirl-Theory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomalocaris Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 I can kind of excuse Camilla and Xander, because they were probably old enough that it would've been to late for the Westermarck Effect to have taken place. I'd also forgive Elise and Leo if they actually acknowledged that those feelings were both taboo and incest in spirit, but it looks like that they're just going 'oh, not related. Cool, lets bang' with no consideration for the fact that the viewed each other as family. While Camilla and Xander wouldn't have the Westermarck Effect in place, Corrin logically should if they were kidnapped before they were about six years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 While Camilla and Xander wouldn't have the Westermarck Effect in place, Corrin logically should if they were kidnapped before they were about six years old. Unless I'm mistaken, six is when it stops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nordopolica Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Ugh, I do NOT understand they they even did this, seriously. It doesn't change the story at all. No one reacts to it or even cares about it. The reveal is utterly pointless and the only thing it really does is make certain people go "WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK". The ONLY thing that makes it less obnoxious than Kamui/siblings is that Kamui and Aqua never saw each other as family. The biggest problem with Kamui/siblings is that the siblings (or at least the younger ones) grew up with Kamui as if they were family or at the very least were told and always believed they were family. Feelings do not shift from familial to romantic just because you find out that you're not related. More so, the premise of Kamui being not blood-related exists ONLY to let Kamui marry the siblings. It's not like you ever find out otherwise! @Swirl-Theory: And I think you're very obviously missing my point. Completely. I completely understand and agree with you on this!!!!!!!1 The fact that any semblance of integrity within the game's very promising premise is lost upon the S-Rank-exclusive reveal is kind of infuriating, and yet you know the brothers are going to be the most popular "husbandos" (especially, from what I've seen, Leo and Takumi) so the fandom will be absolutely flooded with those pairings, just like it was with Chrom. No one will care that they're Corrin's brothers because it's cute and they're tsunderes and the game lets you. I'm not even mad at the people who do it, I'm mad at IS for thinking they could have the best of both worlds on this one and for the most part everyone going along with it. Even if I'm not going to marry any of them myself, I'm kind of meh when it comes to the older siblings (except Hinoka, sort of) because it's very possible they never thought of Corrin as a sibling, but still that opens the door of Corrin's weird fetishisms since he/she seems to have been lusting after their supposed sibling. Hell, the nail in the coffin is even if you marry one of the younger siblings, they'll continue to call you Big Brother or Big Sister throughout the game. It's like the game's main storyline and its fucking waifuisms exist in completely separate worlds that never interact, which contributes to the overall clusterfuck of identity crises that is Fates. Whatever, I'm salty and passionate and tired of work. Please forgive me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) I wasn't implying that you were saying that it was wrong to marry the little sisters or anything, I just wanted to point out that there are some people that can want to protect the little sisters while still thinking that there is nothing wrong with marrying them. And as for the incest thing Not that it would've mattered with damn Leon since he still had feelings for his own blood sister, it's not that much of a stretch for him to have feelings for his other sister whom he thought was blood related as well. They seriously did not have to add this bit in, it was pointless just like the Corrin/Azura cousin reveal. STILL NOT THE POINT I'M TRYING TO MAKE ;/ Besides, at least Leon can't bone Camilla, regardless of his feelings for her. While they certainly didn't need to throw it in there, he can't marry her in the scope of the game and may possibly be explained by Westermarcke. But more importantly, he can't marry her. Seeing someone as your sibling is more important than just the blood that you share. Leon sees f!Kamui just as much as his sister as he sees Camilla. And yet, because Kamui is the SUPER SPESHUL SELF-INSERT WHO'S NOT REALLY RELATED people are SOOOO in love with it ;/ EDIT: @nordopolica: I find it hard to believe that EVERY SINGLE ONE of Kamui's siblings would reciprocate feelings as well. For the Hoshido siblings, while one could argue that Kamui falling in love with them can make sense because Kamui didn't even realize they existed until recently, the younger three Hoshidan siblings at the least have grown up believing Kamui was their true sibling. Who says they reciprocate? And the younger two Nohrian siblings at least may well have grown up WITH Kamui, who says they reciprocate? This game just fucked up hard by trying to let people have their cake and eat it too. Speaking of which, I just had some cake. It is WAY too fucking sweet and I don't want to eat it all, nor can I. Which is basically the Fates cake. Edited February 10, 2016 by Sunwoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 STILL NOT THE POINT I'M TRYING TO MAKE ;/ Besides, at least Leon can't bone Camilla, regardless of his feelings for her. While they certainly didn't need to throw it in there, he can't marry her in the scope of the game and may possibly be explained by Westermarcke. But more importantly, he can't marry her. Seeing someone as your sibling is more important than just the blood that you share. Leon sees f!Kamui just as much as his sister as he sees Camilla. And yet, because Kamui is the SUPER SPESHUL SELF-INSERT WHO'S NOT REALLY RELATED people are SOOOO in love with it ;/ Honestly I'm more surprised people didn't care in the English fandom then they did in the Japanese fandom. I thought that would have been frowned upon way more here then... well... there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Honestly I'm more surprised people didn't care in the English fandom then they did in the Japanese fandom. I thought that would have been frowned upon way more here then... well... there. From what I'd heard, the people who were kicking up the biggest fuss in the Japanese fandom when that was revealed were the Leon fangirls … particularly the f!Kamui/Leon fangirls. So rather than some moral outrage, it sounds more like they just have some interesting priorities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebony Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) From what I'd heard, the people who were kicking up the biggest fuss in the Japanese fandom when that was revealed were the Leon fangirls … particularly the f!Kamui/Leon fangirls. So rather than some moral outrage, it sounds more like they just have some interesting priorities. I didn't particularly care about it (sans it explained a bit) but I wouldn't have gotten angry about it tbh. I do have to say, if Leo and Takumi were made appealing to girls in the first place Were they planning the S-rankability early into the game development? Edited February 10, 2016 by Ebony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) I can kind of excuse Camilla and Xander, because they were probably old enough that it would've been to late for the Westermarck Effect to have taken place. I'd also forgive Elise and Leo if they actually acknowledged that those feelings were both taboo and incest in spirit, but it looks like that they're just going 'oh, not related. Cool, lets bang' with no consideration for the fact that the viewed each other as family. I won't comment any further on the surprise cousin reveal (this is meant to be a SFW blog after all) other than that it was stupid and never should've happened. I'm not opposed to incest as a concept (my favorite fantasy epic has incest as one of its central plot points), just with how indifferently Fates handles such a heavy subject. There are so many dimensions to incestuous relationships but Fates boil it as only slightly more complex than a standard romance. I could see Camilla, Marx and maybe Ryoma possibly being attracted to Kamui but even then, Camilla is the only one that showed a definite attraction to you before S supports. The most frustrating thing of incestuous relationships is that it leaves your canon relationship with characters dubious. Schrodinger's Incest: Until the S support, your siblings are both attracted to you and not attracted to you. In regards to your spoiler. It seems completely pointless and adds nothing to the story besides making another incest pairing. Edited February 10, 2016 by NekoKnight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 I'm not opposed to incest as a concept No context needed here ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) (my favorite fantasy epic has incest as one of its central plot points), just with how indifferently Fates handles such a heavy subject. There are so many dimensions to incestuous relationships but Fates boil it as only slightly more complex than a standard romance. I could see Camilla, Marx and maybe Ryoma possibly being attracted to Kamui but even then, Camilla is the only one that showed a definite attraction to you before S supports. The most frustrating thing of incestuous relationships is that it leaves your canon relationship with characters dubious. Schrodinger's Incest: Until the S support, your siblings are both attracted to you and not attracted to you. In regards to your spoiler. It seems completely pointless and adds nothing to the story besides making another incest pairing. Exactly. I wouldn't be anywhere near as disappointed with the Nohr S-Ranks if they actually had more depth to them then 'We're not actually related, so it's okay for us to get married now'. Hell, I might've enjoyed them greatly and found them touching (not the Hoshido ones though, those can fuck right off in my opinion). But the fact that the mentions of there being no blood relations between them basically being the only mention of their familial bonds in the entire support makes it ridiculous. Also, the less said about that spoiler, the better. Every time it gets mentioned I feel myself become one step closer to going nuclear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) No context needed here ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Damn you Phillius. Hell, I might've enjoyed them greatly and found them touching Two can play at this game. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Well written incest will have to wait for fanfiction. Edited February 10, 2016 by NekoKnight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Water Mage Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 All you people leaving Ricken unpaired are gonna be banned, because he's got a pretty good class set and modifiers that lean towards a hybrid build :P:I'm going to be quite disappointed if there's an uproar over Sakura/Elise "because they're KIDS!" Ricken's support with Sully is what I'd expect out of someone that's a year or two older than Elise, at most. So why is it okay for younger boys to be married, but the younger girls need an age adjustment?EDIT:Then our culture needs to change. If Nintendo can shove same-sex supports in the game, then I don't see why the hell they can't leave the kids as kids (and sort it out later). It's a culture thing, yeah. When you say "pedophile", most people's first thoughts are some hairy 40-60 year old man getting touchy toward his students, neighbor's kids, or nephew/niece. Or an otaku online gushing about an anime girl's panties. A lot of people simply don't register an adult female preying on a young male (Or at least expressing sexual attraction toward them) as the same crime, which is why people are hesitant to hire on male teachers at elementary schools or leave their children alone with a male babysitter.There's also an element of gender power dynamics, of course; the aforementioned example isn't seen as a woman preying on a boy but as a boy somehow "conquering" an adult woman like a real man.What I find rather odd, though, is not the pedophilia double standard but the incest one. Sakura, Elise, and sometimes Camilla are frequently brought up in the "eww, that's your sister, why can you marry them" way, yet nobody really bats an eye at the roughly twenty trigintillion girls talking about what they want to do to Takumi, Leo, or Xander (Poor Lobster Lord...). Incest is usually equally taboo across gender. FINALLY someone says it! I agreee with so much. This double standard is just wrong. Not only that, but if you take into considerarion how much insecure and fragile Takumi and Leo are, one could say you're taking advantage of them in the same way you're taking advantage Sakura and Elise. But have someone ever pointed this out? Probably not, because their insecurity and fragility is one the reason the considered "cute" and "attractive". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tryhard Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Double standards can't get in the way of muh pairings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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