The Lunatic Club [Fates]

[joshcja]

The thing is, the only resource you have to spend on Keaton is EXP. And his daughter is him with better RES and SPD, but slightly less tanky. There is a reason she is considered the second best kid (behind Percy) because she can't be screwed. Keaton can't be screwed as well, and is not affected by the weapon triangle, while still having decent hit rates. He doesn't really need to be reclassed unless you really want him to suck (E weapon rank locked at that point of the game sucks).

That's all, he is always reliable, in case you got screwed in other areas. He kinda falls of lategame( like chapter 25 or 26). Xander outclasses him as a tank, but he outclasses everyone lol.

Also his personal skill is a godsend for people that play offline only ( like me).

I just assume this is a thing because people are idiots.

(That said postgame zerker dogchick seems entirely legit, nowhere near top 5 but top 10 for sure)

Getting outclassed by a prepromote (admittedly a GODLY prepromote) who joins 2-3 stat benchmarks under your entire army is a death sentence.

Xander is really cool and lobster guy showed just how strong he can get with favoritism but forced aggressor in ch28 speaks for itself. (No hate thor, the ryoma solo was a fun build and pulling it off on a first run was pretty impressive)

I like Keaton, any unit can be good with favoritism, the scale is how high the cost/benefit goes, Keaton eats a metric ton of EXP and contributes nothing in the hardest chapters in the game without being force fed every single arms scroll and 2-3 heart seals + master seal. Even then he's still just bad Arthur. When a units entire contribution in their base class can be summed up as "2/3 of a beastkiller" they're objectively bad on the scale of that game. By the scale of fire emblem in general Keaton is amazing, by the scale of fates lunatic he's already in a body bag.

I really like Benny, he's just fun to use, I will never ever claim that he is a good unit in game. (Actually all of my favorites outside of Odin/Ophy/Silias/Sophie/Arthur are flat out booty garbage.)

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[DoesntKnowHowToPlay]

The thing is, the only resource you have to spend on Keaton is EXP. And his daughter is him with better RES and SPD, but slightly less tanky. There is a reason she is considered the second best kid (behind Percy) because she can't be screwed. Keaton can't be screwed as well, and is not affected by the weapon triangle, while still having decent hit rates. He doesn't really need to be reclassed unless you really want him to suck (E weapon rank locked at that point of the game sucks).

That's all, he is always reliable, in case you got screwed in other areas. He kinda falls of lategame( like chapter 25 or 26). Xander outclasses him as a tank, but he outclasses everyone lol.

Also his personal skill is a godsend for people that play offline only ( like me).

Beast Killers+Kitsunes > Keaton

It hurts him also that Beast Killers are extremely common on Lunatic, culminating in the hilarious giant blob of Generals in Ch26 that are all packing one. He also struggles against anything with range (hello Chapters 17, 22, 23, 25) due to being forced melee-only. I'll grant you that Beastbane is great, but it's also kinda redundant once you have your own Beast Killer and enough dudes to dual strike off it against cavalry groups...and if you're not going for the 200-turn bird-cheese on Ch19, you are absolutely going to pick up a Beast Killer.

Also EXP is one of the game's most precious resources; saying that's all you need to spend on him is kinda like saying all you need for Gunter to be good is a +7 Brave Lance because he comes pre-leveled. You're spending about as much EXP on him as anyone else, except you can't go extra because he shows up in Chapter 14 and has no good beasts to pick on until Chapter 18.

I like the dog, but I do not advise using him on Lunatic if you don't know what you're getting into.

[-Cynthia-]

Benny's uses are kinda limited. He's good for turtling and for C19 maybe, but has low Mov, can't double, can't OHKO, and gets doubled a lot before Wary Fighter so obvious big problems.

Keaton has some pretty good bases, huge growths in key areas, auto Beastbane. Has meh speed, and a 1 range lock with 6 Mov is...not super great. Struggles with groups of archers, ninjas, and especially mages which are common.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Man chapter 13 is literally Leo Squadron show

Leo soloed the south, Niles murders the fliers and Odin soloed the rest of the map

Gotta say Niles has been by far the most useful unit in the team. He killed everything that Odin and Silas isnt able to kill effectively in one shot and this is just with Iron Bow

[joshcja]

Man chapter 13 is literally Leo Squadron show

Leo soloed the south, Niles murders the fliers and Odin soloed the rest of the map

Gotta say Niles has been by far the most useful unit in the team. He killed everything that Odin and Silas isnt able to kill effectively in one shot and this is just with Iron Bow

Man Niles is Niles tier. There are no substitutes.

Most godly utility combat unit ever made.

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[Elycia]

Omg Revelations Ch17, the Paladins are destroying me every time. When I see the Nohr peeps for reinforcements, their stats make me cry (cough Peri Odin Laslow) .-.

[avengerfive]

Can confirm Niles is amazing. His bulk tho, is not.

[Thor Odinson]

Starting RevLunatic as my first/mostly blind run, who thought chapter 9's unit balance was remotely okay

whatever, i prepared for that and threw Rinkah her favoritism package

Rinkah favoritism 2.0 is happening

Also I got a hilariously bulky Niles on my Conquest run and I asked all my friends if Niles was supposed to be bulky (since with Cam pairup and a tonic he could reach 30def) and they all looked at me funny

Edited March 16, 2016 by Thor Odinson

[joshcja]

Starting RevLunatic as my first/mostly blind run, who thought chapter 9's unit balance was remotely okay

whatever, i prepared for that and threw Rinkah her favoritism package

Rinkah favoritism 2.0 is happening

Also I got a hilariously bulky Niles on my Conquest run and I asked all my friends if Niles was supposed to be bulky (since with Cam pairup and a tonic he could reach 30def) and they all looked at me funny

As a fellow Rinkah lover/absurd favoritism giver I look forward to this.

#TheAbsAreReal

Also holy shit, that niles.

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[Thor Odinson]

As a fellow Rinkah lover/absurd favoritism giver I look forward to this.

#TheAbsAreReal

http://luminescentblade.tumblr.com/post/141125581374/started-revelations-and-a-new-round-of-favor-the

it begins

[joshcja]

http://luminescentblade.tumblr.com/post/141125581374/started-revelations-and-a-new-round-of-favor-the

it begins

I think you made a mistake and equipped her with food instead of a real weapon.

[Rei-]

Omg Revelations Ch17, the Paladins are destroying me every time. When I see the Nohr peeps for reinforcements, their stats make me cry (cough Peri Odin Laslow) .-.

i was pretty surprised to not be able to save after 16, but fluke routed and killed ALL the pallys + cavs on turn 2/3. Lined up xander ryoma MU pally silas, etc and walled em off lmao. Also, Levin sword MU Op :l

[Thor Odinson]

I think you made a mistake and equipped her with food instead of a real weapon.

Look man, this is the lord and master seafood of map-wiping, using his name will ensure she too, can wipe entire maps

[joshcja]

Look man, this is the lord and master seafood of map-wiping, using his name will ensure she too, can wipe entire maps

That or she'll just taste really good when served with garlic butter~

(Gonna call it a win either way)

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Man i think i messed up

Odin, Kaze, Silas, Niles, and Effie all hits around level 17 - 18 with Silas at 19. I think promoting right now won't hurt me in the long run(20/20 is overrated anyway) but it doesn't feel right

Also the more i look at it the more i realized how good Arthur really is. Level 11 and he had 33 HP. Thats insane. Sadly the Effie x Arthur combo only benefits Effie since Arthur Speed isn't as wtf as Kaze

Also dunno if i should pick up the kids. Sophie and percy stats look good, but the rest is.... kinda questionable. Odin is basically ruined from the word go thanks to having Mozu as mother, but Odin is GODin anyway.

Sometimes i hope Odin can marry Leo.

*totally intended

[The Fir Coat]

Sadly the Effie x Arthur combo only benefits Effie since Arthur Speed isn't as wtf as Kaze

That's why you A+ Niles.

[Ownagepuffs]

I'm slowly getting closer to having too much unit :(

How good is Bennie, and Keaton? Leo is a Royal so i figure out he's a monster, and he joined the game by literally one shotting the entire map, but i dunno about those two

Benny's in the running for worst unit in Nohr and Keaton is as good as infantry gets except everyone in Nohr is mounted and he isn't and no 1-2 range. Like, not even a shitty javelin or something.

Leo is a great pairup bot for Odin... Ok Leo's actually the third/4th best mage in conquest maingame depending on your avatar build and is a total freeby outside the 2k you spend to heart seal his ass out of dark knight asap, but it is a very distant third. He gets a lot of his rep from existing in an effective vacuum so yes he is a bit overrated. That said he is 100% worth using if you didn't go with a dm/dviner MU. (He can actually pick up vantage pretty easily on ch22 and compete with his pupil...with 6 chapters left in the game)

There's MU being a better mage than Leo and.... that's it. Leo comes prepackaged with a 10 Mt tome only he can use w/no drawbacks, 8 mov, and pretty gr9mazing bases save his easily fixable speed. Like, what sort of high impact drug are you taking up the nose to say any mage even comes close to Leo's level of facestompery. Because I'd like 2 fucking crates of it.

[Thor Odinson]

Urgh, I just beat chapter 11 and already facing the giant shittery that is Rev unit balance. It was a good thing I saved Mozu's paralogue for Kaze and Rinkah to level at least (moreso Kaze than Rinkah, since I gave Rinkah a forge and tonicdump to be my other actually useful combat unit on chapter 9), but I need to actually like feed Saizo and it's just so sad when he's so good on BR. I can't imagine it for the Odin fans.

Edited March 16, 2016 by Thor Odinson

[DoesntKnowHowToPlay]

There's MU being a better mage than Leo and.... that's it. Leo comes prepackaged with a 10 Mt tome only he can use w/no drawbacks, 8 mov, and pretty gr9mazing bases save his easily fixable speed. Like, what sort of high impact drug are you taking up the nose to say any mage even comes close to Leo's level of facestompery. Because I'd like 2 fucking crates of it.

why would any mage use a weak-ass 10 mt book when nosferatu (9 mt at +1) and lightning (read: goddamn brave tome) can be purchased from the store and used with a humble C-rank in tomes

also 8 move ain't an advantage for leo since he has to get off his damn horse if he wants to use nosferatu, also known as the best spell in the game. most of the game is not nice to horsemen either

[joshcja]

There's MU being a better mage than Leo and.... that's it. Leo comes prepackaged with a 10 Mt tome only he can use w/no drawbacks, 8 mov, and pretty gr9mazing bases save his easily fixable speed. Like, what sort of high impact drug are you taking up the nose to say any mage even comes close to Leo's level of facestompery. Because I'd like 2 fucking crates of it.

Incoming wall of text...

Bryn is a free forged thunder but outside of that it's absolute ass, It's not lightning, it's not nos, its not moljinor, its not pony tome or gate, fuck it's flat worse than a +3 fire. Free intrinsic pavise would be nice, if it mattered, at all.

Ranking in nohr based on availability bases and growths at Leo's join running off +magic strats. (If you ignore every other mage in the game ofc Leo is going to be the best mage)

Ophelia>MU>>Odin>Leo>>>>>>>Nyx (Literally exists to give Leo a baby hole)

Ophy/MU make Leo their bitch we're not going into that.

Odin vs Leo is at least vaguely comparable with an edge to Odin though Leo use does free up a lot of early exp routing. If you hard roll Odin (which is disgustingly easy to do btw) he will have on average +/-2 mag to sorc leo and 2+ stats over his boss in every other stat but skill where he will lead by a big 3-4 points, and is packing vantage for effective immortality. Leo can catch up to his protege on ch22 or a post 20/21 feeder paralouge but if you're rolling deep on odin he's taking the same dip for LoD+seal str to stay ahead...forever. Leo is also slightly worse at using non-nos tomes than Odin is because critrate.

I'm not mentioning cost/benefit in a pure resource sense as Leo gets flat bodied there if he try's to actually compete with the big kids club due to his garbage speed base. (Sorry xander your speedwings are in another castle)

So yeah. Leo is the 3rd/4th best mage in the game depending on who you actually want to use that play through. Sorc!MUxOdin gives a pretty generous early exp pool for maximal shipping and makes good use of Leo later on, Odinx+magdiviner!MU breaks the game in half but has very little room in the early exp curve and dedicates Leoto a pure pairup bot. For off class+mag MU builds, Odin is the only unit that's giving significant early nos contribution (nyx is a joke) and you have a middling early exp pool but you have more flexibility in terms of unit usage/marriage options overall and Leo contributes nicely.

Or you can ignore early mage's entirely (They're complete and utter overkill, you really do not "need" them) and let freebie Leo be "good enough", then yeah he becomes the best mage by default.

Example of a run where freeby Leo can really shine, dude in this thread who overextended on exp, flat skipped Ophy and mage!Mu and is just packing base Odin with a nos tome. In that situation Leo is on par with an 18/1 dust Odin or a raw 20/1 Odin if he eats an immediate speedwing and heart seal. They can build to A+ as bro's and he can still have double vantage sorc's rolling deep by ch21. Leo is also significantly more useful in parents only for similar reasons.

TL:DR: Leo, is a fantastic freebie, a great unit overall, can patch up any mistakes you made nicely, or just serve as a really solid prepromote to free up some early exp. He's not the best, but his competition is "Perfect Nostank, MU, God mode", the fact that he can keep up at all speaks volumes on how good he is.

Edit: Right, Leo is also better in Rev but fuck if I'm treating Corin emblem like a real game.

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[BaKaDaNaa]

Hello everyone! I'm starting Birthright Lunatic right this moment and I was wondering who would benefit the most from the Dread Scrolls and Ebon Wings. I was thinking Asama would be a good idea for either one of them, and I know for a fact that Mozu makes a great Dread Fighter, but other than that...

Help needed!

[joshcja]

Hello everyone! I'm starting Birthright Lunatic right this moment and I was wondering who would benefit the most from the Dread Scrolls and Ebon Wings. I was thinking Asama would be a good idea for either one of them, and I know for a fact that Mozu makes a great Dread Fighter, but other than that...

Help needed!

Slap them on whoever you waifu/husbando and enjoy the ascetic on.

Broken DLC classes are broken and it's birthright aka ryoma solo.

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[BaKaDaNaa]

Is it that broken, even for Lunatic? Not sure who I'm gonna S rank yet.

[joshcja]

Is it that broken, even for Lunatic? Not sure who I'm gonna S rank yet.

It's more that the late skills are retarded and early promoted stats @ unpromoted exp is a tad absurd when you can set it up on ch7.

The classes themselves are honestly weaker than/on par with their main game contemporaries outside of those admittedly sizable advantages though. You'll still enjoy the game, you can just use them like master seals if you want a better feel for the game while still getting the classes if that sounds more enjoyable.

Just relax and toss together a nice shitposter build man, Birthright isn't really suited for optimization as much as it's suited for all out casual favoritism. (That's not a critique, it's what makes the game enjoyable and differentiates it from "real fates" and "Corin solo+ shipping emblem")

To set aside my Conquest bias for a second, some of the later chapters in birthright manage to be challenging for a lot of players who build suboptimaly but they're still entirely manageable with any set of units in the game and a lobster.

So yeah, just have fun with it.

Edited March 16, 2016 by joshcja

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Alright manage to give Odin Vantage and promote him into Sorcerer.

Why is Leo so likable holy shit.

Also Kaze and Silas C support is hilariously romantic