The Lunatic Club [Fates]

[joshcja]

Belka gets nothing from Arthur. She technically gets Fighter but its already her secondary. Its only if its the same base class would the secondary be passed by S/A+ supports

Huh, just double checked and you cant. Learn something every day/Mistakes were made.

Meh, I'll still hype it for more convenient sealing early on (Fuck the heart seal limit)

Edited March 18, 2016 by joshcja

[The Fir Coat]

I think this time I am going to try Camilla S Arthur and A+ Selena, with the goal of making her a Berserker with Shurikenbreaker for Chapter 25. I'll also try Silas x Belka and Odin x Elise, as well as Samurai Corncob x Xander for those Superior Nippon Skills we talked about to see if it actually makes him any better. Silas is kind of disappointing me so far as a replacement for Effie, Vow of Friendship is difficult to actually use because Corrin is such a good combat unit with so little health (I went +Speed this time, maybe I should try +HP).

For Camilla I could try S Niles and A+ Belka instead, that would give Camilla an additional movement point, but I think I'm going to pair Niles with Mozu (who will be level 1, because she's a janky character and not nearly as useful as Donnel). This path also allows Arthur to get the Wyvern skills, and Niles would have a much harder time functioning as a Wyvern Lord because E Rank Hell is very difficult to deal with if you have bad Strength. Also Trample is functionally the same as Bowfaire for him and Quick Draw is better than Strength + 2 on a PP character, so he'll be fine anyway (he does get Archer and not Villager, right? I've never used Mozu).

I think I've heard there is a Falcoknight with Pass somewhere along the line that I can throw a pokeball at? Probably in the Hinoka Chapter.

[joshcja]

I think this time I am going to try Camilla S Arthur and A+ Selena, with the goal of making her a Berserker with Shurikenbreaker for Chapter 25. I'll also try Silas x Belka and Odin x Elise, as well as Samurai Corncob x Xander for those Superior Nippon Skills we talked about to see if it actually makes him any better. Silas is kind of disappointing me so far as a replacement for Effie, Vow of Friendship is difficult to actually use because Corrin is such a good combat unit with so little health (I went +Speed this time, maybe I should try +HP).

For Camilla I could try S Niles and A+ Belka instead, that would give Camilla an additional movement point, but I think I'm going to pair Niles with Mozu (who will be level 1, because she's a janky character and not nearly as useful as Donnel). This path also allows Arthur to get the Wyvern skills, and Niles would have a much harder time functioning as a Wyvern Lord because E Rank Hell is very difficult to deal with if you have bad Strength. Also Trample is functionally the same as Bowfaire for him and Quick Draw is better than Strength + 2 on a PP character, so he'll be fine anyway (he does get Archer and not Villager, right? I've never used Mozu).

I think I've heard there is a Falcoknight with Pass somewhere along the line that I can throw a pokeball at? Probably in the Hinoka Chapter.

Yeah Niles should get the sniper tree from Mozu (Who is actually a gr8mazing unit casually if you're not using all 3 of the early heart seals...2 are absolutely Odin locked but the 3rd is up for grabs I guess).

I don't want to say VoF is harder to use than Effies personal, but getting your VoF cycles down pat is absolutely not new/safe player friendly and can be flat out counter intuitive at times. That said it's super consistent once you get over the learning curve.

The pass falcoknight can be captured in Hinoka's chapter yes.

Edited March 19, 2016 by joshcja

[The Fir Coat]

Yeah Niles should get the sniper tree from Mozu (Who is actually a gr8mazing unit casually if you're not using all 3 of the early heart seals...

She seems like crap to me. What is the point of having a bad Archer early on in Conquest? Insta-promoted Selena does her job much better, Niles does her job much better, and unlike Donnel she doesn't get a psuedo-promotion when she reclasses because Villager bases aren't crap in this game (archer has the exact same bases...) Also she's a glass cannon where Donnel had the best defensive growths besides Nowi. In a game where there are plenty of units that are amazing offensively without being total crap on the EP Mozu doesn't really fit in.

If you compare her to something like Paladin Jacob I don't know how you can justify the Seal.

Edited March 19, 2016 by The Fir Coat

[DoesntKnowHowToPlay]

Two words: Golden Kite. Kinshi Knight is one of the best classes in the game bar none, especially in Conquest where you have fun chapters like 20, 21, 22, 23, and 24. It's also incredibly hard to get otherwise; you're limited to Shigure and Selena otherwise. Having two archers also makes 10 a lot less painful as you can man all three ballistas. If you're LTC'ing then she's obviously worthless because the best play is to just not do her paralogue, but for normal casual play she's basically a second Niles who trades stacked Res for superiority in every other stat.

Never really seen the appeal to Paladin Jakob either; just go let Corrin take some abuse and Silas turns into a Paladin.

Edited March 19, 2016 by DoesntKnowHowToPlay

[The Fir Coat]

I'm sure Mozu is good after promotion, but before that she needs to struggle around as a crappy underlevelled Archer for a fairly difficult part of the game. Almost every character is good in this game if you level them up. Paladin Jakob on the other hand can rush the left side in 8 and kill Flora in 1 turn before stopping the Soldier from grabbing the first village on the left, gets Elbow Room, Shelter and Defender in 3 levels, and doesn't really fall off until mid/late game.

Also if you S Niles with Mozu he can get the Kinshi skills instead and you don't have to deal with a level 1 unit in E Rank Hell.

[Redwall]

Never really seen the appeal to Paladin Jakob either; just go let Corrin take some abuse and Silas turns into a Paladin.

I'm only at C10 right now, but Jakob's been very good so far as a Paladin.

C7: if you're playing with Ranking awards, Jakob may have to be a Paladin to get the seven-turn clear. Not sure though since I haven't played online.

C8: with +1 Str and +1 Spd from base, and a C-level Pair Up with Corrin, Jakob ORKOs the boss on PP4 with 100% displayed Hit given the appropriate tonics. iirc the odds of getting at least +1 Str by Lvl 4 are about 80% if you do the binomial calculation, while getting at least +1 Spd happens about 87% of the time.

C9: Jakob can ferry Corrin to ORKO the lower-right Archer on PP3, then switch to Jakob to break the wall and receive a Song from Azura to ferry Corrin to OHKO the Enfeeble user on PP4. The defensive support Jakob provides (Pair Up + personal skill) is much appreciated for tanking the EP3/4 onslaught, and even allows Corrin to tank a hit from the boss without healing if you're going for the unreliable five-turn clear.

Long term I can see him falling off, but the combination of high Movement, decent damage output thanks to Elbow Room, and good EXP gain is too much to pass up early on.

[-Cynthia-]

Paladin Jakob is good, although some Corrin builds also really like that first Heart Seal. Ninja/Dark Mage Corrin generally want to get out of E rank ASAP.

[joshcja]

I'm sure Mozu is good after promotion, but before that she needs to struggle around as a crappy underlevelled Archer for a fairly difficult part of the game. Almost every character is good in this game if you level them up. Paladin Jakob on the other hand can rush the left side in 8 and kill Flora in 1 turn before stopping the Soldier from grabbing the first village on the left, gets Elbow Room, Shelter and Defender in 3 levels, and doesn't really fall off until mid/late game.

Also if you S Niles with Mozu he can get the Kinshi skills instead and you don't have to deal with a level 1 unit in E Rank Hell.

Or, Silias can pick up niles.

Yeah you can whore mozu around for sniper tree skills and she still puts in a good bit of work as the village bicycle. She does have one thing every non Silias/Laslow/Nina (but she's a broken PoS) archer lacks though, actual growths. She's worth using casually sometime and it's really easy to fit any non-thwomp/non keaton unit into pre-18 conquest as that's effectively "Silias Emblem" so casualy it's all about who gives the biggest payoff lategame. Mozu gives pretty huge returns.

Paladin!Jakob is much much better in birthright where you have limited cav access and don't get Camilia 3 chapters into the game.

Edit: I still need to try out Ninja!Mu but it just seems so weak compared to dm(Nos is one hell of a drug)/Diviner (+2 mag is one hell of a drug)

Edited March 19, 2016 by joshcja

[-Cynthia-]

Ninja's better against certain enemy types(Peg Knights and Ninjas mostly). Although if you have a Dread Seal, Dread Fighter is a better Ninja pretty much.

[joshcja]

Ninja's better against certain enemy types(Peg Knights and Ninjas mostly). Although if you have a Dread Seal, Dread Fighter is a better Ninja pretty much.

So things mage/diviner build Mu kills in one hit anyways early on, and you have bows/breaker/gate/"ignore intended play and orko with nos" for later?

I mean I'm still gonna try it but that kills a lot of hype, It's hard to get "better" than a flat ohko.

Edited March 20, 2016 by joshcja

[Thane]

I gave Velour the Great Lord class seal because I wanted to see the strangest combination of class and character at work. Also blatant favoritism.

Let's just hope I haven't made Hinoka useless, but oh well. I don't find Revelation Lunatic to be that challenging so far, so I'm experimenting a little.

[Rukina]

Chapter 5 required human sacrifice to complete. Thank goodness I picked casual instead of classic for this mode.

[-Cynthia-]

So things mage/diviner build Mu kills in one hit anyways early on, and you have bows/breaker/gate/"ignore intended play and orko with nos" for later?

I mean I'm still gonna try it but that kills a lot of hype, It's hard to get "better" than a flat ohko.

The hit rates are pretty sketchy though, especially on EP without Heartseeker. Calamity Gate does help later in the game though. There are some things that mages can't OHKO either(like paired up pegs in C10).

I found Diviner Corrin to have some pretty serious durabilitty issues personally- dat 1 base defense from class.

Edited March 20, 2016 by -Cynthia-

[joshcja]

The hit rates are pretty sketchy though, especially on EP without Heartseeker. Calamity Gate does help later in the game though. There are some things that mages can't OHKO either(like paired up pegs in C10).

I found Diviner Corrin to have some pretty serious durabilitty issues personally- dat 1 base defense from class.

Yeah diviner has to subsist on fire dodgetanking, but sub-40% hitrates off jakob+fire at wtd make it pretty consistent.

Dm Mu failing to orko the paired pegs in 10 sucks, but mag+2 is one hell of a drug and a fire/thunder forge (depending on growth rng)+ speed pot + jakob = blicked peg. Even if diviner!Mu misses the benchmarks...everything else in that corner of the map should be dead, so settling for a 2rko isn't terrible while Ninja!Mu would need to face wtd vs almost all of ch10 sans the dual club village and pegs.

Early hitrates can be a bit shakey (70%ish at wtad) with -skill so I can see that being a thing for people who prefer consistency.

Again I'm saving my final opinion on +str ninja till after i try it. These are just "pre run" impressions so there may be a bit of bias.

Edited March 20, 2016 by joshcja

[Aggro Incarnate]

(deleted)

Edited February 17, 2020 by Aggro Incarnate

[-Cynthia-]

Hmm that's interesting, there are a lot of cool Capture units nearer to the end of the game (Master of Arms Rallybots, Falcoknights with Pass etc.)

Finished my Sorc MU run. Ryoma was easy, just used a forged Mjolnir to fry some lobster. ORKOing Takumi...not so much. Even with capped Mag, Rally Mag, forged Lightning etc. just wasn't enough damage. Had to buy Life and Death to do the job reliably.

[avengerfive]

There needs to be way to get a second unit down there to Takumi on Turn 2. Then it's easy killing him. 2 hits from Yato, and then probably brave sword Xander should do the job. It may involve using the C24 Falco tho, which sucks because high-level generics take forever to recruit. Probably need to use a double/triple dance as well.

[-Cynthia-]

Yeah he should be easy enough to KO with 2 units. I imagine getting a second unit down there is doable enough, but you probably need Boots on the right people and whatnot.

[The Fir Coat]

Hmm that's interesting, there are a lot of cool Capture units nearer to the end of the game (Master of Arms Rallybots, Falcoknights with Pass etc.)

Finished my Sorc MU run. Ryoma was easy, just used a forged Mjolnir to fry some lobster. ORKOing Takumi...not so much. Even with capped Mag, Rally Mag, forged Lightning etc. just wasn't enough damage. Had to buy Life and Death to do the job reliably.

Haitaka is a badass too. Supports aren't even the world's biggest deal in this game like they were in Awakening, they generally just mean like 5 stats on Pair Up.

[joshcja]

Hmm that's interesting, there are a lot of cool Capture units nearer to the end of the game (Master of Arms Rallybots, Falcoknights with Pass etc.)

Finished my Sorc MU run. Ryoma was easy, just used a forged Mjolnir to fry some lobster. ORKOing Takumi...not so much. Even with capped Mag, Rally Mag, forged Lightning etc. just wasn't enough damage. Had to buy Life and Death to do the job reliably.

Yeah that's why I prefer Ophelia for Final!Takasshat. You need exactly 74 Atk to flat orko Takumi with lightning on PP.

(43 mag (2 statues cap) +5 (tomefaire or trample)+2 (mal aura)+10(LoD) +8(Dm Corin pairup@supportive) +4(rally mag)+3(forged lightning) = 75) It's easier to pull off than it looks, Or you can be a sane human being and just let her vantage/bowbreaker his ass on EP for a safe 5 hit kill with lightning or 3 hit kill with "insert high Mt tome".

If you don't want to deal with the falco capture you can just save a Niles!Shigure for a 100% safe ch27/28 double pass falcoknight access. Nina has ridiculous enough bases to work just fine as a combat unit even with with frailzura as a mom.

It's 2 rescue charges instead of 1 but 2 unit takumi is safe as hell

Edited March 22, 2016 by joshcja

[DoesntKnowHowToPlay]

Does Birthright Lunatic ever pick up? After Conquest Lunatic kidless this is a complete joke. Probably obnoxious as hell to do with low turncounts but I've never been one for that.

[Fruity Insanity]

Is it that easy?

I'm playing Lunatic Conquest Classic atm (also kidless), and it's really fun so far (even if I've restarted countless times... Am on ch. 19 right now), but I probably won't bother with Lunatic Hoshido or Invisible Kingdom if they're not very challenging...

Edited March 23, 2016 by Fruity Insanity

[Thor Odinson]

BR Lunatic 23 is pretty solid if you don't spam Ryoma too hard

Imo Rev Lunatic is the easiest---though it could be that I started on BR so a lot of my earlier resets could've been attributed to not being used to the attack/guard stance mechanics, but Rev is like, it's not even hard, just kinda annoying, the map gimmicks don't make anything more challenging they just make things take longer

I hardly resetted at all on Rev Lunatic also i made Rinkah super again and she gets hilarious

[soranauta]

What would be a good strategy for chapter 5 in Lunatic mode? I remember handling myself in Hard mode but in Lunatic I get royally screwed after I deal with the first 4 enemies. I've tried to approach from both sides with Kaze paired up with Rinkah for bulk but I can't bait an enemy without getting surrounded.