Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[Rezzy]

Just now, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

With a Dancer and two good ranged attackers (doesn't matter if they're mages or bows/daggers, but generally mages see more success), deathless runs are pretty easy. The only hard part is lugging around a bonus unit that doesn't mesh with your core and also can't take a hit.

I always forfeit if a match isn't deathless, since that run is pointless anyway.

I only do that if I've already got a streak.  I like to have at least some 7 streak, even if it isn't deathless as a baseline, since I don't like blowing a ton of crests.

[Rezzy]

Just now, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

With a Dancer and two good ranged attackers (doesn't matter if they're mages or bows/daggers, but generally mages see more success), deathless runs are pretty easy. The only hard part is lugging around a bonus unit that doesn't mesh with your core and also can't take a hit.

I always forfeit if a match isn't deathless, since that run is pointless anyway.

I only do that if I've already got a streak.  I like to have at least some 7 streak, even if it isn't deathless as a baseline, since I don't like blowing a ton of crests.

[MrSmokestack]

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

Which is utterly ridiculous. ONE stupid death shouldn't be costing people that much. This kind of bullshit is why I hate the arena and always have.

There's nothing BS about it though. If you underperform and lose someone while someone does better and loses nobody, then they deserve a higher ranking than you. It's elementary. Otherwise, there's no challenge.

@rockocalypse Deathless might not matter if you play casually, but to score well you need a balanced team that can address the meta threats and go deathless. It's perfectly possible with just a single glance from the posts of regulars in the Arena thread.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

1 minute ago, Rezzy said:

I only do that if I've already got a streak.  I like to have at least some 7 streak, even if it isn't deathless as a baseline, since I don't like blowing a ton of crests.

I used to do that, but I find it to just be a waste of time. If I reset my streak on the first day, then I still have like 5 days to get a new deathless streak. It's only if I'm halfway through the week that I start using crests.

[rockocalypse]

2 minutes ago, Othin said:

If you have the time, consider sometime taking a bunch of screenshots during one of your arena matches to chronicle all your moves throughout it and try to explain your decisions as best as you can. If you do that and post it, we can try giving you more specific advice about how to improve your strategies.

I'll make a thread for it. I think there's a lot for both sides to benefit on from doing something like that. But if I dont see you reply on that thread I will cry.

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Arcanite said:

I can agree with you here

but now, getting deathless is gonna mean even more since you would need it to rank up as a whole

It shouldn't, imo. This is why I'm not looking forward to this update at all. I'm probably going to just ignore the arena entirely from now on. There's no point when I can hardly ever get anywhere in it and this will likely only make it harder for me. I don't know what I'll be doing in the game besides, but I might find something. I do have a few May quests left that don't involve the arena.

3 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

I mean, it's kinda in the spirit of Fire Emblem. You get punished for deaths.

And in other FE games, you can just reset and do the chapter again. It's not that simple in the arena. You can't just reset the match. Your winning streak is gone if you lose. There's no resetting.

[MaskedAmpharos]

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Which is utterly ridiculous. ONE stupid death shouldn't be costing people that much. This kind of bullshit is why I hate the arena and always have.

You say it's impossible to get deathless, but this in itself is evidence that it isn't. It's precisely because so many people are getting deathless Advanced wins that a single death costs you so much.

If several hundred or several thousand other people have units with close to the same BST/merge level/skills as you, then of course it makes sense that if you get a death and they don't, they'll all rank higher. 

[Anacybele]

Just now, MaskedAmpharos said:

You say it's impossible to get deathless, but this in itself is evidence that it isn't. It's precisely because so many people are getting deathless Advanced wins that a single death costs you so much.

If several hundred or several thousand other people have units with close to the same BST/merge level/skills as you, then of course it makes sense that if you get a death and they don't, they'll all rank higher. 

On the contrary, I was told by someone here that not many can get deathless win streaks.

But whatever the case, the arena is still far too difficult and stupid to me to want to bother with anymore.

[rockocalypse]

2 minutes ago, MrSmokestack said:

There's nothing BS about it though. If you underperform and lose someone while someone does better and loses nobody, then they deserve a higher ranking than you. It's elementary. Otherwise, there's no challenge.

@rockocalypse Deathless might not matter if you play casually, but to score well you need a balanced team that can address the meta threats and go deathless. It's perfectly possible with just a single glance from the posts of regulars in the Arena thread.

I agree with your first point. And to some extent your second point. But the lower tiers are just not players with perfected P2W teams, and so they typically lose more units in their runs. So to compete on such a level, deathless runs are LESS important. Not meaningless, but not necessary.

 

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

.And in other FE games, you can just reset and do the chapter again. It's not that simple in the arena. You can't just reset the match. Your winning streak is gone if you lose. There's no resetting.

Think of the streak as being 12 chapters in and your last save is chapter 9 but now you lost a unit. :P

[Vaximillian]

6 hours ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Sharena is better than Ultimate Oboro tbh

@Vaximillian

Truer words have never been spoken.

[Extrasolar]

Just what is the Arena update going to do, anyway? How is it going to change?

[Rafiel's Aria]

It's too early to say how I feel about the Arena, but I'm looking forward to this season!

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

On the contrary, I was told by someone here that not many can get deathless win streaks.

But whatever the case, the arena is still far too difficult and stupid to me to want to bother with anymore.

Then don't. (I don't mean this in a rude way. Imagine it with a little tiny shrug instead of cold stoicism.) If you don't like the Arena, it's not really IS's fault. They've made several updates, and a lot of people seem to be happy with them. Is it perfect? No. But it's a work in progress. If you are really REALLY upset, you should write to IS or at least write a review on the app. Complaining here won't fix anything. It will probably just start fights, and I'm sure you don't want that.

[Arcanite]

1 minute ago, Extrasolar said:

Just what is the Arena update going to do, anyway? How is it going to change?

The tiers will give different rewards for each ranking whereas before they did nothing

Also, we get orbs now as a reward!

[Othin]

Just now, Extrasolar said:

Just what is the Arena update going to do, anyway? How is it going to change?

It'll add maps with defensive terrain - possibly in place of some of the existing maps? There are some similar-looking ones. More importantly, it's replacing the feathers for arena rank with similar numbers of feathers and a few orbs each week based on your tier, and a system for moving up or down the tiers depending on your rank within the tier each week.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

It shouldn't, imo. This is why I'm not looking forward to this update at all. I'm probably going to just ignore the arena entirely from now on. There's no point when I can hardly ever get anywhere in it and this will likely only make it harder for me. I don't know what I'll be doing in the game besides, but I might find something. I do have a few May quests left that don't involve the arena.

And in other FE games, you can just reset and do the chapter again. It's not that simple in the arena. You can't just reset the match. Your winning streak is gone if you lose. There's no resetting.

Y'know, maybe you should participate in the Arena analysis thing Othin suggested. I'm honestly puzzled by how you keep losing outright. Even if deathless might be hard, I find it very hard to be forced into an unwinnable situation. Heroes is more about quick decision-making instead of the long term planning and memorization of normal FE games, but surely, after all this time of playing this game, you should have picked up some patterns.

1 minute ago, rockocalypse said:

I agree with your first point. And to some extent your second point. But the lower tiers are just not players with perfected P2W teams, and so they typically lose more units in their runs. So to compete on such a level, deathless runs are LESS important. Not meaningless, but not necessary.

Lower tier players don't go up against perfected P2W that often, so it should be easier to get deathless to begin with. If you're in the 680 score range where skill inheritance is common and the monsters all come out, then you're not a lower tier player.

[Anacybele]

Just now, Rafiel's Aria said:

It's too early to say how I feel about the Arena, but I'm looking forward to this season!

Then don't. (I don't mean this in a rude way. Imagine it with a little tiny shrug instead of cold stoicism.) If you don't like the Arena, it's not really IS's fault. They've made several updates, and a lot of people seem to be happy with them. Is it perfect? No. But it's a work in progress. If you are really REALLY upset, you should write to IS or at least write a review on the app. Complaining here won't fix anything. It will probably just start fights, and I'm sure you don't want that.

Except I don't speak Japanese?

And fine if some people like the arena, I can't stop them from enjoying it.

[rockocalypse]

@Extrasolar well, firstly the people you're competing against will SOLELY be those in your same tier. So, the P2W players with +10s at tier 18 wont be battling the F2P grand strat master in tier 14. Also, rewards are changing. Basically you get rewards per season not based on score (which is now used just for rank up/down and I guess rank within tier) but based on what tier you are in that season. i believe. Serenesforest.net main page has a breakdown.

[Rafiel's Aria]

Just now, Anacybele said:

Except I don't speak Japanese?

And fine if some people like the arena, I can't stop them from enjoying it.

You don't need to speak Japanese to write an app review in the Google or Apple Store. :P I'm pretty sure people look pretty closely at those.

[MaskedAmpharos]

6 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

On the contrary, I was told by someone here that not many can get deathless win streaks.

But whatever the case, the arena is still far too difficult and stupid to me to want to bother with anymore.

And you're being told right now that many people do. I guess it's a matter of perspective. It's true that the majority of the playerbase cannot get deathless streaks consistently. However, it is also true that several thousand people do manage to get those streaks consistently, and I consider that a lot of people. 

3 minutes ago, Extrasolar said:

Just what is the Arena update going to do, anyway? How is it going to change?

It splits people into stratified tiers based on performance, and now, instead of all players competing with each other in Arena, you only compete with the rest of your tier, which adds a level of competition. If you're on the high end of your tier, you move up to a higher tier. If you're on the low end, you get demoted to a lower tier. Higher tiers get higher rewards every week, and now rewards include both feathers and orbs. 

[rockocalypse]

3 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Lower tier players don't go up against perfected P2W that often, so it should be easier to get deathless to begin with. If you're in the 680 score range where skill inheritance is common and the monsters all come out, then you're not a lower tier player.

I-Im not low tier? ;.; Thank you so much... My father would never recognize me as anything but scrub tier (really though, that makes me pretty excited/happy!)

But I fight p2w teams... horribly often. If I ever go to advanced even once. Sometimes intermediate has a one or two F2P build units which is enough to brick my team usually.

[Anacybele]

4 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Y'know, maybe you should participate in the Arena analysis thing Othin suggested. I'm honestly puzzled by how you keep losing outright. Even if deathless might be hard, I find it very hard to be forced into an unwinnable situation. Heroes is more about quick decision-making instead of the long term planning and memorization of normal FE games, but surely, after all this time of playing this game, you should have picked up some patterns.

And I'm honestly puzzled by how people keep winning outright. I'm constantly in literally unwinnable situations and can rarely find any good strategy to win, even when it involves dancing and Reposition/Swap/Pivot stuff.

2 minutes ago, Rafiel's Aria said:

You don't need to speak Japanese to write an app review in the Google or Apple Store. :P I'm pretty sure people look pretty closely at those.

I meant writing to IS themselves would require Japanese, but you're right.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

1 minute ago, rockocalypse said:

I-Im not low tier? ;.; Thank you so much... My father would never recognize me as anything but scrub tier (really though, that makes me pretty excited/happy!)

But I fight p2w teams... horribly often. If I ever go to advanced even once. Sometimes intermediate has a one or two F2P build units which is enough to brick my team usually.

By not being low tier, I mean that if your score range is about 680, then the resources you have at hand are not low tier. Which means, you have the tools to be able to fight other teams with four 5* level 40s. What even is your team though?

What do you define as a p2w team?

Just now, Anacybele said:

And I'm honestly puzzled by how people keep winning outright. I'm constantly in literally unwinnable situations and can rarely find any good strategy to win, even when it involves dancing and Reposition/Swap/Pivot stuff.

Well, whenever that thread comes up I guess we could try to help you.

[rockocalypse]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

And I'm honestly puzzled by how people keep winning outright. I'm constantly in literally unwinnable situations and can rarely find any good strategy to win, even when it involves dancing and Reposition/Swap/Pivot stuff.

It may seem ridiculous me saying this after our whole "deathless run" topic. But I have found one of the most powerful tools in arena (in my tiers) is being able to pull  the right units to fight you and sometimes even milling one of your units to do so. As long as you can set up 2 kills in a turn, the rest SHOULD prove trivial. Even if it means you lose a unit.

Also, ALWAYS take out dancers/ healers first. And pull Healers who attack to archers because they will attack and do nothing and you get free kills.

Seperating dancers is also a good tactic

[Extrasolar]

Thanks for all the explanations, guys!

I do like the adjusted matchmaking, competing with players only in your tier. So I took a look at the chart on the main page, and I don't quite understand the last column, the one with the ~[number] starting at rank 8 indicating that you go down a rank. So if you don't reach 80% of your original score for the next season, does that mean you're demoted a rank?

[Arcanite]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

And I'm honestly puzzled by how people keep winning outright. I'm constantly in literally unwinnable situations and can rarely find any good strategy to win, even when it involves dancing and Reposition/Swap/Pivot stuff.

You need to start seeing into the future!

Don't just look at how you're going to defeat one person, look at how what you do will make the enemy behave the next turn. The AI is dumb, but they definitely have some tricks!