Aether Raids General Thread

[Anacybele]

7 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

The most common non mythic AR unit used is Aversa. She gains 10 hp from mythic buffs so outstacking her Hp won’t work. All units that get debuffed by her have panic status inflicted and a -3 to all stats. 

So you get -3 to all stats for every unit that is adjacent to another unit and all units that get the buff from Eliwood get that buff immediately turned into a penalty.

 

That’s why so many defense teams use only wards and drives and goads, since those are in combat.

I doubt every single team that fights mine will have her on it though.

[Vicious Sal]

12 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I doubt every single team that fights mine will have her on it though.

People have five teams. So that means they have plenty of room for one aversa. If they see they only need one unit to shut down your entire team, they have no reason not to use it.

You can see in the Lvl10 compendium many people on SF have a +10 Aversa, most competitive players do too. You were asking why you were getting many losses. I already pointed out one glaring weakness to a common resource used in AR. Even if people do not have Aversa, there are still panic manors, dazzling panic staff users, monstrous bow, spectral tome, legions axe, cherche’s axe and more to counter your team.

So instead of using visible buffs, try to go for combat buffs. Or you are bound to keep losing even after you level up your defense fort.

[mampfoid]

2 hours ago, LordFrigid said:

Join the difficult defense map crew. We have pie.

I like pie. 

Ok, running blindly into your map, my current to-go offense team gets units killed. I don't have any mythic heroes besides Eir though and certainly no merged bonus unit. 

I have to think if I can find an original approach with my own units. Don't want to sacrifice grails for a flier-ball team. 

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Vicious Sal said:

People have five teams. So that means they have plenty of room for one aversa. If they see they only need one unit to shut down your entire team, they have no reason not to use it.

You can see in the Lvl10 compendium many people on SF have a +10 Aversa, most competitive players do too. You were asking why you were getting many losses. I already pointed out one glaring weakness to a common resource used in AR. Even if people do not have Aversa, there are still panic manors, dazzling panic staff users, monstrous bow, spectral tome, legions axe, cherche’s axe and more to counter your team.

So instead of using visible buffs, try to go for combat buffs. Or you are bound to keep losing even after you level up your defense fort.

Eliwood's buffs aren't visible though? I've had him buff, say, Frederick before, and he doesn't get the blue stat numbers and changes on the screen. So either the panic effect actually affects all buffs, or that's not the reason my team isn't good enough.

Also, those people like Aversa, fine. More power to them. I personally don't give a shit about her at all. I don't have to use her myself to be competitive.

Another thing, no team is going to be able to handle every single threat. Obviously my team will have a weakness, that's why I don't expect to always win. But I'd like a few wins.

No thanks, I think visible buffs are better. They typically increase your stats more than the combat ones. +6 Atk/Spd from Hone Cavalry as opposed to only +4 from Goad. As an example. That bit of extra speed could be the difference between being able to double or not getting doubled. And that extra Atk could mean you get a kill instead of leaving an enemy with 1 or 2 HP.

I only use combat buffs if I want to stack them on top of visible ones. Otherwise, I only use visible buffs.

 

[Vicious Sal]

If people want to exchange friend codes and try to fight my defense to give pointers i would appreciate that! I’d be ore than happy to give feedback on other peoples defenses. =]

0421969108

 

You built your team around eliwood giving bonus doubler to three units. That means you rely on visible buffs like the hones you mentioned. Eliwoods bonus doubler does jack shit if all those fancy blue numbers turn red immediately. That means instead of a +12(bonus doubler included) to all stats you get a -6. That is a huge difference. So yeah, hones give a bigger bonus, but they also give a bigger penalty since they are easily turned into that by enemies who control their units instead of the AI controllinng yours.

 

And I don’t care that you do not use Aversa, more power to you. You don’t fight your own defense however, others do. And pretty much all others have at least one way to inflict panic status on one of their teams since so many people use L!Azura. So if you want to build your team in a way that pretty much everyone else can easily deal with, be my guest. But don’t whine that you are only losing in that case.

You want to win more defenses? Maybe listen to advice instead of shooting it down immediately.

Edited July 5, 2019 by Vicious Sal
anT

[Ice Dragon]

24 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Eliwood's buffs aren't visible though? I've had him buff, say, Frederick before, and he doesn't get the blue stat numbers and changes on the screen. So either the panic effect actually affects all buffs, or that's not the reason my team isn't good enough.

Bonus Doubler itself doesn't give visible buffs, but it relies on visible buffs to actually do something. If you are using Eliwood's Bonus Doubler effect and you aren't using visible buffs (like his Vision of Arcadia skill), then the Bonus Double effect isn't actually doing anything.

 

25 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Also, those people like Aversa, fine. More power to them. I personally don't give a shit about her at all. I don't have to use her myself to be competitive.

He's not talking about you using Aversa. He's talking about your opponents using Aversa. A team that relies on visible buffs is vulnerable to players using Aversa to inflict Panic to stop the buffs from working.

[Anacybele]

3 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Bonus Doubler itself doesn't give visible buffs, but it relies on visible buffs to actually do something. If you are using Eliwood's Bonus Doubler effect and you aren't using visible buffs (like his Vision of Arcadia skill), then the Bonus Double effect isn't actually doing anything. 

Then wouldn't I still see the blue increased stat numbers from Vision of Arcadia? The point is that I never did when I looked.

4 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

He's not talking about you using Aversa. He's talking about your opponents using Aversa. A team that relies on visible buffs is vulnerable to players using Aversa to inflict Panic to stop the buffs from working.

He said a lot of competitive players have +10 Aversa, so I assumed he thought I should use her too.

And anyway, like I said, if that's my team's weakness, oh well, a single team can't win every single battle and deal with every single threat.

 

[Vicious Sal]

Just now, Anacybele said:

Then wouldn't I still see the blue increased stat numbers from Vision of Arcadia? The point is that I never did when I looked.

He said a lot of competitive players have +10 Aversa, so I assumed he thought I should use her too.

And anyway, like I said, if that's my team's weakness, oh well, a single team can't win every single battle and deal with every single threat.

 

Visions of arcadia requires you to field a dragon or beast unit to grant the buffs.

And while I do recommend Aversa, she is that good, you don’t have to use her if you don’t like her. Other people do use her however.

 

And yeah, that is one weakness of your team, an incredibly commonly used tactic people use is panic. It is a very bad idea to make your team weak to one of the most common AR offense tactics. Besides that, it is one weakness that I know of. I do not know your map layout, units, trap placement, positioning and more, I would need the map and skills for that. But you could be suspectible to more tactics lije hit and run, galeforce, cc vantage and stuff like that. Show your map and skills and we might be able to help.

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

Visions of arcadia requires you to field a dragon or beast unit to grant the buffs.

And while I do recommend Aversa, she is that good, you don’t have to use her if you don’t like her. Other people do use her however.

 

And yeah, that is one weakness of your team, an incredibly commonly used tactic people use is panic. It is a very bad idea to make your team weak to one of the most common AR offense tactics. Besides that, it is one weakness that I know of. I do not know your map layout, units, trap placement, positioning and more, I would need the map and skills for that. But you could be suspectible to more tactics lije hit and run, galeforce, cc vantage and stuff like that. Show your map and skills and we might be able to help.

And I've done that too, I have Caineghis on my defense team.

And I choose not to use her.

I doubt it's really that common, honestly. I've never really seen panic used in anything in the game, in fact. I hear more about tactics like gravity and pain.

[Ice Dragon]

@Anacybele Just watch all of your defense replays and see what players are using. You can see for yourself what is common, what is not, and what players are doing to beat your team. If you want to lose fewer defense matches, that should be the first thing you do.

Also, we can't help you with your defense map very much unless you actually show us what it looks like.

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

@Anacybele Just watch all of your defense replays and see what players are using. You can see for yourself what is common, what is not, and what players are doing to beat your team. If you want to lose fewer defense matches, that should be the first thing you do.

Also, we can't help you with your defense map very much unless you actually show us what it looks like.

I've done that before, actually. And...I didn't really learn anything from it. Besides, even if I did, it's not like I can just erase those other losses.

Nobody asked to see it, I thought. As I said though, it won't be much help now. Maybe closer to this season's end when I get a new team ready for next season.

[Vicious Sal]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I've done that before, actually. And...I didn't really learn anything from it. Besides, even if I did, it's not like I can just erase those other losses.

Nobody asked to see it, I thought. As I said though, it won't be much help now. Maybe closer to this season's end when I get a new team ready for next season.

What are you talking about, i asked litterally five minutes ago...

 

And you can always learn from your losses. Tally how many times you lost to a galeforce comp, close counter vantage units, supertanks, panics etc. See if your units choke up, if they are stuck behind buildings. 

And show your defense map and skills, otherwise helping you makes it that mich more difficult.

[Ice Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Besides, even if I did, it's not like I can just erase those other losses.

The point is to reduce the number of future losses you get, not to change the past.

The only way you can not learn anything is if you didn't watch any replays. Watching even one replay will at least tell you what other players are using against you, and that counts as learning.

 

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Nobody asked to see it, I thought.

Yes, someone did:

3 hours ago, LordFrigid said:

Out of curiosity, what does the map look like?

 

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

As I said though, it won't be much help now. 

You have slots for 5 maps. You can build a new map in one of the additional slots while you wait for the season to wind down. "Now" is never too early to start working on something.

[Anacybele]

6 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

The point is to reduce the number of future losses you get, not to change the past.

The only way you can not learn anything is if you didn't watch any replays. Watching even one replay will at least tell you what other players are using against you, and that counts as learning. 

Yeah, and it won't do much now until the update comes and adds defense rewards.

Who they're using doesn't matter much when in many instances my best counters to those units will still lose. And there are many units players can use, I can't predict who will show up.

Watching replays taught me nothing.

Edited July 5, 2019 by Anacybele

[Vicious Sal]

8 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Yeah, and it won't do much now until the update comes and adds defense rewards.

Who they're using doesn't matter much when in many instances my best counters to those units will still lose. And there are many units players can use, I can't predict who will show up.

Watching replays taught me nothing.

In that case please do keep posting how you fail while ignoring other people trying to help you so we can enjoy your suffering.

Seriously, that mentality and stubborn attitude is what is keeping you from climbing, not your terrible defense team or your bad performance on offenses.

[Anacybele]

3 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

In that case please do keep posting how you fail while ignoring other people trying to help you so we can enjoy your suffering.

Seriously, that mentality and stubborn attitude is what is keeping you from climbing, not your terrible defense team or your bad performance on offenses.

...Really? Was being so rude necessary?

I'm not immune to accepting help. But I don't have to accept every single idea someone gives me, you know. What you all suggested are things I've done and tried, in this case.

[XRay]

23 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Watching replays taught me nothing.

I would at least tally what strategy the enemy teams use and create a team that counters the most common strategy. Counter-Vantage, super tank, mass debuff, Galeforce, and regular Player Phase (the ones that focus on raw damage like Brave archers and Blade mages), are the most common I think.

Counter-Vantage is easily shut down with 2 or more Firesweep nukes. Super tanks are vulnerable to Pulse teams. Mass debuff teams just means you need to avoid bonus buffs and try to run Restore. Galeforce teams can be stalled with super bulky Wary Fighter tanks like Surtr. Regular Player Phase teams can be countered with strategic placements of Heavy Traps, removing your own Bolt Trap (so they cannot enter Desperation range nor easily use Wings of Mercy), and use high mobility ranged units yourself.

Edited July 5, 2019 by XRay

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, XRay said:

I would at least tally what strategy the enemy teams use and create a team that counters the most common strategy. Counter-Vantage, super tank, mass debuff, Galeforce, and regular Player Phase (the ones that focus on raw damage like Brave archers and Blade mages), are the most common I think.

Counter-Vantage is easily shut down with 2 or more Firesweep nukes. Super tanks are vulnerable to Pulse teams. Mass debuff teams just means you need to avoid bonus buffs and try to run Restore. Galeforce teams can be stalled with super bulky Wary Fighter tanks like Surtr. Regular Player Phase teams can be countered with strategic placements of Heavy Traps, removing your own Bolt Traps, and use high mobility ranged units yourself.

Sure, but one team can't possibly counter ALL of those. And you can only deploy one defense team at a time. If I deployed, say, a team that was anti-panic, people will just switch to a different offensive team that an anti-panic team is vulnerable to, right?  Changing to avoid one threat makes me vulnerable to another, I guess is what I'm saying. It's like I said before, one team can't counter everything.

I guess in the end, getting defense wins just feels like luck, as it does in arena.

[Vicious Sal]

Or you let people help you, people who have over a 70% win rate or more, people who apparently have defense team that win a lot more than lose. 

My lift loss this week has been a whopping -0 and i have had 12 wins and only two losses, both of which had at least two enemies defeated. You know why? My map works and counters almost all above teams to some degree. It forces people into unfavorable positions by bringing the fight to them. It is not perfect but it does work against most offense teams.

 

 

[Hilda]

3 hours ago, Anacybele said:

Oh. Well, of course I try to position things strategically. Like, I put a trap in front of who I believe would be the most easily targeted unit otherwise. But I guess there could be more to learn about that.

My defense team right now, since I lack Duma and all, is built around legendary Eliwood's support. So I put in three units with the same Atk stat for him to buff, since the other units there have lower Atk. And I added seals that buff further, and legendary Azura is there because she's best refresher (and mine has perfect +Spd, -Def IVs on top of that).

L!Eliwood Team based defense is really really bad unless you run a multitude of Harsh Command+ or Restore+. Units can get so easy paniced on Defense Teams due to Aversa which basicly means you are sitting on a Team that is more cripled by the presence of L!Eliwood then buffed.

Just the present of Aversa or a Panic Manor means that all or half of your units will insta die the moment they go into battle. I stoped using on my Defense Teams any kind of visible buff unless there is a Rally Trap with a L!Azura redance there.

The only buffs i provide to my Defense Teams are buffs that cant be paniced like Air Orders or Nagas Fang buff etc. which renders Aversa not useles, but only half as potent. I switched to working more with debuffs like Sudden Panic, Defense debuff structures, debuff BSlots or debuff Seals.

[Captain Karnage]

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

Yeah, and it won't do much now until the update comes and adds defense rewards.

Who they're using doesn't matter much when in many instances my best counters to those units will still lose. And there are many units players can use, I can't predict who will show up.

Watching replays taught me nothing.

Part of playing games like this are ensuring you have some way of dealing with your opponent's strategy. Now I really don't play Aether Raids but I do play a lot of MTG, and always for games 2 and 3 you need to change up your deck to make it work better against your opponent by bringing in pieces that hurt their main strategy     

and watching replays can show you how your AI likes to move, so you can better position them, because every healer knows the best spot for them is in the middle of the battlefield

Ana, listen to these people, they know what they are doing and are actively trying to help you improve as a player.

[Anacybele]

1 hour ago, Hilda said:

L!Eliwood Team based defense is really really bad unless you run a multitude of Harsh Command+ or Restore+. Units can get so easy paniced on Defense Teams due to Aversa which basicly means you are sitting on a Team that is more cripled by the presence of L!Eliwood then buffed.

Just the present of Aversa or a Panic Manor means that all or half of your units will insta die the moment they go into battle. I stoped using on my Defense Teams any kind of visible buff unless there is a Rally Trap with a L!Azura redance there.

The only buffs i provide to my Defense Teams are buffs that cant be paniced like Air Orders or Nagas Fang buff etc. which renders Aversa not useles, but only half as potent. I switched to working more with debuffs like Sudden Panic, Defense debuff structures, debuff BSlots or debuff Seals.

That's a weird opinion given how much trouble people had with Eliwood's LHB. A lot of people said it was possibly the hardest one so far. Even a seasoned player like Phoenixmaster said it was plain EVIL. Obviously, a legendary Eliwood based team works well. No idea why you'd think it was bad.

1 hour ago, Vicious Sal said:

Or you let people help you, people who have over a 70% win rate or more, people who apparently have defense team that win a lot more than lose. 

I've tried, but nothing people have suggested here worked for me.

1 hour ago, Captain Karnage said:

Ana, listen to these people, they know what they are doing and are actively trying to help you improve as a player.

I never said they weren't trying. Nor that I didn't appreciate it. But like I keep saying, their suggestions didn't work.

[Captain Karnage]

37 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I've tried, but nothing people have suggested here worked for me.

 

39 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I never said they weren't trying. Nor that I didn't appreciate it. But like I keep saying, their suggestions didn't work.

From what I have seen you post the best way to get help NOW, is to post a screen shot of your defense map, and show us your unit builds

everyone in this thread is trying to assist you with minimal information, the best way to help you is for you to share your defense map

[Anacybele]

13 minutes ago, Captain Karnage said:

From what I have seen you post the best way to get help NOW, is to post a screen shot of your defense map, and show us your unit builds

everyone in this thread is trying to assist you with minimal information, the best way to help you is for you to share your defense map

And I said I'd do that when the season is closer to being over, so I can prep for next season.

Also, technically, I never asked for help. But I wasn't going to ignore someone who gave a suggestion.

Edited July 5, 2019 by Anacybele

[Jave]

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

And I said I'd do that when the season is closer to being over, so I can prep for next season.

There's zero benefit on waiting, because you're just giving less time to those who want to help you to work something out.