Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[Saint Rubenio]

5 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Well, showing up is one thing. Actually playable is another.

Looks like it's only one from each Octopath game. Cyrus, Partitio, and Tithi.

...Still got Cyrus. Still a win.

[BrightBow]

50 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Are we sure Echoes' director wasn't Kaga in disguise? He couldn't allow one of his own games to get remade without his damsel fetish being inserted in /s

IS does an IS thing
FE Fans: Is that Kaga?

They dedicated a whole category in Heroes for their corruption fetish. Mareeta even got in that way first. As much as Kaga is trying to keep up, he isn't anywhere close.

[Saint Rubenio]

15 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

IS does an IS thing
FE Fans: Is that Kaga?

They dedicated a whole category in Heroes for their corruption fetish. Mareeta even got in that way first. As much as Kaga is trying to keep up, he isn't anywhere close.

Yeah, all things considered, at least Kaga doesn't develop a gacha. There's the real depravity, right there.

[BrightBow]

Guy doesn't even use brainwashing the same way. The remake portrayed Delthea's possession dramatically different compared to the original. Going for that blank expression look that is so common with the corruption fetish.

Needless to say Evil Julia also got the angry eyebrows.

 

Heroes Julia is... well, frankly I don't even know what this expression is supposed to be.

 

[Codename Shrimp]

[Saint Rubenio]

12 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

She looks so creepy. I hope her villainous phase lasts longer than 2 seconds here.

[Sidereal Wraith]

55 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

 

[Armagon]

3 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Yeah, all things considered, at least Kaga doesn't develop a gacha. There's the real depravity, right there.

Just for this, KagaSaga characters are gonna show up in the next banner because Kaga consented to it as a free way to advertise Vestaria Saga 3, releasing in 2055.

 

[Eltosian Kadath]

4 hours ago, Armagon said:

 

But it's why I did say this is like the worst game to iron man.

What makes it obnoxious to ironman is the numerous random unit dies death defeat conditions added to maps. Part 4 is where the defeat conditions are at their most sensible, but even then most of those maps have multiple game over units, which is worse than most games having just one. Somewhere between a half to a third of part 1 has the Any Ally Dies defeat conditions, and even when Radiant Dawn gets over that bad habit, characters can kind of randomly be added in as game over conditions even into part 3, worse yet sometimes its suicidal green units as well. 

 

4 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

It's nowhere near as bad as Houses softlocking you if you don't use / lose / reclass to the wrong class the starting students, Fates with its super specialized, min-maxed unit building or TRS where you lose half the healers in the game if Attrom dies on turn 1 of his map.

I don't see how Fates is even in the running here. It can be a difficult game, but there are so many ways to replace your units if you want, gives you a lot of options to change up the units you have to fill holes, and I find it rather ironman friendly for its difficulty level. Blazing Blade on the other hand deserves some mention as a game that is distinctly ironman unfriendly for its difficulty level...

[Saint Rubenio]

4 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Just for this, KagaSaga characters are gonna show up in the next banner because Kaga consented to it as a free way to advertise Vestaria Saga 3, releasing in 2055.

 

Implying Kaga gives half a fuck about Vestaria's reception lol

3 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

What makes it obnoxious to ironman is the numerous random unit dies death defeat conditions added to maps. Part 4 is where the defeat conditions are at their most sensible, but even then most of those maps have multiple game over units, which is worse than most games having just one. Somewhere between a half to a third of part 1 has the Any Ally Dies defeat conditions, and even when Radiant Dawn gets over that bad habit, characters can kind of randomly be added in as game over conditions even into part 3, worse yet sometimes its suicidal green units as well. 

Yeah this. As annoying as retreaters are, I definitely prefer them to this dumbass "everyone game overs you" nonsense.

4 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

I don't see how Fates is even in the running here. It can be a difficult game, but there are so many ways to replace your units if you want, gives you a lot of options to change up the units you have to fill holes, and I find it rather ironman friendly for its difficulty level. Blazing Blade on the other hand deserves some mention as a game that is distinctly ironman unfriendly for its difficulty level...

Hmm. I suppose we might be talking different kinds of "ironman friendly" here. I used to think Berwick Saga was pretty bad for ironmanning too, due to how unique each unit was, but as it turned out, it was tough to make the game unbeatable, you just lost more content from dead units than in a game like Shadow Dragon where a dead unit is kinda whatever.

Fates is kinda like that, I guess. Except I'd argue it doesn't really have enough lategame options to mitigate bad lategame deaths, unless you use Ghost Gold or something to unlock every paralogue before you risk losing the father and his child with him. Also if you lose Niles so much of the game becomes so much more difficult, including Endgame which becomes a massive issue to complete in the higher difficulties if you don't have an army of Pass peggies. Which is really dumb.

This is all assuming Conquest because, well, who plays the other campaigns? Haha, couldn't be me. Gunter Bad

[Armagon]

7 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Implying Kaga gives half a fuck about Vestaria's reception lol

He is aware of Western appeal tho, otherwise he wouldn't have licensed out the loc rights.

[Codename Shrimp]

12 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Also if you lose Niles so much of the game becomes so much more difficult, including Endgame which becomes a massive issue to complete in the higher difficulties if you don't have an army of Pass peggies

Me who only used Niles like once in quadzillion runs:

[Eltosian Kadath]

19 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

 Endgame which becomes a massive issue to complete in the higher difficulties if you don't have an army of Pass peggies. Which is really dumb.

I don't think this is as bad a problem as you think, as I tend to find that being willing to sacrifice units to finish the game works as a solid alternative to the cheese strats most people use in endgame, people just aren't used to, or comfortable with those kind of strategies, and how to get the most out of them. I tend not to mention it much, but I legitimately believe Conquest endgame was designed with unit death in mind.

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

He is aware of Western appeal tho, otherwise he wouldn't have licensed out the loc rights.

He was aware that people in the West wanted to play his games, and decided to find a way to let us have them out of, unironically, the goodness of his heart. I don't think he gives much of a fuck if a lot of people play them, he's making them for himself. It's Dangen that wants to get money for their localization work. That's probably the reason they're the only Dangen games - and Steam games, basically - that never go on sale.

Anyway, all this to say, no, IntSys outKaga'd Kaga on their own merits. Truly the student has surpassed the master. Until the master came in with a steel chair labelled "I can't wait for you to turn 18." Which is, most unfortunately, a line in Vestaria Saga 2. Because Shouzou Kaga is a creature.

1 hour ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Me who only used Niles like once in quadzillion runs:

I'll never understand it. You're willing to pour so many resources into a bad unit like Mozu but then Niles is apparently "too bad" even though basically all he needs is like, an energy drop and a tonic, if that?

...Wait shit I'm the one arguing optimal strats now, noooooooo

1 hour ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

I don't think this is as bad a problem as you think, as I tend to find that being willing to sacrifice units to finish the game works as a solid alternative to the cheese strats most people use in endgame, people just aren't used to, or comfortable with those kind of strategies, and how to get the most out of them. I tend not to mention it much, but I legitimately believe Conquest endgame was designed with unit death in mind.

Oh, I see. That's fair enough, I suppose. That'd explain why 75% of the cast are retreaters lol, they just want you to let them all die at the end.

[Lightchao42]

When you need a bigger boat

On 12/3/2023 at 7:12 PM, Acacia Sgt said:

I would unironically wish for a Nintendo Kart.

I would main Olimar (they wouldn't exclude Olimar because Miyamoto would hunt the developers down if they tried). I don't expect it to happen but it would be neat if it did.

On 12/3/2023 at 11:39 PM, Armagon said:

Also they put the King Kong vs Godzilla theme in the movie, that was a surprise.

Oh yeah, though I didn't notice it when I saw the movie myself. Godzilla vs. Destoroyah's ending theme also combined it with the Godzilla Suite.

I feel like Singular Point overused the Godzilla theme, but I think Minus One made good use of it.

6 hours ago, BrightBow said:

Heroes Julia is... well, frankly I don't even know what this expression is supposed to be.

That's a scowl, she's annoyed that her future self forced her to participate in a magical girl play.

[Armagon]

3 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Until the master came in with a steel chair labelled "I can't wait for you to turn 18." Which is, most unfortunately, a line in Vestaria Saga 2. Because Shouzou Kaga is a creature.

Kaga male characters falling in love with a legal age woman 

 

2 hours ago, Lightchao42 said:

feel like Singular Point overused the Godzilla theme, but I think Minus One made good use of it.

I don't think they used it more than the other.

[GuardianSing]

The bisexual army more like.

Man that was a long prologue

Nailah likes him submissive and breedable clearly

He's gay, ma'am

I make my jokes but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if some of the writers and artists of this game were experienced in "yaoi" related media. The influence there feels prominent and I swear it's not just me.

Both Telius games are gayer than the games that actually allow gay relationships and I stand by that.

She has returned to her former glory...

Wait, brother?! I knew about Almedha but who is the-

Ohhhhh...

Oh it all makes sense now

Also shout out to Ashnard doing the Garon face.

Ack, who am I kidding, they're all the bisexual army

Early to bed, early to rise...

Enough order and stability makes it easy to forget the troubles of the world. As long as the average person is comfortable with their position they might be terrified of any kind of chaos, even if it means letting those less fortunate suffer under a mountain of apathy.

...At least that's my interpretation of this scene.

Okay I didn't plan this out properly because only four of these units can reliably fight.

*three

Perhaps it was half my fault but god I hated how long that map was.

Another reason this death feels more emotional than the parental deaths of other games is just from the fact that Almedha isn't taking it very well.

In the Fire Emblem games I've played to completion thus far, those being FE3, FE8, FE9, FE11, FE13, FE14, FE15, and FE16 each had some form of the protagonist witnessing the death of their mentor figure, yet often failed to make it hit an emotional core for similar reasons.

For one, the initial shocked, angry, and sad reaction from the protagonist during the death gets very quickly booted out as the protagonist goes throughout the next few chapters as if nothing happened. It's hard to care about a character's death if they meant so little to the main character that they seem to get over it in like a day. They aren't mentioned much at all throughout the rest of the game and they don't have an effect on the psyche of the protagonist.

Two, the deaths don't make any risks and are too obvious because of that. I feel like a death in any media needs to weigh out the potential benefits and setbacks of said death, and to make the death impactful they need to make it so the death truly feels like a loss of something, but you also don't want to lose too much if the loss from that death doesn't outweigh the narrative potential of them staying alive. In Fire Emblem most deaths have neither loss nor gain. These mentor figures are engineered to not have any relevance to the plot so the story doesn't actually lose anything but by doing so makes the deaths feel pointless because...well they didn't lose anything. The plot of Three Houses remains the same regardless if Jeralt stays alive or not which is a problem. It's pretty easy to tell if these characters are going to die because of how little plot relevance they have while alive.

Three, they fail to be interesting characters for the player and for the protagonist. The main character may like their parents but they like them in the same way that someone likes a good looking vase, and the response to that parent's death is much the same how'd they react to a good looking vase of theirs breaking, they seem to forget about it completely as the story continues which definitely makes it look like they never really cared that much about them. You don't get much of anything on how much or what their parental figure means to them, you just assume that they care about them because they're their parents, and family typically care about each other. Corrin meets Mikoto as their mother for pretty much the first time in their conscious life and only knows her for half a day before she dies, and despite Corrin explicitly saying that they don't feel any connection towards Mikoto, they respond very strongly to her death, as if the writers forgot what they were doing and decided to just default to the usual.

Pelleas's death hits none of these, his mother reacts to it in a way you'd expect her to considering her only child just fucking died. She's distraught, depressed, and unreasonable. Even if Pelleas wasn't the most fleshed out character it remains an emotional death because I can tell how much Almedha cared about him.

 

[Armagon]

26 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

For one, the initial shocked, angry, and sad reaction from the protagonist during the death gets very quickly booted out as the protagonist goes throughout the next few chapters as if nothing happened. It's hard to care about a character's death if they meant so little to the main character that they seem to get over it in like a day.

I think they flat out just do not have time to grieve. 

[Acacia Sgt]

24 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

Nailah likes him submissive and breedable clearly

And also for him to not change just for the sake of it as well, I guess.

24 minutes ago, GuardianSing said:

*three

You can take it off, at least.

3 minutes ago, Armagon said:

I think they flat out just do not have time to grieve. 

That and plenty use of timeskips for some of them, too. As well that Almedha can get away with it since she's not playable, I suppose.

[Acacia Sgt]

Okay, time to continue with Clannad...

[Interdimensional Observer]

20 hours ago, GuardianSing said:

This is what waking up to go work is like

My takeaway from this line is that Skrimir might not have been fully awake during this battle, that he fought it half-asleep.

Lion prince strong.

1 hour ago, GuardianSing said:

I make my jokes but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if some of the writers and artists of this game were experienced in "yaoi" related media. The influence there feels prominent and I swear it's not just me.

There is one game I'm aware of where the devs admitted to trying to appeal to yaoi fans. -Not this one though.

 

13 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Well, the official timeline had a lot of wars happening. Just not continent-spanning ones.

To be precise:

The 432-478 Begnion vs. Crimea & Daein War being the most prolonged conflict. Though I imagine there was a brief window in 425 when Crimea was fighting Daein and Daein got declared on by Begnion, which would've meant four countries at war at once, prior to Daein presumably rushing a white peace with Crimea.

A 46-year war would perhaps suggest that Begnion could readily match Crimea + Daein in might, otherwise you'd think a clear win would've happened sooner. And if Begnion was able to besiege Nevassa (perhaps because its army was off in Crimea), then they could've reoccupied easily half of Daein for those decades of war, losing them probably only gradually and holding onto at least a rump until the peace treaty.

Kilvas's surrender earlier might've made things worse for Daein, but perhaps that helped old king Dheg sleep easier. Since a BvCD war was purely Beorc, Phoenicis and Gallia could've told themselves "let those stupid humans kill each other" as to why they should stay out of the nonsense. If Kilvas had accepted Phoenicis's aid, maybe the situation in Daein wouldn't have gotten as bad, and Crimea wouldn't have gotten involved, but then it's also possible they would've ended up with a five-country conflict.

Notable in this timeline I find to be two things. The first being the matter of Laguz-Beorc relations shaping conflict and geopolitical separation. And the other is Begnion the great power trying to cling on to control of the entire continent outside of Goldoa. Nice if simple for IS to have done this.

 

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

I think they flat out just do not have time to grieve. 

You're actually reminding me of this one early scene in SRWJ. Akito snaps at everyone else for a lack of mourning after leaving Mars, and yeah, the others say it's not that they don't want to, it's that they can't at the speed things have been going.

[Acacia Sgt]

5 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Notable in this timeline I find to be two things. The first being the matter of Laguz-Beorc relations shaping conflict and geopolitical separation. And the other is Begnion the great power trying to cling on to control of the entire continent outside of Goldoa. Nice if simple for IS to have done this.

To be fair, Begnion used to control everything sans Goldoa. Crimea and Daein broke off and declared independence, the Laguz left the main population centers in the eastern half of the continent and then took over the sparsely and seldom populated woods and islands far from the core Begnion region. So yeah, it's not surprising some in Begnion would want to return to those good old days...

... man, how... relatable to modern day issues...

OMG, Begnion is Russia!

Edited December 6, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Interdimensional Observer]

Just now, Acacia Sgt said:

To be fair, Begnion used to control everything sans Goldoa. Crimea and Daein broke off and declared independence, the Laguz left the main population centers in the eastern half of the continent and then took over the sparsely and seldom populated woods and islands far from the core Begnion region. So yeah, it's not surprising some in Begnion would want to return to those good old days...

... man, how... relatable to modern day issues...

Honestly I like having a grand theme stretching over hundreds of years like this. Begnion's repeated efforts to retain hegemony are... something.😄 Not sure exactly how historical such a thing actually is, but it sounds like it.😆

And Begnion's bigness seems to have always been in the cards for Tellius.

Even in the old map, sure "Razia" is probably the Grann Desert. Yet the entire eastern half of the continent (Noad, Est, and Persis being duchies within the Empire) belonged to Begnion. And Serenes seems to have massacred even back then judging from Leanne's old profile, so by the start Beta PoR, the ashen woods probably would've been de facto Begnion again.

Gallia and Crimea got bigger, Daein moved eastward, Phoenicis shrank and Kilvas was invented. Yet Begnion remained predominant even with these changes.🤓 That makes some sense, given Ike's old story was centered on a murder-treason-disappearance mystery in Begnion.

...What I don't actually understand on the Beta map is how the western countries were at all relevant when Ike's story was outwardly Begnion-centered.

• Though I'll guess that Titania b/c children & retainers of a traitor, founded the mercenaries corp in Crimea, much safer that way.
  • Also, Crimea's Recollection profile mentions a curious detail that does not appear aligned with the final game. That being, Crimea relies overwhelmingly on mercenaries for the national defense.
• That, I imagine, would've set the stage for Crimea-Daein conflict, as in Path of Radiance.
  • Although I can't imagine in this beta world the scenario of Ike heading to Begnion to get its help against Daein. Since here, Ike would have a grudge to settle against Begnion, especially his powerful adoptive maternal grandfather.
    • Yet, if under the diplomatic protection of Crimea/Elincia, I can imagine Ike wouldn't be arrested simply for stepping foot in the country again. So, perhaps the PoR Begnion visit could've happened just the same.
    • And once in Begnion, the Heron & S Massacre apologies stuff could've unfolded just the same.
• Were they already planning a duology even in the beta phase?🤔 Since combining both a Crimea-Daein war and a murder-mystery about the BIG country in a single game seems like too much.
  • The Recollections does describe the duchies as being powerful and fairly independent. Perhaps Ike becomes cordial enough with Sanaki, yet remains at odds with the big three dukes, including grandpa (but then he couldn't have been chancellor of the empire?).
  • Stefan's beta profile calls the "dark god" by the name "Yune". So the lie was probably always a thing?

The choice to delete the murder-mystery, and to divorce Greil and Elena from having anything to do with Begnion and Duke Persis, and go for something less dramatic for them in Daein. Why?🤔 ...Did IS find it difficult to reconcile with their other ideas? Did they choose to retain the grand narrative and reduce Ike's personal story? 

[Acacia Sgt]

Development histories are always so interesting.

Maybe they did already had in mind two games. Which makes me think, did Kaga did with Archanea? Since in the first game the northeast region of the continent is deliberately non-visited, but we do visit in the sequel. So perhaps same thing here.

It was probably too much for just one game, I suppose.

I like how it looks like that island off the coast of Beta!Gallia was simply pushed back into the mainland of the release map. Almost like a puzzle piece, heh.

Edited December 6, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Acacia Sgt]

Nine lights. Still far from the end... but edging ever closer. I'm not ready. I wasn't when I saw the anime, still aren't even now...