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Thoughts on FEH's fanservice

FEH and fanservice  

91 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you play FEH for the fanservice?

    • Yes, I play FEH mostly/entirely for the fanservice
      3
    • Yes, but I enjoy other aspects of the game
      19
    • No, but I don't mind the fanservice
      36
    • No, and fanservice sours my enjoyment of FEH
      20
    • I like fanservice, but FEH doesn't cater to me
      4
    • Fanservice doesn't affect my experience with FEH
      9
  2. 2. Do you, PERSONALLY, think FEH needs more fanservice?

    • Yes, I would like to see more fanservice
      10
    • No, I think fanservice is fine as is
      16
    • No, but it needs variety
      33
    • No, and I would like to see less
      20
    • I don't care either way
      12


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I don't really mind the fanservice in Heroes. Fanservice in a gacha game doesn't cost us anything. In Fates you can say certain characters suffered because they focused on fanservice while they should be focusing on something else. But Heroes isn't like that, Askr is a safe environment where characters can devote some of their character to fanservice and where it can add something instead of taking away from them. 

Takumi is shown to be a bit less mature than he styles himself to be and he's a canonical beach lover. With this in mind him being a beach unit that actually looks happy for a change makes sense. They even incorporated the obscure detail that he's good with kids by pairing him with Tiki who calls him ''Tak-Tak''. Its suitable, it adds to him and its cute. 

Roy and Lilina spending valentine together is an endearing sight and the Ostian and Pheriean families(+Lyn) going to festivals together seems like something they all would  do. 

Given that she has a very childish side Lucina is very much the type to dress up as a bunny and get very happy about it. Alfonse definitely not wanting to dress as a bunny but doing so to make Sharena happy is a nice depiction of their sibling relation and Loki manipulating Veronica to dress up and say ''hippity hop'' because it amuses her seems in character for everyone involved. 

Despite all the controversy it must be said that Camilla really is the person to go to the beach, the hotsprings and visit a ton of festivals. 

The biggest problem when it comes to fanservice is that a lot of it is monopolized by a select set of characters. If its a cute girl alt then it likely goes to Lyn or Lucina, if its an...uh developed woman its usually Camilla or Kagero, if its an alt for a teenage boy it goes to  Takumi and for loli's its often Tiki or Sakura. 

Edited by Etrurian emperor

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Do you play FEH for fanservice? 

  • No, but I don't mind the fanservice. I play this game because it's Fire Emblem (and also because I admit that I like the mechanics of the game. However, if it wasn´t a FE game I wouldn't have touched it). I have played other gatcha before (always as a F2P), but only felt attached to one (Valkyrie Crusade, which I'll may be refering later). The main difference here is that FEH being a FE game makes it a lot more easy for me to not disconnect from the game.

Do you personally think that FEH needs more fanservice?

  • No, but it needs variery. Most of the times, fanservice in FEH (not taking into consideration OG versions, since they have their own style) is either a cute loli (such as Summer Elise, Christmas Lyssa or Bride Sanaki) or a women with big chest (Camilla, Kagero, Gunnthrà, Laegjarn, even the only Charlotte in the game is an alt of this kind). Sure, there are also other female characters that receive alts, but they don't seem fanservicy at all. There's of course a few exceptions, but they aren't used as much as some of us would like. 
  • For example, some of my personal favourite fanservice alts are: Anna: Wealth-Wisher (she's cute, but more important, she has a more beliveable body shape. Also, that wink, it gives me between charming and naughty vibes. I don´t need her revealing anything, although I would love a summer Anna tbh), Cordelia: Knight Paradise (she´s simply wow. She´s so badass in the most anime context of the word. Also, while not revealing anything specifically I would consider her really appealing to the eyes. And once again, in her special, she's winking), Caeda: Talys's Bride (most of what I said before applies to her. However, she is more in line with the cute adorable girl style. Being like that without being a loli is other of my favourites fanservices. Probably the only of my favourite alts that I still don't have. Seeing that manual with the divine codes really hurts T.T) and L'arachel: Harvest Princess (similar reasons to Caeda, but mixed with a bit of naughty). These are the type of women I feel attracted to in real life, so I like when I see that represented in fanservice. It's not like if I didn't like thicc women too, but geting 4 (between thicc + loli) for every Ana/Cordelia/Caeda type is too much. We need more badass, naughty, tsundere and cute shy girls in the special heroes. And also hot/interesting men.
Spoiler

Anna Wealth-Wisher Face.webpCordelia Knight Paradise Face.webpCaeda Talyss Bride Face.webpLArachel Harvest Princess Face.webp

  • There are also other fanservices that I like: customes. For example, I think my two favourite alts in this regard are men. Lukas: Buffet for One (literally, my favourite alt in the game. I really like both his design and the clothes themselves. Its like, he's wearing the kind of clothes that I'd love to wear, but that I've been born too late to wear in the current society) and Ike: Brave Mercenary (a character cosplayed as another character who is his father? Pls, more like this).
Spoiler

Lukas Buffet for One Face.webp

  • In order to close the Special Heroes theme, what I really don't like is when they try to put characters out of place just because they're popular. For example, Marisa: Crimsom Rabbit (she could perfectly have gone for a badass character, but they decided to ruin it trying a cute approach that just don't match the character). 
  • Out of special heroes (and CYL), there's other thing that I want more in the game, and it's related to damaged arts. Most of girls just seem afraid, screaming, crying or all of them at the same time. I'd like more damaged arts like Soleil's (she's like, c'mon, I'm not afraid, I'm enjoying this battle).

 

Spoiler

Soleil Adorable Adorer BtlFace D.webp

  • While I don't really have any problem with revealing fanservice, I prefer sutile fanservice. Insinuative clothes > revealing clothes. 
  • Finally, I would add something and I hope this doesn't get missunderstood. While I don't like the hot springs theme at all, I think they did a really good job there. It got 5 types of sexual fanservice and only 2 of them were the over and over repeated: we had a nice looking man (Ryoma), a badass woman (Hinoka), a cute girl (gladly not approached on a loli style, Sakura), a loli (Elise) and a thicc woman (Camilla). In my opinion, I would have changed either Sakura or Elise for an intelectual man, or at least something similar in line of the theme (maybe Jakob?). 

I'll edit the post with the PNGs in spoiler in order to make it as clear of possible what I'm trying to say.

 

Also, I'm not a native English speaker, so if any moderator find the wording thicc inapropiate, just tell me which word must I use to change it. 

 

Edit: totally agree with what @Etrurian emperor said.

Edited by Javi Blizz

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I agree very much with the two above me. 
I play fire emblem heroes, because it's fire emblem (to me) and it's fun. I don't have a problem with "fan service" because to me - everything kinda is fanservicey - it doesn't have to be people in towels or swimsuits but it could simply be an adorable Faye carrying a bucket of meat. that's really sweet, it hits me as a fan, and it services my needs (i like archers regardless of the movement). and I know that's what not what people mean by fanservice but i honestly feel that's how it should be applicable


is this servicing you as a fan. 
sexually/adorably
must-protecc-syndrome
movement type/gameplay

basically there are some units i wouldn't even pull for but i do because they fly (bonus points if they are flying range.) for example.  whatever rocks your boat, i feel as long as people are respectful of other people's wants/needs in the game, and if the game can provide for everyone, then i'm cool wtih it and for the most part i think they do (esp. because when it doesn't hit me, i can safely save up).

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My favorite part of FEH is being able to see all these characters we love so much interacting with one another, and being able to see them in circumstances outside of their home games. It's like getting to hang out with your friends again. 🙂 It also allows for things to occur which couldn't happen in their normal timelines (i.e., Berkut and Rinea being happy together and alive at the same time, Griel getting to see how the mercenary company is doing after his death, Sigurd getting to meet his adult son, etc.)

So, basically, I like it for the sentimental stuff. Heheh! But I also really like FEH's own story and characters, too. So, I guess it's all about the characters and what they do in their lives to me.

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I despise this kind of fanservice. It detracts from the narrative and everything FE is trying to be and is just there to pander to the immature and/ or creepy parts of the fanbase. If they like fanservice, whatever - that's what Dead or Alive is for. Leave the degenerate stuff out of a game that's trying to be something better. Even worse are characters who exist solely for fanservice, or those who are supposed to be interesting or important but are only used as fanservice*. I think this thread was doomed to arguments from the start, but I'll refrain from giving examples all the same. I imagine it's not hard to tell who I'm referring to though.

1 hour ago, Mercakete said:

My favorite part of FEH is being able to see all these characters we love so much interacting with one another, and being able to see them in circumstances outside of their home games. It's like getting to hang out with your friends again. 🙂 It also allows for things to occur which couldn't happen in their normal timelines (i.e., Berkut and Rinea being happy together and alive at the same time, Griel getting to see how the mercenary company is doing after his death, Sigurd getting to meet his adult son, etc.)

So, basically, I like it for the sentimental stuff. Heheh! But I also really like FEH's own story and characters, too. So, I guess it's all about the characters and what they do in their lives to me.

The OP clearly explained this wasn't the type of fanservice being discussed right now xD But I agree that this is the kind we should have, not the type that's just pandering to people with nothing better to do with their lives.

* Weirdly enough, I'm more accepting of outfits that are open about being fanservicey (like summer alts) vs those that are trying to "hide" the fact that they're fanservicey. Olivia for example: I think her default outfit is stupidly over-designed for something that's just meant to be titillating, but I'm neutral about her PA!art (and Tethys' for that matter) because it's simpler and more to the point about her being a dancer. (And I said more accepting - not accepting of all such outfits.)

P.S. And to the people who will inevitably complain "I like fanservice, why should it bother you" and variants of the same: https://www.resetera.com/threads/why-women-criticise-sexualised-character-designs-ot2-i-have-no-pants-and-i-must-scream-read-op.65064/

Edited by DefyingFates

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@DefyingFates

I know. But I was responding to this prompt:

15 hours ago, NegativeExponents- said:

If you answer to anything other than the 1st option on the first question, then what besides the fanservice appeals to you about Heroes?

I just don't want to talk about sexual stuff, so I focused on this prompt. I like non-sexual fanservice, for the most part. As for sexual fanservice, I don't like it. Even for ones that appeal to me, objectively, I'd rather keep by brain above base impulse level, you know? I just think it's mentally healthier to not focus on base impulse stuff most of the time, especially since such things can easily get addictive, which is, again, bad for the brain and produce hard habits to break. (Like, "what's your mind on?" kind of habits.) It can also lead to looking at other people with the mindset of "how can I get gratification from them?/how do they appeal to me?" instead of "that person is an individual with his or her own hopes, dreams, and problems, and should be treated with respect. And that person is beautiful as a person, not as an object." So, I also think that sexual fanservice can be dangerous, especially for minors and young adults whose hormones are in full swing and whose brains haven't finished developing.

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14 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

P.S. And to the people who will inevitably complain "I like fanservice, why should it bother you" and variants of the same: https://www.resetera.com/threads/why-women-criticise-sexualised-character-designs-ot2-i-have-no-pants-and-i-must-scream-read-op.65064/

 

I will say - as a girl. I don't like that article. For a myriad of reasons.

again I'll point back to my post. I think fanservice of all kinds exist. I don't think anyone is wrong for liking the type of fanservice they do - nor does it make them immature (or creepy). it's what they happen to like. everyone likes what they like and i don't think that they should feel excluded (or feel bad) for doing so personally. But it's a your millage may vary here. 

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26 minutes ago, Mercakete said:

I just don't want to talk about sexual stuff, so I focused on this prompt

Oh okay, that's fair. And I agree with what you have to say too, especially about the negative impressions it can leave on people.

16 minutes ago, daisy jane said:

again I'll point back to my post. I think fanservice of all kinds exist. I don't think anyone is wrong for liking the type of fanservice they do - nor does it make them immature (or creepy). it's what they happen to like. everyone likes what they like and i don't think that they should feel excluded (or feel bad) for doing so personally. But it's a your millage may vary here.

I get that. I really do. I just think there's a time and a place for this stuff (and everything really). If blatant fanservice is what you live for, you should stick to dating sims. If you want complex games with your fanservice, you should play Dead or Alive or the Neptunia games (or heck, anything by Compile Heart - I hear they make some really good ones). And there are straight-up Adult Only games out there too, aren't there?

My issue is that Fire Emblem is meant to be more serious, so I hate that IS feels compelled to appeal to the lowest common denominator by including walking fetishes wherever they can.

Thankfully Three Houses prioritised giving everyone actual personalities before anything else. I just wish I could say the same for everything else they've put out over the last few years.

Edited by DefyingFates

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40 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

Oh okay, that's fair. And I agree with what you have to say too, especially about the negative impressions it can leave on people.

I get that. I really do. I just think there's a time and a place for this stuff (and everything really). If blatant fanservice is what you live for, you should stick to dating sims. If you want complex games with your fanservice, you should play Dead or Alive or the Neptunia games (or heck, anything by Compile Heart - I hear they make some really good ones). And there are straight-up Adult Only games out there too, aren't there?

My issue is that Fire Emblem is meant to be more serious, so I hate that IS feels compelled to appeal to the lowest common denominator by including walking fetishes wherever they can.

Thankfully Three Houses prioritised giving everyone actual personalities before anything else. I just wish I could say the same for everything else they've put out over the last few years.

to make a point - One of my very favourite television shows is Xena: Warrior Princess.  It's funny/'camp, and extremely serious depending on the episode or what's going on. Xena (how she dresses/acts) can be seen as very fanservicey. But she's also a warrior, a mother, a lover, a friend, everything. But if you only focus on one aspect (how she looks like - as a character - you tend to miss out on all of that). 

Fire Emblem should be a complex (as it can be) thing like Xena. there was war, murder, death, redemption intrigue, but also love, laughter and fun. and so (to make this easier I think it's a whole other debate on actual "design choice etc"-) a Character decides to be on more 'sexual" side of dressing - to fight a war, kick butt etc - why is that a lower common denominator? because there is still more to that character than just that.  You can have both. You can be more than both. And it doesn't make it wrong to want it/like it, or Fire Emblem should be "above" that. that's not very realistic. 

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2 minutes ago, daisy jane said:

to make a point - One of my very favourite television shows is Xena: Warrior Princess.  It's funny/'camp, and extremely serious depending on the episode or what's going on. Xena (how she dresses/acts) can be seen as very fanservicey. But she's also a warrior, a mother, a lover, a friend, everything. But if you only focus on one aspect (how she looks like - as a character - you tend to miss out on all of that)

I get that; Bayonetta's another character with a revealing design but has a lot going for her, but the stuff in bold is my sticking point: both examples have more going for them than just their looks. My problem is with characters who only have revealing designs and nothing else - or characters who are supposed to be more than just fanservice, but don't actually do anything but pander to the audience. Those are the ones I hate and think drag the franchise down with them.

To use Tethys from FE8 as an example again: she has a revealing design, but she isn't throwing herself at all the men she Supports with. Instead you learn more about why she became a dancer and what she's been through and you realise that she has a much more subdued personality than she lets on. If all the other characters that have not-so-subtly come up in this thread were the same way I wouldn't have a problem with them - the thing is that they aren't and that's why I dislike them so.

I hope that makes sense!

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Honestly, fanservice doesn't faze me at all anymore, I've spent years watching anime/reading manga, I'm confident in saying that I've seen it all.

In terms of "sexual" fanservice in FEH, I don't mind. Honestly, you see worse in real life than what is actually seen in-game. I do think there comes a point where you have to draw a line, like, if it is very OOC for a character to be showing a lot of skin, or acts very uncomfortable about it, then yeah, lets not do that.

Do I play FEH for the fanservice? No. I play it because it's FE. If I get to see Marth dressed as a groom and Caeda in a bridal dress, that's a bonus.

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Some fanservice is good

Then there's the constant the game trying to show these woman's cleavage popping out of her freaking swimsuit.

Like some of my favorite fanservice was

Also Summer Xander, Leo, and Helbindi are amazing

waiting on Summer Hrid IS answer my calls give me what I want

Edited by PeonyofLeosa Dreamworld

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I realized sometime within the first year of the game I was not the target audience. I'm a woman in her mid-twenties who is attracted to men more intellectually than physically, and I wanted to play a game that let me use characters I grew to love in the Tellius series as well as get to know some new ones! After playing RD and PoR, I certainly didn't expect to have characters throwing themselves at a self-insert that I had named (and at first, thought could be a woman because nothing said otherwise until we saw closer art).

But, eventually, I learned more about Awakening and Fates, and realized that the later FE games did have more of a dating sim aspect I'm not at all interested in. However, I don't mind the designed for fanservice characters that clearly don't appeal to me (I try to not to look at Loki too long, for example...) as long as it isn't pushed on me. That's why Loki and some of the other really sexualized women greatly annoy me. I don't want them throwing themselves at the avatar who represents me. If there was more of a degree of separation between me and the avatar, I'd be a lot happier with the state of fanservice in the game.

At the same time, I get a lot of people playing the game don't want that degree of separation. It's just frustrating to me, as a woman, that unlike Fates or Awakening, I can't design a female avatar and get away from sexualized female characters flirting with me. I'd be fine with some sexualized characters flirting with other characters in the game, it just makes me uncomfortable when they are written to be flirting with me.

So, in conclusion... my main issue is probably part of the reason others enjoy the game. If the sexualized characters weren't throwing themselves at me, I'd be okay with the fanservice. Which goes to show that as a straight female, I'm not the target audience, despite being a huge Tellius fan. And for a game meant to celebrate the franchise, that is disappointing to me.

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12 hours ago, Venmi said:

as long as it isn't pushed on me. That's why Loki and some of the other really sexualized women greatly annoy me. I don't want them throwing themselves at the avatar who represents me. If there was more of a degree of separation between me and the avatar, I'd be a lot happier with the state of fanservice in the game.

I'm a straight guy and even I'm disgusted by this stuff, so I know exactly how you feel.

I don't get how people can enjoy it either, but that goes back to the "a time and place" thing: if fictional, scantily clad women throwing themselves at you is how you keep your esteem high, fine. Just...not in a franchise about fighting wars, please?

Edit: The self-esteem thing came off pretty aggressive. Not my intention!

Edited by DefyingFates

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Unfortunately fanservice is pretty much the standard these days. Haven’t you all noticed how fanservice is becoming more common in games and franchises where there wasn’t before? People are also becoming more open about liking fanservice and developers are taking noticed of that. Also, haven’t you noticed how whenever a female character gets introduced the first thing people do is ogle over her appearance? And that in a matter of hours a ton of raunchy fanart of the female character appear? As I said developers took notice of that, realized that fanservice sells and a lot and cranked it up in their games. We’re pretty much in the age of fanservice.

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I don't mind fanservice in most things, really. As someone who likes both guys and girls, I'm not gonna act holier and pretend like I don't seeing cute girls and guys in different outfits from time to time when I'm playing. I like character designs and I get excited being able to see characters dressed differently, I find it interesting.

I don't think it needs more fanservice, but I would like more variety, at least. I'm honestly not a big fan of swimsuits to begin with, it's nice from time to time I'd like to see a lot more kimonos, or even different types of dresses, maybe something classy and sophisticated like suits or something different for guys.
And I would obviously prefer it for characters I am more fond of. I find it cute seeing these characters I've grown really fond of in different outfits and situations, it's just something I enjoy and find interesting. Don't care about half of the Heroes OCs in that sense.

So yea, I don't mind the fanservice, doesn't need more, but want more variety.

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The main appeal of Feh to me is the unique aspect of using my favorites from different FE games all together in one place, and because the gameplay is pretty fun while doing so. But yes, I do like the fanservice too, and I would be happy for them to do more of it. I like the seasonals a lot, from the goofy to the sexy ones, and that whimsy improves the game to me. Alts like Spring Loki or Halloween Mia are really fun to see. (And yes, I have no problem with them doing more male fanservice either, even if that doesn't appeal to me as much personally) I like the main games to be a little more serious, but for something like this I'm all for people fighting in bikinis and Santa suits mixed in, or Loki and Aversa "fighting over" Kiran in Forging Bonds. (I really don't self insert, but that was still by far the most entertaining FB to read for me)

FE's just never been that kind of super serious franchise that I find fanservice or some goofy stuff unwelcome in.

Edited by Alkaid

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3 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

I'm a straight guy and even I'm disgusted by this stuff, so I know exactly how you feel.

I don't get how people can enjoy it either, but that goes back to the "a time and place" thing: if fictional, scantily clad women throwing themselves at you is how you keep your esteem high, fine. Just...not in a franchise about fighting wars, please?

I don't know why your sexuality has anything to do with this, 'cause these big booby designs also appeal to straight girls and lesbians too.

Fighting war franchise with CHARACTERS, characters that can also happen to be scantily dressed, flirty women when not on the battlefield. What happened to women can freely express their sexuality? Are we suddenly a good Christian value community now when it comes to Fire Emblem? Also, there are people who feel lonely, are uncomfortable/busy with real life interactions, maybe these characters who constantly 'throw themselves' at the self insert character make those people happy without the heavy investment. Don't just generalize and mock everyone who likes these stuff as people who like to keep their esteem high, pretty disrespectful...

-- 

Fanservice is fine when it's applied to both male and female characters, which I think Fire Emblem as a franchise and in Heroes is doing very well. (though I do realize there is disproportional statistic when it comes male/female banner ratios, and they can definitely do better in that department)

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Quite simply, I find it embarrassing, and I know a lot of people who are put off from the game (or other FE games) due to the fanservicey stuff

34 minutes ago, thanny said:

I don't know why your sexuality has anything to do with this, 'cause these big booby designs also appeal to straight girls and lesbians too.

Fighting war franchise with CHARACTERS, characters that can also happen to be scantily dressed, flirty women when not on the battlefield. What happened to women can freely express their sexuality? Are we suddenly a good Christian value community now when it comes to Fire Emblem? Also, there are people who feel lonely, are uncomfortable/busy with real life interactions, maybe these characters who constantly 'throw themselves' at the self insert character make those people happy without the heavy investment. Don't just generalize and mock everyone who likes these stuff as people who like to keep their esteem high, pretty disrespectful...

-- 

Fanservice is fine when it's applied to both male and female characters, which I think Fire Emblem as a franchise and in Heroes is doing very well. (though I do realize there is disproportional statistic when it comes male/female banner ratios, and they can definitely do better in that department)

You know why he brought up his gender and sexuality-- straight men are the target audience with this stuff. A minor point to add, but take note that fictional female characters who are scantily dressed has nothing to do with expressing their sexuality. They're completely fictitious, they have no agency and therefore can't express themselves. These design choices exist because their creators went with it, in order to cater to themselves and/or a target audience.

There are a lot of reasons to criticize this stuff, and while I don't necessarily begrudge anyone for enjoying sexually objectifying content, it's kind of unfair that the people who don't enjoy it are given no choice, and are sometimes told they're a prude or whatever. It's important to listen to people when they're criticizing these design choices because it's pretty common for some fans to get carried away and start pushing people out of the community over things like this. For what it's worth, I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone say they've felt a self-esteem boost from seeing anime boobs, but it's pretty common to hear people of all identities saying they're uncomfortable with these design choices.

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1 hour ago, thanny said:

I don't know why your sexuality has anything to do with this, 'cause these big booby designs also appeal to straight girls and lesbians too.

Fighting war franchise with CHARACTERS, characters that can also happen to be scantily dressed, flirty women when not on the battlefield. What happened to women can freely express their sexuality? Are we suddenly a good Christian value community now when it comes to Fire Emblem? Also, there are people who feel lonely, are uncomfortable/busy with real life interactions, maybe these characters who constantly 'throw themselves' at the self insert character make those people happy without the heavy investment. Don't just generalize and mock everyone who likes these stuff as people who like to keep their esteem high, pretty disrespectful...

I'm not the person you quoted, but since he was replying to me, I'll throw a bit in here.

I only mentioned being a straight woman to emphasize that I am not the target audience, and I get uncomfortable when the romantic attentions are written to be directed to me. Actually, I'd be nearly as uncomfortable with a male character doing it- that's not why I'm playing the game. Just as those who enjoy that are allowed to enjoy it, I'm allowed to be uncomfortable with it. I fully enjoy a well done relationship fleshed out between characters. If that involves a woman scantily dressed and comfortable with her sexuality, that's not an issue for me. If she flirts with male characters, that's fine. I wish FEH was more about interactions between characters, not with me. That's why it being aimed at the self-insert is so frustrating, because I play this game to interact with Tellian characters (who weren't extremely sexualized) and not to be flirted with.

To be clear, I'm not generalized or mocking anyone else. I'm explaining what type of fanservice I'd like to see less of. 

Well, that's my two cents.

 

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9 hours ago, daisy jane said:

to make a point - One of my very favourite television shows is Xena: Warrior Princess.  It's funny/'camp, and extremely serious depending on the episode or what's going on. Xena (how she dresses/acts) can be seen as very fanservicey. But she's also a warrior, a mother, a lover, a friend, everything. But if you only focus on one aspect (how she looks like - as a character - you tend to miss out on all of that). 

 

Xena has the advantage of being the protagonist of just about every episode, so it’s easy for other aspects of her character to be developed. FEH splits it’s focus between... a lot of characters, and their design in the only aspect that doesn’t suffer from a lack of prominence.

Another thing to note is FEH is not really a story-driven turn-based strategy game, it just masquerades as one. It’s a system designed to suck as much money out of the customers as possible. Other such systems have proven that a certain kind of fanservice is a very efficient method, so naturally IS will make use of it for their system.

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29 minutes ago, Johann said:

You know why he brought up his gender and sexuality-- straight men are the target audience with this stuff. A minor point to add, but take note that fictional female characters who are scantily dressed has nothing to do with expressing their sexuality. They're completely fictitious, they have no agency and therefore can't express themselves. These design choices exist because their creators went with it, in order to cater to themselves and/or a target audience.

There are a lot of reasons to criticize this stuff, and while I don't necessarily begrudge anyone for enjoying sexually objectifying content, it's kind of unfair that the people who don't enjoy it are given no choice, and are sometimes told they're a prude or whatever. It's important to listen to people when they're criticizing these design choices because it's pretty common for some fans to get carried away and start pushing people out of the community over things like this. For what it's worth, I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone say they've felt a self-esteem boost from seeing anime boobs, but it's pretty common to hear people of all identities saying they're uncomfortable with these design choices.

And if he dislikes the sexual fanservice, that's completely fine. My point is that it's trivial to point that out when it's his taste as an individual. Like the straight male target audience you've stated, there are women and gay people who enjoy these things too, even if it's not directly catered to them.

Characters are most certainly expressing themselves by the way they are designed, and these characters are created for different perspectives and different people to interpret and critique. Sure, it might not be their foremost intention, but people can also view these female characters as positives such as empowering, not just sexually objectifying in a negative way. Hawkeye is a character that doesn't wear a shirt, probably to show off his strength and might, but what if there are people who are not comfortable with men shirtless? What if people sexually objectify him? But God forbid women be sexually depicted.

I very much agree to your point that people should not be berated and called prude or anything for voicing their complaints and distaste for these sexual fanservice aspects of the game, and it certainly isn't everyone's cup of tea. But... FEH is in no way shoving these design choices in our faces. People who don't enjoy the content are no way forced to consume them, most of the time this franchise provides a means to avoid them. When @Alkaid mentions Aversa and Loki fighting over the player character in Foraging Bonds, you do not have to read it, there is a skip button and is not detrimental or important to the overall plot of the story. If you simply don't like the sight or owning scantily dressed women as units, you can bench, fodder or ignore them. You are not forced to use them. Aside from Loki, I cannot think of a single character who even dresses as scandalous as her in the main story, and constantly fawning over you. (Loki does have a set mysterious goal, and is also interested in us because we have the power to summon heroes from any universe, don't forget)

When people insult anime characters with big boobs, how would people with actual big boobs feel? Is it better if they gloom about it, or is it better if they look at characters like Camilla and Kagero and not give a single damn about what others think, and be proud of their body like the characters? Anyone can be uncomfortable with anything, not just boobs or raunchily dressed girls with flirtatious personalities.

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28 minutes ago, thanny said:

When people insult anime characters with big boobs, how would people with actual big boobs feel? Is it better if they gloom about it, or is it better if they look at characters like Camilla and Kagero and not give a single damn about what others think, and be proud of their body like the characters? Anyone can be uncomfortable with anything, not just boobs or raunchily dressed girls with flirtatious personalities.

Zero shits given.  Source: friend.

. . .so, uh, what exactly are you arguing?

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1 hour ago, Venmi said:

I'm not the person you quoted, but since he was replying to me, I'll throw a bit in here.

I only mentioned being a straight woman to emphasize that I am not the target audience, and I get uncomfortable when the romantic attentions are written to be directed to me. Actually, I'd be nearly as uncomfortable with a male character doing it- that's not why I'm playing the game. Just as those who enjoy that are allowed to enjoy it, I'm allowed to be uncomfortable with it. I fully enjoy a well done relationship fleshed out between characters. If that involves a woman scantily dressed and comfortable with her sexuality, that's not an issue for me. If she flirts with male characters, that's fine. I wish FEH was more about interactions between characters, not with me. That's why it being aimed at the self-insert is so frustrating, because I play this game to interact with Tellian characters (who weren't extremely sexualized) and not to be flirted with.

To be clear, I'm not generalized or mocking anyone else. I'm explaining what type of fanservice I'd like to see less of. 

Well, that's my two cents.

 

I completely understand and respect your views and opinions. I was just simply kinda itched at the "scantily clad women throwing themselves at you is how you keep your esteem high, fine." remark. I completely agree with you though, I definitely prefer fully fleshed out relationships between characters over characters worshiping self-insert characters any day!

3 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Zero shits given.  Source: friend.

. . .so, uh, what exactly are you arguing?

Well I'm glad she's strong and comfortable with her body, but there are insecure people with big boobs too!

Well to the part you selectively quoted, the argument and statement is the fact that the female body and personality are beautiful, people should be proud and confident about their bodies even if they get sexually objectified at times!

As opposed to revealing ladies = Bad

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3 minutes ago, thanny said:

Well I'm glad she's strong and comfortable with her body, but there are insecure people with big boobs too!

Well to the part you selectively quoted, the argument and statement is the fact that the female body and personality are beautiful, people should be proud and confident about their bodies even if they get sexually objectified at times!

As opposed to revealing ladies = Bad

I think the issue is sexual objectification, not self-esteem.  It's pretty complicated, and I don't think this is the topic to fully explore it.

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