Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[Armagon]

13 minutes ago, Lightchao42 said:

Conveniently, the upcoming Great Ace Attorney Collection has a "Story Mode" that essentially makes the game play itself,

But....but that's the reason I don't play VNs.

I know I effectively cheated my way through Layton but I wouldn't do that again in this day and age.

12 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Olivier is the best.

True.

12 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I've found myself a nice little screenshot LP, and I'm using it as reading material.

This is very valid actually. I did this with Xenosaga Episode II, a game where I really liked the writing but the gameplay- *war flashbacks*.

Anyways, since Trails is very story heavy and you're just in it for the story, this is a viable alternative approach.

4 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Their portraits are always so expressive.

Which is very good.

Indeed.

It is especially good for Lea because she, you know, is canonically 95% mute. So her expressiveness perfectly conveys what she's trying to say. Ah, if only more silent protags were like this.

[Saint Rubenio]

9 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Even if you don’t like the gameplay, I am very glad for this fact.

I've little complaints about the story so far, yeah. The characters are fun, and though the plot is rather predictable, it's being enticing enough for me to want to know more, even if I do believe I've seen about enough of the gameplay. It's been a while since I had a good screenshot LP to read during meals, so I'm honestly not too unhappy with this result. Expect to hear more impressions of the story from me unless someone says "go away Trails hater" or something lol

And yeah, Olivier is the best. I hope the writers won't be cowards and write off his obvious bisexuality as "haha he's just quirky but don't worry he's into girls like a normal person", because that'd rather anger me, not gonna lie.

9 minutes ago, BrightBow said:

Sure, but saving also forces a soft-reset, taking you out of the experience. I think the games would most certainly be better if you didn't have to do that. Whether that's by changing the HP system or by simply removing it altogether.

The original Ace Attorney trilogy's "gameplay" always felt extremely tacked on to me. Really feels like the flimsiest excuse to be able to call the games, well, "games". The two Investigations titles are far more solid in that regard. They're not exactly super riveting, but there's a little more for the player to do than press A a bunch of times, at least. Not that it's an awful flaw that destroys the experience or anything. They're story games first and foremost, you just have to go in accepting that.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Saint Rubenio

[Shrimpica]

9 minutes ago, Sooks said:

have made it to the final chapter of FC.

Prepare for kino

20 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

the story does interest me, but the gameplay drags it down massively. Due to this, I've done what I did for all those other games: I've found myself a nice little screenshot LP, and I'm using it as reading material.

So yeah. I might continue to share my impressions on the story, if you guys are interested, but I think I'd rather not continue to subject myself to the gameplay. It's very RPG, and while I wouldn't call it bad by any means, I'm afraid I just don't enjoy it that much, personally.

I honestly expected the other way around from you xD

Still, glad you like it in some way!

[Interdimensional Observer]

5 hours ago, DragonFlames said:

As for me, I delved a bit into the series that birthed the "OBJECTION!" meme.
Pretty awesome games, all things considered! Quite hilarious, too, with pun names such as Wendy Oldbag or Luke Atmey. XD

Always happy to see someone enjoy a franchise. I'm not interested enough to actually play Phoenix Wright, but sufficiently curious to read peoples' comments around the games, to the spoiling of myself on a lot of it.

Since you're getting into pure adventure games and VNs now have you considered Nine Hours, Nine Persons, Nine Doors? It'd be of a very similar vein to that Danganronpa series you've played. The DS game, now available on iOS if that helps, was considered quite good back in the day. Although created to be a standalone title, it did spawn two sequels to form the Zero Escape series. The first sequel, Virtue's Last Reward was generally well received too, although the finale -Zero Time Dilemma- was something of a letdown, not bad, but the series didn't end on its strongest foot.

 

4 hours ago, Dayni said:

Doesn't sound empty at all.

The song title "Empty Tome" is referring to Order of Ecclesia's main character- Shanoa. She loses her memories in the first few minutes of the games, and thus she is "emptied". And for the tome part, Shanoa does develop a potent arsenal of attacks ultimately derived from magic, which is emphasized in the game's opening trailer. A lack of emotion, driven solely by a mission because it was assigned to her, paired with deadly offense, Shanoa is a "weak mind in a strong body".

[DragonFlames]

4 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Sounds like you played through the orig trig, which are true classics.

Not entirely yet! I'm still working on the third game (fifth case is the next one up). But yeah, it's been pretty fun so far!

4 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

 

 

Love how the thumbnail has Maya hit Phoenix in the face with her instrument. xD

4 hours ago, Shrimperor said:

Fun fact: if he fidn't succed in Magic Shirou was going to become a lawyer

"I am the attorney of my law..." XD

1 hour ago, twilitfalchion said:

I've been knocking out the smaller games in my backlog lately. Right now it's Hollow Knight.

I feel like I'm banging my head against a wall trying to fight the Watcher Knights. 👀

But once I'm past those, the rest of the game shouldn't be too difficult.

Nice, nice! Good luck with that!

43 minutes ago, Armagon said:

They are pretty funny games and on principle, these are the types of VNs I'd play since it has actual gameplay in it.

But at the same time, I'd feel like I'd just suck at it and just look up all the answers haha. That's exactly what I did with the Professor Layton trilogy. Got to a point where I was just there for the plot and looked up guides for each and every puzzle that came my way.

 So far, I only had to look up... I think maybe five things over the trilogy total. The logic is pretty tight when you pay attention to everything that is being said and going on. Which I do like!
I honestly thought I would suck at it more than I do, too. xD

12 minutes ago, Sooks said:

I have made it to the final chapter of FC.

Congrats!

[Sooks]

1 minute ago, Shrimperor said:

Prepare for kino

Silver will!

Silver will!

SILVER WILL!

3 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I've little complaints about the story so far, yeah. The characters are fun, and though the plot is rather predictable, it's being enticing enough for me to want to know more, even if I do believe I've seen about enough of the gameplay. It's been a while since I had a good screenshot LP to read during meals, so I'm honestly not too unhappy with this result.

And you haven’t even gotten to the super good part yet!

Although I guess maybe I haven’t either, I’m only on the first game after all. But chapter 3 turns the plot into probably the best I’ve seen in a game.

That would be impressive but I haven’t actually seen that many good ones in games, so...

I wouldn’t have expected you to not be an rpg person though, but in retrospect I feel like your strong desire for FE maps to have 50 things to do should have made it obvious.

Anyway, I will now contribute with my own Trails journey.

[Venger_06]

18 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

...Isn't the anime, like, incomplete, though? From what I saw in the comments section (buried underneath the "economics and waifu" memes) apparently it only goes up to like, volume 4 of 15? That'd be a rather unpleasant surprise in the extremely unlikely event that I ever sat down and watched that.

It is enough to have an idea.

[DragonFlames]

7 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Since you're getting into pure adventure games and VNs now have you considered Nine Hours, Nine Persons, Nine Doors? It'd be of a very similar vein to that Danganronpa series you've played. The DS game, now available on iOS if that helps, was considered quite good back in the day. Although created to be a standalone title, it did spawn two sequels to form the Zero Escape series. The first sequel, Virtue's Last Reward was generally well received too, although the finale -Zero Time Dilemma- was something of a letdown, not bad, but the series didn't end on its strongest foot.

Might look into these! Thanks!

[Saint Rubenio]

17 minutes ago, Armagon said:

This is very valid actually. I did this with Xenosaga Episode II, a game where I really liked the writing but the gameplay- *war flashbacks*.

Anyways, since Trails is very story heavy and you're just in it for the story, this is a viable alternative approach.

My view on this matter is as follows: While it's best that a game has both, if a game has strong gameplay but weak story, I can just skip the story and play the game for, well, the actual "game" part. If a game has strong story but weak gameplay, however, the gameplay isn't something you can skip in most games, so it makes the experience rather unbearable. For this reason, story-heavy games I tend to prefer reading/watching in the form of LPs as opposed to actually playing them.

If story is the goal and the gameplay is not properly utilized as another tool to tell it, I find a LP to be a perfectly valid alternative, since it cuts out the less enjoyable part.

14 minutes ago, Shrimperor said:

I honestly expected the other way around from you xD

Hahah, well, that's understandable, given my constant talk of gameplay above story. But yeah, though I haven't brought it up much in this thread, something that I've always enjoyed is to pick up screenshot LPs of story-heavy games and read them during meals, in bed or in any other occassion when I'm not able to play. This game is perfect for that.

Quote

Still, glad you like it in some way!

Funnily enough, I decided to quit the game itself like 5 seconds before Olivier appeared. Sheesh, that was way too close to being a disaster. Imagine quitting before meeting Olivier... That'd have been an F for me!

Besides I need to find out if my theories about Professor Alba are right so I can act smug

9 minutes ago, Sooks said:

But chapter 3 turns the plot into probably the best I’ve seen in a game.

Hoho! Big words! I don't think this game stands much of a chance to beat Omori and the emotional exhaustion it left me feeling, but I expect it to be an enjoyable read nonetheless.

9 minutes ago, Sooks said:

I wouldn’t have expected you to not be an rpg person though,

Even after I said like 20 times since I arrived at this thread?

Quote

but in retrospect I feel like your strong desire for FE maps to have 50 things to do should have made it obvious.

Hahah, well, yeah. That's one of the things that really drew me into FE. Even if my first was 7, well, it seemed like a lot to take in at the time!

Edited May 15, 2021 by Saint Rubenio

[Lightchao42]

12 minutes ago, Armagon said:

But....but that's the reason I don't play VNs.

I know I effectively cheated my way through Layton but I wouldn't do that again in this day and age.

What I should have said is that you could play the game normally and use Story Mode to skip whatever you get stuck on, since you can turn it on or off whenever you want. Unlike Layton, AA is mostly based on your ability to put together information and notice contradictions, so it usually isn’t very difficult if you’re observant.

(My only experience with Professor Layton is the Ace Attorney crossover, but I don’t recall any of the puzzles being particularly difficult. Also it has a few Xenoblade VAs which is cool.)

[null]

12 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Silver will!

Silver will!

SILVER WILL!

15 minutes ago, DragonFlames said:

Nice, nice! Good luck with that!

Thanks!

Edited May 15, 2021 by twilitfalchion

[DragonFlames]

A screenshot LP of a story-heavy RPG, especially one such as Trails must be a nightmare to put together.
Kudos to the peeps who have that kind of patience!

Assuming they screenshot every bit of main story dialogue. But even if they don't.... it's impressive, I think.

[Armagon]

10 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

My view on this matter is as follows: While it's best that a game has both, if a game has strong gameplay but weak story, I can just skip the story and play the game for, well, the actual "game" part. If a game has strong story but weak gameplay, however, the gameplay isn't something you can skip in most games, so it makes the experience rather unbearable.

My stance is exactly the same haha. I'd much rather play a game with bad plot but good gameplay than a game with good plot but bad gameplay. Of course, having both aspects be good is optimal.

Now that I think about it, I don't think I've ever dropped a game for having bad plot. I've only dropped games because either the gameplay was bad or I simply wasn't feeling it.

6 minutes ago, Lightchao42 said:

What I should have said is that you could play the game normally and use Story Mode to skip whatever you get stuck on, since you can turn it on or off whenever you want.

Oh. In that case, I think I can work with that compromise.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Armagon

[Interdimensional Observer]

21 minutes ago, DragonFlames said:

Might look into these! Thanks!

To basically summarize what I remember reading once of the first game, abbreviated as 999, the main character is going about their daily life, when a gas cloud suddenly knocks them unconscious. When they wake up, they are somewhere they do not recognize, with eight other random individuals ...and a bomb has been placed in his small intestines. Get out of the building alive- that is the goal. Everyone has a numbered bracelet shackled to them, and each room requires the group that pass through have numbers that when properly calculated, equal the number on the door. If someone tries to go into a room and their number isn't right, kaboom!

Virtue's Last Reward keeps the numbered bracelets thing, and I think adds a voting mechanic of some kind. Zero Time Dilemma I think opted for fixed teams instead. Both sequels keep that "escape room challenge" setting alive.

 

9 minutes ago, DragonFlames said:

A screenshot LP of a story-heavy RPG, especially one such as Trails must be a nightmare to put together.
Kudos to the peeps who have that kind of patience!

Assuming they screenshot every bit of main story dialogue. But even if they don't.... it's impressive, I think.

I tried doing one for Persona 2 Innocent Sin, posted here on SF. 

I gave up towards the end, all that remained were the four zodiac dungeons and the final dungeon, but I still gave up. It was sooooooooo much tedious work.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Interdimensional Observer

[Sooks]

11 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

My view on this matter is as follows: While it's best that a game has both, if a game has strong gameplay but weak story, I can just skip the story and play the game for, well, the actual "game" part. If a game has strong story but weak gameplay, however, the gameplay isn't something you can skip in most games, so it makes the experience rather unbearable. For this reason, story-heavy games I tend to prefer reading/watching in the form of LPs as opposed to actually playing them.

If story is the goal and the gameplay is not properly utilized as another tool to tell it, I find a LP to be a perfectly valid alternative, since it cuts out the less enjoyable part.

I agree with all of this.

11 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Hoho! Big words! I don't think this game stands much of a chance to beat Omori and the emotional exhaustion it left me feeling, but I expect it to be an enjoyable read nonetheless.

Highlight the part right after where I said I hadn’t seen that many great stories in games. I mean I guess AC Odyssey was shaping up to be great, but I got sick of the gameplay, so... 

11 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Even after I said like 20 times since I arrived at this thread?

Well when did you arrive? I mean, it was before me.

[DragonFlames]

1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

To basically summarize what I remember reading once of the first game, abbreviated as 999, the main character is going about their daily life, when a gas cloud suddenly knocks them unconscious. When they wake up, they somewhere they do not recognize, with eight other random individuals

So far so indeed similar to Danganronpa.

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

..and a bomb has been placed in his small intestines. Get out of the building alive- that is the goal. Everyone has a numbered bracelet shackled to them, and each room requires the group that pass through have numbers that when properly calculated, equal the number on the door. If someone tries to go into a room and their number isn't right, kaboom!

Oh my! That sounds like it could get intense fairly quickly. Interesting!

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I tried doing one for Persona 2 Innocent Sin, posted here on SF. 

I gave up towards the end, all that remained were the four zodiac dungeons and the final dungeon, but I still gave up. It was sooooooooo much tedious work.

Oh, I believe you!

[Punished Dayni]

33 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

The song title "Empty Tome" is referring to Order of Ecclesia's main character- Shanoa. She loses her memories in the first few minutes of the games, and thus she is "emptied". And for the tome part, Shanoa does develop a potent arsenal of attacks ultimately derived from magic, which is emphasized in the game's opening trailer. A lack of emotion, driven solely by a mission because it was assigned to her, paired with deadly offense, Shanoa is a "weak mind in a strong body".

Thanks for the summary, though I'll be honest and say I was more punning on the actual track and how it sounds against the title.

[Saint Rubenio]

5 minutes ago, DragonFlames said:

A screenshot LP of a story-heavy RPG, especially one such as Trails must be a nightmare to put together.
Kudos to the peeps who have that kind of patience!

The heaviest story game I've LPed is Berwick Saga. I spent entire days transcribing plot. It was an experience.

5 minutes ago, DragonFlames said:

Assuming they screenshot every bit of main story dialogue. But even if they don't.... it's impressive, I think.

The Trails LP I'm watching has transcriptions. It must've been hell... Unless there are scripts available online that he copied from.

1 minute ago, Armagon said:

Now that I think about it, I don't think I've ever dropped a game for having bad plot. I've only dropped games because either the gameplay was bad or I simply wasn't feeling it.

Ultimately, a game's most important aspect is its gameplay. It's what makes videogames, what sets them apart from movies and books. Story is most commonly an added bonus, a break from the gameplay in the form of text and visuals, but ultimately unnecessary to experience the pure gameplay. You could take out the story from these games entirely and absolutely nothing would change. The game would still be the game. Maybe some people wouldn't be as motivated to play without plot hooks to keep them interested, but people who truly enjoy the core gameplay would see their experience impacted very slightly. On the other hand, the only way to take out the gameplay and leave the story is... well, to not play the game at all, and just read/watch someone else's playthrough. In other words, treat it like a book or a movie - these games lose their identity as games, so to speak.

I have great respect for games that manage to utilize its gameplay as a tool to better tell the story - those are the real story games, in my opinion. Games where the gameplay and the story work in unison and harmony to tell a tale in a way that no other form of media could possibly manage. I've played few games that come close to this to varying degrees, and even fewer that achieve what I'd call the perfect balance. I mean, heck, even stories I quite enjoy, like Berwick Saga's. That game, love it as I do, falls in the first category still.

Thank you for coming to my Ted talk. I am deeply ashamed that it is still not as long as my average Three Houses rant.

Just now, Sooks said:

Highlight the part right after where I said I hadn’t seen that many great stories in games. I mean I guess AC Odyssey was shaping up to be great, but I got sick of the gameplay, so... 

I understand, I just wanted to gush Omori some more, because Omori is one of the greatest stories I've ever seen in a game and I want it to be known, goddamnit.

Just now, Sooks said:

Well when did you arrive? I mean, it was before me.

Really? Pretty sure you already were here. I arrived when Shrimpy started playing Berwick Saga and Benice pinged me to help him give advice to Shrimpy. I was in the middle of my own Berwick LP, so it can't have been more than a year.

[DragonFlames]

The question for what the best stories I've seen in games are is a tough one to answer, actually.

Well... not THAT tough, because my answer would be very bleeding obvious (NIghts of Azure, which I consider the best game I've ever played in my life), but I don't want to leave out other candidates, like...
Etrian Odyssey Untold: The Millenium Girl
Digimon Story Cyber Sleuth (yes, I'm serious)
Danganrona V3: Killing Harmony
Blue Reflection
Megadimension Neptunia VII (again, completely serious)
Shin Megami Tensei Devil Survivor 2
Tales of Xillia 2
Tales of Berseria
Nights of Azure 2: Bride of the New Moon

There are more examples, but these are the most standout ones to me.

9 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

The heaviest story game I've LPed is Berwick Saga. I spent entire days transcribing plot. It was an experience.

Oh, so you didn't screenshot every bit of dialogue and just wrote out the dialogue itself? I see!

Back when I attempted to make an LP out of Nights of Azure, I tried to summarize the dialogue.
Prolly wasn't the best idea.

9 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

The Trails LP I'm watching has transcriptions. It must've been hell... Unless there are scripts available online that he copied from.

I see! Yeah, I can imagine!
I actually don't know if there are scripts, but I'm fairly positive there would be.

Edited May 15, 2021 by DragonFlames

[Shrimpica]

49 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Silver will!

Silver will!

SILVER WILL!

 

 

[Shrimpica]

But i can mostly say now RPGs aren't really a thing for you, Ruben, as RPGs do take their time to build up the battle system, starting pretty basic and then evolving so they don't feel stale. If they throw everything from the beginning at you they won't only not have anything to show later, but it might be too much for the player to take in.

[Shrimpica]

Duality of weebs

[DragonFlames]

And because I haven't done so in a while...

10/10 music

10/10 gameplay
As well as the best boss fights I have ever seen in a game, both modern and old.

10/10 story

And 10/10 characters.
Especially the protagonist.

All in my humble opinion, of course!
Methinks I should get started on that other challenge run I wanted to do sometime soon so I have an excuse to talk about this game again. Mwahaha

Edited May 15, 2021 by DragonFlames

[Shrimpica]

Gust ost, never dissapoints.

Do't go the way of jdk pls

[Spara]

6 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I did play a little bit of this map, so I saw them.

Very Kaga.

Ah, I see. Frankly, I'd have expected people to drop the game around Ch8 (boring map), and not before the super cav rushdown map. 

I think, once I've fully replayed HSoS, I'm gonna do another Berwick run, and just challenge myself to see how good I can make my rankings without rigging or grinding in side maps. Plus, gives me an excuse to read through the whole story again, 'cuz it's been a fair bit since I read all the story in a playthrough. Who knows, maybe I'll make Windstorm Owen my dedicated combat unit. It's not a good idea, but hey, he could have like 14x3 atk in Chapter 5.