Green Poet

sigh ##Unvote back to reading

lol damn when did this happen

70 pages 24 hours into D2 gg Going through Refa's D2 I'm still confident in my Rapier read. Following Blitz's death immediately after phase start he puts together a reads post and votes Rapier because he feels that Blitz was trying to distance himself from Rapier, but then this vote is unceremoniously dropped with no explanation. He then starts encouraging Weapons to list reasons why Rapier isn't scummy anymore: "I know you said something before about your case on Rapier weakening, but like I don't know why?" and why there are better lynch candidates: "But dude, what made you feel so strongly about it in the end (considering you were willing to vote him over Rapier)?" Refa goes from voting Rapier to inexplicably not voting him to trying to nudge people towards stating why Rapier isn't scum. This change of heart is probably because he wanted to appear supportive of the Rapier wagon at phase start and then edged off of it when he started to realize that he could possibly save his scumbuddy. Blitz ISO: "@Hugh, if you have any questions after reading the rules, go on ahead and ask in thread" If I were saying this, idk if I would add "in thread"? I'm probably trying to read too much into this but I can see Blitz adding it for emphasis so that scum!Hugh understands the distinction between the thread and scumchat I don't see many Blitz-Rapier interactions that are very telling. Blitz does try to push a kirsche case and gets a townread on Refa more or less from a nulltell, both of which are pretty understandable in retrospect. The only thing that's weird to me is how his last post votes Poly for allegedly wanting to quickhammer him and not answering questions. Considering that everyone was throwing around votes rapidly towards the end of D1, was Poly's vote somehow more particular? The last time Blitz mentioned Poly was to state that he had a townread on Poly so the jump is overall not so easy to follow. Also, Via is obvtown because 1. he was vocally opposed to being town leader despite having the best role for it 2. if he's scum, his role has no utility for his faction and is entirely a misdirection role meant for safeclaiming. his role actually makes sense as town because it gives LOC to a faction that does not have full OC 3. Blitz & Via situation in ED1 doesn't look like scum-scum interaction Now to read the 30 something posts that sprung up as I was typing this.

as before, I'm one of the anons From what I can tell nothing's changed wrt Rapier and he hasn't posted so ##Vote: Rapier If anyone has questions for me and/or would like me to send them mail, let me know. I'll hopefully have time to work on a content post later tonight

Email sent, reading thread..

o.O I wasn't even aware that we lynched Blitz... I thought the day ended with no lynch because we had insufficient votes for a hammer? Guess I need to go read the last several pages of D1 lol

I thought Blitz was ITP as well until I saw that; I'm not familiar with the theme's lore so "Phases of Morgana" wasn't an alignment I immediately associated with mafia. However, I think it can be pretty solidly assumed that Blitz' faction is mafia based off of him having a protective role though, as a real ITP would have no need for that.

That was my first assumption, but why did we get a notification about a third party for this kill and not the last one? The two immediate conclusions are: 1. Terrador was dayvigged by someone else, and today's ITP dayvig comes with the caveat of ITP's existence being announced when they make their first kill, or 2. Terrador and Blitz were dayvigged by the same person/faction, and the presence of an ITP is announced upon the second shot. I've been on as anon since phase start, and that shot wasn't mine. Shinori was not anon, so the second anon is still unaccounted for. 1-shot deathproof + godfather, 2-shot doc so this must mean someone tried to kill him already Considering that this was an ITP kill, it's likely imo that the one who shot Blitz and removed his initial deathproof was a townie.

Not enough time to go over the how many pages that've popped up since I've been away so someone give me like a one sentence summary if possible Is my vote is needed for consolidation

I'm here What are we doing

ebwop

Going to reread Terrador and his interactions but his vote doesn't influence my current Rapier read/vote. I should be around for phase end but I will be gone for the next 2-3 hours.

Going to come back to post when the thread isn't moving so fast. For now, Rapier = Terrador > Poly >>> Ciraxis' slot

Terrador being miller would somewhat contextualize why he was talking like he wanted to be culted. I'm having trouble understanding why he thought a miller claim would be bad to claim outside of his first post though, as long as the claim is still ED1... My lynch preferences were reiterated at the bottom of my last post: Rapier foremost, then Poly next, but his lynch is not viable today. Ciraxis would have been an alright lynch had he not subbed out, because I'd need to read BBM. I am not at all unsure on who I would like to see lynched. I am saying that if wagons developed on people other than my scumreads, I would still be willing to lynch them unless said person was Via.

Would rather lynch Terrador than SB today. He's still tunnely, Refa's post about a majority of his reads being fluff is spot on, and his comments about being culted when no cult is confirmed to be in the game feel off. Because some lynch > no lynch. Basically I'm saying that Via is by far my strongest townread atm. Your take on the Blitz-Via interactions felt noncommittal in that you switched from initially voting Via to voting Blitz without stating why Via was now the less scummy of the two. Also you had a Rapier-like comment where you said you didn't think they were scum-scum interactions but you were scumreading both of them, which read like a contradiction to me and also like a way to get out of having to solidly take a side in that interaction.

Alright, catch up time. Via sent me the letters, so that's cool. Still townreading them. Promised Ciraxis read: -RVS vote on Weapons, no comment -says it's not ok to claim to kirsche because he isn't 100% cleared, this is logically sound -sheeps Rapier, I'm scumreading Rapier but this is still fundamentally a null tell -"I don't understand how Bluedoom could be his strongest townread either. It just comes off as forced, and I'm not buying it." Doesn't explain why he doesn't understand the townread or how it's forced, this is scummy -wrt Rapier: " Seems more like a brainfart than anything particularly malicious." But why is a brainfart an indication of towniness/someone you should sheep? If anything, an inattentive player is one that you shouldn't follow Overall, I think his hard defense of Rapier against Weapons is unnatural and his reasons for townreading Rapier are nonexistent. However, this isn't scummy unless Rapier flips scum (which I believe is likely to happen), in which case the natural conclusion is that Ciraxis' unfamiliarity with the concept of distancing oneself from their scumbuddies led to this chainsaw. SB read because it looks like he's a wagon now: I haven't looked intently at the cases on him so far. As I stated earlier, I've been townreading him based on his posts from the game's start to page 10 based on how his logic all looked fine. Looking through all his posts now, I don't see "passivity" as someone said. If anything, what bothers me is how SB doesn't stick to any singular scumread, and very quickly hops from one vote to another while giving up short cases on his last scumread after getting a response from them. -His first non-RVS vote on Marth, for example, is something I would have expected to stay since he expressed dislike for in-thread claims and Marth had just claimed VT after SB voted him. Marth was the one who first asked if anyone else "would like to break the game D1 with a massclaim" so I would expect SB to continue to vote Marth due this disagreement? -Voteswitch from Eury to Rapier is meh. This is what I meant by "jumps between votes after getting a response from his last scumread." Overall: It's D1 so a lack of confidence could be expected. I don't remember ever playing with scum!SB but a the same time I'm not sure that a player as good as SB would be as noncommittal towards each read as town as he has been this game. It seems that all of SB's large posts have been sent from a phone or ipod and that is rather distracting (I played most of SF3 as town on mobile and couldn't come up with content for my life because reading the thread was terrible). I don't want to vote SB over the other wagons right now and I'm just not confident that he's scum but as far as consolidation goes I would be willing to vote anyone other than Via today. A Rapier lynch was still viable last time I checked and Poly was never a wagon so I would prefer the former. That Ciraxis got a wagon so quickly after one vote is alarming in that I'm wondering if the people voting him did so just because he's a newer player and an easier case. I also thought his post was poor but wouldn't have voteswitched off of Rapier for it because Rapier had more posts and I felt more confident in my read on him than someone with only one non-RVS post. Voting someone off of as little content that Ciraxis comparatively had doesn't feel like very careful scumhunting.

Sorry via x___x btw you may not have seen it in my massive spoiler tags post but I asked if you could send me some letters (like preferably 3+) as well. but if you're not townreading me and would rather not that's totally understandable.

This isn't a bad thing because no one's reads are 100% accurate. And even so, why are you implying that I'm trying to give myself a safety net against a completely normal fault? It'd be great if my reads were all accurate right now, but I'm not afraid to be wrong. It's inherently scummy not to vote because voting is town's primary way of influencing the lynch. It's how they kill scum and win. Not voting when there is a decent amount of content to analyze is usually antitown. Not that my case on Rapier solely had to do with not voting, because he did vote. It's the backpedalling from his initial reasoning (possibly due to the reminder from a scumbuddy?) that looks scummy. You're also misrepping him in saying that the extra time Rapier took made his read harder. His delayed vote was not the product of deliberation; he explained it as simply having forgotten to vote, which is a contradiction with his previously expressed unwillingness to vote at all. If someone requires time to solidify a read, they would normally announce this by saying something along the lines of "I'll make a post later with my reads because I'm busy/still reading right now" rather than "I don't think any of the above content merits my attention or vote." Rapier initially said the latter. Hopefully you're not townreading Rapier solely over this misunderstanding. I do not see any towniness coming from his first posts. @Weapons - I've rolled scum only once, in Elie's ITTD Mafia. It was only my second time playing mafia so I did pretty badly lol. I scumslipped D1 and got lynched D2. In other news - Proto's post gives me townie vibes. Terrador's reads post is good because all of his reads are consistent with all of his previous non-null reads. Via's voteswitch reminds me that I need to actually read Ciraxis soon. The fact that Ciraxis has like more votes on him than he has posts means he's probably said something very scummy or he's an easy case, or both.

hmm, LOC is rather complicated.. Anyway, reads/impressions post from the last 10 pages: [spoiler=Via & Blitz situation. From game start to mid-page 3] SB: "Realtalk though, this post reminded me that there's probably a decent chance this is multiball? Based on the last .hack mafia." What's "multiball"? pedit: From later context I assume it's synonymous with "multifaction"? Via: "blitz it's ed1 scumvibes why are you so defensive" It didn't sound defensive since Blitz was trying to figure out what about his voteswitch had given Via "vibes" when no real explanation was given. Calling someone defensive over this is an overstatement imo. Poly: "though I don't particularly like the Blitz/Via exchange just now; while I thought Blitz was being fairly defensive I feel like the way Via went about telling it was a bit vague and distance-y?" If you didn't really like either of their responses, what in particular made you vote Via over Blitz? Via: "DUDE WHAT EVEN AM I SUPPOSED TO SAY IT'S AN ED1 GUTREAD" I don't like how the conversation got hung up on this, it's been about 10 posts since the Blitz questioning happened Poly: "though I'm feeling only marginally worse about you than Blitz because he was still way too defensive about that switch" I still don't think it was defensive. If someone had said "I have a gut feeling about you" and then voted me, I would ask what prompted that gut read. Just like: Hugh of Ilia: "When a guy's got a hunch it's best to follow it." Why did no one ask him what made him feel this "hunch." Getting hung up on Blitz & Via over "gut feelings" while not examining Hugh's equally questionable gut-based RVS vote = wat? Marth: "Clearly the people sending you emails are the mafia trying to waste their emails and maybe look like they're contributing. ...I was joking but I think its something to consider." Actually this is a good point, though I don't think Marth is townie for it (it's just a nulltell imo) since this line of reasoning is fairly intuitive since this is the answer that one arrives at whenever they pose the question "well what would the scumteam do with their emails" Poly: "no I'm not really reading it as scum/scum interaction but I'm scumreading both of you for varying reasons in that exchange" This pings me as scummy Not resolving to pick a side but your vote is on Via? If it's not scum-scum interaction but you think both are scum, this is also a pretty plain contradiction At this point I think both Via and Blitz are slapfighting townies, Marth and SB are null but contributing good points, and Poly is a little scummy [spoiler=Rapier's first post to kirsche calling for claims, about page 3 to page 5] Rapier: "And no, I'm not going to vote anyone right now. I don't see a point in doing so, as there is no content at all to pursue." Well, there's been a large spectacle between Via and Blitz from the last two pages. I think there's definitely something to talk about there? At least I think any observer could judge between Via and Blitz and come to an educated guess as to whether one or both is town/scum? There's content here and Rapier's dismissal of it feels like an excuse to not have to read it. It's definitely not something to be handwaved as RVS shenanigans, esp. since an email was sent and it was discussed. Rapier: "I find strange how Marth says he's kidding, then adds "hey, maybe we should think about this". If you consider pondering about it, then you aren't kidding about it." I actually don't think what Marth said was contradictory or otherwise odd. When he said he was joking, I read it as "well I'm joking that the person who we're talking about (the one who just sent the letter) isn't guaranteed scum or anything" and then I read the "it's something to consider" as "in general mafia would use their emails to appear townie since that's obviously all they can do with them." I don't agree with Rapier's vote but w/e it's understandable re: Rapier saying he won't anyone, then voting Marth This is scummy because it's an attempt to remedy the initial scummy play (refusing to vote) with conciliatory, textbook townie play (actually voting). If I had been around at the time of this post, I would have voted Rapier. Refa: "Man, I don't see how Marth's one liner is telling at all. Is that something that he'd only say as scum? If so, why? It's pretty funny that I don't agree with anyone's cases so far. Please understand, dude, mafia sucks." Refa are you me Blitz: "I don't get your email Bizz" Who's Bizz SB: "Sometimes townies get crackpot theories but why do they out them and then say "this probably isn't right, but it might be..."?" Isn't this what townies are supposed to do? Theories are all town has so... tonwnies would out them, right...? I get the feeling that SB is considering/trying to case Marth here but doesn't have enough to go off of Poly @ Blitz: "So you were just picking at Via's gutread for no real reason? That's arguably worse than being defensive imo, since you're just wasting time. Did you actually get anything from that exchange?" Feels like a scum post I do not understand why it would still be relevant to discuss the Via & Blitz exchange here. Poly doesn't explain why Via is now no longer scummier than Blitz, nor has he explained his earlier read of "I don't think they had a scum-scum interaction but I'm still scumreading both." Marth: "I only consider not voting scummy if you make posts where it looks like you're scumreading people but you're not acting on it." Sure but even if it's not a scumtell, what do you think of rapier SB: "Please stop massclaiming in public in an LOC game." The voice of reason kirsche: "I should lead because I have the only modconfirmable role in the game." Scum mayor is a thing though SB: "Scum mayor pls" Why is SB not town leader rn [spoiler=Refa's first large post(s) to Eury's third post, page mid-5 to end of 8] re: Refa's posts, particularly post #100 probably not even relevant but I've noticed a sharp increase in Refa's use of colloquialisms in referring to others (i.e. "hey man," "bro," "dude") and while it's hard to describe the feeling, it's like... are these terms maybe meant to help in buddying with people? I realize colloquialisms and posting style are much less telling than any other part of content, but it got me thinking esp. b/c of how Junko had started changing his posting style as well (consistently ending every one of his posts with something along the lines of "I g2g now," "I have to go now so sorry for the short post" etc.) in Code Geass mafia where he rolled scum. tl;dr null tell but going to read Refa more closely I guess. not that that helps since I can basically never actually read refa well inb4it's just a PR >.> As for the actual content of Refa's post #100 - his responses are good but I don't see why he votes Marth (assuming "Marthipan" is just a nick for Marth) when the people he's replying to are Blitz, Poly and kirsche, and he doesn't discuss Marth in his replies? Terrador: "You do realize that claiming mason without somebody to confirm it has virtually no weight, correct?" I think kirsche's claim is actually a good/trustworthy one from town's POV because it forces him to be held to a level of role accountability. He will need to reveal who his buddies are eventually, and scum!kirsche will either out people who can deny association (thus giving us a confirmed scum lynch) or out his scumbuddies, which offers potentially even more information if we lynch any of them. I thought about this for a long time and claimed to kirsche earlier today. Mason is just an extremely dangerous fakeclaim for scum who's trying to become town leader. I suppose this also means that I'm townreading kirsche...? Honestly I just can't see him as scum with this claim. Terrador: "And before someone says it, yeah, there's 110% the possibility that the mason claimant may be a scumbuddy or a stand-in who believes that mason, or that it may not be a good play for the mason and partner. I get that. But that doesn't change the fact that claiming mason without any evidence proves all of nothing." Yes, but no definitive proof =/= not extremely trustworthy. Consider if the claimant is a scumbuddy - we could potentially lynch two scum just off of this failed gambit. Terrador is being very paranoid imo but I don't think he's scum for it. SB then votes Terrador and I'm basically townreading SB now just off of having thoughts consistent with mine for basically the whole game so far Via: "also I agree with the Terra suspicion and I'm kinda paranoid he's feamrongering to keep town from organizing itself actually" This is meta-based but I think that Terrador's play is in line with what I would expect from him as town. In the training filler and P3M as scum, he would always cooperate with town ideas and go out of his way to appear agreeable and open-minded always. In FFTA as town, he was significantly more independent and less automatically trusting, and got frustrated enough in one disagreement to sub out. That his current play is heavily leaning towards the latter makes me feel that he's very likely to be overly paranoid town. Weapons' Rapier vote is good. kirsche: "If no masons are dead come D3 then you should start asking questions." Why D3, what's so special about D3 Eury's not wallposting but people think that this lack of effort is scummy But she's shown that she's completely capable of posting massive walls even as scum (a la P3M, as might be obvious it's like the one game I have particularly strong memories of lol) so I would consider this a nulltell. Have people scumreading Eury for this really played a game with scum!Eury? :/ Via: "I've sent messages to almost all the people who have posted today." Can I haz emails too pls SB: "Also: the obvious solution to Town Leader stuff is just to Mason Via, unless it gets rid of roles." This is the best idea/10 However Via's probably gonna get NKed now that this idea has been suggested @Randa's post #142 who is scum your post is pretty empty on scumreads Eury: "And I'm trying to keep shit small for easier-reading" If you have the time/motivation I would request your usual wallposts because I think it's significantly easier to read your alignment based on those. Short posts from Eury are almost... foreign, I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels this way Eury: "Bluedoom's had poor ideas + content, and questionable posts. Don't like him." This one line is not enough justification to vote Marth, esp. from Eury. Randa's follow-up post where he votes Eury is very understandable in light of this. At this point: Rapier - scummy Poly - scum-ish Blitz - town-ish Via - town Terrador - town SB - literally could not be townier unless someone dayvigs him now and he flips scum, in which case he's probs death miller Marth - null Eury - null [spoiler=page 9 and 10] kirsche: "You're nowhere close to clear when in a couple of days time when the masons die I will be clear." What makes you think they'll be dead @Terrador's post #168 who else is scum, you've been tunneling kirsche Weapons: "I mean I don't really want to play town leader anyway, so I'm going to avoid claiming unless this really takes off, in which case I might just sub out." I legit thought this was a scumtell when I read it but no one seems to have reacted the same way so I'm guessing this is a natural reaction given SF's history of there being widely differing preferences of OC and NOC? Clarification from anyone would be appreciated since this reads much like "it would be very difficult for scum!me to counter a town leader play" Randa: "Cause I didn't vote Kirsche in the first place due to the Mason claim." Doesn't this mean that you're townreading him and do actually trust his claim Via: "If you try to work w/ me and then die and leave everything to me I'm gonna buckle down and cry under the pressure lol" :( There, there. Rapier: "Also, I find it strange that Weapons is still pressuring me for some minor thing that I did on page 3. Do you really have no better scumread than "hey that guy said he wouldn't vote but he did, therefore scummy"?" Reads like scum being frustrated at being caught for what they perceive to be the wrong reasons. Also, referencing less relevant content all the way from page 3 just to address a scumread on you, instead of relevant topics of contention such as Terrador's reaction to kirsche, the implications of Via's confirmed role, Eury's shorter posts... pretty scummy. Gaius: "Hi I exist. Here goes my first post. I just read 10 straight pages so I apologize if my logic is flawed, reasoning unclear etc. Ask to clarify if needed." Hi I like your avatar Gaius' case basically sheeps Terrador's but I don't see anything wrong with it from his explained POV Randa's earliest content was pretty weak but I think the Eury vote is OK so I'm gonna go with a super concrete and definitive null read on him for now yay Terrador needs to stop tunneling kirsche, and vice-versa. I think all of the possible arguments and counterarguments for the issue they are contending have been exhausted, and they both need to start scumhunting elsewhere. ##Vote: Rapier

In the middle of working on a large post containing my thoughts on the whole game so far. Need to stop in order to take a train, so, as of my impressions up to mid-page 6 only, I am scumreading Rapier > Poly, I think that Blitz and Via are townies slapfighting unnecessarily over the course of pages mid2-late4, I think that SB has been playing the most rationally throughout the game (though most of his posts are nulltells since logic =/= townie) and I have an interesting thing to say about Refa's colloquialisms (maybe not so interesting plz don't be offended roofa) If it matters, I would have voted Via around the middle of page 2 and voteswitched to Rapier towards the bottom of page 4, if I had been present. Going to finish the large reads/impressions post before I actually put down a vote in order to make sure it's actually still relevant. I won't be around to answer anything for a few hours, and at that point I will probably still get the reads post out first before responding to anyone's stuff. cut: Gaius' avatar is also super cute and awesome and I'm probably going to end up townreading him for that gggggghhh.

so many pages why also hi via o/ as i said pregame i will probably not be able to post content today (as in 24 hours today, not day phase today) but i will have a presence soon sheeping this

/in, though I will have minimal activity until the 22nd.

yep, though people who hadn't heard of the vn series may not have known about F/SN before watching F/Z (like me, lol). And even knowing the ending and how the main character was probably going to win, fans often differ on who their favorite contenders were.

Why haven't you decided to host a game yet? And if you were to, what would you want the game's theme to be? Who were you rooting for during your first time watching Fate/Zero? practically an obligatory question to every f/z fan :p

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