TheEnd Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) I only need to go to a few more vg/anime conventions dressed as a mage girl with Vincent before he'll let me re-name it TangerineForest. Then it'll be TF... like FESS' creator Are you trying to create a stable time loop, fruit I thought Joshua or Vincet/Aveyn Knight owned this site? Just call him Vincent. Vincent owns the site, Joshua is the forum root, but the fruit is the actual forum administrator. Vincent doesn't do moderator work (he just runs around being moe and helping people) and Jyo is rarely around. But enough of my little derailment, carry on Edited February 27, 2012 by TheEnd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) As for the topic at hand, yeah sometimes people are super harsh to newblets (and even not-so-newblets). Spriting board comes to mind. I know people are just trying to help in that board, but it can be seen as rather discouraging for new spriters. In the FE boards, most of the arguments are pretty intelligent for the most part. To be fair, I don't think critique should be sugar coated, especially if there's nothing to sugar coat. If there's something the spriter's done well, we do point them out as well and compliment that, but there's some sprites that are just a giant clusterfuck of mess that really needs a whole overhaul. In general, experienced spriters (and non-spriters with good eyes) can see the problems with a sprite a lot more clearly than the average non-spriter, and the problems thus stand out a lot more. So sometimes it's not even we being too harsh, but rather many new spriters just can't take honest critique instead of people sucking up to whatever they put out that may not even be good. The people who learn to accept critique, and can see past the "harsh" wording to see that we're genuinely trying to give help, go on and fix their issues and become better spriters. It's not really harsh, IMO, just blunt. And blunt is a good thing. When you sugarcoat and compliment things that aren't even good, you're lying to the person. We don't make exceptions. We're just as blunt to our friends and the spriting gods as we are to newbies as long as we can see a problem. And if they can't handle the same level of critique we give to everyone else, their loss. Because Trent IS as blunt to me, or Dan, or just about everyone else in our skype chat as he is to the new spriters as long as we have a sprite to show him and he can see problems with it. And I do what he suggests, because it helps. Edited February 27, 2012 by Luminescent Blade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popo Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Then it'll be TF... like FESS' creator Please, please don't let that happen. XD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Marth 64 Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Please, please don't let that happen. XD What will it happened if it did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buttmuncher.ops Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Please, please don't let that happen. XD What will it happened if it did? kid's like you would get your online presence murdered from all the cliqueyness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 To be fair, I don't think critique should be sugar-coated especially if there's nothing to sugar coat. If there's something the spriter's done well, we do point them out as well and compliment that, but there's some sprites that are just a giant clusterfuck of mess that really needs a whole overhaul. In general, experienced spriters (and non-spriters with good eyes) can see the problems with a sprite a lot more clearer than the average non-spriter, and the problems thus stand out a lot more. So sometimes it's not even we being too harsh, but rather many new spriters just can't take honest critique instead of people sucking up to whatever they put out that may not even be good. The people who learn to accept critique, and can see past the "harsh" wording to see that we're genuinely trying to give help, go on and fix their issues and become better spriters. It's not really harsh, IMO, just blunt. And blunt is a good thing. When you sugarcoat and compliment things that aren't even good, you're lying to the person. We don't make exceptions. We're just as blunt to our friends and the spriting gods as we are to newbies as long as we can see a problem. And if they can't handle the same level of critique we give to everyone else, their loss. Because Trent IS as blunt to me, or Dan, or just about everyone else in our skype chat as he is to the new spriters as long as we have a sprite to show him and he can see problems with it. And I do what he suggests, because it helps. Umm im not saying "sugar coat shit". Im saying stuff like "Omg my eyes are fucking burning...wtf." is actually not very cool. Saying stuff like "Dude, you arent ready to custom yet. You should stick to splicing because you keep getting [insert issue here] wrong." is perfectly awesome. Ive walked into a few spriting threads and seen people just say stuff like "Omg just no. JUST NO!" That makes people want to leave or not share their sprites. Theres a difference between being blunt and honest and just being a shithead. Seph has gotten loads better at this and in fact, i wasnt even thinking of him when i made the comment. ;) He's gotten to the point where he will elaborate on what is wrong with any given sprite in a decent manner. (Sure, sometimes he still gets a bit...snarky but overall, he tries to help the best way he knows how.) So yeah, im not saying one should sugar coat critique. (Some spriters need someone to be direct.) What im saying is there are still people out there that can be quite nasty when they dont need to be. I do get there are a lot of overly sensitive people who post their sprites. They were probably used to people going "hey thats not bad" on other forums. Ive seen that many many times too. Like, someone will post a sprite and you or Seph or any other seasoned spriter will go "Yeah theres pillowing over here. You need to fix that." or "Head is too small...thats not how heads look. Move it up a couple of pixels" or junk like that. And the OP will get all butthurt and say "But over at [insert forum name here], they said it was good!" and then a small drama bomb gets dropped. So i hear you there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanami Touko Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Seph has gotten loads better at this and in fact, i wasnt even thinking of him when i made the comment. ;) He's gotten to the point where he will elaborate on what is wrong with any given sprite in a decent manner. (Sure, sometimes he still gets a bit...snarky but overall, he tries to help the best way he knows how.) <3 I am glad my efforts have not gone unnoticed :3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) Well yeah, that's fair enough, then. Insults are pretty uncalled for when the spriter just posts their stuff and expects feedback. I mean, if there's at least some crit behind those insults, it's still pretty mean and definitely could be worded better, but at least the spriter could still get something out of it. What's really bad is if someone insults their work and then doesn't give legitimate feedback and actual critique. That's just terrible. Ohaithar Trent :3 Edited February 27, 2012 by Luminescent Blade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 <3 I am glad my efforts have not gone unnoticed :3 If it helps, I like it, too. Now tell me how much I suck in my own thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 <3 I am glad my efforts have not gone unnoticed :3 Of course i noticed. I lurk that board extensively. You used to be really...kinda mean. Another thing that annoys me is when some people totally ignore the advice given by some of the best spriters in the community. Or even go as far as saying "Ive done this for x amount of time. I dont need your help." Zomg....I think you guys all know to whom i refer to here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanami Touko Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Ohaithar Trent :3 yes hello there Rimu. If it helps, I like it, too. Now tell me how much I suck in my own thread Awww thanks. I can't tell people who don't suck that they do Of course i noticed. I lurk that board extensively. You used to be really...kinda mean. ;) I really did ;D And yes, those people are pretty much the worst. It doesn't matter how long someone's been doing something, if Michelangelo was still alive to this day and I saw something wrong in his art, I'd point it out. Just because you do something for years doesn't mean you're perfect at it and can't improve because nothing is, in fact, perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Another thing that annoys me is when some people totally ignore the advice given by some of the best spriters in the community. Or even go as far as saying "Ive done this for x amount of time. I dont need your help." Zomg....I think you guys all know to whom i refer to here. Oh god those people @__________________________@ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 yes hello there Rimu. Awww thanks. I can't tell people who don't suck that they do I really did ;D And yes, those people are pretty much the worst. It doesn't matter how long someone's been doing something, if Michelangelo was still alive to this day and I saw something wrong in his art, I'd point it out. Just because you do something for years doesn't mean you're perfect at it and can't improve because nothing is, in fact, perfect. Yeah. Like, ive been spriting for like...freaking EONS. Like since 06. And i STILL cannot full custom. (sure i go through spurts of not spriting at all...) So throwing that around will get me no where fast. looool. And i still get giddy if someone awesome like Dei posts in my sprite thread or people vote for my entry in a spriting contest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sync Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I'm just lurking right now to see what it's like here. It's the internet; it's like that on any other types of forums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Starwind Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 I've been lurking here for awhile and just now started posting. Anywho I don't think anyone has been harsh. Not to me at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klokinator Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Holy fuck this thread is still a thing? Last I saw it was three pages long like two months ago lol. I can't tell people who don't suck that they do It's true. After Seph saw my mindblowing full customed sprites he never said another word to me about it again. Everytime he viewed my thread though, I'd hear a distant jerking off motion from the far corners of Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buttmuncher.ops Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 It's true. After Seph saw my mindblowing full customed sprites he never said another word to me about it again. Everytime he viewed my thread though, I'd hear a distant jerking off motion from the far corners of Canada. i lol'd this would be sig quote worthy, if i was one of "those" kind of people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Life Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Holy fuck this thread is still a thing? Last I saw it was three pages long like two months ago lol. Homo lived for 3 year. I ain't that impressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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