Othin Plays FE13!

[S.C. Amigo]

Another class question:

How do you feel about the Thief classes in this game? You know, about them being back to swords, the Assassins now having bows, Rogues having staves and being called Tricksters, all that. Do you like them in comparison to say, the Tellius ones, or no? Or do you even use them at all?

[Westbrick]

Another class question:

How do you feel about the Thief classes in this game? You know, about them being back to swords, the Assassins now having bows, Rogues having staves and being called Tricksters, all that. Do you like them in comparison to say, the Tellius ones, or no? Or do you even use them at all?

I know I'm not Othin, but in case you'd like my two cents as well:

Thanks to the new doubling formula (+5 instead of +3), thieves are more offensively useful, as they're among the few units who can double-attack consistently early on. Which is good, as there's nothing to steal and less to pick, meaning that thief utility is far lower in this game than in previous titles. Bows are relatively useless because of the E weapon-level Assassins start with combined with their low attack, making the staff utility of Tricksters a near universally-superior choice.

I don't think Othin likes Gaia much, although I find him very useful. Anna is excellent.

[S.C. Amigo]

I'm glad to hear they are a bit better, combat-wise. I remember having problems with using them in the GBA games because at least Thieves felt so fragile (to me), and that made levelling them up difficult. Thanks for the tip about the Assassins, too.

[BBM]

Is it that Bows are relatively useless in general, or just on Assassins because E Bows sucks?

[Ema Skye]

E anything sucks, because it limits you to just Bronze weapons.

[Pitbuller26]

On the topic of Assassins using bows, is it possible for them to activate Lethality when using a bow?

[Othin]

Is it that Bows are relatively useless in general, or just on Assassins because E Bows sucks?

They're not bad, per se, but it's hard to justify raising bows from E rank, and a bit of a chore because you don't have an enemy phase to work with and gain WExp. I found that Viole and Noire as innate bow users did fine, though.

On the topic of Assassins using bows, is it possible for them to activate Lethality when using a bow?

Haven't tried it, but Snipers can activate Astra while using bows, and Dark Knights can activate Astra while using tomes, so I assume any skill/weapon combination is possible.

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Okay, actually trying it now, Lethality works with tomes, so it should work with bows as well.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Othin

[Espinosa]

It looks like marrying Sariya to Callum/Vake/Ronku/perhaps also Henry and Gaia should give you a Noire with access to Assassin. Compared to Bow Knights, Assassins have more skill and speed but less defence.

Also, it looks like Armour Knights have a rather low base defence growth (15%), especially if you compare it to what it was in the DS games. I guess that makes General!Sumia a terrible idea. Even Snipers have the same defence growths.

[Pitbuller26]

Haven't tried it, but Snipers can activate Astra while using bows, and Dark Knights can activate Astra while using tomes, so I assume any skill/weapon combination is possible.

---

Okay, actually trying it now, Lethality works with tomes, so it should work with bows as well.

Nice. Did the tomes also have that blood effect too? It would look (well in my mind) pretty cool if bows had the same blood effect going on when Lethality activates.

[Emperor Hardin]

How does Cullum fare as a unit, have you used him at all?

[Othin]

Nice. Did the tomes also have that blood effect too? It would look (well in my mind) pretty cool if bows had the same blood effect going on when Lethality activates.

I tried it with animations off the first time because of the low activation rate, but trying it again, yeah, it does. For tomes, the part where the spell is cast and launches the attack towards the enemy is normal, but then when the attack makes contact with the enemy, the screen turns red with the blood splatter effect. I couldn't see much of the splatter because it was a long-range attack so the enemy was at the edge of the screen, though.

I assume it works the same way with bows.

How does Cullum fare as a unit, have you used him at all?

I used him a bit on my first playthrough to not a whole lot of success. His defenses are great for the earlygame, though, especially when he's using Double to provide bulk to an ally. His ability to grant a huge Def boost is especially valuable on Lunatic, but his combat prowess on the front lines suffers because everything doubles him for heavy damage, and there are more Hammers to cause trouble for Frederick.

[Only My Unit]

So that makes Lethality literally FE's version of a Fatality than FE Tellius did. Raging Demon slashes were kinda cool, but too few for my tastes. XD

[Westbrick]

How does Cullum fare as a unit, have you used him at all?

This is a controversial opinion of mine, but I could see Callum in Top tier. He'll be in High at a minimum. His placement would be for the same reason as Frederick's: he's absolutely essential during the earlygame, although for his +5DEF double boosts instead of a Jeigan status.

EDIT: This applies only to Lunatic/Lunatic+.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Westbrick

[Espinosa]

This is a controversial opinion of mine, but I could see Callum in Top tier. He'll be in High at a minimum. His placement would be for the same reason as Frederick's: he's absolutely essential during the earlygame, although for his +5DEF double boosts instead of a Jeigan status.

EDIT: This applies only to Lunatic/Lunatic+.

But we don't put Louise in the top tier just for supporting Pent. Though this is a pretty poor example, seeing how Pent is doing fine without her deployed anyway.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

An A support between two set characters and a +5 def bonus to any unit you like are two different things.

Not to mention Pent/Louise come fairly late.

[Othin]

This is a controversial opinion of mine, but I could see Callum in Top tier. He'll be in High at a minimum. His placement would be for the same reason as Frederick's: he's absolutely essential during the earlygame, although for his +5DEF double boosts instead of a Jeigan status.

EDIT: This applies only to Lunatic/Lunatic+.

I'm not sure a rating of 10/10 for five maps followed by like 5/10 for the remaining 20 is what I'd call Top Tier status or even High Tier.

I mean, I just completed Ch8 and promoted both Krom and MU, and I could see myself going the whole rest of the game without Frederick now, although I don't plan on it. Callum is even less essential: I'm still using him, but really just because I want to. I'm not sure he was involved in combat once in Ch8, even with so much as a support bonus.

[Emperor Hardin]

Cullum's growths on the site look pretty high.

[Espinosa]

Is it possible to keep units on the field just for their support bonus without any fear they will be attacked? Because the word utility gets a whole new meaning in this game.

[Othin]

Is it possible to keep units on the field just for their support bonus without any fear they will be attacked? Because the word utility gets a whole new meaning in this game.

Support bonuses require being adjacent, but they're rather generic. What we're talking about is the bonuses given from having Callum in Double: whenever he sits on someone, he gives them at least +3 Str and +5 Def, at least as a Knight. This doesn't carry a risk of being attacked while in this state, but he does contribute to combat, being automatically the highest priority for Dual Attacks and Dual Guards. Without a doubt, it's a form of contributing as much as anything else, like casting a Barrier spell.

[Ema Skye]

Double also sounds like the movement problems of Armor Knights isn't a big deal this time around. Go into double with someone and take advantage of their high movement while still being able to partake in combat. Those are some pretty great bonuses just for sitting there.

Question about reclass. Do the bonuses behave like promotion bonuses, as in do the base stats have any effect in the bonus? Like if I reclassed from Myrmidon to Barbarian, would I get +6 HP, +4 Str, -1 Mag, -6 Skl, -2 Spe, -1 Def and -1 Res? Or is it something else?

[Westbrick]

I'm not sure a rating of 10/10 for five maps followed by like 5/10 for the remaining 20 is what I'd call Top Tier status or even High Tier.

I mean, I just completed Ch8 and promoted both Krom and MU, and I could see myself going the whole rest of the game without Frederick now, although I don't plan on it. Callum is even less essential: I'm still using him, but really just because I want to. I'm not sure he was involved in combat once in Ch8, even with so much as a support bonus.

Okay, I'm not sure I'd seriously end up arguing Callum for top tier, but he is absolutely essential, and he does deserve to be in High. He plays the same role as Frederick- necessary for those insanely difficult early chapters- but unlike Frederick, who grows gradually worse over time, Callum's usage nosedives pretty quick towards the end of midgame.

[Othin]

Double also sounds like the movement problems of Armor Knights isn't a big deal this time around. Go into double with someone and take advantage of their high movement while still being able to partake in combat. Those are some pretty great bonuses just for sitting there.

Question about reclass. Do the bonuses behave like promotion bonuses, as in do the base stats have any effect in the bonus? Like if I reclassed from Myrmidon to Barbarian, would I get +6 HP, +4 Str, -1 Mag, -6 Skl, -2 Spe, -1 Def and -1 Res? Or is it something else?

It does, and yes, that's how reclasing works.

Okay, I'm not sure I'd seriously end up arguing Callum for top tier, but he is absolutely essential, and he does deserve to be in High. He plays the same role as Frederick- necessary for those insanely difficult early chapters- but unlike Frederick, who grows gradually worse over time, Callum's usage nosedives pretty quick towards the end of midgame.

Honestly, the most difficult chapter is Ch2, which is over by the time he joins. I'm sure I could get away with never deploying him again after he joins in Ch3.

And I wouldn't call Ch7 "the end of midgame" in a 27-chapter game.

[Fei Mao]

I don't think this has been asked yet, but are there recruitable generics in this game like FE11 and FE12?

[Westbrick]

Honestly, the most difficult chapter is Ch2, which is over by the time he joins. I'm sure I could get away with never deploying him again after he joins in Ch3.

And I wouldn't call Ch7 "the end of midgame" in a 27-chapter game.

I found that +5DEF highly useful until much later than Chapter 7. The thing about Lunatic is that, for most chapters, you've got deployment slots to spare: because the enemies are so strong, you can't simply bring units to tag along, so only your best will get fielded. And Callum is a consistently excellent double partner.

[Emperor Hardin]

I don't think this has been asked yet, but are there recruitable generics in this game like FE11 and FE12?

I'm not Othin, but I can there say there are not.