Most Overrated character?

[Fia]

Do people even say that Lachesis is any good? I have heard plenty of good things about Leaf but I can't recall anything about Lachesis.

Actually I don't even think I heard any good things about Leaf. I heard people adore their promotion class but pretty much that's it. Maybe that's just me.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Fia

[Florete]

I actually agree that "overrated" isn't the best word to use. Even when people argue if a character is well-written, different tastes on writing shape their opinions (it is easier than just discussing personalities though). However, there probably isn't a better word to use in subjects like this and people couldn't be arsed to type "Which character has the biggest difference between how much you like them and how much people like them?", so overrated and underrated it is.

With that said, I don't think mages are "overrated". Other than Soren I don't see them getting a lot of love.

You made it sound wordy there, but people do that. "[Things] other people love that you can't stand?" for example. I hate the word "overrated" because most people use it in a context that would be better with that question, but saying "overrated" makes it sound more like you're stating a claim.

You have a great point. Still, let's just say that admitting Nephenee's flaws is NOT one of the things most of her fans do often, and Soren... I'm not convinced that he's that much better than any of the other mages at all.

Also, would "overhyped" be a better word for topics like these?

Well, no. People won't naturally be "Oh I totally love Nephenee but there's this and this and this wrong with her." That doesn't mean they don't realize the flaws, though. And who does think Soren is "much better" than the other mages?

[Shadow Mir]

Well, no. People won't naturally be "Oh I totally love Nephenee but there's this and this and this wrong with her." That doesn't mean they don't realize the flaws, though. And who does think Soren is "much better" than the other mages?

Ahh, I guess you have a point, but still. As much as I like Ilyana, I'm not one to try to sweep her speed issues under the rug. I was thinking more in terms of those who, when confronted about a character's flaws, either try to make them sound trivial or even ignore them altogether. As for that last one, I can't give a definitive answer.

[Snowy_One]

With the other swordmasters? Cause he's pretty much them with less luck and for free.

If that was how he was treated, maybe I wouldn't hate him so much. But for years now I've seen people almost literally drool over him. I've seen him even hit top-tier at one point on Ye olde Gamefaqs while Zihark was mid and Mia was below Lucia. And to top it off I've seen multiple people drool over his character in the past and call him 'badass loner' and stuff like that. That's why I think he's mega-overrated.

[Axie]

You made it sound wordy there, but people do that. "[Things] other people love that you can't stand?" for example. I hate the word "overrated" because most people use it in a context that would be better with that question, but saying "overrated" makes it sound more like you're stating a claim.

Oh but your question doesn't cover everything "overrated" does - just look at the people in this thread who said "I like Seth but he is overrated" for example. But I agree with your overall opinion, people should use "overrated" less.

If that was how he was treated, maybe I wouldn't hate him so much. But for years now I've seen people almost literally drool over him. I've seen him even hit top-tier at one point on Ye olde Gamefaqs while Zihark was mid and Mia was below Lucia. And to top it off I've seen multiple people drool over his character in the past and call him 'badass loner' and stuff like that. That's why I think he's mega-overrated.

Maybe it's just me, but when people are being ridiculous, it's hard to let them negatively affect my opinions. It's a fact Stefan isn't top tier so if people say he is despite all evidence then I can not really pay attention.

That's why I find it so hard to say people are overrated in gameplay. The only examples I had for overratedness in gameplay are not even generated by gameplay itself:

-- People putting Oifaye above the "bad Jeigans" back in the day was kinda silly; I'm not even sure if most people still call "good Jeigans" Oifayes, though

-- When people praise Marcus they just tend to do it in general and forget FE6 Marcus doesn't stay useful as nearly as long as FE7 Marcus does

-- People sometimes say Franz is almost a second Seth and I don't think they realize how good Seth is when they say that

-- I guess Lex as a father is a legit gameplay complaint, though? Elite is good but it will never make up for weird growths for most kids and no inheritance for male kids. Ambush/Wrath may be amazing but I could have just had a good Magic base/growth for Arthur instead (and still keep Wrath)

[Randoman]

Sigurd, definitely. Yes, he can solo the game, yes, he's the strongest unit in FE4 and possibly all of FE but the last time I checked his competition Seth and Marcus didn't let themselves get Falaflamed into oblivion, not only dying before the final boss is defeated leaving his son to clean up his mess but also losing out on availability for half of his game unlike Seth and Marcus who stuck around the whole time (practically the whole time for Marcus in FE7) is it really necessary for fans to constantly praise him as if their lives depended on it? Voting him for practically every best/worst competition that he's eligible for has also gotten really out of hand (Best unit, sure. But best deceased character? Best brother when it's practically his fault his sister died? It's the only reason why I gave up on voting for those competitions). I've just really gotten sick of how out of control Sigurd's fanbase has become.

Lex, I've also never really understood the praise for (probably because I never got the Hero Axe due to FE4 liking placing super secret items on one specific spot of the whole gigantic map).

And to make this post not sound like an FE4 bash-fest (though I have been tempted to make a thread like that, since I never see any FE4 hate from others, yet I see bashing on all other FEs barring 5 constantly), I'll mention Duessel from FE8. I find his stats (except weapon levels) similar to Yuno in FE6, yet he gets a lot of praise. Does his earlier jointime help him that much?

Edited October 17, 2012 by Randoman

[-Cynthia-]

And to make this post not sound like an FE4 bash-fest (though I have been tempted to make a thread like that, since I never see any FE4 hate from others, yet I see bashing on all other FEs barring 5 constantly), I'll mention Duessel from FE8. I find his stats (except weapon levels) similar to Yuno in FE6, yet he gets a lot of praise. Does his earlier jointime help him that much?

Combination of jointime, FE8 enemies being easy (particularly slow) and Garm being available to help his Spd issues. I do find him a bit overrated myself though, his durability is mostly overkill anyway and that's his main selling point.

[Silvercrow]

Lex, I've also never really understood the praise for (probably because I never got the Hero Axe due to FE4 liking placing super secret items on one specific spot of the whole gigantic map).

Yea this is kind of the selling point of Lex. The difference between him with and without it is astronomical.

You'll probably still find him overrated if you find Sigurd overrated though.

[Jedi]

Sigurd, definitely. Yes, he can solo the game, yes, he's the strongest unit in FE4 and possibly all of FE but the last time I checked his competition Seth and Marcus didn't let themselves get Falaflamed into oblivion, not only dying before the final boss is defeated leaving his son to clean up his mess but also losing out on availability for half of his game unlike Seth and Marcus who stuck around the whole time (practically the whole time for Marcus in FE7) is it really necessary for fans to constantly praise him as if their lives depended on it? Voting him for practically every best/worst competition that he's eligible for has also gotten really out of hand (Best unit, sure. But best deceased character? Best brother when it's practically his fault his sister died? It's the only reason why I gave up on voting for those competitions). I've just really gotten sick of how out of control Sigurd's fanbase has become.

Lex, I've also never really understood the praise for (probably because I never got the Hero Axe due to FE4 liking placing super secret items on one specific spot of the whole gigantic map).

And to make this post not sound like an FE4 bash-fest (though I have been tempted to make a thread like that, since I never see any FE4 hate from others, yet I see bashing on all other FEs barring 5 constantly), I'll mention Duessel from FE8. I find his stats (except weapon levels) similar to Yuno in FE6, yet he gets a lot of praise. Does his earlier jointime help him that much?

I've seen plenty of FE4 bashing, most comes from how different it is or in some cases people think its extremely over rated in general, or they just don't like the story nor the characters. I mean heck I didn't like it at first myself but it grew on me when I finally understood it. [gameplay-wise]

Lex also passes down Elite to a kid so there is that as well not just the Brave Axe.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Captain Jedi

[Anouleth]

You made it sound wordy there, but people do that. "[Things] other people love that you can't stand?" for example. I hate the word "overrated" because most people use it in a context that would be better with that question, but saying "overrated" makes it sound more like you're stating a claim.

Well, no. People won't naturally be "Oh I totally love Nephenee but there's this and this and this wrong with her." That doesn't mean they don't realize the flaws, though. And who does think Soren is "much better" than the other mages?

The Spanish?

And to make this post not sound like an FE4 bash-fest (though I have been tempted to make a thread like that, since I never see any FE4 hate from others, yet I see bashing on all other FEs barring 5 constantly), I'll mention Duessel from FE8. I find his stats (except weapon levels) similar to Yuno in FE6, yet he gets a lot of praise. Does his earlier jointime help him that much?

Right, except that Duessel actually wins important stats by huge margins (HP by 8, Strength by 7, Defense by 8), and has 10 more CON so in practice, he's faster as well. Even before he gets Garm.

If you want a character that's comparable to Yuno statistically, take Syrene or Isadora: except they're actually underrated, if anything.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Anouleth

[BBM]

Elite is indeed better than having better growths because even if the child's growths are slightly worse, they'll be a higher level so their stats will be slightly better until both kids cap. And Arthur is not really good without Holsety or Ambush because his durability is crap, and durability in this game matters more than most because of how enemies are clustered together. Azel!Arthur gets hit by one enemy, Wrathkills them back, and then gets hit by the second and goes splat. This can be partially mitigated with a Defence Ring but all that'd do is increase the amount of people Arthur can take on by himself from 2 to 3 or 4. Whereas Lex!Arthur can just Wrathkill them because he'll never get hit after he's below health. His biggest problem is not being able to OHKO after a bit, but he can take a Magic Ring and Tron after promotion and he'll be much better than Azel!Arthur will.

As for Lex's kids, most are okay with having their default weapons.

Plus Hero Axe raep.

[Anouleth]

Elite is indeed better than having better growths because even if the child's growths are slightly worse, they'll be a higher level so their stats will be slightly better until both kids cap.

Elite also means an earlier promotion, which is especially good for Arthur.

[Silvercrow]

Yea, I'll agree that Lex and Sigurd might be overrated, but I'll defend Lex!Arthur to the death. It is really the only setup aside from Holsety that lets him be a dominant unit at any stage of the game.

[Momo]

I think part of the reason Lex is valued so highly is because he doesn't take anything from anyone else. Literally only one other person can even use his precious axe (Lachesis) and that's only if you promote her. Considering how annoying trading items in that game is, being able to not worry means a lot.

[Axie]

I've never had problems with Azel!Arthur and he wasn't particularly blessed in any stat. And yes, Elite gives kids a level lead, but in Arthur's case, Lex!Arthur needs to be Lv16 (on average) to match Azel!Arthur's base Magic. Azel!Arthur wouldn't be Lv16 at the same point of the game, but he would have gotten some levels and would have a lot more Magic. However, I won't pretend I play FE4 efficiently (I don't waste turns for love points or reinforcement abuse or something, but my strategies probably aren't the best) so maybe (probably?) Elite in general is way more useful in an efficient playthrough than it is to me.

[Baldrick]

It helps him get a horse quicker, and Lex gives Arthur Wrath/Ambush.

But a truly efficient playthrough would prefer Azel because it takes less turns to pair.

[Silvercrow]

In a truly efficient playthrough, Tiltyu doesn't get paired afaik, so it's kind of a moot point

The thing is that as long as Arthur has a magic ring, his base magic is actually high enough all the way until chapter 10 or so. Enemies have pretty poor resistance/HP for quite a while.

[Loki Laufeyson]

You have a great point. Still, let's just say that admitting Nephenee's flaws is NOT one of the things most of her fans do often, and Soren... I'm not convinced that he's that much better than any of the other mages at all.

Also, would "overhyped" be a better word for topics like these?

I have seen some Neph fanboys acknowledge her shaky starts in both games. They will usually say "Yeah shes not amazeballs right out of the box but when she gets going...hnngh!" Of course thats more around here and in parts of the Something Awful FE community. You do have a point that generally, a lot of Neph fanboys dont want to admit her faults. lawl.

As for Soren, again, with me its about his character more than him as a unit. I know the dude has flaws as a unit. In FE9, hes pretty good but his strength makes tomes that arent forges or fire, bog him down. Mostly to start with. Plus his defense is not great in either game. In FE10, hes got some problems. Without transfers, dude might really not do so well if he isnt fed kills and stuff. Even with transfers, he needs a bit of love and BEXP abuse because of his lower level. I can make him pretty amazing with a little skill recipe that i discovered but thats just me. A lot of people prefer Calill.

[BluBlaDe]

Nephenee is probably the most overrated of the whole series. As for the other games :

FE4 : Definitely Altenna. Sure she could kill but I don't remember her being so great at magic defense. My memory is a little foggy of this game although.

FE5 : Shiva and Fergus. Sure I overuse the fuck out of them but I started hating Fergus a lot since I failed chapter 10 and 11 thrice because he could not take hits from ballistas. I know I'm not being rational and I played like shit but I lost 2-3 hours of gameplay man. Shiva is an absolute brute on arena but he died at the end of chapter 6 AND chapter 9 TWICE at the arena so I had to restart them all over. There ya go full of bias point and random hatred. I still use them although and deep down I know how good they are.

FE7 : Florina too.

FE8 : Lol does not really matters, they could pretty much all becomes brutes. I'd say Garcia maybe ? Haven't played in over two years.

FE10: It's definitely Nephenee for everyone. I've also seen somewhere that Jill was good which I disagree to too. So I guess both Nephenee and Jill.

[Randoman]

Right, except that Duessel actually wins important stats by huge margins (HP by 8, Strength by 7, Defense by 8), and has 10 more CON so in practice, he's faster as well. Even before he gets Garm.

If you want a character that's comparable to Yuno statistically, take Syrene or Isadora: except they're actually underrated, if anything.

Hmm... fair enough. Though I meant that both Yuno and Duessel are similar in that their stats are quite low for their level. I suppose that's not exactly true for Duessel, given what you said in your post. I find Syrene's stats strong for her level (not to mention for a prepromote, but her jointime negates her strong stats).

[Anouleth]

Hmm... fair enough. Though I meant that both Yuno and Duessel are similar in that their stats are quite low for their level.

Except they have roughly the same level, only Duessel has much better stats, with giant leads in HP/STR/DEF and similar speed. If Duessel's stats are "low", then Yuno's are "beyond abysmal".

I suppose that's not exactly true for Duessel, given what you said in your post. I find Syrene's stats strong for her level (not to mention for a prepromote, but her jointime negates her strong stats).

As I recall, Syrene's stats are fine to do her job, but if you wanted to use her for serious combat, you wouldn't be able to. Like, I remember that she doesn't double Wyvern Riders in her starting chapter with the Dragonspear, which is the only way she can 2HKO them. That's bad.

[MacLovin]

Nephenee is probably the most overrated of the whole series. As for the other games :

FE4 : Definitely Altenna. Sure she could kill but I don't remember her being so great at magic defense. My memory is a little foggy of this game although.

FE5 : Shiva and Fergus. Sure I overuse the fuck out of them but I started hating Fergus a lot since I failed chapter 10 and 11 thrice because he could not take hits from ballistas. I know I'm not being rational and I played like shit but I lost 2-3 hours of gameplay man. Shiva is an absolute brute on arena but he died at the end of chapter 6 AND chapter 9 TWICE at the arena so I had to restart them all over. There ya go full of bias point and random hatred. I still use them although and deep down I know how good they are.

FE7 : Florina too.

FE8 : Lol does not really matters, they could pretty much all becomes brutes. I'd say Garcia maybe ? Haven't played in over two years.

FE10: It's definitely Nephenee for everyone. I've also seen somewhere that Jill was good which I disagree to too. So I guess both Nephenee and Jill.

Garcia is underrated.

IMO, Trainees and Gerik are overrated.

[Sasori]

Are Trainees overrates? I've seen almost nothing, but hate for them.

I think they are fun to use, but that they where not designed with efficiency in mind.

[Shadow Mir]

IMO, Trainees and Gerik are overrated.

Ehhhh... I don't even see that much in the way of praise for the trainees, so how they're overrated is beyond me.

[Axie]

How in the world are trainees overrated? They are not worth it without grinding and everyone knows it. The only people who praise the trainees nowadays are people who are not familiar with "playing for turns" and use the tower and skirmishes to grind, and the trainees are actually usable then.