Loki Laufeyson Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 I consider Micaiah to be the exact opposite of a Mary Sue. She is on the cover and build up to be the main character. But she has barely any impact on the plot and it's obvious that the real hero of the story is Ike. Which makes Micaiah little more then a glorified Camus, let alone a Mary Sue. Fair enough, but Micaiah has a huge impact on the plot. Shes the main driving force for two parts of the game. Parts 1 and 4. Yes, Ike is the hero of the story, but Micaiah is also the heroine of the story. I understand why people don't like the story, but I can never understand why people don't like the game play aside from the team-switching. Agreed. The gameplay of RD is seamless in my opinion. I actually really like the team switching. Adds some spice to it. Latest Confession: I deleted all of my old files in RD and am starting a fresh new series of runs. That means my current run counts as a "First Play" meaning Pelleas is gonna die. It will be the first run since i got the game and figured out all the second playthrough stuff, that i dont get Lehran and the extended epilogue scene. But it doesnt matter! SHINON HAS TRANSFERS! ERMAHGERD!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) My problem with Micaiah in theory is (controversy alert) that her origin is the exact same as a Mary Sue: A minor cliffhanger of FE9 (Sothe's special person) was taken advantage of to insert a girl who has a unique special power (that stops mattering after Part 1 and seems to be included just for show), unique special hair, being a part of the unique special Branded (without suffering any of the bad things of being a Branded, in a country that hates anything even remotely Laguz), a hot guy willing to die for her, and a personality that everyone in canon loves sooner or later. Later on you find out she's the older sister of Sanaki and should be ruling Begnion, and that she's the voice of a goddess who saves the world. Whether you like her or not, that's a lot of Mary Sue traits. I've read some bad Harry Potter fanfics that sound quite a bit like this. I don't have access to the Part 3 script which would be crucial for me to truly form an opinion on if Micaiah is a Mary Sue or just a victim of FE10's terrible writing in general (or both, making her an accidental Mary Sue - yes that exists), but considering her backstory, Part 1 and Part 4, I'm not at all impressed. Edited October 31, 2012 by Axie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prax Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) I think Micaiah probably screws up and becomes the enemy too much to even be considered a qualified Mary-Sue. Ike thinks she's crazy, and Soren hates her. Since Ike and co are the de facto heroes with nothing but good intentions from the last game, it vilifies Micaiah even more. lol Plus you can make all those people from the previous game fighting on Micaiah's side to switch sides over to Ike's, which shows again how supporting her side is "wrong". The only people loyal to her are her own Dawn Brigade and possibly Pelleas (but we all know he's misguided dark mage being puppeted around by Izuka, so that only makes his support of Micaiah more dubious). It seems more like they built Micaiah up to be this beacon or a Mary-Sue, only to tear her down in the game to present a twist, and then they never quite gave her enough room to redeem herself. She's not even present in a lot of the last quarter of the game because she's literally being possessed by Yune (who is a different character and not just another persona/facet of Micaiah -- the last move where Ike powers his blade up to defeat Ashera? Wasn't Micaiah who helped him. It was Yune). I think I was more disappointed by the fact that Micaiah was supposed to be the main HERO hero, but she in the end played second fiddle to Ike and then the ending focused on Ike too. For these reasons, I demand that the next Fire Emblem feature a female mage-fighter HERO hero for REAL this time! No more spotlight sharing with stinky boys! lol Had Radiant Dawn fleshed out support conversations more, I probably would rank it higher than PoR.. but right now, they are kind of about equal. Edited October 31, 2012 by Prax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Oh boy, another Micaiah Mary Sue discussion breaks out. All I'm going to say on the matter is that she has a lot of Mary Sue characteristics but her character itself may or may not be a Mary Sue depending on how you look at her. I personally think that she may be one. Sure, she makes lots of mistakes in part 3 and Ike + Greil Mercenaries hate her. But in 3-11, Ena tells Ike and Sanaki to "stand down and make peace with Daein", which I could argue that in-story makes Ike + Sanaki look like the "bad guys". Everyone immediately forgives her in part 4, even hotheaded Skrimir. I dunno, I personally feel that she is likely one. Others disagree. Let's just agree to disagree. My favorite characters are Tormod and Rath. (Loran, maybe, when I get FE13.) I am unapologetically a fan of both Tormod and Rath. For the next FE game, I want a bisexual FE lord who can marry both guys and girls. Preferably a male mage. I'd also be happy if the lord was a guy with a playable brother or a girl with a playable sister. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ema Skye Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Whole Series Wise -I think FE needs to go back to FE3/4/5 where each game had a different feel than the next. FE6 and 7 are basically the same game, just different names. FE8 is guilty of this too, only it adds a world map. This is why FE10 is easily my favorite western game, because it's so different than the other games. -Similarly, I think that the Elibe games are a weak point in the series. I guess FE6 was a test of their ability to make portable FE, and FE7 was an introduction game for the western players. I guess FE kinda lost quite a bit when Shozou Kaga left Intelligent Systems. Thankfully FE13 looks like it will change things. Archanea or however you spell it -I like how real these games are. 99% of humans aren't magical, so it makes sense that they'd almost never grow in magic or resistance. -I don't like Peg. Knight -> Draco promotion. I think it's kinda weird. -FE3's two book system was excellent and needs to be used again -I don't like how FE11 and FE12 try to be exact remakes. After playing FE10, they felt like a one-step forward, 2-steps back deal. They can still be a remake without being a 1-1 remake. They could've added console canto, the ability to rescue, SUPPORT CONVOS, and multiple lords (like Nyna). -I like Reclass because it can make everyone useful, or at least not useless. -Dem Sniper promo bonuses -Dem Dracoknight promo bonuses Valensia game -Awesome soundtrack for an 8bit game -Kinda seems like it was a test of FE10's parts system due to how the chapters are spread out. -I like how it doesn't require grinding -IT HAS KATUA! -All in all, this is an underrated game that needs more love Jungral Games -PAIRING WAS BEST THING TO HAPPEN TO THIS SERIES BECAUSE IT ENSURES EVERY PLAYTHROUGH WONT BE LIKE THE OTHER UNLESS YOU ACTUALLY DO THE SAME THING AS THE PREVIOUS PLAYTHROUGH -I didn't like how every battle in Gen.2 was "let's go kill everyone in this country, then we'll go kill everyone in this other country and so on and so on. Plot was kinda primitive. -Holy Blood was kinda cool, even if it made pairings like HolynXAyra and ClaudeXSylvia kind of incest. -Castle Hub is a genious idea -I wish FE4 wasn't a game of make the ponies run. -Never played past Ch.4 of FE5 because THE RANDOMNESS. -I really liked the idea of FE5's Universal caps Elibe Games -They can both die in a fire of BOLGANONE -I don't like any characters from either game. -They're so bland Magvel -World Map makes this not a basi text swap when compared to Elibe. -L'ARACHEL is best character ever! -I wish this game was easier to hack -I wish this game was harder -I wish all the CC characters could actually join in the main story. :/ -I still love LARACHEL Tellius Games -FE10 was the best thing to happen to FE since FE5 -FE9 was simply okay -FE10 supports are the only thing that stops it from being a perfect game -Well, that and character balance (looking at you Fiona) -The indoor maps made me wish FE3/5 Dismounting existed in this game. -Jill's character development is about as much as Fin's is. But Jill didn't need 2 Generations to acheive it. :P -I'm a Ike hater. -I think FE9!Titania is better than Seth because AXES. Awakening -So many good things about this game -like the DLC -and the spotpass -and the pairings -and the supports -But there's no fog of war -I don't miss the magic triangle -I'm so glad light magic is gone -The skill system is awesome -The art style is my favorite in the series. -Yeah, I want this game bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) Being an archer in real life makes me like pretty much every archer and sniper in the series to some amount [especially those female ones <3 Briggid, Igrene, and Louise most of all] regardless of "tier" usage I play both Casual and Drafts/LTC, because its fun to play the games in multiple ways in drafts I take note of effectiveness, in casual I use whomever the hell I want. Fire Emblem is my 2nd favorite series of all time ranking just below my enjoyment of the Sonic the Hedgehog series. I think Zealot is an underrated unit in FE6 I didn't like FE4 or FE5 at first but they quickly became 2 of my favorite games in the series after I figured them out via help from Refa, Horace, Shin, Darros and others. I don't hate any unit in particular I can generally find something likeable about each, even if their performance isn't up to snuff with some others. I used to dislike Jeigans and Prepromotes now they are among some of my favorite units. I like all the Lords to an extent and I don't have any hate for any certain ones nor do I think they are mary/gary sue/stu's I do like and use Est units [mostly in casual unlessss I have some tricks] Edited October 31, 2012 by Spirit Detective Jedi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrostyFireMage Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) FE6: - I think the game is the worst FE due to some of the worst character balance in any FE and the overly huge boring maps. - Rutger is an overrated crit-magnet who I replace with the awesomeness which is Fir at the first opportunity I get, level difference and efficiency be damned. - I also enjoy training Wendy via arena and using her in my main party. - Ward is better than Lot. - I occasionally prefer using Oujay instead of Dieck. FE7: - Sain is more irritating than Serra due to his "hilarious" tendency to flirt with every young woman ever. - I prefer pairing Kent with Lyn because Kent has been with Lyn since the beginning of the game and Rath just kinda comes out of nowhere. - Fiora is more pathetic than Florina (hai i'm gonna avenge my friends by throwing my javelin at the nearest nomad best plan evarrrr) - Wil is best archer because Rebecca's kind of a tsundere bitch. FE8: - Neimi is awesome. - Joshua is a dick. - Lute needs to be drop-kicked into a furnace. - L'Arachel is the best princess ever. - I try to use all the trainees WITHOUT level grinding in skirmishes/Tower of Valni. FE9: - Tormod is best mage. FE10: - Leonardo is best sniper. - Edward is better than Mia. Edited October 31, 2012 by Frosty Fire Mage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Elibe is my favorite FE universe and it pains me when people don't love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garteam Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I find pegasus knights are kinda useless compared to wyvern riders, they may have higher speed and resistance, but they're to frail in opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 Omg so much to reply to! My problem with Micaiah in theory is (controversy alert) that her origin is the exact same as a Mary Sue: A minor cliffhanger of FE9 (Sothe's special person) was taken advantage of to insert a girl who has a unique special power (that stops mattering after Part 1 and seems to be included just for show), unique special hair, being a part of the unique special Branded (without suffering any of the bad things of being a Branded, in a country that hates anything even remotely Laguz), a hot guy willing to die for her, and a personality that everyone in canon loves sooner or later. Later on you find out she's the older sister of Sanaki and should be ruling Begnion, and that she's the voice of a goddess who saves the world. Whether you like her or not, that's a lot of Mary Sue traits. I've read some bad Harry Potter fanfics that sound quite a bit like this. I don't have access to the Part 3 script which would be crucial for me to truly form an opinion on if Micaiah is a Mary Sue or just a victim of FE10's terrible writing in general (or both, making her an accidental Mary Sue - yes that exists), but considering her backstory, Part 1 and Part 4, I'm not at all impressed. I agree. I think she was designed to be a lot like Ike, (Read: Escapist Character) but somewhere along the line, the writing got fubar'd and the Sue bomb got dropped. There is a difference between an Escapist Character and a Sue. The former is a fun character that people love to escape into. They go on awesome adventures, often have nifty powers or something, do some pretty cool plot junk, but often end up having flaws in the long run. Harry Potter is a good example of this. So many kids escaped reality with Harry but also saw him make mistakes and felt his pain, etc. Sue is...well you guys already know. The line can get pretty blurred between the Escapist Character/Protagonist and the Sue. Canon Sues happen this way. Micaiah's problem isnt really the whole silver hair, special powers, voice of the goddess thing as much as it is the whole treatment she gets with the Apostle reveal. That was an asspull and veered her straight into Sue Territory. Her becoming Queen of Daein was just as bad if not worse. I think Micaiah probably screws up and becomes the enemy too much to even be considered a qualified Mary-Sue. Ike thinks she's crazy, and Soren hates her. Since Ike and co are the de facto heroes with nothing but good intentions from the last game, it vilifies Micaiah even more. lol Plus you can make all those people from the previous game fighting on Micaiah's side to switch sides over to Ike's, which shows again how supporting her side is "wrong". The only people loyal to her are her own Dawn Brigade and possibly Pelleas (but we all know he's misguided dark mage being puppeted around by Izuka, so that only makes his support of Micaiah more dubious). It seems more like they built Micaiah up to be this beacon or a Mary-Sue, only to tear her down in the game to present a twist, and then they never quite gave her enough room to redeem herself. She's not even present in a lot of the last quarter of the game because she's literally being possessed by Yune (who is a different character and not just another persona/facet of Micaiah -- the last move where Ike powers his blade up to defeat Ashera? Wasn't Micaiah who helped him. It was Yune). I think I was more disappointed by the fact that Micaiah was supposed to be the main HERO hero, but she in the end played second fiddle to Ike and then the ending focused on Ike too. For these reasons, I demand that the next Fire Emblem feature a female mage-fighter HERO hero for REAL this time! No more spotlight sharing with stinky boys! lol Had Radiant Dawn fleshed out support conversations more, I probably would rank it higher than PoR.. but right now, they are kind of about equal. Ehhhh...At the end of the game, theres only one character that hates Micaiah. (left alive anyway) And that is Soren. Ike no longer thinks her crazy. Skrimir, upon joining her team, immediately warms to her and even says "No one doubts your gift, Micaiah." Wut? Dude, since when? BK is revealed to have acted on Sephiran's orders to help her. Sanaki even accepts the fact that Micaiah is the true Apostle. Everyone, in the end, still ends up loving Micaiah. Sure, DB members can defect but only under certain circumstances. Haar has to be the one to make Jill defect. Lethe or Mordy has to be the one to make Zihark defect and..if im not mistaken, only if theres transfer data. While the game did take some pains to question Micaiah's motives in part 3, thats all out the window when part 4 rolls around. Some would even argue that Yune possessing Micaiah is also a Sue trait. *shrug* Is she a true by-the-letter Sue? Hard to say. Its probably safe to say she isnt Bella Swan caliber Sue. Does she have too many traits of a Sue to make people uncomfortable? Yeah. Totes. By extension, is Ike a Sue? If PoR didnt exist and this game only existed as a stand-alone, yeah i would say he was. But i dont consider him a true Sue. Both characters were designed to be fun Escapist Characters. I think its just some dodgy writing that one ended up seeming Sue-ish. Elibe is my favorite FE universe and it pains me when people don't love it. Yar. Yar... Also i dont like it when people say referring to peg knights and wyvern riders as Horsebirds and Lizardbirds respectively, is being a mindless follower. Those are funny terms and they warm the cockles of my heart. Sue me. (oh! c wut i did thar?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komeiji Koishi Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 They are funny terms and they fill my heart with rainbows. Fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Also i dont like it when people say referring to peg knights and wyvern riders as Horsebirds and Lizardbirds respectively, is being a mindless follower. Those are funny terms and they warm the cockles of my heart. Sue me. Like I said, I personally think both those terms sound rather dumb... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 I do like Dragonbird better than Lizardbird but the statement still stands. Despite finding Micaiah to be too close to Suedom, i admit to rooting for her in part 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searis Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I hate units whose hit rate is unreliable and tend to avoid them. This pretty much means that (Pirate)Ross, Hector and Dart are the only axe locked units in the GBA games I actually use, as the other axe users in those games always have really bad aim for me. I only used Laguz units on my first run through fe9 and now other than Tibarn and the Herons don't bother using them in 9 or 10. In a recent play through of fe4 in chapter 1, after killing all the enemies on the map I returned/warped all my units but Sigurd and Ethlin to the base castle and had them all go as far as possible in the arena. I got the shock of my life when Deidre wiped out the whole arena, only having a little trouble with the last fighter(he almost killed her with one hit, but after that she dodged her way to victory). I was very surprised as she had only had one level up before I did the arena with her. I decided to check her status and found she had the magic ring, I had forgotten I had her deal the last blow to Sandima! (I'm doing substitute run through so was making sure only Ethlin, Cuan, Dew, Sigurd, Fin and Deidre got hold of items(to sell to others if unusable) or money) Afterwards I couldn't help but laugh at myself for forgetting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 (edited) I hate units whose hit rate is unreliable and tend to avoid them. This pretty much means that (Pirate)Ross, Hector and Dart are the only axe locked units in the GBA games I actually use, as the other axe users in those games always have really bad aim for me. I find it kinda funny you use Dart, considering that he looks to me like the type of unit you'd avoid like the plague. That being said, I tend to avoid most axe mainers in the GBA games for a different reason altogether - they're just too darn slow. Edited November 1, 2012 by Golden Cucco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searis Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 (edited) I find it kinda funny you use Dart, considering that he looks to me like the type of unit you'd avoid like the plague. That being said, I tend to avoid most axe mainers in the GBA games for a different reason altogether - they're just too darn slow. Maybe I got lucky but the two times(not a lot I know) that I have used him he hasn't suffered from missing like mad like the other axe mainers usually do for me. I always use Hector and Ross though as they seem to actually hit things most of the time instead of missing. The Hatchet helps Ross a lot though. Edited November 1, 2012 by Searis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isko Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I resorted to using Sorcerer and Nosferatu multiple times in Awakening. I am so ashamed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaMonkey Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I prefer the FE10 support system over all of the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 So the FE9 system, only without any of the conversations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 So the FE9 system, only without any of the conversations. And being able to support anyone, and being able to gain support points on more than just being deployed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axie Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 The FE6/7/8 system with the ability to gain support points like FE10 would be the best system. Work on it IS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otherarrow Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 (edited) I don't like Ike. In The Sacred Stones, I preferred Eirika's route over Ephraim's, and not just because Ephraim gets the ghost ship. I have used the enemy control glitch more than once. It bugs me when people omit the "The" from "The Sacred Stones", but even I know that it just nitpicking. I need to play more Fire Emblem games, as most of my knowledge is second hand. Am I doing this right? Edited November 2, 2012 by Otherarrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 And being able to support anyone, and being able to gain support points on more than just being deployed. Aha, I didn't know about the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I dislike FE11 a lot because I don't like the story and the characters are too plain and lack personality. Also, the chapters are dull and easy unless played on the Hard Modes (** or more). I hate how they used the same old mechanic from FE1 too. I'd feel the same about FE12, but since it's got a better script, support conversations and MU, all is forgiven. I almost never use late arriving characters unless they are noticeably good, like Harken (imo). I laugh at Rath's joining time and current stats/level. It's a joke, right? Nino's an even worse joke. I never met the level requirement to go to the Linus/what's his name's chapter because I focus more on other units. However, the Main Lord is always around Level 20 when I get there. I don't even bother with leveling up Lyn, I know she'll suck regardless of how much I babysit her. I like Bartre, he's one of the units I always use on my playthroughs. Other examples are Rebecca (I admit she isn't that spectacular, but I like her), Raven, Prissy, Pent, Oswin and Lowen. On the other hand, Sain, Lyn, Legault, Wil, Dart, Isadora, Dorkass are mostly always benched. I'm too lazy to check out enemies' stats and weapons and then compare with one of my units' stats, so I save state a lot. Especially because I tend to go Leeroy Jenkins and frequently miss something important (for example, sending a Peg Knight on an archer/ballista's range). Because of my last confession, FE5 is my worst enemy because it requires a lot of calculating from my part, besides a few annoying things, such as not being able to use your characters when they're overused, having scarce equipment, and all the nasty surprises a first-time player might meet on the way. However, I plan on playing it on Elite mode later. FE4 is my favorite game from the series, followed by FE9, FE10 and FE7. I'd like to see a version of FE4 with Support Conversations, more chapters (as in, the original chapters are divided by castles), more space for insights about the characters, remastered music and graphics. It's hard to acknowledge that IS isn't going to work on a remake of it, like they did with FE1 and 2, although I understand why and how it would be hard to change some stuff. ... I think that is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheatEnabled Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 i save all of the "good items" till the last chapter when i realize i saved them for no reason, every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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