RTU discussion thread

[Da Bear]

You're making it sound like we're going up against a full hoard of enemies. :P I don't know how you play, but whenever Virion chips at an enemy, that enemy goes down the following attack and Virion is left mostly unscathed during the enemy phase (or one or two enemies attack him, but they're handled easily).

He can pair up with someone in his two forced chapters and give them DEF. I never mentioned pairing Virion with someone somehow means you use every single character. Don't put words in my mouth.

One or two enemies attacking him takes away most of his health unless you're giving him Frederick or Kellam.

I covered this already... and you don't seem to be listening. Why have him give pair up boosts when others do better? No one has answered this question.

[General Horace]

One or two enemies attacking him takes away most of his health unless you're giving him Frederick or Kellam.

I covered this already... and you don't seem to be listening. Why have him give pair up boosts when others do better? No one has answered this question.

Why use anyone other than like Sully, Panne, Frederick, Avatar and co then? Your point isn't really applicable.

Edited May 25, 2013 by General Horace

[HeroMystic]

He's actually still terrible. He's probably the only (first generation) unit in the game that is harder to level up than Donnel. He'll reach Wyvern and everyone else will be promoting. Leaving him as still the worst unit on the team.

Virion is not harder to level than Donnel, purely because he has ranged attacks. You can give Virion a forged Bronze bow and he can steal kills pretty easily, and unlike Donnel he doesn't immediately die if any unit glares at him. Even with Frederick or Sumia as pair-up, Donnel gets ORKO'd by most units. Donnel's Enemy Phase is just as non-existant as Virion's until he reclasses.

[Da Bear]

Why use anyone other than like Sully, Panne, Frederick, Avatar and co then? Your point isn't really applicable.

...I don't think any of you either understand my posts. It's fun in the game to not always use the best units but when it comes to pair-up there's no real point not to pair up optimally. For Virion to be used for pair ups he has to be the best unit left... which isn't happening.

Virion is not harder to level than Donnel, purely because he has ranged attacks. You can give Virion a forged Bronze bow and he can steal kills pretty easily, and unlike Donnel he doesn't immediately die if any unit glares at him. Even with Frederick or Sumia as pair-up, Donnel gets ORKO'd by most units. Donnel's Enemy Phase is just as non-existant as Virion's until he reclasses.

This isn't Lunatic. When you've realized that this is hard mode then maybe you'll realize that your post isn't correct.

[HeroMystic]

This isn't Lunatic. When you've realized that this is hard mode then maybe you'll realize that your post isn't correct.

You're saying this to the person who is playing Hard Mode at this very moment.

Go ahead and try to put Donnel in the frontlines during Enemy Phase. See how he does.

[Da Bear]

You're saying this to the person who is playing Hard Mode at this very moment.

Go ahead and try to put Donnel in the frontlines during Enemy Phase. See how he does.

He gets 2HKOed. 1RKOing Donnel in Chapter 4 is almost impossible (for non-bosses, the knights and mages might one-shot him) and Chapter 5 isn't that much harder. This is without me counting tonics and pair up btw.

I'm playing HM right now as well and it sounds like you're later on and didn't level him up while enemies were still pathetic.

And that's not really counti

[General Horace]

base donnel is ohko'd and doubled by the fighters in chapter 4

with one level (which is probably all he got in his paralogue, where he's orko'd by every enemy on the map) he's facing similar numbers. Sure if you stuff him with tonics and stuff hes 2hko'd (gasp) but he's also doing like 6 damage (with a strength tonic) to the 4 defence enemies in the chapter. When you give other units tonics at this point, they're easily doubling and orko'ing the enemies in this chapter, and they're not even Frederick. Even crappy units like Virion with a few levels can be hitting for 15 damage or so.

Chapter 5 is way worse for him considering Wyverns can just swoop in and kill him, or he'll get orko'd by myrmidon's regardless of pair ups.

But again its hard for me to talk about a unit like donnel, I'm used to playing at a faster pace than most, so I find him pretty impossible to train without slowing down enough to make it bearable.

Edited May 25, 2013 by General Horace

[Da Bear]

base donnel is ohko'd and doubled by the fighters in chapter 4

with one level (which is probably all he got in his paralogue, where he's orko'd by every enemy on the map) he's facing similar numbers. Sure if you stuff him with tonics and stuff hes 2hko'd (gasp) but he's also doing like 6 damage (with a strength tonic) to the 4 defence enemies in the chapter. When you give other units tonics at this point, they're easily doubling and orko'ing the enemies in this chapter, and they're not even Frederick. Even crappy units like Virion with a few levels can be hitting for 15 damage or so.

Chapter 5 is way worse for him considering Wyverns can just swoop in and kill him, or he'll get orko'd by myrmidon's regardless of pair ups.

Not last I saw but wtv.

I like how you utterly disregard pair ups when calculating how Donnel does.

Chapter 5 is just as bad for Virion. I'm not going to talk about Donnel right now. Maybe when we're actually ranking him.

Edited May 25, 2013 by bearclaw13

[General Horace]

with a defence tonic and kellam pair he's getting orko'd.

although if you wish to drop it, so be it.

[Da Bear]

with a defence tonic and kellam pair he's getting orko'd.

although if you wish to drop it, so be it.

I've never come across him getting 1RKOed in that circumstance is my only problem...

It's not so much not wanting to do it as knowing it won't go anywhere.

[HeroMystic]

Chapter 5 is just as bad for Virion. I'm not going to talk about Donnel right now. Maybe when we're actually ranking him.

I'm on Chapter 4 right now, and I did recruit Donnel. He survives with a Defense tonic or a pair-up that gives defense vs the physical units, and the mages will never ORKO him. If he doesn't proc speed on his level-up, he needs +1 SPD to avoid getting doubled from the fighters, and of course Ms. Marth destroys him. So I'll concede that with some effort, Donnel can survive getting sneezed on for Chapter 4 at least.

Chapter 5 is easily Virion's Chapter though, because Flier weakness exists. Which means Virion can get easy kills with a forged bow.

[Da Bear]

I'm on Chapter 4 right now, and I did recruit Donnel. He survives with a Defense tonic or a pair-up that gives defense vs the physical units, and the mages will never ORKO him. If he doesn't proc speed on his level-up, he needs +1 SPD to avoid getting doubled from the fighters, and of course Ms. Marth destroys him. So I'll concede that with some effort, Donnel can survive getting sneezed on for Chapter 4 at least.

Chapter 5 is easily Virion's Chapter though, because Flier weakness exists. Which means Virion can get easy kills with a forged bow.

Dude. Virion gets swarmed after doing 3/4 of the health of a wyvern he's not even countering like Ricken. People say he rocks that chapter but, and I've tried here I know this to be true, he just dies too fast.

Edit: Sorry missed "forged". worth pointing out wyverns aren't that hard to KO with a forge and others use it better.

Edited May 25, 2013 by bearclaw13

[The Fush]

The problem with Inigo isn't with his stats since with enough babying he can be good as the others

It's only really the availibility, since you either get him early and end up getting him bad stats (by the way I found his chapter rather easy since I could just nip out enemy groups one by one), or recruit him later so he has good stats but ends up not contributing much to the rest of the game (unless you love DLC)

I suppose the length it takes to baby his mother counts as wasting time resulting as lower availibility in your game.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

So, yeah dude

Virion OHKOes a Falcon Knight

That > Inigo

[Da Bear]

So, yeah dude

Virion OHKOes a Falcon Knight

That > Inigo

Forged Silver bow? Also did you enjoy making him something resembling useful?

Bow Knight Inigo prolly could too

[Raine]

Hell, Donnel did that with an Axe without the fliers bonus. Not to mention, my blue-haired Inigo looked at it, laughed, and ran it through with an iron sword. Do the same to a Wyvern Lord and I'll be mildly impressed.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

That Donnel need grindahh, while this Virion is an extremely late addition on the team

Heh

[Da Bear]

That Donnel need grindahh, while this Virion is an extremely late addition on the team

Heh

Not really. I'm currently working on ways to level up Donnel in an efficient mind-frame. I think I can get him too level 6 by Paralogue 2 while only sacrificing a turn or two off of the typical turn-counts, and that's not even in every map.

[Ema Skye]

Not last I saw but wtv.

I like how you utterly disregard pair ups when calculating how Donnel does.

Chapter 5 is just as bad for Virion. I'm not going to talk about Donnel right now. Maybe when we're actually ranking him.

Fighters have ~18 attack and 8 Speed. Donnel has 3 speed. Donnel gets doubled. He has 2 defense and 16 HP. That's an OHKO.

If we give him Kellam:

18 Attack 8 AS vs 7 Defense and 16 HP

11 damage x 2 = 22. Still KOed.

Fighters are the only ones that actually OHKO him, but they're also among the slowest of the enemies (I /think/ the archers might be slower but there are only around 3 of them). Thieves miss the ORKO against Kellam!Donnel but he 3HKOs iirc.

[HeroMystic]

^Is that based on his debut chapter? The discussion was actually based on Chapter 4 and 5. By that point, Donnel already has a level and he'll more than likely get a point in SPD, allowing him to not get doubled.

I don't think anyone is silly enough to argue Donnel isn't full of suck on Paralogue 1.

[Raine]

egad, Paralogue 1 Donnel is such a trick to not get his lame ass killed. But at the point he gets a few levels under his belt-- even as a villager-- he's strong enough to take on the better enemies in most early maps. The first second seal will always be his in my games~<3

EDIT: if ever there was a unit that would make Lunatic not seem quite so hard, it would be him.

Edited May 26, 2013 by Raine

[Loki Laufeyson]

Joining map? Donnel is crap and a liability. Its kind of an asspain just to get him to gain a level. Results, you will not see for some levels. Underdog is neat and all but keeping Donnel as a villager for that long on No Grind is D:

[Sweq32]

Well, seeing as how I'm one of the few people on here who can see the better traits in characters, I use practically every character in the game, even the ones generally regarded as useless. Granted, I have a couple units that could probably solo maps at this point, but I still try to be variable in who I use, simply because I can. In most previous FE games, I wasn't able to explore all my options because of the lack of grinding oppurtunities, but since Awakening allows it, training everyone is my goal in every run I do. It pays off in the end to have many great units.

Also, I'd like to say that Assassin is a great class stat-wise and one of the best physical classes on top of Hero. Assassin may look like crap, but you cannot deny that there is no class faster than this one. Really, Sorcerers and Assassins are the greatest classes in Awakening, and if you have a well trained Sorcerer with a Forged Aversa's Night tome, there's not a chance of them dying, even moreso if they have Vantage.

On topic, Virion probably is one character I'd say that I wish was more useful, but if you want a good archer, certain Spotpass characters do the job better. Besides that, he wasn't given access to Sorcerer, Assassin, or Paladin, so that poor guy can't even hold up with the others. On the bright side, no character got more class option screwed than Ricken.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Ricken easilly has better Class Sets than Virion

Seriously though, sometime you wish someone like say.... Libra replaced Mage with Knight or Paladin. Its a dream comes true

Edited May 26, 2013 by JSND

[Sweq32]

Ricken easilly has better Class Sets than Virion

Seriously though, sometime you wish someone like say.... Libra replaced Mage with Knight or Paladin. Its a dream comes true

Ricken has only one class set based around magic: the Mage set. Granted, he has access to some nifty skills, such as Dual Guard + and Aegis, but I really wish he had more magic classes open to him. I only ever use him as a Dark Knight.