Fakeclaim Mafia - Game Over

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

Or maybe it should be

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[eclipse]

. . .actually, I'm tempted to keep my vote on you for your attempt at snark. Note the qualifying difference of "shouldn't have to" - in other words, OPTIONAL.

You made it back in time, which helps a lot. You also speak of face-to-face mafia, which is quite different from forum mafia. On a forum, I can read what I post, hit Preview and reread it, edit it, and ponder upon my own words before posting. Because of your face-to-face experience, stuff like verbal tics would be more likely to transfer over to a forum-based game, especially if you didn't sit down and analyze the differences between the two play styles (you picked on semantics earlier, which is something that's good in a live game and weak in a game where the players have a very long time to formulate an answer). If I overlay that style on top of the principles that you posted, it's enough to change my read on you; in this case, it's just enough to get you out of today's lynch spotlight. Keep in mind that there's a lot of things that get stripped out of a forum game - you don't get things like body language, tone, and spontaneousness (the first one is impossible to replicate on a forum, the second can be guessed at, and the third doesn't work unless it's five minutes to hammer). I still don't agree with your mindset, but it makes more sense in live games, where a written record of everything isn't kept.

That means my vote shifts to the following, for reasons stated earlier:

##Unvote

##Vote: scorri

I think that Refa's insistence on No Lynch is silly, but not scummy - I'd expect his team to yell at him for sticking out like a sore thumb. I'm pretty sure a lynch will go through, because Shinori exists (and I WILL yell at everyone come D2 if it doesn't).

[eclipse]

Or maybe it should be

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SB vs. BBM spam competition GO!

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

SB vs. BBM spam competition GO!

Don't give me that. It's mostly your fault.

[eclipse]

Don't give me that. It's mostly your fault.

Read Toonami Mafia, if you dare.

[Paperblade]

##Vote: Elieson

I think that this has the best chance of hitting scum. His Refa suspicion is really bad, basically his entire case is "Refa is new and doing new player things and that makes him MAFIA" and that's what he spends half his time talking about. If this was Prims or someone doing this sure you could argue they were mafia I guess but this?

[Sunwoo]

I will not promise anything about whether or not I'll be around tomorrow or near deadline, because all weekdays except for Friday are busy for me at the moment. Right now, I know which players I do not support a lynch on. As for who I would lynch, I'm still not completely convinced about SB. In all honesty, this is mostly over Manix's actions rather than over SB's actions. SB himself has been, well, not terrible. I believe I covered what I thought about his content already.

As for the role mix-up earlier, I'm reading it as null. It's true that if he were scum then his scum buddies may have said something, eclipse, but there are situations when scum can't communicate with one another. I remember in Trainwreck, Levity and I were screaming at Marth for something on the final day, but neither of us could get to him in either the scum QT or the Skype chat QT before the game ended.

Elieson, I will reread his stuff again later and hopefully have an opinion on him. From what I recall, though, I think he was trying too hard to push a case on Refa, by which I mean I think he was trying to make it seem like a bigger thing than it really was.

Gave my thoughts on scorri sometime yesterday and nothing's changed there since she hasn't said anything aside from being okay with SB lynch and then unvoting him. Would like to know what her current scum reads are and if she still suspects Refa.

Grassbridger ... I'm starting to think that this spat between him and eclipse is bordering into "personal territory" at the moment (on his end) and I'm not of clear enough mind to read past emotion right now. I'll reread his content later to reevaluate whether I think he's actually scummy or just having a massive play style conflict with eclipse.

[Zkirsche]

It's not any benefit because I'm not here all day and for this brief moment where I am here there's no way I can get a thorough read on GB/bearclaw.

##Unvote

Decide it without me, you know where I stand (ScumBee and Refa leaning town). Guess I wouldn't cry over Elie either but not sold on it not just being his meta to get so overreactive of these small things because I think he gets lynched early a lot for it.

[BBM]

Votals

Grassbridger (1): Bearclaw

Refa (3): Weapons, Psych, SB

Weapons (2): Shinori, Elie

SB (1): Boron

Bearclaw (1): Grassbridger

Scorri (1): Eclipse

Elieson (1): Paperblade

Not Voting (7): Kay, Polydeuces, Refa, Bizz, Scorri, Euklyd, Kirsche

With 17 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch at deadline and 9 to hammer. Phase ends at 9 PM EDT on September 25th (1 AM GMT on September 26th). You have 13 hours and 40 minutes left.

Edited September 25, 2013 by BigBadMarshmallow

[Psych]

##Unvote

before school, just in case i forget later

[Percivalé]

Boron reading the role mixup as null gives me scumvibes but Manix attempting to discredit Shinori also read as scummy to me so eeehh.

##Vote: Elieson

Unfortunately I won't be around today to really do anything so I don't have time to construct Elieson argument, but I agree with Paperblade that he spent a lot of time talking about Refa and also I think he spent too much time focusing on Weapons and I just think there are people who have done scummier things than Weapons did. (Something to note may be his very vague Kay defense "oh she just hasn't been around but Weapons is active lurking!!" and ye) Also I don't like how he worded his case on me being related to my "defense" of Weapons because neither of us have flipped yet. He was unclear when I addressed him about this.

but yeah after this I am completely busy for the rest of the day unfortunately. I may make it back for deadline to help consolidate a lynch and that's the most use I will be

[Percivalé]

has flipped*

ENGLISH GRAMMAR IS VERY IMPORTANT TO ME

[Percivalé]

if weapons flips scum the wedding is off btw

[Elieson]

Welp weapons is throwing some opinions out and een though there's some waffling, he's at least noticing and commenting on things with opinions regarding motive, which I find decent as contribution terms go.

As for my case on Refa, I never based my case on Refa being new [paperblade] because his first gAme, iirc, was filled with strong performance. I'm explicitly not giving him the newbie card, and would love to be quoted on it.

SB isn't doing much of much, and considering the strange Manix behavior that SB is supposed to recover from, I'm still leaning scum on him.

All these points on Scorri are worth sheeping i guess, but then again, that's what I feel the case on her mainly is; someone saying she isn't doing much of value, and people sheeping. THIS actually looks like like the weapons case from 36 hours ago. Only the difference bein that she's not being voted for, but is being given a leaning scum classification by various peeps.

Ugh. My scumread on eclipse was founded by my emotions getting the best of me. I'll admit that; I disagree with her methods. WRT that, unless her flip pulls out scum somehow, it still is a risk since she hopes people will learn from their "mistake of lynching her townie self", which IMO isn't cool because it's assuming behavior changes, and we all know that saying about the word "assume".

Still mild scumread on Bizzu, tho I only had association (with weapons) due to early game shenanigans and defenses, and while that's not a typical thing to do, I guess there wasn't scum intent behind it.

So I guess for now, I'd go SB>>Levibii>weapons>scorri>nullish-crowd

Though I'll be honest, I haven't paid much attention to grassbirdcage since I feel like I'm reading myself in his posts and get bored mid-post-read, and kirsche seems more forgettable to me now than any other player I can think of.

Read Toonami Mafia, if you dare.

hey what's that supposed to mean? My game was amazing!

[Percivalé]

"mild scumread" but I'm second on your list ??

is that the only thing you have to say about SB wtf

[Percivalé]

Also why are you still voting for the third person on your scumlist then??

[Elieson]

Shoot I forgot to switch my vote to

##unvote

##vote SO

and my scum list isn't filled with obviscummy scum pants reads. SB, my strongest scumread, is between obviscum and leaning scum. Meaning my read on you is lesser leaning scum.

[Elieson]

Ohai bizz I see a biggum post about me. If I may reply to the 404s within it :|

My association between you and weapons came from you outright calling weapons an easy target, wen he was getting heat. That's defense, from where I was reading at the time. If you don't think it's a legit message to gather from that post, well I can't help you there, but try looking at it from where I stand. It's almost like you're calling me out for doing the same thing with Kay, and yet refusing to accept that people can say the same of you.

Wrt my Kay thing. Facts is facts, yo. Weapons has many posts. Kay has few. Active lurking means posting but not contributing. Kay wasn't doing that, she still isn't. It sucks that she's done nothing but she didn't have like 7 posts of nothing before that. Weapons did. There's an easy difference between the two, and one was active lurking, the other wasn't. At this point idc if Kay gets lynched or not Because she's done jack of all squat, but I'd rather look for scum among posting players than non posting players.

Uhhh, I gotta ask too; Where paper calls me out for looking at Refa as hard as I did, you do too, but he mentions that I called out his newbieness (which I didn't, in fact I did the opposite). Since you're borrowing his case on me, do you feel the same thing?

Also, Who would you fall back on, assuming I wasn't the main lynch for today? Your most recent posts indicates that all of your scumreads are SF CAN ONLY HAVE ONE MAFIA GOD AND ELIESON IS HE, and you'd only pop back for consolidation if you happen to be around. Do you like, at present, have anything else as far as scum reads?

[Percivalé]

If you want me to be completely honest my scumreads are all fucked up and I have ntotime today to change that. I would vig Kay rather than lynch Kay, and Kevin gives me vibes because he's been p under the radar and I can't remember a lot of his opinions and I don't have time to go through ISOs, I'll do it during the night phase

Also yeah if you want to call it a defense of Weapons, it's a defense, because I still think hesan easy taget, fite me.

I'm on my phone btw sorry for any typos

[Elieson]

Also yeah if you want to call it a defense of Weapons, it's a defense, because I still think hesan easy taget, fite me.

I'm on my phone btw sorry for any typos

So am I scummy for previously finding your [now] admitted defense scummy, or do you just not like it?

And I live on my phone, so I know what you mean by typo syndrome.

[charlie_]

Strong town read on Levity, I doubt if scum she would have CCed me.

This actually makes sense, Shinori. You have a pro town claim but aren't pro town yourself (Kirby in a nutshell) so I agree with Weapons' logic here.

Eclipse's response to Bizz's forthcoming case on her is troubling to me. Townies should focus on scumhunting, and if they have to defend themselves, that's regrettable because it means someone is going after the wrong person. Eclipse being intrigued by having to defend herself? Doesn't seem to come from a pro-town mindset. I find it scummy, along with a general pattern of an odd tone in her interaction with Bizz.

Townies defend themselves too, you know. Not having to defend themselves is best, yeah, but not defending themselves doesn't help out the town, it just makes it easier for the mafia to force mislynches onto them. I don't see what's wrong with eclipse wanting the ability to defend herself, rather than "I think X is scum".

I also feel like Grass is bad here when he's asking about why eclipse to want to be lynched, considering he doesn't know her role (and iirc she said her role worked better when dead) and even says that it's suboptimal for scum to do it, but continues to attack her which is a weird contradiction.

Refa, why were you so eager to jump on Paper's suggestion to massclaim?

Polyduces "massclaiming already" post isn't good, where are your opinions man? Please don't tell me I adblocked them like I did with your avatar.

my phone autocorrects "ok" to "sk"

Your phone is the greatest.

Dislike this post from Paperblade. Shinori ISN'T confirmed town, so there's still a chance that he might be scum. I don't see how the censor could be caught that quickly if you played it carefully tbh.

I feel like almost the entirity of Shinori's content up to now (#346) is coasting on his claim and deciding whether or not massclaiming should be a thing.

Continuing on downstairs.

[Percivalé]

So am I scummy for previously finding your [now] admitted defense scummy, or do you just not like it?

The issue isn't whether or not I'm defending Weapons (which, from a simple standpoint, I was), it's that I don't know what you can draw from it because neither of us has flipped. I don't know if you're finding it scummy because of associative reads which, as I said before, is flimsy because you don't know either of our alignments. I was assuming that because you found Weapons scummy and noticed I was defending him by expressing that I thought he was an easy target, you found me scummy too for defending someone you thought was scummy. Therefore, I don't understand your train of thought here.

[Percivalé]

Like, if Weapons actually (god forbid) flipped scum, THEN I would understand, but right now I just don't.

[Percivalé]

(and that's just one example)

[Elieson]

My train of Thoight is pretty simple.

Town doesn't have reason to defend someone because it doesn't really help town to defend ???-aligned players. Scum, on the other hand, benefits from defending scum as it aids their alignment, yet can be passed off as Day 1 shenanigans at this point in the game.

When your defense is "oh that's just how he is" then that brings meta into the argument, which also takes validity from his participation in game by taking his entire lifetime's worth of play (95% as you said I think), and declaring it as pretty much a point worth nothing.

I can't see why town!you would want to defend ??!weapons because at that point, and for a while after, he did nothing, and for all town!you knows, you're defending scum!weapons.

Tl;dr Why would you take the risk to defend a questionably aligned player who's contributions were moot at best, unless you are aware of something that the rest of us aren't aware of?