Refa Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 ALSO Who's up for breaking the game with a D1 massclaim? : 3 Man, I forgot to reply to this, but why would you rather have a massclaim over one player with all of the claims? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Why wait until D2 when we can be organised now? Also you seem awfully passive, with "other people can do what they want". Should other people claim? If I was gonna claim to anyone it would probably be Via because of unlimited messages but yeah. I've been mulling over this but I don't think SB would just casually throw this out even if it was obvious? ##unvote ##Vote: SB Bothers me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Hey, hope you don't mind if I reply to that message you sent me on thread (uh, after this post)...uh, but not right now, man. I have to be doing things now. Why wait until D2 when we can be organised now? Also you seem awfully passive, with "other people can do what they want". Should other people claim? I wouldn't (and haven't), but maybe they have a reason to trust you (although I can't see why at this point other than a meta read of some sort), dude. Like, maybe I'd advise people against claiming to you if I was scumreading you, but I don't even have a read on you myself, so it'd be dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Also man, can you explain your SB scumread? I really don't get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB. Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Mayor could easily be scum in a setup this size so I don't even know what you're saying? Why would I not post that as town? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Good morning, crew! More detailed read later, but re: the kirsche thing: a mayor role alone is not leadership material, especially given how SF has a very, very long history of giving historically very town roles to scum, even when it seems from ingame that it wouldn't work. ##Unvote ##Vote: Kirsche Why do you feel the need to lead early Day 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 I just don't see why you'd just up and give the game away like that SB. Just feels wrong and weird. @Terrador: Because a town with a leader is better than a town without. I don't see what's so difficult to understand about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Also mayor is always a bad role because of how controlled lynches are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 I just don't see why you'd just up and give the game away like that SB. Just feels wrong and weird. @Terrador: Because a town with a leader is better than a town without. I don't see what's so difficult to understand about that? That's not the issue I'm challenging, and you know it; don't equivocate. I'm saying that you, as a player, should understand that we can't reasonably feel comfortable claiming to you on that ground alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB. Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Via clearly didn't care about keeping their role a secret and unless the scumteam was composed of newbies they would've figured it out already anyway. Lynch control+easy fakeclaim makes Mayor a decent scum role. I don't see what's so bad about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 That's not the issue I'm challenging, and you know it; don't equivocate. I'm saying that you, as a player, should understand that we can't reasonably feel comfortable claiming to you on that ground alone. What? I answered this question: Why do you feel the need to lead early Day 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 What? I answered this question: Maybe it was phrased poorly to address the issue I wanted to talk to you about, which is: you don't have the grounds to be leading right now, so why are you asking for claims? And if you think this is reasonable--if you can, show me a time where you sheeped a claim like this, and it was legitimate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 What happened to half my post. Ugh not typing it all up again: Terrador is just using buzzwords and not trying to find scum intent. ##unvote ##vote: Terrador Mayor is a good role to claim to because it's easily provable and does basically nothing except decide panic deadline lynches, which shouldn't happen anyway. Having a leader is good to have ASAP and people can never be properly cleared regardless, not including the fact that alignment cops are rare nowadays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 In choose you're own role there was a vote control role and the LOC allowed for code generation which allowed PB to lead the town and they eventually just won. Any OC game in existence will have a town leader of some sort, and there's a reason for that: an organised town can break the game. It allows for optimised protection and clever investigation coordination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Also town leaders are generally just people who put themselves forward to lead without much clearance. See: Life in PiG mafia as an example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 What happened to half my post. Ugh not typing it all up again: Terrador is just using buzzwords and not trying to find scum intent. ##unvote ##vote: Terrador Mayor is a good role to claim to because it's easily provable and does basically nothing except decide panic deadline lynches, which shouldn't happen anyway. Having a leader is good to have ASAP and people can never be properly cleared regardless, not including the fact that alignment cops are rare nowadays. I'm pretty sure that digging for claims without any real grounding for doing so THIS early has some scum intent to it. Yes, theoretically nulltell, yada yada, but scum knowing who town's PR are breaks the game just as hard. @Marth: What do you think you stand to gain from claiming vanilla at this juncture? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeaponsofMassConstruction Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Will say other stuff later but town leader isn't even that useful in this setup since you only get 2 emails per day/night. We could make a code, but that's against the spirit of the game and I would personally be against it. Also, kirsche, you're just not clear or even close. And the mechanics say there are vanillas in this game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Will say other stuff later but town leader isn't even that useful in this setup since you only get 2 emails per day/night. We could make a code, but that's against the spirit of the game and I would personally be against it. Also, kirsche, you're just not clear or even close. And the mechanics say there are vanillas in this game. Not saying there aren't vanilla, just questioning what Marth thinks he's got to gain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 It's easy to manipulate the email limit though because I can have obvclears e-mail each other orders in a chain or use other methods (e.g. Bizz, the thread etc). I personally don't think code making is against the spirit of the game but each to their own. Elie also allowed it. Would people claim to me if I was cleared? I think I have a way of doing it but cba if noone will care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Nah screw waiting I am mason leader. Town should claim to me or do the same thing as they did in ROTAOTIG:BTTIDWSRM30G:LFOCH where they ignored me and got deceived by PB for like 3 days =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=45017&hl= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 @kirsche: You do realize that claiming mason without somebody to confirm it has virtually no weight, correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrador Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 And before someone says it, yeah, there's 110% the possibility that the mason claimant may be a scumbuddy or a stand-in who believes that mason, or that it may not be a good play for the mason and partner. I get that. But that doesn't change the fact that claiming mason without any evidence proves all of nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeaponsofMassConstruction Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Not saying there aren't vanilla, just questioning what Marth thinks he's got to gain. Oh that wasn't directed at you, it was just a general heads up. Thoughts on the game thus far: I did not see anything scummy from either Blitz or Bizz from their one exchange, and don't really think there's anything about it worth commenting about anymore. Honestly at this point I think Marth is my strongest townread. That's mostly due to his claim and its nature, and that I see nothing wrong with posting a joke and then seriously reconsidering it, and also that he seems very carefree. ##Unvote, ##Vote: Rapier That 180 needs to be pressured a lot more. Everybody's giving him a pass but why? I also really don't like how he disappeared right after but that's of course circumstantial. Poly and SB also stand out both for being a bit aggressive in the game so far. I think so far Poly has been very purposeful wrt to it, so even though I disagree with some of the pressing (from memory of the first read through), I like it so far. On the other hand, SB has taken two stabs (asking Blitz about Refa, against Marth for his first post, and on reread he's not actually being aggressive) the first of which is a dead end, and the second of which I feel is twisting something which clearly could've been town motivated. The rest of his posts so far have been rather cruisy, so I'd also vote him at this point in the game. Also, I really want to speculate that based on how the email system is setup, there's going to be message faker or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zkirsche Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 And before someone says it, yeah, there's 110% the possibility that the mason claimant may be a scumbuddy or a stand-in who believes that mason, or that it may not be a good play for the mason and partner. I get that. But that doesn't change the fact that claiming mason without any evidence proves all of nothing. That's always going to be the case for any kind of investigation, which I have already stated. You can never be 100% sure but leading needs to happen so you have to compromise. If no masons are dead come D3 then you should start asking questions. Do you want to win or do you want to let your neverending paranoia get the best of you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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