Do You Like The Kids? / Your Thoughts on Them

[secondworld]

Literally just replace Oifey with an avatar, and your good. I'm sure some would complain, but this is the easiest solution.

And actually the worst solution since an already existing character is being replaced.

Well now that I'm posting I should give my two cents: dumb story-wise, great gameplay-wise, I like a few of them.

I would prefer 2nd gen not showing up again, but I wouldn't be opposed to a time skip since that's only been used once so far and it could be interesting to see how they would do that kind of thing again(for story and gameplay).

[maybe]

Honestly, i want that. I want a darker fucken story too. With Kids.

lmao. It would be nice to remake FE4, but like, i dont feel like theres room for an Avatar in that game. And you know they would try to put one in.

i'd love an fe4 remake partially because that game would benefit massively from having the ability to skip or speed up enemy phases i would probably hate this game if emulators didn't exist thank you fast forward button

but also because of how unique of a game is

like, fates added plenty of new stuff and some of the stuff they added is really cool

so it makes me curious how they could implement some of the things fe4 added, and maybe add some modern things too

the whole castle system especially would be interesting to see expanded on

although I do agree that they would probably add an avatar and that would be bad

it's not that i don't have faith in the newer team, but avatar just sort of seems like a staple at this point

although if they did add one i think he'd probably replace oifaye or have a similar role

[Captain Karnage]

Another reason I don't think they'll do a timeskip even though I love FE4 RIP remake is because it means that if there are no substitute characters there's the issue of time limits on S/A rank supports in order to get the kids, which could lead to Chapter 11 Chrom automarry shenanigans, and would also mean a potential Avatar character doesn't get their pick of the lot and we know we can't have anything that puts the player's marriage candidacy at risk!!!!

hell, if you wern't careful Chrom would marry you

then you'd have no choice but to be Queen

[Loki Laufeyson]

Literally just replace Oifey with an avatar, and your good. I'm sure some would complain, but this is the easiest solution.

NOoo! Oifey tho! That stache cannot be replaced!

i'd love an fe4 remake partially because that game would benefit massively from having the ability to skip or speed up enemy phases i would probably hate this game if emulators didn't exist thank you fast forward button

but also because of how unique of a game is

like, fates added plenty of new stuff and some of the stuff they added is really cool

so it makes me curious how they could implement some of the things fe4 added, and maybe add some modern things too

the whole castle system especially would be interesting to see expanded on

although I do agree that they would probably add an avatar and that would be bad

it's not that i don't have faith in the newer team, but avatar just sort of seems like a staple at this point

although if they did add one i think he'd probably replace oifaye or have a similar role

Well, FE4 can also be made to look longer than it really is. Those huge maps can be trimmed down and packaged as more than one chapter at a time. Poor fucken Oifey. I dont want it if Oifey goes bye bye tbh.

[MCProductions]

NOoo! Oifey tho! That stache cannot be replaced!

Well, FE4 can also be made to look longer than it really is. Those huge maps can be trimmed down and packaged as more than one chapter at a time. Poor fucken Oifey. I dont want it if Oifey goes bye bye tbh.

I imagine Oifey would still be there, but like Jagen in FE 12, he would just be for flavor text whilst his role is filled by the avatar

[Loki Laufeyson]

I imagine Oifey would still be there, but like Jagen in FE 12, he would just be for flavor text whilst his role is filled by the avatar

N o. Oifey must remain Oifey and playable. Avatar should be able to bang Oifey, not be Oifey. :|

[nordopolica]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

[MCProductions]

N o. Oifey must remain Oifey and playable. Avatar should be able to bang Oifey, not be Oifey. :|

That's obviously going to be possible dude

[Loki Laufeyson]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

*screams*

[Jedi]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

Plz no, don't give IS ideas lol.

[MCProductions]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

I'd buy it

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Honestly Finn is pretty much THE Avatar of FE4. Dude did not fucking die

[secondworld]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

Let's not forget the paralogues where Eldigan, Travant, Arvis, and Ishtar can be recruited because surprise! They didn't actually die!

[nordopolica]

Honestly Finn is pretty much THE Avatar of FE4. Dude did not fucking die

I momentarily forgot about Finn, but yes. He barely ages save for a new mullet and can potentially be the father of any of the G2 units barring the storyshipped ones (Leonster siblings, Seliph, etc.) All it would take is to create a new customisable character, putting them in a role akin to Finn, and letting them be the parent OR spouse of any of the G2 kids. *shudder* now that it's seeming plausible, I'm starting to regret the discussion.

Let's not forget the paralogues where Eldigan, Travant, Arvis, and Ishtar can be recruited because surprise! They didn't actually die!

Travant: I was only a mean dude ™ because of my repressed feelings. Sorry I murdered your parents and all but can I join your group?

Leif: yuh ofc

Edited March 17, 2016 by nordopolica

[NekoKnight]

Inb4 FE4 remake where Avatar replaces Sigurd but survives Belhalla due to his strong will and overwhelming desire to bang his friends' nubile children.

Let's not forget the paralogues where Eldigan, Travant, Arvis, and Ishtar can be recruited because surprise! They didn't actually die!

You're both horrible people and are probably already working for IS.

[MCProductions]

Let's not forget the paralogues where Eldigan, Travant, Arvis, and Ishtar can be recruited because surprise! They didn't actually die!

I would the king of bad taste, and have the female avatar marry the bolded. sorry, not sorry Deirdre

Edited March 17, 2016 by MCProductions

[Unrefined-Nemesis]

the children mechanics are great for online battle, matching and pairing for parents for the best skill set and stats is mathematically fun as they are superior than their parents in terms of stats.

Story wise they were misplaced and don't fit in at all.

[Gaggle of Geese]

I don't mind their existence. What I DO mind is how badly IS fucked up when it comes to character count--for a male avatar, marrying nearly any first generation character makes it impossible to get all the children characters.

Seriously, words cannot express how much this pisses me off. How did they manage to screw up this badly? My only hope is that this could possibly be fixed with an update, but I don't think this is the kind of thing that can be patched.

[Unrefined-Nemesis]

I don't mind their existence. What I DO mind is how badly IS fucked up when it comes to character count--for a male avatar, marrying nearly any first generation character makes it impossible to get all the children characters.

Seriously, words cannot express how much this pisses me off. How did they manage to screw up this badly? My only hope is that this could possibly be fixed with an update, but I don't think this is the kind of thing that can be patched.

Perhaps that the female Kamui/Corrin is the one that is meant to the one that is canon that is why they made it that way, however the second gen characters do give the better stat bonuses to kana if you are all about the stats

[~Inigo~]

So I like how the gameplay aspect worked. If it does come back, we need a pregnant status where they get -10 dodge and HP, but get +5 ATK. Either that or a stork...

[ckc22]

Jedi described it completely the same as I would.

The eugenics is still there. If you isolate it.

Making it easier is to encourage interactions between players.

You're starting to sound like you hate it because "it doesn't feel as special" trying to optimize. Like how he Casual mode inclusion started debates.

Accessibility with interaction is a good thing. Nothing is stopping you from finding the best setup from breeding.

My Castle is a completely optional component. The inheritance system is still as deep, if not more, intellectually stimulating for setups as Awakening.

This is nothing like casual. You can play casual on a file without affecting anyone else. Eugenics/min/maxing is defined by the meta - everything in the game affects the meta and affects everyone trying to min/max. Nothing is optional - ignoring a feature of the game turns what you're doing into a challenge run, not min/maxing. I'm not saying it's been removed I'm saying it's been simplified to boring levels - the only thing that truly matters when making pairings is mods. The system is shallower and less interesting for the changes.

How exactly do you feel they "dumbed down" the eugenics? I don't really consider giving characters the ability to use A+ and S Rank Supports to gain new classes "dumbing" anything down. In fact, it's the opposite, it adds another layer to min maxing entirely.

Mycastle skill buying eliminates any need to consider skills. That means that mods and final class are the only other things. Because the effect of S pairings in battle has been reduced in importance, it's no longer an important consideration meaning you can pretty much use it as a means of passing a class, in addition you have a unidirectional A+ to pass classes as well meaning it's easy to get whatever final class you want. Basically min/maxing boils down to mods which is far less complicated and interesting than the process in Awakening.

Edited March 17, 2016 by ckc22

[FoliFF]

Slightly off-topic, if the child mechanic return most of us agree some sort of time-skip is probably the best to do it but how would you guys feel if they did similar thing in awakening? However, this time around the 1st Gen travels into the future for like 20 or so year and meet up with gen 2 characters. Or more to meet their grand grand etc. children. One plot reason is that big bad Kefka won and destroyed the world or something. So with help of Naga they travel into the future for another plot reason so they can save their present.

I mean hey better use the outrealms/dragons gate/spotpass to its fullest extant since time travel tropes is no stranger to FE anymore. Gotta make the timeline even more convoluted eh?

[shadowofchaos]

This is nothing like casual. You can play casual on a file without affecting anyone else. Eugenics/min/maxing is defined by the meta - everything in the game affects the meta and affects everyone trying to min/max. Nothing is optional - ignoring a feature of the game turns what you're doing into a challenge run, not min/maxing. I'm not saying it's been removed I'm saying it's been simplified to boring levels - the only thing that truly matters when making pairings is mods. The system is shallower and less interesting for the changes.

Mycastle skill buying eliminates any need to consider skills. That means that mods and final class are the only other things. Because the effect of S pairings in battle has been reduced in importance, it's no longer an important consideration meaning you can pretty much use it as a means of passing a class, in addition you have a unidirectional A+ to pass classes as well meaning it's easy to get whatever final class you want. Basically min/maxing boils down to mods which is far less complicated and interesting than the process in Awakening.

So, "it's easier and more accessible TO OTHERS so it's makes it boring for me, so it must be dumbed down and boring." Okay.

"Meta".

You're acting as if they crap all over the competitive scene... when there is none.

Min maxing in FE has been a single player endeavor for the campaign. Their design choice using my castle... an optional feature, is proof of that.

"Nothing is optional"

My Castle is a glorified barracks.

Do you reset the game repeatedly for Awakening to get a specific STR bonus for a certain character to optimize?

You're saying there is no need to consider skills is because you basically have a "google" for skills built into the game.

In the context of min-maxing, you decide what resources are "part of your playthrough".

You're literally blaming the game for having Internet access.

It literally doesn't affect the system's complexity in a single player environment.

Do you reset for event tiles?

Again, you sound like you're complaining about accessibility because it makes you feel less special for the achievement of min-maxing.

You can theory craft still because going online is outside the context of your playthrough. They outright state that in the introduction video for If.

Almost every kid can have every skill ever. But getting them by yourself through beating the game or guest character cards will take forever by yourself.

At the end of the day, what is the point of optimization? The fun of theorycrafting and the road there.

And there are some who like to boast about their achievement.

The fact that you even brought up "wah my pairings aren't the best" that very few people do, shows you are the latter group and are hostile to the change simply because you're insecure about how there is nothing to show for it, rather than the fun of min-maxing.

Edited March 17, 2016 by shadowofchaos

[ckc22]

So, "it's easier and more accessible TO OTHERS so it's makes it boring for me, so it must be dumbed down and boring." Okay.

"Meta".

You're acting as if they crap all over the competitive scene... when there is none.

Min maxing in FE has been a single player endeavor for the campaign. Their design choice using my castle... an optional feature, is proof of that.

"Nothing is optional"

My Castle is a glorified barracks.

Do you reset the game repeatedly for Awakening to get a specific STR bonus for a certain character to optimize?

You're saying there is no need to consider skills is because you basically have a "google" for skills built into the game.

In the context of min-maxing, you decide what resources are "part of your playthrough".

You're literally blaming the game for having Internet access.

It literally doesn't affect the system's complexity in a single player environment.

Do you reset for event tiles?

Again, you sound like you're complaining about accessibility because it makes you feel less special for the achievement of min-maxing.

You can theory craft still because going online is outside the context of your playthrough. They outright state that in the introduction video for If.

Almost every kid can have every skill ever. But getting them by yourself through beating the game or guest character cards will take forever by yourself.

At the end of the day, what is the point of optimization? The fun of theorycrafting and the road there.

And there are some who like to boast about their achievement.

The fact that you even brought up "wah my pairings aren't the best" that very few people do, shows you are the latter group and are hostile to the change simply because you're insecure about how there is nothing to show for it, rather than the fun of min-maxing.

Lol Obviously touched a nerve. I'll try and respond to your line item rant.

No. This has nothing to do with being easier or more accessible - you could perfectly pair anyone you wanted in Awakening and been fine. The difference is that they've removed a component of the gameplay for players at the high end. The addition of casual didn't remove classic. That's why this is not analogous.

Games can still have metas without a competitive scene.... Multiple FE titles have an endgame now. Mycastle is not an optional feature in the context of creating the best units. Because there's 0 reason to choose skill access over better mods. Again min/maxing does not include deciding what resources are part of your playthrough.... I already said you could do challenge runs if you'd like - which are an entirely different thing.

Barracks str bonuses are random and optional and not permanent, which I'm sure you know are not germane to the conversation, but your goal isn't rational discussion...

I'm not complaining about accessibility because it "makes me feel less special" nothing about min/maxing makes me feel special... I just have fun doing it. The option has been severely limited.

Theory crafting will take a huge hit because min/maxing revolves around using all of a games systems.... this game will never have a thread like The Pairing Thread from Awakening because of it. Many major contributors to that thread like Airship Cannon and Astrophys agree....

I agree that the fun of min/maxing is theory crafting, which has been reduced and in some ways eliminated from Fates. Which is my issue with it.

Edited March 17, 2016 by ckc22

[shadowofchaos]

I do apologize for being rant and being emotionally blinded, but your initial statements almost sounded like mine as well. The very first thing you mentioned is "other people complaining about their ships".

Except they dumbed down the eugenics component of all of it so that no one has to shed a tear that their ship isn't "the best!!!111!!!"

They're basically nonexistent and you sounded like you were mocking the system for petty reasons.

Now that you actually explained yourself properly, your stance sounds much more reasonable.

And yet, min-maxing itself sounds very petty when you're complaining about the system not being deep enough when a feature was designed so that people's who found min-maxing boring, didn't have to go through it. It's a middleground because the system still has skills from inheritance, but those who don't want to go through that can skip it.

The game isn't designed with min-maxers in mind.

Saying the system isn't deep or complex enough because of a rule set of "using all resources" sounds wrong. For most people, the complexity is still there. Which is why it sounds like you're the only one complaining here that they "dumbed it down". And arguably... they have... in your context. But for the typical person who thinks about the eugenics, my castle is not a "nerf".

It sounds... kind of backwards to me.

Because you're putting it on the context of online skill trading, not individual isolated playthroughs like Awakening is.

Remember that to some people, min-maxing grinding is boring. You still have the option to min-max the way you did in Awakening. Except this time people also have the choice to skip all of that.

tl;dr You disagree with the design, but saying the system was "dumbed down" isn't accurate.

Edited March 17, 2016 by shadowofchaos